Anybody like watching Jordan Peterson talks on YouTube?

[LoNatural]

This interview is just beautiful, the way he elegantly destroys modern leftist arguments is just unbelievable. The guy is smart, we can't deny that.

 

[Othermind]

Diversity of opinion is too valuable to throw away because of dislike.

Diversity of opinion is only as good as the actual opinions being passed around. A community of thinkers gains nothing from the introduction of fascists or creationists.
If we don't ditch shit opinions once and for all discourse becomes an endless purgatory of debunking the same trite talking points that bigots will NEVER stop shoving down people's throats.

the way he elegantly destroys modern leftist arguments is just unbelievable

Oh boy, here we go...

 

[sif]

This interview is just beautiful, the way he elegantly destroys modern leftist arguments is just unbelievable. The guy is smart, we can't deny that.

Okay so I watched some of his stuff since I made my comments in this thread last night and he definitely doesn't do a lot of things elegantly.

 

[Final Escape]

I was driving around this afternoon and was thinking about how we live in a time and a place where you not allowed to call a spade a spade. You can't say anything negative about anybody or anything anymore that happens to be absolute truth. Especially if your a straight wasp male like I am.

This is why society starts to go down hill when nobody can be held accountable. It takes some decades to achieve this moral breakdown as each generation of people gets slightly worse and are never corrected by the natural forces that used to correct people.

 

[Chinaski]

This is why society starts to go down hill when nobody can be held accountable. It takes some decades to achieve this moral breakdown as each generation of people gets slightly worse and are never corrected by the natural forces that used to correct people.

This, and the post you quoted, is inane white noise, the typical reactionary position of "society is going down the pan!" without giving any examples or evidence of such a shift or explanation as to why, beyond some vague riddle about a "natural order" being disturbed somehow. Absurd stuff.

 

[Chinaski]

How old are u? If you are a boomer than you of all people should understand how much things have changed since the days you were young. Your generation had the most opportunity, prosperity, and freedom that ever existed in the US. But your generation decided to take a giant shit on the younger gens after u because narcissism? I don't know lol! Now the younger generations are suffering because of the massive debts and irresponsibility of that generation. Young people now can't even start their lives because cost of living so high, thanks to terrible policies, expensive gov programs, and endless money printing, costly wars that nobody wants.

This is an abject failure to understand or even recognise how the capitalist economic model has evolved and accelerated beyond control, and instead chooses to lump all blame for the socio-political issues which trouble you at an entire generation of "irresponsible narcissists" who simply adapted to meet the economic power structure. I'd love to know what your solution is to "young people being unable to start their lives", something tells me it would not be one of the more obvious ones.

 

[Pulpit2018]

Diversity of opinion is only as good as the actual opinions being passed around. A community of thinkers gains nothing from the introduction of fascists or creationists.
If we don't ditch shit opinions once and for all discourse becomes an endless purgatory of debunking the same trite talking points that bigots will NEVER stop shoving down people's throats.

This is SO WRONG.So your ideal society is what?An endless colony of same-thinkers like in 1984?
A progressive utopia,where nobody can say anything offensive and thoughts are policed?
Besides who decides who the bigot is?You?
You dont protect against fascism,by introducing more fascism...

Free market of ideas and thoughts is the only way people,grow up!

 

[Final Escape]

This is an abject failure to understand or even recognise how the capitalist economic model has evolved and accelerated beyond control, and instead chooses to lump all blame for the socio-political issues which trouble you at an entire generation of "irresponsible narcissists" who simply adapted to meet the economic power structure. I'd love to know what your solution is to "young people being unable to start their lives", something tells me it would not be one of the more obvious ones.

The solution would be to cut all those old age benefits that young people have to pay for. Loosen the noose a bit lol! That would be a start. I'm sure there's much that could be done but Im not educated enough about gov spending to understand where all the taxes go and how u could reduce the expenditures. It's like sorry, u were duped by your government, we can't actually afford your old age retirement that u were promised. Guess u shouldn't have trusted the government ponzy schemes huh!

 

[Pulpit2018]

We need more libertarian practices,in the whole.And by libertarian i do not mean just legalize weed!

 

[Chinaski]

The solution would be to cut all those old age benefits that young people have to pay for. Loosen the noose a bit lol! That would be a start. I'm sure there's much that could be done but Im not educated enough about gov spending to understand where all the taxes go and how u could reduce the expenditures.

Yup, thought so. As suggested policies regarding wealth distribution go, "cut benefits to the elderly poor to slacken an invisible noose" is one of the worst I've heard, this is one notch below going full Logan's Run.

 

[Hopeless_soul]

Free market of ideas and thoughts is the only way people,grow up!

We need more libertarian practices,in the whole

Libertarian practices regarding free speech? Sounds very nice. How would you solve the ever-increasing problem of deepfakes and living in a post-truth society though?

 

[Pulpit2018]

solve the ever-increasing problem of deepfakes and living in a post-truth society though?

Can you explain on that?What is deepfakes?

 

[Hopeless_soul]

Can you explain on that?What is deepfakes?

Basically advanced disinformation strategies with the use of new technologies. This is from a Foreign Affairs article:

'Thanks to the rise of "deepfakes"—highly realistic and difficult-to-detect digital manipulations of audio or video—it is becoming easier than ever to portray someone saying or doing something he or she never said or did.' (...) 'Deepfakes are the product of recent advances in a form of artificial intelligence known as "deep learning," in which sets of algorithms called "neural networks" learn to infer rules and replicate patterns by sifting through large data sets.'

 

[Final Escape]

Yup, thought so. As suggested policies regarding wealth distribution go, "cut benefits to the elderly poor to slacken an invisible noose" is one of the worst I've heard, this is one notch below going full Logan's Run.

I don't mean that the poor elderly should not be taken care of but not at the expense of people who are not related especially and did not sign up consenting to pay for the retirement of unrelated elderly. Before social security, people had kids in big part because that was how you handled your old age. You took care of your kids and in turn they helped u out in your old age. Unfortunately young people now, many of them can't afford kids at least if u want to be able to raise them well and not be too busy working to see them. It's become harder to have just one parent be able to stay home which makes it less of a burden. If both people work full time it's difficult, spend enuf time with your kid plus still have energy to keep the marriage together. Also, when they virtually transferred parenting to the state or outsourced the care of kids to unrelated people, this broke down the normal respect and atttachment of kids to parents. This might be why people make the assumption that u can't count on your kids to help u in old age. Because parents see that their kids are estranged more so than ever before. It has to do with breaking the child/parent bond early and by the time your kid is a teen they hate u lol! Because you weren't there much when they needed u most in the early years.

 

[Pulpit2018]

Basically advanced disinformation strategies with the use of new technologies. This is from a Foreign Affairs article:

'Thanks to the rise of "deepfakes"—highly realistic and difficult-to-detect digital manipulations of audio or video—it is becoming easier than ever to portray someone saying or doing something he or she never said or did.' (...) 'Deepfakes are the product of recent advances in a form of artificial intelligence known as "deep learning," in which sets of algorithms called "neural networks" learn to infer rules and replicate patterns by sifting through large data sets.'

Well,i ll tell you.
It wont be solved by more "government intervention" of the internet,thats for sure.
Perhaps private companies that detect and analyse and combat deepfakes.
Either way,censorship is never the answer.

 

[Hopeless_soul]

Well,i ll tell you.
It wont be solved by more "government intervention" of the internet,thats for sure.
Perhaps private companies that detect and analyse and combat deepfakes.
Either way,censorship is never the answer.

Fair enough. I would call the whole thing 'the post truth-piñata society'. :)

 

[Johnnythefox]

This reviewer wasn't too impressed with his performance in my home town.
*after the show, Halloween parties have begun and ghouls are roaming the city centre. I'm briefly startled by the sight of two figures clad in white boiler suits and matching masks, before the rational part of my brain assures me they are almost certainly benign individuals disguised as dangerous ones.

Peterson, I fear, is the opposite.*

https://www.thenational.scot/news/1...just-a-warm-up-for-jordan-petersons-diatribe/

 

[Pulpit2018]

Fair enough. I would call the whole thing 'the post truth-piñata society'. :)

You know its quite a conversation.
In the modern times,with information at your hands you can learn about anything.It could be absolutely correct or absolutely wrong.There is a tornado of information out there,and lot of it is bad information or downright lies,fakes.
In the old times,you had books-newspapers that were somewhat edited and filtered.
That gave you a more streamlined view of the world,probably slighty more true as well.
But access was harder,and the people in charge could decide what you see.

With the liberation of information,and technology everybody can spew his shit.
However that is not necessary a bad thing.
Again the free market must sort out,the bad from the good.The lies from the truth.
In a way,in the modern world,you have more responsibility to find out what is going on.
You must become your own investigator.You cant really on publications,news outlets,institutions etc...
More freedom,more information.
That means more burden on the population to rise up and educate itself properly.
Find out for yourself.You cant rely on others for stuff like this.

Its a big issue no doubt.Personally i would rather have an open market of chaos,than some central institutions dictating "history,education,truth,etc.."

 

[Chinaski]

I don't mean that the poor elderly should not be taken care of but not at the expense of people who are not related especially and did not sign up consenting to pay for the retirement of unrelated elderly. Before social security, people had kids in big part because that was how you handled your old age. You took care of your kids and in turn they helped u out in your old age. Unfortunately young people now, many of them can't afford kids at least if u want to be able to raise them well and not be too busy working to see them. It's become harder to have just one parent be able to stay home which makes it less of a burden. If both people work full time it's difficult, spend enuf time with your kid plus still have energy to keep the marriage together.

This is absurd, the notion that the right to essentially live a dignified and healthy life is dictated by wealth or acquisition alone is beyond shortsighted.

Social security is exactly what it says; it's security for all against circumstances which may impact upon ones ability to compete within an inflexible capitalist society. In the UK, before social security, we had slums with poor sanitation kept by baron landlords, healthcare only for those who could afford it, educational attainment and the social mobility it offers dependent upon the wealth of one's parents and nothing else, anyone unfortunate enough to be put out of work through wider economic circumstances or invalidity pretty much went hungry. The 1945 Labour government implemented a widely transformative range of policies based around the Beveridge Report (ldleness, lgnorance, Disease, Want, Squalor) to eradicate all of the above. The welfare state, council housing with good sanitation, a national health service free to all at the point of need, the Education Act which entitled every child, regardless of background, to a high standard of education, a system designed to take collective responsibility for prividing a safety net for all citizens "from the cradle to the grave". All of the above required a level of taxation on the wealthy in order to invest in these projects which in turn created jobs; not an unfair ask, given that the wealthy may not hold their privilege had the working classes not just fought in a war to defend it.

Now, that's a handy-potted description of one term of office for a democratically elected socialist government but it set the standard for what became the post war social democratic consensus, even if successive governments have done their bit to dismantle and water these things down - capitalism, like any other organism, is adaptive and resourceful in its will to survive; therefore any serious attempt at challenging economic inequality within a capitslist framework will always come down to accepting a collective societal responsibility for the welfare of those who exist within that society and demanding that the wealthy accept the very same responsibility. Putting generation against generation, or ethnicity against ethnicity, or some phoney battle for gender supremacy, will not resolve a single problem; capitalism, and those in whose interests such a system best serves, thrives on inequality, feeds off petty battles fought within the lower classes, encourages distrust and the blame of some mythical 'other', and this is exhibited quite clearly in your posts imo.

 

[mattwitt]

This is why society starts to go down hill when nobody can be held accountable. It takes some decades to achieve this moral breakdown as each generation of people gets slightly worse and are never corrected by the natural forces that used to correct people.

It's like Michael Savage always says... "Liberalism is a mental disorder"

 

[Hopeless_soul]

Its a big issue no doubt.Personally i would rather have an open market of chaos,than some central institutions dictating "history,education,truth,etc.."

It could happen that in the midst of that open market of chaos, elections are manipulated, governments are overthrown, terrorist attacks increase, and so on. But yeah, sometimes chaos is necessary to raise awareness and elicit change (Jesus, that sounds like an industrial psychology statement, lol). In that sense, Trump and his antics are a good example. Personally, I wouldn't like a cataclysm before some measures are taken on the matter.

 

[Chinaski]

Personally i would rather have an open market of chaos

It's like Michael Savage always says... "Liberalism is a mental disorder"

Am l the only person on this godforsaken hellhole of a website who is politically to the left of Genghis Khan?

 

[About_to_Go]

This is why society starts to go down hill when nobody can be held accountable. It takes some decades to achieve this moral breakdown as each generation of people gets slightly worse and are never corrected by the natural forces that used to correct people.

You're not saying anything here.

Why is society going downhill?
Who needs to be held accountable, and for what?
What indicates a moral breakdown from generation to generation?
What are the natural forces that correct people? If they are natural forces, shouldn't they always work?

 

[Pulpit2018]

Oh please.Bad capitalism.Boo hoo.
Free market systems are the best,and it has been proven by history.
Look at this: https://www.fraserinstitute.org/sites/default/files/economic-freedom-of-the-world-2018-execsummary.pdf

Let me ask you this: DO YOU WANT TO LIVE IN A COUNTRY WITH HIGH ECONOMIC FREEDOM OR NOT?
Thats all you need to tell me.The fact that almost anyone wants to live in the West (economic freedom,capitalism) tells you all the truth.

Why do all the immigrants come to USA,Europe,Canada if CAPITALISM IS SO BAD?

 

[Chinaski]

Why do all the immigrants come to USA,Europe,Canada if CAPITALISM IS SO BAD?

Heh. Are you serious here?

 

[Pulpit2018]

It's like Michael Savage always says... "Liberalism is a mental disorder"

Liberalism is fine.The original definition at least...

 

[Final Escape]

You're not saying anything here.

Why is society going downhill?
Who needs to be held accountable, and for what?
What indicates a moral breakdown from generation to generation?
What are the natural forces that correct people? If they are natural forces, shouldn't they always work?

If you take personal responsibility away from people with things like the welfare state, morals break down because the damages/costs are socialized onto society as a whole instead of accruing to the individual. Think single mothers as an example. It decivilizes society when women have kids with men who are not willing or able to help provide for u when u get pregnant. But since there's a welfare state, women get a stream of income just by having a kid. Well the unfortunate thing is that kids from this situation often become damaged so then they are likely to end up in prison at some point and now tax payers are forced to pay for the mistake u made by getting pregnant outside of wedlock. Do u see how without welfare state either the parents of the girl step in to help raise the child, or u would be forced to give your child up for adoption, because abortion is also forced on the population through taxation. So all those abortion mills might not be so common or easily accessible.

 

[Pulpit2018]

Heh. Are you serious here?

What the hell.Do i have to argue about things that everybody knows?

Yes.People want to come to USA.I wonder why.

 

[sif]

What the hell.Do i have to argue about things that everybody knows?

Yes.People want to come to USA.I wonder why.

How is that arguing? He said heh, can't you take a joke?..... Sorry I had to

 

[Pulpit2018]

How is that arguing? He said heh, can't you take a joke?..... Sorry I had to

I only joke in threads where dead people are discussed.