What damage can sn cause if you survive?

[malevolentdiety]

According to Stan's guide the risks are low of damage

 

[rozeske]

I don't want to get bogged down in the science.

Nah. When you are making such claims, and suggesting to keep a glass of OJ as an antidote, which would lead to serious harm to anyone that takes your word for it (yes there are many users like that) you better have something of a concrete evidence and explanation than "drinking OJ makes me feel good after a night out" and "I don't want to get bogged down in the science".

 

[losing hope]

Nah. When you are making such claims, and suggesting to keep a glass of OJ as an antidote, which would lead to serious harm to anyone that takes your word for it (yes there are many users like that) you better have something of a concrete evidence and explanation than "drinking OJ makes me feel good after a night out" and "I don't want to get bogged down in the science".

Dude I've posted 3 sources ALREADY! One of which is a members account whilst they attempted to ctb. In other words the BEST form of evidence! This is on top of my experience. You've not provided any evidence.

Symptomatic patients with methemoglobinemia or those with a significantly elevated methemoglobin level should be admitted to the hospital....

Intravenous (IV) methylene blue is the first-line preferred agent. Intravenous vitamin C, riboflavin, exchange transfusion, and hyperbaric oxygen treatment are second-line options for patients with severe methemoglobinemia whose condition does not respond to methylene blue or who cannot be treated with methylene blue

Methemoglobinemia Treatment & Management: Approach Considerations, Initial Management, Pharmacologic Therapy, Exchange Transfusion, and Hyperbaric Oxygen

Methemoglobin contains iron in the ferric state (Fe3+) rather than the reduced ferrous form (Fe2+) found in hemoglobin. This structural change causes an alteration in the blood’s ability to bind oxygen.

emedicine.medscape.com

Nitrite is an oxidative agent that causes methemoglobinemia in many species. Ruminants are especially vulnerable because the ruminal flora reduces nitrate to ammonia, while nitrite as an intermediate product is 10 times more toxic than nitrate. Acute intoxication is manifested primarily by methemoglobin formation and resultant anoxia.5 The common treatment of methemoglobinemia with methylene blue is potentially hazardous and should not be used specially in patients who may be at risk or suffer from glucose-6-phosphate dehydrogenase (G6PD) deficiency.6 Therefore, the other ways of treatment are suggested for this condition, such as using various vitamins as antioxidant.7

Vitamin C has potentials to scavenge free radicals and protect cells from oxidative damage. Recycling of α-tocopherol by ascorbate has been demonstrated in cellular organelles and erythrocyte membranes.8-11 It also acts as a co-factor for NADP reductase required for glutathione metabolism.12 Furthermore, vitamin C can directly reduce methemoglobin and is proven to treat cyanosis effectively.13

Antioxidant effect of different vitamins on methemoglobin production: An in vitro study

Nitrite intoxication occurs frequently in ruminants and equines. The most common treatment of this disorder is administration of 1% methylene blue, although the use of some antioxidant agents e.g. vitamins and complementary treatment may also be useful. ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

 

[Yarani]

Cool and happy to have a good debate with anyone who is interested in searching for the truth. Don't care who is proven right or wrong. You sound like you might be such a chap.

I don't want to get bogged down in the science. But whenever I've drunk OJ or taken vitamin C after a night out either on booze or drugs I instantly feel better. Try it yourself and see what you find.

I also remember a girl on here who thought she was ctb'ing with SN but it turned out to be Pro-Cure Sodium NitirAte. Her thread ran I think from Xmas 2022 to new years day 2023 IIRC and she posted photos of herself (a 20 something blonde girl). I think she said she felt better after drinking OJ. If I can find the thread I'll post it here as more proof.

Oh thank you, for being kind and open. I highly appreciate that.
I wouldn't be able to confirm your alcohol experiment, since I strongly dislike the taste of alcohol and the feeling of loss of control, so I never ever drink haha. It could be something else aswell though, I think having read that food helps mitigating drug/alcohol effects. I think it was something like the food delaying drug absorption and therefore softening effects, I have also experienced that often and predictably, and it's logical. I think certain substances might also bind to certain foods, rendering them ineffective, or producing new effects, and other stuff like that.
I could even imagine a placebo effect, I mean, orange juice is often perceived as healthy ... haha, no idea. Placebo effects can be incredible though.
Also I just found an article describing that ingested nitrate can turn intro nitrite if you took an antacid which raised the ph value of your stomach, and that vitamin C inhibits nitrate turning into nitrite. That would support the story of the blonde girl.

 

[rozeske]

Dude I've posted 3 sources ALREADY! One of which is a members account whilst they attempted to ctb. In other words the BEST form of evidence! This is on top of my experience. You've not provided any evidence.

Methemoglobinemia Treatment & Management: Approach Considerations, Initial Management, Pharmacologic Therapy, Exchange Transfusion, and Hyperbaric Oxygen

Methemoglobin contains iron in the ferric state (Fe3+) rather than the reduced ferrous form (Fe2+) found in hemoglobin. This structural change causes an alteration in the blood’s ability to bind oxygen.

emedicine.medscape.com

Antioxidant effect of different vitamins on methemoglobin production: An in vitro study

Nitrite intoxication occurs frequently in ruminants and equines. The most common treatment of this disorder is administration of 1% methylene blue, although the use of some antioxidant agents e.g. vitamins and complementary treatment may also be useful. ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

It is obviously your choice to do as you please but it would help the community if you could clearly indicate this is your personal opinion rather than suggesting it as a fact and referencing a source that doesn't even prove its effectiveness for SN poisoning.

My personal opinion on the matter is i believe it's a ridiculous idea:

A) a members attempt testimony
posted anonymously, and an odd one at that, could never be referenced as "the best form of evidence"

B) the research on the relation between OJ and nitrite in cured meat is a conclusion that it helps avoid carcinogenics and it suggests "a glass of orange juice with your bacon and eggs will be helpful. However, if you are having more than a single rasher you might want to use a vitamin C supplement." When you look at the permissible ratio of sodium nitrite to meat in cured meat is 200 mg/ kg. So there would only be a fraction of that much nitrite in a single rasher. That 1 glass of OJ is recommended to convert that tiny amount of nitrite. So comparing that to the 25gm of SN dose and suggesting to use OJ incase of aborting SN attempt, imo is RIDICULOUS. But like you said it's still your choice. You do you, as should everyone else. No need to lose sleep over it.

 

[losing hope]

My personal opinion on the matter is i believe it's a ridiculous idea:

My personal opinion on the matter is i believe you haven't got a clue. Hence why you haven't posted any evidence. Thus far I've posted 7 sources include pubmed (the authority on these matters) which states; Furthermore, vitamin C can directly reduce methemoglobin and is proven to treat cyanosis effectively.13

Antioxidant effect of different vitamins on methemoglobin production: An in vitro study

Nitrite intoxication occurs frequently in ruminants and equines. The most common treatment of this disorder is administration of 1% methylene blue, although the use of some antioxidant agents e.g. vitamins and complementary treatment may also be useful. ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Something else that undermines confidence in anything you post, is when you said & I quote "it was my way of asking if we should keep a bottle of booze just incase since there are users that owed their failure to having drank alcohol." I had to then reply "No I don't suggest having a bottle of Vodka straight after a failed SN attempt. Nor does that sound like a remotely good idea in my opinion."


And your the one talking about harming others with mis info???


Another personal opinion of mine, is there is no point arguing with .... people. I'll let readers fill in the blank. Goodnight ;-)

 

[rozeske]

My personal opinion on the matter is i believe you haven't got a clue. Hence why you haven't posted any evidence. Thus far I've posted 7 sources include pubmed (the authority on these matters) which states; Furthermore, vitamin C can directly reduce methemoglobin and is proven to treat cyanosis effectively.13

Antioxidant effect of different vitamins on methemoglobin production: An in vitro study

Nitrite intoxication occurs frequently in ruminants and equines. The most common treatment of this disorder is administration of 1% methylene blue, although the use of some antioxidant agents e.g. vitamins and complementary treatment may also be useful. ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Something else that undermines confidence in anything you post, is when you said & I quote "it was my way of asking if we should keep a bottle of booze just incase since there are users that owed their failure to having drank alcohol." I had to then reply "No I don't suggest having a bottle of Vodka straight after a failed SN attempt. Nor does that sound like a remotely good idea in my opinion."


And your the one talking about harming others with mis info???

Sure thing, I hear they are now planning of forgoing the process of administering methylene blue to treat SN caused methemoglobinemia and just dose you with vitamin C. Brilliant!

Hence why you haven't posted any evidence.

the research on the relation between OJ and nitrite in cured meat is a conclusion that it helps avoid carcinogenics and it suggests "a glass of orange juice with your bacon and eggs will be helpful. However, if you are having more than a single rasher you might want to use a vitamin C supplement." When you look at the permissible ratio of sodium nitrite to meat in cured meat is 200 mg/ kg. So there would only be a fraction of that much nitrite in a single rasher. That 1 glass of OJ is recommended to convert that tiny amount of nitrite. So comparing that to the 25gm of SN dose and suggesting to use OJ incase of aborting SN attempt, imo is RIDICULOUS.

 

[losing hope]

Sure thing, I hear they are now planning of forgoing the process of administering methylene blue to treat SN caused methemoglobinemia and just dose you with vitamin C. Brilliant!

I've reported you for twisting my words and also the words of Pub med. Dude you need to also learn English, as you needed me to educate you on what the term "counteract" actually meant. Since you thought Vodka "counteracted" SN.

Now you don't seemed to know what the term "evidence" means. And are just providing the mods an example of how you are trying to twist my words to savage that destroyed ego of yours I smashed during this debate.

Oh on a totally unrelated note; I like your msg under your avatar "Maybe I am the problem." Maybe...

As we both agree we & readers can believe what they want. So no need for any more replies is there?

 

[rozeske]

I've reported you for twisting my words and also the words of Pub med.

Good thing you reported it. I'm already quite familiar with the list of your other, I hate to use the word ridiculous so many times, let's just say questionable plans to incorporate in to your ctb plan so I didn't bother to involve a Mod and just decided to point out your misleading suggestion myself, in the hopes of putting a stop to yet another one of the recent "SN is this SN is that" misguided claims.

 

[Yarani]

Furthermore, vitamin C can directly reduce methemoglobin and is proven to treat cyanosis effectively.13

Antioxidant effect of different vitamins on methemoglobin production: An in vitro study

Nitrite intoxication occurs frequently in ruminants and equines. The most common treatment of this disorder is administration of 1% methylene blue, although the use of some antioxidant agents e.g. vitamins and complementary treatment may also be useful. ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Interesting find!
The vitamin C was associated with an increased methemoglobinemia in the 20 mmol/L-1 condition, though. I wouldn't know how to applicate those results to orange juice consumption. Like, which amount do I need for how much SN? What if I make it worse?

Also I'm sad that we have to fight so often. Just try to stay kind, what we really want is understanding and being understood. We can't have that when we fight. Also I wish we could abstain more often from proclaiming absolute truth. There is no absolute truth in my understanding, because we are unable to know and consider and connect everything that there is. All we get is being on a path to truth proximity with twists and turns and only you are on your own path. We are human and fighting sadly comes naturally with the human mind and that's okay, but we can try our best to limit it. I mean look at this forum, why does it even have to exist. Often because people don't understand and respect each other as much as we would need. You will see that differently, but that doesn't have to mean either perception is entirely invalid. Probably just based on incomplete knowledge and understanding or just a differently shaped perspective, but I have yet to see the person that this doesn't apply to and who has access to the absolute truth or something. We don't even know yet how the thing works that makes us able to consider the thing itself in the first place. How can you be 100% sure about anything at all. Do you even have to be. Man I am truly uncomfortably unhinged today, it has to stop.

 

[losing hope]

Interesting find!
The vitamin C was associated with an increased methemoglobinemia in the 20 mmol/L-1 condition, though. I wouldn't know how to applicate those results to orange juice consumption. Like, which amount do I need for how much SN? What if I make it worse?

Also I'm sad that we have to fight so often. Just try to stay kind, what we really want is understanding and being understood. We can't have that when we fight. Also I wish we could abstain more often from proclaiming absolute truth. There is no absolute truth in my understanding, because we are unable to know and consider and connect everything that there is. All we get is being on a path to truth proximity with twists and turns and only you are on your own path. We are human and fighting sadly comes naturally with the human mind and that's okay, but we can try our best to limit it. I mean look at this forum, why does it even have to exist. Often because people don't understand and respect each other as much as we would need. You will see that differently, but that doesn't have to mean either perception is entirely invalid. Probably just based on incomplete knowledge and understanding or just a differently shaped perspective, but I have yet to see the person that this doesn't apply to and who has access to the absolute truth or something. We don't even know yet how the thing works that makes us able to consider the thing itself in the first place. How can you be 100% sure about anything at all. Do you even have to be. Man I am truly uncomfortably unhinged today, it has to stop.

Thanks for that and couldn't agree more with what you said about fighting. Pretty low to be picking fights on a suicide forum for one's own ego IMO.

 

[YosemiteGrrl]

There is no way to be absolutely sure about something that's never been extensively researched on. You can only do your own research and relay on avaliable resources including the pph and medical reports of SN poisoning, which there is a lot out there. You can make an educated guess though any attempt at taking a life may cause permanent damage. There is one case report I've seen of brain death after SN poisoning. So even if the chances are slim it can happen, especially in an attempt of resuscitation.

Where did you see the report of this brain death after SN? And was the person a living vegetable?

 

[rozeske]

Where did you see the report of this brain death after SN? And was the person a living vegetable?

Here is the report. She was declared brain dead and her family was contacted and agreed for organ donation in line with her wishes.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9892231/#:~:text=A%20liver%20derived%20from%20a,transplanted%20safely%20in%20select%20cases.

 

[Yarani]

Here is the report. She was declared brain dead and her family was contacted and agreed for organ donation in line with her wishes.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9892231/#:~:text=A%20liver%20derived%20from%20a,transplanted%20safely%20in%20select%20cases.

Especially devastating due to
- her changed decision concerning life and death, meaning she wanted to survive at that moment
- the fact that she called for help immediately and it still was too late.

 

[losing hope]

Especially devastating due to
- her changed decision concerning life and death, meaning she wanted to survive at that moment
- the fact that she called for help immediately and it still was too late.

All the more reason to have Vitamin C (and if you can get it Meth Blue) by your bedside just in case you find yourself in that situation. Perhaps if she had MAYBE she might have survived. Can't see any downsides in having them there just in case.

This is a PRO-CHOICE forum after all. So choice also means having the ability to change your mind (& the means like Meth blue by your bedside) even at the last minute.

 

[Dot]

Drinking orange juice caused the below failed SN attempt.

Jen0804

16/09/2019​

Failed Feb 2019. Reason: mixing with orange juice (vitamin c cancels SN). Still became very ill. Still have minor health problems but I am alive

[NOTE: Member suspects orange juice's vitamin C cancelled efficacy of SN.] AsexualBarbieBoy said: "Are the health problems related to the Sn? If so, what are they?" REPLY: "Alopecia. Attempted in February, hair started coming out within that same week and continued until June. It's slowly growing back now, thank god. I'm female and of child-bearing age. My cycles stopped completely so I believe it can mess up hormones/endocrine - not sure about long term fertility or male fertility etc. Immediately after taking it and the whole two weeks after, my kidneys and bowels just werent functioning - I also couldn't feel hunger. I ate an apple and two bites of a hospital sandwich for a whole week or so (drank as normal) but I was so not hungry. There you have it, those are my long term symptoms from s n failure. Not so severe but still a pain."

Source; https://docs.google.com/document/d/1OKnH260kpVBA9_o3_hpvmLW5sdhemQ-d8GC9GwTP2i8/mobilebasic

Ok bt quotng Jen0804 sayng 'Vit C cancls SN' ds nt mke tht claim tru

Sme1 els mixd thr SN wth cka-cla & othr sft drnks & thy faild - pssbly bcse othr substncs intrruptd absorbtn - thn agn othr ppl hve mixd SN wth othr fd & drnk & hve stll passd awy - u r takng sme1 assumptn @ fce-valu whn thre = lttle info t/ spport tht asumptn

Th/ 'bst frm of evdnce' wld b a randmisd cntrol trial or mta-anlysis stdyng thse specfc effcts of Vitmn C on effcts of SN poisnng - nt an anecdotl commnt frm a laymn on an internt frum

Your question on Meth blue reminded me of this thread; https://sanctioned-suicide.net/threads/my-methylene-blue-kit.100655/

I certainly am going to try to source some like OP did in that above thread. Might even ask my doctor for some saying I have SN.

RE' Orange juice, it has vitamin C in it, which counteracts the effects of SN; https://naturallyconscious.blogspot.com/2010/01/drink-oj-with-your-carcinogenic-cured.html

1 - tht = a blog - nt a scientfc papr

2 - 'th/ effct of SN' -- whch effct - jst bcse tht persn claims tht drinkng OJ lng-trm hlps t/ prevnt cancr in a blg ds nt equ8 t/ nullfyng specfc effcts of SN poisnng whch cre8 methmglobnemia

My personal opinion on the matter is i believe you haven't got a clue. Hence why you haven't posted any evidence. Thus far I've posted 7 sources include pubmed (the authority on these matters) which states; Furthermore, vitamin C can directly reduce methemoglobin and is proven to treat cyanosis effectively.13

Antioxidant effect of different vitamins on methemoglobin production: An in vitro study

Nitrite intoxication occurs frequently in ruminants and equines. The most common treatment of this disorder is administration of 1% methylene blue, although the use of some antioxidant agents e.g. vitamins and complementary treatment may also be useful. ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Something else that undermines confidence in anything you post, is when you said & I quote "it was my way of asking if we should keep a bottle of booze just incase since there are users that owed their failure to having drank alcohol." I had to then reply "No I don't suggest having a bottle of Vodka straight after a failed SN attempt. Nor does that sound like a remotely good idea in my opinion."


And your the one talking about harming others with mis info???


Another personal opinion of mine, is there is no point arguing with .... people. I'll let readers fill in the blank. Goodnight ;-)

U r neglectng lts of othr factrs hre

- Ths papr = basd on petri-dsh xpermnts - nt treatng a humn wth concntr8td SN poisnng

- Vitmn C - alng wth methlyn Blu - r usd wth specfc dosng & adminstratn - n.e medcatn usd improprly cn mke thngs wrse evn if tht medcatn sves lves whn usd corrctly

SN concntratn usd fr ths xpermnt ws v lw & only 1/3 vitmn C concntratns lowrd methglbnmia - 1 of th/ concntratns evn increasd th/ effct "Vitamin C at the concentration of 20 mmol L-1, was not effective, but it even increased methemoglobin formation significantly"

s/ as othrs hve sd - u r spredng misnfrmatn whch on ste lke sasu = incrdbly dangrs

shre artcls abt dffrnt treatmnts whch r b-ing investg8td fne - bt d/ nt shre misnfo & undr-rsearchd dta whle presntng tht info as 'proof' & 'fct' & simtneously talkng dwn on othr usrs

 

[heartbroken12]

Reposted on Dot's behalf:

Drinking orange juice caused the below failed SN attempt.

Jen0804

16/09/2019​

Failed Feb 2019. Reason: mixing with orange juice (vitamin c cancels SN). Still became very ill. Still have minor health problems but I am alive

[NOTE: Member suspects orange juice's vitamin C cancelled efficacy of SN.] AsexualBarbieBoy said: "Are the health problems related to the Sn? If so, what are they?" REPLY: "Alopecia. Attempted in February, hair started coming out within that same week and continued until June. It's slowly growing back now, thank god. I'm female and of child-bearing age. My cycles stopped completely so I believe it can mess up hormones/endocrine - not sure about long term fertility or male fertility etc. Immediately after taking it and the whole two weeks after, my kidneys and bowels just werent functioning - I also couldn't feel hunger. I ate an apple and two bites of a hospital sandwich for a whole week or so (drank as normal) but I was so not hungry. There you have it, those are my long term symptoms from s n failure. Not so severe but still a pain."

Source; https://docs.google.com/document/d/1OKnH260kpVBA9_o3_hpvmLW5sdhemQ-d8GC9GwTP2i8/mobilebasic

Ok but quoting Jen0804 saying "Vitamin C cancels SN" does not make that claim true.

Someone else mixed their SN with Coca Cola and other soft drinks and they failed- possibly because other substances interrupted absorption- then again other people have mixed SN with other food and drink and have still passed away - you are taking someone's assumption at face value when there is little information to support that assumption.

The "best form of evidence" would be a randomised control trial or meta-analysis studying these specific effects of Vitamin C on effects of SN poisoning- not an anecdotal comment from a layman on an internet forum.

Your question on Meth blue reminded me of this thread; https://sanctioned-suicide.net/threads/my-methylene-blue-kit.100655/

I certainly am going to try to source some like OP did in that above thread. Might even ask my doctor for some saying I have SN.

RE' Orange juice, it has vitamin C in it, which counteracts the effects of SN; https://naturallyconscious.blogspot.com/2010/01/drink-oj-with-your-carcinogenic-cured.html

1 - that is a blog not a scientific paper

2 - 'the effect of SN' - which effect - just because that person claims that drinking orange juice long term helps to prevent cancer in a blog does not equate to nullifying specific effects of SN poisoning which creates methmoglobnemia

My personal opinion on the matter is i believe you haven't got a clue. Hence why you haven't posted any evidence. Thus far I've posted 7 sources include pubmed (the authority on these matters) which states; Furthermore, vitamin C can directly reduce methemoglobin and is proven to treat cyanosis effectively.13

Antioxidant effect of different vitamins on methemoglobin production: An in vitro study

Nitrite intoxication occurs frequently in ruminants and equines. The most common treatment of this disorder is administration of 1% methylene blue, although the use of some antioxidant agents e.g. vitamins and complementary treatment may also be useful. ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Something else that undermines confidence in anything you post, is when you said & I quote "it was my way of asking if we should keep a bottle of booze just incase since there are users that owed their failure to having drank alcohol." I had to then reply "No I don't suggest having a bottle of Vodka straight after a failed SN attempt. Nor does that sound like a remotely good idea in my opinion."


And your the one talking about harming others with mis info???


Another personal opinion of mine, is there is no point arguing with .... people. I'll let readers fill in the blank. Goodnight ;-)

You are neglecting lots of other factors here.

• This paper is based on petri dish experiments- not treating a human with concentrated SN poisoning
• Vitamin C along with methylene Blue are used with specific dosing and administration - any medication used improperly can make things worse even if that medication saves lives when used correctly
• SN concentration used for this experiment was very low and only 1/3 vitamin C concentrations lowered methemoglobinemia- one of the concentrations even increased the effect: "Vitamin C at the concentration of 20 mmol L-1, was not effective, but it even increased methemoglobin formation significantly"

So as others have said - you are spreading misinformation which on a site is Sasu is incredibly dangerous.

Share articles about different treatments which are being investigated- fine. But do not share misinformation and under-researched data while presenting that information as "proof" & "fact" & simultaneously talking down on other users.