What are your highest values?

[blanketyblk]

Being open and talking. everything else i can deal with. but if i don't know what is going on inside your head. i can't work with you.

 

[262653]

Serenity and peace.
It makes me sad just to think about it. Both are incompatible with living, which is a constant hunger... bound to live like a raised dead. It's no wonder necromancy is widely frowned upon.
Too idealistic... seemingly unattainable, but you said the highest. What can possibly come on par with these two? No hunger, no rotting, no change, no suffering... too appealing to think about anything else.

Oh, are we are talking about the value of others to ourselves? Then it's definitely usefulness. Be it from kindness, erudition, selfishness, sense of humor, self-awareness or whatever. "If the person is perceived as useful to me, then I value this person."

 

[Black_Knight]

Freedom, pleasure, wonder, whimsy, love, bonding, authenticity, honesty, compassion. If I still had a sense of humor I'd appreciate a little bit of impish fun now and again, so long as it stays benign, the more obscure the better. I should've been born a wood elf.

Man it looks like I'm the only filthy hedonist here lol.

 

[Lifetimepunishment]

Solidarity

 

[Kikoo Loool]

Honesty.

That's why I hate my wife.

 

[kohaku]

Treating everyone like a human being. Equality. Faith in psychology. Hating conservatives.

 

[kolski]

Honesty, trust, and freedom.

 

[ScorpiusDragon]

compassion for one's fellow human beings.

 

[irrelevant_string]

Serenity and peace.
It makes me sad just to think about it. Both are incompatible with living, which is a constant hunger... bound to live like a raised dead. It's no wonder necromancy is widely frowned upon.
Too idealistic... seemingly unattainable, but you said the highest. What can possibly come on par with these two? No hunger, no rotting, no change, no suffering... too appealing to think about anything else.

Oh, are we are talking about the value of others to ourselves? Then it's definitely usefulness. Be it from kindness, erudition, selfishness, sense of humor, self-awareness or whatever. "If the person is perceived as useful to me, then I value this person."

Avatar checks out

 

[Mr2005]

Honesty and integrity. Empathy and love.

 

[262653]

Avatar checks out

You played it! Tell me you played it. Of course you played it... What I am, a blithering idiot?
You did played it, didn't you?

 

[CuriousAboutThis]

Kindness, humillity, respect, intelligence, honesty, self-awareness

As these are also important to me I would also say loyalty other than the typical family, friends, and pets some form of morals and balance.

 

[Kyrok]

I think the purer it is, the more unnatural it is.

Well, you're assuming that what is natural is self-interested. That's generally rejected by modern evolutionary theory.
Also, even if it were true, then maybe that says we're capable of being better than what is "natural." After all, that which is natural isn't necessarily good.

 

[Mr2005]

Honesty and integrity. Empathy and love.

Copying things from Wikipedia. Not taking yourself too seriously

As these are also important to me I would also say loyalty other than the typical family, friends, and pets some form of morals and balance.

Loyaltys overrated. Actually it's potentially dangerous

 

[agreement]

Consistency

 

[irrelevant_string]

You played it! Tell me you played it. Of course you played it... What I am, a blithering idiot?
You did played it, didn't you?

I didn't

 

[burnedCookie]

I don't like this word, too often used by people, especially big corps, but rarely followed by actions that match the words
if people could just respect each other and live in peace it would be a good start

 

[262653]

I entirely recognize that value is a delusion.

But what does it imply? I'm often hearing phrases such as "<something> is an illusion/delusion", like ego and free will, but what does it tell us?
What also would be true (or false), if we recognize value as delusion? That we shouldn't have them (for example), or shouldn't take them seriously?

I didn't

Well, if you ever want to, and get a chance. It has fancy dialogue lines, made by a young and ambitious game studio (at that time). Magic invades Victorian era. Feature to play as mentally deficient, with stunted dialogue options and journal entries.

 

[Temporarilyabsurd]

Doubt .

 

[irrelevant_string]

Well, if you ever want to, and get a chance. It has fancy dialogue lines, made by a young and ambitious game studio (at that time). Magic invades Victorian era. Feature to play as mentally deficient, with stunted dialogue options and journal entries.

But wait, am I really mentally deficient or do speech difficulties and emotional immaturity only make me seem so? Supposedly I'm a brilliant mathematician with a keen grasp of numbers.

Oh this is amazing, much like me in real life. Well, minus the brilliant mathematician part. I do love mathematics though.

I'm often hearing phrases such as "<something> is an illusion/delusion", like ego and free will, but what does it tell us?

I often wonder about that too. What I concluded is that saying "X is an illusion" means that X isn't exactly what it appears to be, not that there isn't anything that deserves to be called X. So in the context of the ego illusion debates, you'd often hear people say that what we think of when we say "I" isn't something that can be located precisely. It might seem to us to be a unified whole in some sense, but in reality it's a bunch of separate processes that somehow give rise to the illusion but cannot be said to be unified in a proper sense.
There's probably some difference between illusion and delusion, but they seem to be related. I'm not sure though, maybe we'd call an illusion a delusion if it turns out to have negative consequences as well.
So @TheDragonoid says

We see morality/values as ends in themselves, even though they can't aid us in our quest for a better life, what can be more delusional than that?

I'm not sure if there is a contradiction in those two claims if we really consider them to be ends in themselves, well, at least if that's the opposite of - means to an end . But if we, as is usually the case, believe them to actually be beneficial when that turns out to be false, then you might say that we were delusional.
But they seem to be a necessity for a functional society, if we don't get back to being hunter-gatherers of course, which isn't a reasonable expectation anyway, but even if that were feasible, it's still debatable wether it would create better conditions for human flourishing. So they are useful in some sense. Did you mean that we do not benefit from them on the individual level? In that case, I can agree.

 

[262653]

But wait, am I really mentally deficient or do speech difficulties and emotional immaturity only make me seem so? Supposedly I'm a brilliant mathematician with a keen grasp of numbers.

Oh this is amazing, much like me in real life. Well, minus the brilliant mathematician part. I do love mathematics though.

There are both options, really mentally deficient is someone with intelligence score of equal or less than 4. For another one there is actually a background called "Idiot Savant". You have speech difficulties and everyone around thinks you're an imbecile, but actually secretly is a math genius. (Also your dialogue options are always stunted despite having high INT.) One of my favorites, on par with a chemist who used herself as a guinea pig for self-enhancing experiments, and indeed she succeeded, but also screwed up her appearance as a result. Oh, characters with low beauty score also get special treatment.

*Well, both options probably have the same lines, but savant gets coherent journal entries, while actually dumb character is also writing gibberish.

What I concluded is that saying "X is an illusion" means that X isn't exactly what it appears to be, not that there isn't anything that deserves to be called X.

Yes, that seems to be more sensible, and the other thoughts too. I don't know what to comment on that, but would gladly hear more about it from both of your insight.

 

[irrelevant_string]

a chemist who used herself as a guinea pig for self-enhancing experiments, and indeed she succeeded, but also screwed up her appearance as a result.

That's just brilliant, she'd be my favorite as well.

Oh, characters with low beauty score also get special treatment.

Wow, I'd be extra special in this universe. I'd still be a special snowflake like now, but unironically.

 

[irrelevant_string]

but sometimes i seen to condescending and granting thanks to my lack of social grace. I apologize if that'sthe case.

Not at all. In fact I may have sounded that way myself. But it wasn't my intention. I merely wanted you to elaborate a bit so that I could better understand what you meant.
And this is what I think now. Feel free to correct me if I misrepresent your views.
First of all I now realize that I misunderstood you here:

We see morality/values as ends in themselves, even though they can't aid us in our quest for a better life, what can be more delusional than that?

Because I was so stuck on my definition of delusion, I took the "even though" as meaning "in spite of" somehow as I was expecting a contradiction somewhere, whereas now I see that the second part of the sentence could have been merely an elaboration on the first one.
It makes sense now. I can't really explain how my non-native-English brain manages to abuse the language like this. It's so inflexible.

So the delusion manifests itself in the fact that we are giving precedence to moral values(that are only ends in themselves) over acting naturally, where better lives are achieved by natural behavior rather than by establishing large scale societies and where striving for better lives is obviously in our interests?
And we're actually deluded about the best course of action for achieving that which is in our best interests.

What I meant when I made that distinction between the benefit on the individual-level and on the level of society was just the fact that you benefit from the morality of other people that is regulated by the laws that are predicated on said moral values, so if everyone(as in every member of the society) benefits from it, I say - the society benefits. But your own morality isn't necessarily beneficial to you personally. It wouldn't be only if you could get away with not reciprocating though.

although the huntering-and-gathering lifestyle is more beneficial, people still first think of things in terms of the system - in terms of how they can fit in this particular state of civilization -, not on how we should act to ensure tangible satisfaction.

I see the logic in that if we presupposed that civilizations aren't beneficial to individuals in any way and that we could do away with them, but I doubt that people you're talking about are making that presupposition.
At this point if we both agreed that the lives of hunter-gatherers really are better on average(on average? Or do we determine the superiority of their lifestyle in a different way?) and that it is their lack of(or just different) moral values that is responsible for that, we would agree on this completely.

 

[sadsadinfp]

Kindness, gentleness, compassion, respect for other people - in a word, empathy. I don't understand people who derive pleasure from others' pain, and don't feel something when they see someone else suffering. I guess everyone's damaged in some way, and it some people it takes the form of hardening their hearts to others. Unfortunately our society is hard and unfeeling, and for me anyway there's no way to live outside of it, and that's why I have to leave.

 

[a_strange_day]

I dont have any, I just try to be a good guy every day, easier said than done

 

[woxihuanni]

Rationalism. It is suffocating to politely listen to anything irrational, and try to avoid confrontation.

And loyalty: keeping your promises, having integrity.

 

[justanotherday]

I feel for animals. Most people are horrible.

 

[Élégie]

Dignity, freedom, authenticity, simplicity, respect, wisdom, consistency, justice...

 

[sadgirl2002]

Kindness, honesty, loyalty, intelligence, compassion, love, selflessness, patience, compassion. The list goes on.

 

[Hexen]

Honor for sure. I have been fucked over by a lot of people.