I have it all but I'm indifferent to living, anyone in the same boat?

[Alec]

I'm feel very disappointed with life as well. The things I thought that would feel amazing I found out that feel only kinda good. But they aren't amazing enough and don't feel good enough for me to want to stick around here. There's only one thing that I truly want now, which is why I'm still sticking around, it's almost an impossible thing but I decided to give it one last chance and if a miracle doesn't happen before my deadline, ph well, there's no point in waiting anymore I'll just be wasting time being bored to death with life. Then on top of that I would feel pain for not living with the "thing" I want the most plus depression and I think bipolar disorder, plus ptsd and a bunch of other stuff. But honestly I feel like maybe I could deal with all those stuff if I felt like life could feel good enough like it could give me actual real pleasure and make me feel good and not just bore me. Because I get bored with almost all the things that other people find fascinating and love very much and sometimes even choose to live for those things only. It's just boring to me, I don't know, maybe we are feeling the same, maybe we are the same in some kind of way. In any case, I love you, hope you'll find whatever it is you are looking for! And I support you, whatever your decision is!

 

[Jojojo]

I can relate in some way. I am 23 as of right now, and I have been bored in life since childhood. With every new step in life I thought I'd find something to my liking, but nothing ever came up. I never had any problems in my childhood or school years, by that I mean: never bullied, not abused by adults or any other negative life changing moments, had friends, had girlfriends and some other positive moments. My family has been always supporting me both mentally and financially: supported me throughout life despite my horrible teenage attitude and always provided me with extra amount of funds to live a life. And as of present, I have plenty of opportunities and funding to flourish in life.

In a nutshell, my point is that I don't have a single reason to seek for a way to end my life from a perspective of a reasonable person. But despite that, I was never truly happy in life - always felt out of the place in this world. I lost interest or passion in anything I tried within short periods of time: from hours to months, but never longer. I have been in several relationships - all of them failed within weeks with the longest one for 3 weeks. I simply rapidly lost any interest in a person.

The reasoning to that behavior is that I was bored at the start, and I after a certain life event I realized: life is not worth living. It was one and only time in my life when I completely forgot that I have a brain. Instead, I let emotions take over and committed a series of suicide attempts which obviously failed since I had no guts to execute them. Funny enough, no one ever found it about them except for my mother who, I think, had some suspiciously extra caring behavior towards me during that time. Nevertheless, after first couple of weeks reign returned to brain, and I started to think. I started to pay more attention to others, and what was happening in the world in general. I was reading news, surfing the internet, social media and all other mass media.

Watching certain videos, reading certain news, witnessing in real life brutal and inhuman actions - all that had a strong negative impact on my view of the human kind and life. I started to have anger issues, and lost control very easily which caused self-harm both mentally and physically. At some point, being a human - felt disgusting , so as living in this maniacally hypocritical modern society. And this isn't just blind hate - I know there is good people and moments to live for. I just can't live with this understanding - pros of life simply cant outweigh cons in my case. There is just too much bad in the world for me, and I can't ignore it. I stopped trying to achieve anything in life since then.

As of right now, I think I am at the point when it is time for me. The only reason that kept me here for that long is my mother. I am the only child, and just thinking of what she will have to go through... It's the only thing that I can feel, and it tremendously hurts me. But I never had any interest in life to start with, and if my mother wasn't alive - I would end this pointless existence without any second thought. So, I believe I am making a right choice for both of us since my future existence will only hurt her - I can't force myself to pretend anymore

 

[Final Escape]

No offense but when people ask for citations they are usually looking for scientifically backed studies and/or information. Not the radical views of an a-hole white supremacist. I have lost a lot of respect for you based on posting a source from a "whining tiki-torch holder." Might as well post some ISIS rhetoric to go along with this while you're at it...

He's not a white supremicist, but I admit it's hard to take in these difficult truths about why baby murder is legal. That video doesn't even cover the full scope of the harm abortion causes in society but it is accurate as far as politics go. I'm sure at some point some woman has benefited from an abortion but a lot of them are carried out for the convenience of the mother, or the father, or the family of the girl or woman who doesn't want to help her take care of the child or something. Maybe your employer will fire u because you're pregnant.

 

[LMFAO FOCKERS]

He's not a white supremicist, but I admit it's hard to take in these difficult truths about why baby murder is legal. That video doesn't even cover the full scope of the harm abortion causes in society but it is accurate as far as politics go. I'm sure at some point some woman has benefited from an abortion but a lot of them are carried out for the convenience of the mother, or the father, or the family of the girl or woman who doesn't want help her take care of the child or something. Maybe your employer will fire u because you're pregnant.

LMFAO!!!

Sweetie...at this point nothing you say is credible. You dont even do your homework. You're letting some a-hole infiltrate your mind and you dont even have any clue who he is. Do your research and stop embarrassing yourself.

Stefan Molyneux

google Stefan Molyneux

 

[woxihuanni]

What do you deem a good marriage? If you're not in love with your partner, all their meek, compromising, ineffectual and socially correct presence cannot give you lust for life.

 

[Irunfar]

Hello folks. I've been contemplating suicide every single day for the past ten years. I just turned 31. I'm certain I'll end my life. I just don't know when it will happen - it depends on when my parents and my husband will pass. I'm still around because I don't want to ruin my loved ones' lives.

From the outside, I should have every reason to be happy - a good marriage, financially well off, loved ones still around, physically healthy, can work if I want to but don't need to work if I don't want to, grew up in a loving family, being smart and good-looking, etc - it's that top 1% life that most people wish for but can't have.

I've been thinking hard about what keeps people going. The answer I've come up with is "hopes to achieve certain goals with the belief that those goals are attainable" and "most people's inability to accurately predict how happy they'll be in the future based on what's happening to them." I also can't help wonder why people like Anthony Boudain, Kate Spade and Robin Williams committed suicide, and why that woman named one of Atlanta's most powerful and influential woman of 2019 killed her two adult children before turning the gun on herself.

Here's a good metaphor: people are like donkeys. A stick is tied to the bridle of a donkey so that it extends above and in front of the animal's head, and the carrot hangs on a string from the far end of the stick, just out of reach of its mouth. Attracted by the sight and smell, the donkey steps forward to bite at the carrot, but as it is attached to the stick, the carrot also moves forward and remains out of reach. The donkey repeats the same ineffective strategy ad infinitum, thereby pulling or carrying whatever or whomever it's laden with. The carrot is common life goals such as owning a home free and clear, having a stable well paying job, finding true love, etc.

It's easy to understand why people who struggle to make ends meet and those with crappy upbringing want to end their existence. They're probably at the brink of collapsing on the ground from all the weight they've been carrying. Even if they want to eat the carrot, they're too exhausted to move forward.

There are also people like me on the opposite end of the spectrum who've tasted all the carrots they wanted. They realize the carrots don't taste as good as they expected. The joy from eating the carrots fades after a while. They don't have particularly strong greed and vanity so they don't really desire more or bigger carrots.

Most people fall in the middle of the spectrum, setting one life goal after another and focus on achieving those goals. Some people are so goal-oriented that they don't bother to self reflect and think about the meaning of life.

I recently watched a Yale University lecture about scientific research on happiness. Many of the results are interesting and counter-intuitive. The studies reveal that people radically overestimate the effects of many life events. Some events feel really big when they happen, but after 6 months or a year later, people adapt and their happiness level goes back to the previous level, which is the idea of "hedonic treadmill" (you keep on running, but no matter how fast you run, you stay where you are). We think those events would have permanent and profound effects but they often don't. There's even a technical term for this: affective forecasting, which most of us are bad at doing. Another interesting finding is that our happiness level is rather fixed, in part genetically, in part we get used to what happens in our lives.

I bet I'm genetically predisposed to depression and suicide - my maternal grandma hung herself.

Some people conduct their lives according to religious doctrines. I think the popular religions and scientific theories might provide a piece of the puzzle, a sneak peek of the reality, but none provides the full picture. Given how religions are also tied to politics, atrocities have been committed in the name of religion, how humans possess limited knowledge of the cosmos and how consciousness can arise out of something unconscious, etc, I remain agnostic. I don't judge anyone being religious but I can't fully adopt any belief system either. Me being a brain in a jar or in a simulation run by an advanced civilization is also plausible.

I lack some instincts that the majority of my fellow humans possess, such as maternal instinct and survival instinct. I gave birth to my first child two years ago. She's sensitive and timid in nature, but overall healthy. I've been struggling to bond with her. I wish she does not exist and I love my cat more than her. I never liked children - I find them too loud, messy, boring, needy, repetitive, and stupid. My mom told me my maternal instinct would kick in once I give birth and said I would feel differently about my own child vs other ppl's children - not in my case. Spending time with my toddler is an unpleasant chore.

I'm on the antidepressant, Lexapro, taking the max dose. It takes some edges off and reduces my impulses. But it's at best a bandage over a wound. Me ending my life won't be an impulsive decision. No medication, no therapists, no helplines can change my view on life in general.

My deepest fears are there's an afterlife, reincarnation, and physical pain. I imagine when my loved ones pass, I'd be devastated and feel part of me die with them, but at the same time, I'd feel relieved that one fewer person will trap me in this world.

I have this feeling that my soul (if there's one) is a slave/prisoner to my genetic materials that just want to be replicated and passed down.

I also feel that there's a ceiling for happiness. Once past that ceiling, too much happiness turns into pain, but there's no limit to mental agony. When I learned about the different substances and drugs in medical school, the effects they create are often compared with orgasm. For instance, the euphoria people feel on heroin is about 250 times stronger than orgasm. I'm not sure how that's measured since euphoria is a subjective experience and can't really be calibrated. Anyway, I remember feeling euphoric from acid trips. It was so intense that I couldn't take it. It makes sense. Orgasms typically last a short time and feel good, but imagine having a 4 hr orgasm - that would be exhausting.

I'm able to feel joy. But I'd readily give up the opportunities of feeling joy in exchange for not being able to feel any pain. There's more joy than pain in my life right now, but I want to feel zero pain.

I passed out from alcohol poisoning about 13 years ago. It was an accident, not a suicide attempt. I was rushed to the ER and had my stomach pumped, put on a ventilator. The last thing I remembered before I woke up from the ER was me falling asleep on my bed. No pain felt before and during my blackout. I hope a successfully executed suicide will feel the same. I haven't decided on a method. I don't have a substance abuse problem. I barely drink any alcohol; I went on acid trips and smoked weed a couple of times but never got addicted.

I'd be interested in hearing stories from suicidal people who have a "perfect" life and their take on the meaning of life and their future plans.

Like any illness, depression doesn't care about your income, IQ, stature, or your social prowess. I'm in a very similar situation. From the outside my life looks very content and desirable. (maybe not as desirable as yours, LOL) However inside, there's a vast emptiness, overwhelming sadness, and just despair. So, here I am on this board researching and planning. If you'd like to chat, please feel free to message me. Also, I like your metaphor of the donkey, from my perspective it's definitely relatable.

 

[cant cry]

When people "have it all" and are unhappy, they don't really have it all. They've got some problem they just aren't aware of. The fact that you aren't bonding with your child is evidence something is very off. You just aren't aware of what. Since you've got money have you considered finding a good therapist to talk things out with?
I know there are some bad ones out there but I had a great one who really helped me see things wrong in my life that I couldn't see. I got her for free at a woman's shelter and would love to get someone like her now but I can't afford it. You've got the money so you could probably find someone you like.
There are also physical problems, like low blood sugar or hypothyroidism, that can cause someone to feel down and not know why. I have never believed that truly having it all makes people bored or unhappy, though.

 

[nitrogen]

Hi @nitrogen

As I read your post it made me smile. You're the first person I've ever heard also use the carrot analogy. I've used it alot over the last 15+ years to explain where I'm at in life and why I'm over this chit. However most don't really get it. People assume once you get a modicum of success you will be fulfilled but sadly that is not the case.

Like you, I went to ivy university; I also worked at some of the top fortune 100 companies. I always thought I'd get married, have kids, etc. However it didnt happen. There are a number of reasons for this, the most important of which is that I dont really fit into social norms including my "expected" social circle. I'm 2E and people dont really get me. Not to mention I grew up poor and went through a chit load of trauma that most in my social circle would never understand. All of this makes me relatively unique.

I find the average man boring after a while and not mentally stimulating to talk to. As a result, I have difficulty connecting with men. However I began to realize that I have difficulty connecting deeply on a longer term basis with people in general (including women.)

I'm uber impulsive and spontaneous. I tried to fill my life up with activities: solo international travel, dance, socializing, motorcycles, church, or anything that I thought would give me the ability to connect with people as well as the excitement of mastery / completed goals. They did their job for a while, then the boredom returned fiercely and I was right back where I started. I always thought that once I got married it would go away. However after hearing and reading a few stories like yours I wonder if that was just some faulty construct in my mind, based on the dreams of family that I once had for my life.

The feedback loop in my life has been one of putting out the positive but getting back 2x the negative. As such I just stopped bothering. I have become emotionally numb to the point where nothing is worth my time including people.

Theres much more going on with me, however it would require a book.


I dont have enough information to offer a perspective but I'd like to ask some questions if you'd like feedback:

• Does your husband mentally stimulate you? Or is it that he so tired from work when he comes home you are just another part of his setup in the "perfect" life (i.e. great sex from his beautiful wife, nice home, child etc.) I'm not blaming him. I just see this alot in accomplished women who become housewives. Life becomes overly routine.
• Do you think if you did not have a child and you were doing something else you wanted to do you'd be happier?
• Is it possible that you have become numb to life after experiencing all this death because you now realize life is meaningless?
• Are there any women friends who "get" you?
• Have you considered giving your child to your mom, etc. for a few months to give you some time away from everyone to think deeply by yourself?
• Are you putting on a "fake" face to keep the household happy / together so that your husband won't think you're not grateful?
• Is it possible that you felt some disconnect from your mom (despite her labeling you her favorite) such that you did not develop your ability to connect internally with others in general?
• If there is anything on your mind that I did not touch upon, that you think would be useful to know about you, feel free to share.

@LMFAO FOCKERS

I don't fit into social norms either, neither does my husband. We find the mainstream value superficial and hypocritical. So-called norm is a set of standards derived from and accepted by the majority, aka, the donkeys that keep trudging forward to bite one carrot after another, believing they'll be happily ever after once they eat the carrots they crave for.

Like you, I tried to fill my life up with activities, which get old and boring after a while, endless novelty is impossible, so I eventually lost interest in them and don't really develop new interests. I've also reached the point where nothing truly intrigues me. I suppose if I really want to just feel something, I can try extreme (perhaps even reckless) activities like cave diving, do drugs, travel around the world solo, etc. I'm reluctant to try them because I don't want to risk agonizing injuries and horrific death. That movie series Hostel is based on true events, yikes. I want my death to be in control of my own hands and as peaceful as possible.

I used to care about how others look at me and I wanted to be popular - most young adults in school go through that phase. I no longer care to impress people: if I do well, they'd want something from me or get jealous; if I don't do well, they wouldn't care or they might even derive a sense of superiority from my misfortune. My parents and husband are exceptions. I want them to love me.

I was in a co-ed fraternity and went to parties all the time in college - I've never been a people person but I forced myself to socialize and make as many friends as possible to look cool and likable. As the years went by, it became apparent that most friendships aren't worth pursuing or maintaining. Like how Aristotle categorizes friendship into three groups: those based on utility, those based on pleasure or delight, those grounded in virtue. The first two types are self-regarding and selfishly motivated, though mutually satisfactory. Unfortunately, almost all friendships fall into the first two types - I don't really need them. As for now, I have a couple of very long term friends (>10 yr) and they're enough for my social needs. Also, one good spouse/soul mate is better than 100 mediocre friends - my husband actually fulfills 80% of my social needs.

I've adopted a minimalist lifestyle. If what I have is enough, I don't bother to buy more or fancier stuff. I've never been materialistic to start with. When I was an immature 20 something, I used to show off my wealth not because I was materialistic, but because I wanted to make friends. Now I'm pretty lowkey.

I never care about ceremonies and celebrations. My husband and I didn't bother to have a wedding (I insisted); we no longer celebrate holidays and birthdays since doing similar things each year gets old and boring. The only thing we do for birthdays and holidays is going out for dinner and binge watch shows together - the typical things that people find relaxing but nothing special for the occasion.

Since you went through lots of trauma when you grew up, is your inability to making long term commitments possibly a self-defense mechanism?

To answer your questions:

Yes, my husband mentally stimulates me. He also suffers from bouts of depression from time to time, but he's high functioning and not suicidal. His depression is rooted in childhood trauma - emotionally abused by a manipulative psychopathic mother who was also a CFO of a Fortune 500 company. He's intelligent, insightful, reads a lot of books, etc. We understand each other as we think similarly. We've been together for 12 years but never run out of stuff to talk about. He's also my best friend. We're equals in this relationship and appreciate the things we do for each other and for the family. @woxihuanni

Yes, I think if I did not have a child, instead of caring for her, I'd be doing something else that I'd enjoy more. Even if just sitting there and doing absolutely nothing is better than dealing with her constant demands and noises. However, she's securely attached to me even though I struggle to bond with her because I try my best to fulfill my responsibility as a mother. She gets plenty of hugs and kisses from me. What I have to do goes before what I want or don't want to do.

I actually haven't come to the conclusion that life is meaningless. In fact, I'll never be able to reach a conclusion on this. Without answers to questions such as what's consciousness, how and why did the universe come to exist 13.8 billion yrs ago, how is subjective reality different from objective reality, what will reconcile the theories of general relativity and quantum mechanics, what's in the higher dimensions, are there parallel universes, reincarnation, afterlife, etc, I can't determine whether life has meaning or not. For instance,

I could be a brain in a jar with electrodes hooked on it. Solipsism is a scary concept. In a Nature article published in April 2019, the cellular function of 32 pig brains was partially restored four hrs after they were slaughtered. Given the short history of modern science, it's completely plausible that an advanced civilization can fully revive or even build a human brain. In this scenario, life would be meaningless.

Or maybe there really is nirvana or heaven. Suffering and doing good deeds in this life could wash away bad karma or sin so I could go to heaven after death. In this scenario, this life would be meaningful, and even suffering becomes a good thing.

Some people say, each individual human should FIND meaning in his/her life despite the objective reality. Well, that sounds a bit cheesy, like an ostrich sticking its head in the sand.

Too bad nobody will know these answers, at least not in my lifetime. In addition to realizing how fragile life can be and how nothing stays fixed, I've developed this "whatever" attitude toward life. No point of trying anything too hard; nothing has to happen; no need to think too far ahead. I'm just following the natural flow of things, like a leaf bobbing up and down, drifting with the current in a river.

My women friends don't really get me. They're either focused on fighting their way up the corporate ladder or lost in their own way. Plus, friendships among women tend to be tricky: A is B's best friend as long as A isn't as hot, A's husband isn't as successful, A's kid isn't as smart, etc; at the same time, A needs to be hot enough, husband successful enough and kid smart enough, etc to be worthy of B's friendship and respect. Most women are competitive and envious.

I put on a fake happy face in front of my parents, but not my husband. My husband knows about my feelings and thoughts pretty well. He even shares some of my perspectives. However, I don't constantly vent or bring them up. If by talking about something does not solve a problem, there's no need to constantly talk about it, because that's just annoying.

The single thing my parents want most in this world is my happiness and they'd do anything for me. Although my mom pushed me to have a child, I'm ultimately the one who made the decision to do so. The child did put some strain on our family relationships: between my husband and my mom, between me and my husband's parents, between me and my mom, between me and my husband. Nonetheless, our family relationships were strong and good to start with, everybody in the family is educated, courteous and rational, we all have our own residence so we're able to keep a comfortable physical distance from one another - no relationship has been damaged beyond repair.

My mom has realized she's made a mistake and she deeply regrets it. I've been trying to give her the impression that I'm slowly accepting the child into my life so she doesn't beat herself up about it. I've made mistakes that have given my parents headaches in the past. They always comforted me and told me it was ok. I should reciprocate in the same way.

I feel disconnected to my parents in the way that I have to put on a fake happy face in front of them. No matter how much pain and numbness I feel, they need to believe I'm having a blast. They'd support me as much as they can if they know about my true thoughts, but that'd sadden them. I want them to be happy and they can't be happy unless I'm happy. I feel disconnected to them also because they fit in the social norm so well that I'm not on the same plane with them.

 

[nitrogen]

I can relate in some way. I am 23 as of right now, and I have been bored in life since childhood. With every new step in life I thought I'd find something to my liking, but nothing ever came up. I never had any problems in my childhood or school years, by that I mean: never bullied, not abused by adults or any other negative life changing moments, had friends, had girlfriends and some other positive moments. My family has been always supporting me both mentally and financially: supported me throughout life despite my horrible teenage attitude and always provided me with extra amount of funds to live a life. And as of present, I have plenty of opportunities and funding to flourish in life.

In a nutshell, my point is that I don't have a single reason to seek for a way to end my life from a perspective of a reasonable person. But despite that, I was never truly happy in life - always felt out of the place in this world. I lost interest or passion in anything I tried within short periods of time: from hours to months, but never longer. I have been in several relationships - all of them failed within weeks with the longest one for 3 weeks. I simply rapidly lost any interest in a person.

The reasoning to that behavior is that I was bored at the start, and I after a certain life event I realized: life is not worth living. It was one and only time in my life when I completely forgot that I have a brain. Instead, I let emotions take over and committed a series of suicide attempts which obviously failed since I had no guts to execute them. Funny enough, no one ever found it about them except for my mother who, I think, had some suspiciously extra caring behavior towards me during that time. Nevertheless, after first couple of weeks reign returned to brain, and I started to think. I started to pay more attention to others, and what was happening in the world in general. I was reading news, surfing the internet, social media and all other mass media.

Watching certain videos, reading certain news, witnessing in real life brutal and inhuman actions - all that had a strong negative impact on my view of the human kind and life. I started to have anger issues, and lost control very easily which caused self-harm both mentally and physically. At some point, being a human - felt disgusting , so as living in this maniacally hypocritical modern society. And this isn't just blind hate - I know there is good people and moments to live for. I just can't live with this understanding - pros of life simply cant outweigh cons in my case. There is just too much bad in the world for me, and I can't ignore it. I stopped trying to achieve anything in life since then.

As of right now, I think I am at the point when it is time for me. The only reason that kept me here for that long is my mother. I am the only child, and just thinking of what she will have to go through... It's the only thing that I can feel, and it tremendously hurts me. But I never had any interest in life to start with, and if my mother wasn't alive - I would end this pointless existence without any second thought. So, I believe I am making a right choice for both of us since my future existence will only hurt her - I can't force myself to pretend anymore

@Irunfar @Jojojo @Alec Reading your posts is like my inner self speaking.

I'm not very fond of the human species either. Humans along with chimpanzees are the only known species on earth that commit genocide. Ultimately, everything living creatures do is maximizing fitness & survival so the genetic materials get passed down.

News tends to report more negative events because that's what catches people's attention the most.

I've never had anger issues though. Sometimes I have extremely violent fantasies but never act on them. I view gore videos and pictures to satisfy my morbid curiosity and to feel something. I went to medical school wanting to be a trauma surgeon so I have a high tolerance for gore.

Alec. What's the thing that you truly want now that's powerful enough to make you stick around? I'm curious.

Jojojo. What makes you say your future existence will only hurt your mother? Wouldn't she get hurt even more by your passing?

I simply can't die before my parents and my husband die. The thought of going through my loved ones die on me is terrifying, but the thought of me living another 30 or even 50 years (my parents are in their 50s and husband in his 30s) is equally terrifying. @Hotsackage @zeroambition

As for now, there's more joy than pain in my life. But even if in the future, there's only pain left in my life, I still have to live for my loved ones.

Like what @Life sucks pointed out, no matter what the circumstances are, even if they have it all, they'll see depressive facts about life and experience pain. That's the reality of living a human life. @Done at Fifty I'm able to feel joy, but I'd be glad to give up my chance of feeling joy in exchange for not feeling any pain. I'm sorry about your situation. It does sound miserable. A lot of people are living a life similar to yours.

 

[LMFAO FOCKERS]

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@LMFAO FOCKERS​

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Since you went through lots of trauma when you grew up, is your inability to making long term commitments possibly a self-defense mechanism?​

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​

I think you processed my post wrong. (Hard to know when typing and reading words so no worries.) Definitely not a defense mechanism. I didnt say I dont want long-term commitments. I very much do but cant find anyone compatible. I've had friendships that were 10-30+ years that recently were dissolved. Either I'm bored with the monotony of discussion (no growth), I became too depressed for them and wasnt exhibiting what they perceive as strength (I've always been the never let anything get you down for long person), or I just stopped disclosing because they could not keep my privacy. I'm kind of glad most are gone. The others that I find boring I feel bad about but its hard to pay attention to conversation thats not mentally stimulating which is a bi-product of my ADHD/2E brain.

As far as men I was engaged once to someone who secretly stole my credit card and ran me into 5 figure debt. I had to sue them for my money. I will spare you the details...

A relative used to always say to me "the man who's for you hasn't been born yet"...Well that about wraps it up I suppose!

I am attracted to smart men. But most smart men dont want a woman who wants to travel, explore the world or gets bored. Men have to feel like they can satisfy their woman's every whim (even if thats not realistic). Most dont feel comfortable if there is an inkling that she has a bit of a restless spirit. Most prefer one who enjoys the monotony. I can't sit home and binge watch movies/shows even if I wanted to. I was never into TV even as a child. The few men that I meet that are exciting are either unstable (unwilling to resolve their issues) or psychopaths.

There are 3 archetypes of men:

1. Alpha-male - you have to get with their program. often they are great earner / providers. but tend to be the work and go home types. They want laid back women or women who make most of the sacrifice for them. The super power couple rarely works.
2. The adventurous type - They are very fun but arent providers. They are not even be reliable. They may even resent you if you are super ambitious because it conflicts with their fun and the image they have for their lives.
3. The laid back guy - he doesnt earn much nor is he ambition or a leader. But he is reliable. However dont expect him to be able to get the family out of a jam. They typically depend on the woman to lead the household and relationship forward. However the woman still has to act like he's the alpha male in order for the relationship to exist.

My personality has problems with each type b/c I want a blend. Of course if I knew the archetypes when I was younger I would have made some different strategic dating decisions.

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BTW there is nothing extreme about traveling the world alone. I find it very fun because I get to see what I wanna see and I'm not slowed down by drama, schedules or people who cant find money to do stuff. Some people get so obsessed with having everything planned to the nth detail which I find suffocating. I also like to emerge myself in the local culture rather staying in some BS 5-star resort looking at the same crap for a week b/c all 5 star resorts are pretty much the same. No I dont sleep in hostels or do shared bathrooms situations either. Yuck!

There arent any boogiemen waiting to get me around the corner. I guess it depends on whether one grew up sheltered or not. I've had street smarts since I was a kid. I had to travel 1hr each way on public transportation to take my 4 yr old sister to school when I was 10. And I had to take myself to high school 1.5 hrs away from home at 11 yrs old. I grew up in what some considered a dangerous neighborhood. Nothing much scares me.

----------------------------

You are lucky you have a husband who you can related too. And the fact he also experiences depression means that he can relate to your current state as well. I dont see the meaning in life or the point so maybe you are in a better place than I am. Perhaps if I found enjoyment in the things you discuss or felt connected to at least 1 human being I'd feel differently? And no I didnt feel connected to the friends I had that were 30+ yrs b/c I figured out long time ago that people dont really mean what they say. For example, I had someone who always called me a sister. But I saw they treated me much different than their blood sister when things were happening in their life, despite me knowing much more deep details than their sister did. I won't get into the details of that. I just accept that humans really dont mean what they say. A huge awakening for someone who naturally tends to to be an idealist and who longs for family.

As some other members have already suggested I think you would find great benefit in seeking out a good therapist. Hunt until you find the right one. You have the means to do so too! You need someone you dont have to save face around and that has to be more than just your husband. From personal experience I can tell you that pretending is a lot of work. You need some time off.

I also think you would do well to have a few weeks (I would say months but you may feel too guilty about that) to yourself. Right now it seems your life is very focused on your child and sooner or later she will pick up on your emotions. Your child needs you to be healthy in order for her to continue to be healthy so you may want to consider "doing whatever you gotta do" to get back to a happier space. Sometimes theres just no way around it.

 

[nitrogen]

Have you tried psychoanalysis?

I've read some books on psychoanalysis. My favorite one is "The Adjusted American: Normal Neuroses In The Individual And Society" by Snell Putney and Gail J. Putney. @LMFAO FOCKERS I bet you'll also find this book provocative and enlightening.

Another book that I highly recommend is "Escape Attempts: The Theory and Practice of Resistance to Everyday Life" by Stanley Cohen and Laurie Taylor.

Another good book is "The Selfish Gene" by Richard Dawkins.

 

[Are you lost too?]

I've read some books on psychoanalysis. My favorite one is "The Adjusted American: Normal Neuroses In The Individual And Society" by Snell Putney and Gail J. Putney. @LMFAO FOCKERS I bet you'll also find this book provocative and enlightening.

Another book that I highly recommend is "Escape Attempts: The Theory and Practice of Resistance to Everyday Life" by Stanley Cohen and Laurie Taylor.

Another good book is "The Selfish Gene" by Richard Dawkins.

oh, I meant like therapy, being psychoanalysis the line followed by the therapist .

Have you tried that?

 

[LMFAO FOCKERS]

I've read some books on psychoanalysis. My favorite one is "The Adjusted American: Normal Neuroses In The Individual And Society" by Snell Putney and Gail J. Putney. @LMFAO FOCKERS I bet you'll also find this book provocative and enlightening.

Another book that I highly recommend is "Escape Attempts: The Theory and Practice of Resistance to Everyday Life" by Stanley Cohen and Laurie Taylor.

Another good book is "The Selfish Gene" by Richard Dawkins.

Sometimes reading just leads to more intellectualization which is the last things "smarties" need. I find therapy useless personally but it may be helpful for you as a venting mechanism especially since you have a bunch of relationships you are managing and all of them are not being managed in truth. (Not being critical at all. Just saying that if your parents really are that connected to you, your relationship should be strong enough to handle a breakdown and rebuild i.e. you getting a little bit more honest with them.) The therapist may help you get through that awkward feeling. It may also give you some relief by allowing yourself a forum to say whatever "horrible" things you feel about being a parent. Right now you are managing your parental responsibility from a logical place. Your child will eventually pick up that something is missing. I did. By the age of 6 I hated my parents.

 

[nitrogen]

Nitrogen, I think you'd be interested in my story, then. It's in my sig. There are some similarities - such as how we "had it all" and having plenty of resources. However, one key difference between your story and mine is that I fooslishly destroyed my entire future despite the resources, while you are leading a successful life that many people crave.

If you're still deciding on a method, I would recommend SN. It's a relatively painless way to pass away.

Hello, @CrushedHopes . I read your story and I'm sorry to hear what you went through and the depressing situation you're in at this moment.

You mentioned that you grew up in a privileged family with little struggles, but started to have behavioral issues when you entered your teenage years and you have a vitriolic personality. As I was reading your story, I was immediately reminded of a family friend's daughter (let's call her EB for short). EB was adopted at 8 months old. She was a sweet and normal kid until she became a teenager. She started to become impulsive, unpleasant, unable to pick up social cues, suicidal. Her adoptive mother took her to a bunch of therapists and doctors, did a bunch of exams and assessments. It turned out she had ADHD, mild autism, growth hormone imbalance, depression. She's been on medication, therapy, put in a special needs school - she's doing much better.

Lots of mental illnesses don't manifest until teenage years and are often overlooked as worse than average teenage behaviors. Most mental illnesses come with genetic predisposition - the girl you fell in love with might have been a trigger of mental illnesses you were genetically predisposed to, but not necessarily the cause.

Do you feel strong self loathe because you believe you ruined your life? All of us need an acceptable self image to live on.

It seems that what's driving you to about to CTB is you can't do what you love for a living or even as a hobby. You're rejected by the community you were part of. I agree it is indeed a sticky situation, and I can understand the deep regret and helplessness you feel. At least you can identify the hurdle in front of you that's preventing you from enjoying a fulfilling and meaningful life. If you can work out a way to jump over it, you'll thrive. People like me, on the other hand, have the world as my oyster but I just feel hollowness and boredom - oysters taste like bland cardboard after a while.

We all have the tendency of daydreaming about "if I didn't make that mistake, my life would have been so much better." The reality is, no matter which path you pick, you'll hit bumps, trip over and fall. But since you're already on the path you're walking and can't go back to pick another path, it's difficult for you to imagine what bumps you could hit on the other paths, so you idealize them.

I'm considering using nitrogen to CTB - that's why my username here is nitrogen. I signed a DNR order years ago. When the time comes, I'll put on my medical necklace and bracelet with DNR engraved on them, write DNR with a permanent marker all over my body and then pull the exit bag over my face.

 

[CrushedHopes]

Lots of mental illnesses don't manifest until teenage years and are often overlooked as worse than average teenage behaviors. Most mental illnesses come with genetic predisposition - the girl you fell in love with might have been a trigger of mental illnesses you were genetically predisposed to, but not necessarily the cause.

The closest thing to a mental illness I have is *supposedly* Asperger's syndrome. Because it is a type of autism, I've never been open about the diagnosis, because of how stigmatized it is. I would hate to be labeled "tismo" or "sperg", so my self defense mechanism is to act aloof and not allow other people to get to know me too well. I'm not sure if I have any other diagnosed mental problems. Maybe I do..... plenty of people have called me batshit crazy before when I lose it.

Do you feel strong self loathe because you believe you ruined your life? All of us need an acceptable self image to live on.


It seems that what's driving you to about to CTB is you can't do what you love for a living or even as a hobby. You're rejected by the community you were part of. I agree it is indeed a sticky situation, and I can understand the deep regret and helplessness you feel. At least you can identify the hurdle in front of you that's preventing you from enjoying a fulfilling and meaningful life. If you can work out a way to jump over it, you'll thrive.

Absolutely. I loathe myself A LOT. I fucking hate myself. I don't necessarily hate the people that ousted me. It was all me. I could have done better. I guess that's just how it is when you're an ex-narcissist..... when everything crumbles down, you'll have nothing left. You won't have friends, pride, and all your accomplishments would have gone to moot. Nothing. Nil. Zero.

Sorry to disappoint, but that's one hurdle I'll never jump over. I can't take the L for this. I stopped having real life friends for a quite few years now. Not having even one online friend remaining (excluding SS members) is too much pain for me to bear.

We all have the tendency of daydreaming about "if I didn't make that mistake, my life would have been so much better." The reality is, no matter which path you pick, you'll hit bumps, trip over and fall. But since you're already on the path you're walking and can't go back to pick another path, it's difficult for you to imagine what bumps you could hit on the other paths, so you idealize them.

Yes, I would not be perfect even if I were to get the chance to do over. But at least I would try my best to rectify the vitriolic behavior that ultimately led to my own downfall to begin with. Small mistakes that can be resolved over one apology are not too big of a deal. You're just gonna get a slap on the wrist and be told to "not do it next time". The grave mistake I've committed was made out of malice. That's more serious than any vitriolic post I've made in the past, where it could just overlooked as "it's just Tim raging, no big deal". It's over for me. I can't deal with this. And I frankly don't want to.

 

[LMFAO FOCKERS]

I'm considering using nitrogen to CTB - that's why my username here is nitrogen. I signed a DNR order years ago. When the time comes, I'll put on my medical necklace and bracelet with DNR engraved on them, write DNR with a permanent marker all over my body and then pull the exit bag over my face.

As an FYI, DNR is typically ignored when it comes to suicide victims. Unfortunately plenty of human vegetables are living despite DNR notes.

 

[Jojojo]

@nitrogen If I might word it a bit different: It is her expectations of me that will hurt her the most. She expects me to get an old-good normal humans life, just like most of other mothers. And I wouldn't care if it was anyone else, but it happened so that she is only person that matters to me, for some unknown reason.

And if we talk about joy or pain - I'd say I don't have neither. I am mostly disguised by just being a human and forced to be a part of "this" society. I am emotionally exhausted and don't really experience much anymore due to all the gore related experience you mentioned with a small difference: I experienced that sort of thing in real life, not just videos or pictures online. I have seen other people taking part in it, and I guess that caused my disgust and intolerance towards life and people in general. It didn't break me - it made me careless towards everything. I don't appreciate anything I have because I simple don't want to accept it - I don't need it. In fact, doesn't matter what life I have , even if it is a perfect one where everything is the way I want - I don't want it. Life pros simply can't overweight cons in my case.

Being the way I am, makes me wonder - Why do I have such a strong attachment to my mother? Why can't I choose something obviously better for myself over something better for her? If she only passed away - it would finally set me free. But after years of forcing myself of being a "normal person" - I can feel how this attachment weakens thanks to how humans are nowadays. And I think I can overcome this limitation at this point - afterwards won't matter because I'll be dead. I only hope that I will succeed with my method on first try.

 

[nitrogen]

As far as men I was engaged once to someone who secretly stole my credit card and ran me into 5 figure debt. I had to sue them for my money. I will spare you the details...

I am attracted to smart men. But most smart men dont want a woman who wants to travel, explore the world or gets bored.

There are 3 archetypes of men:

1. Alpha-male - you have to get with their program. often they are great earner / providers. but tend to be the work and go home types. They want laid back women or women who make most of the sacrifice for them. The super power couple rarely works.
2. The adventurous type - They are very fun but arent providers. They are not even be reliable. They may even resent you if you are super ambitious because it conflicts with their fun and the image they have for their lives.
3. The laid back guy - he doesnt earn much nor is he ambition or a leader. But he is reliable. However dont expect him to be able to get the family out of a jam. They typically depend on the woman to lead the household and relationship forward. However the woman still has to act like he's the alpha male in order for the relationship to exist.

You are lucky you have a husband who you can related too.

And no I didnt feel connected to the friends I had that were 30+ yrs b/c I figured out long time ago that people dont really mean what they say. For example, I had someone who always called me a sister. But I saw they treated me much different than their blood sister when things were happening in their life, despite me knowing much more deep details than their sister did. I won't get into the details of that. I just accept that humans really dont mean what they say.

Right now it seems your life is very focused on your child and sooner or later she will pick up on your emotions.

@LMFAO FOCKERS I think you're right that most smart men don't want a restless woman who wants to travel, explore the world and gets bored easily. I'm only attracted to men whom I admire, and for me to admire a man, he has to be more capable, wise and intelligent than me - only alpha males meet my standards.

One commonly used term for people getting married and starting a family is "settling down." It implies you stop being so spontaneous and start to make long term plans with your life partner together. You make commitments, compromises and sacrifices for each other.

A family is like a miniature enterprise that comes with unavoidable chores and tasks - food needs to be made/bought/put on the table, bills need to be paid, the child needs to be cared for, tax returns need to be filed, toilets need to be scrubbed, lawsuits or legal threats against ppl or businesses that ripped us off need to be prepared, investment decisions need to be made, etc. For it to function well, the tasks should be roughly evenly divided between the couple. Some tasks can be delegated to certain specialists (for instance, financial advisors, property managers, house cleaners, etc) to reduce the workload, but that still requires supervision and management.

Marital problems can arise when the power dynamics at home go off. I've noticed two common types. 1: The power couple - both busy making money and other chores left unattended to and child neglected. 2: The sole breadwinner husband diminishes the importance of the work the stay-at-home wife does.

It sucks that your ex-fiance stole your credit card and put you in debt. You must have felt so betrayed and hurt.

Yeah, people don't mean what they say, not necessarily because they're liars, but because our state of mind changes with life circumstances. People say whatever to maximize personal gain. Many people don't even treat their blood relatives that well. I've seen siblings fight for their deceased parent's assets even before the body is cremated.

@Are you lost too? I made an appt to see a therapist next week since quite a few of you encourage me to give it a try. The reason why I haven't seen a therapist is that my husband said it was like talking to a bartender - he found his therapists dull and useless.

The suicide rate among psychiatrists is high - 58 to 65/100,000 compared with that of the general population, 11/100,000 - how ironic. The high suicide rate is in part due to some psychiatrists choose the specialty because they themselves or loved ones suffer from mental illness and they want to gain a deeper understanding of themselves, yet they fail to overcome their own demons. Perhaps also because they reach some epiphany about the fundamental nature of life and death through talking to some of their patients.

Besides my "non-maternal" brain and finding children annoying in general. Part of me doesn't want to bond with my child. I don't need another person to trap me in this world. Another reason why I struggle to bond with her is that I can't determine the meaning of life - it's very likely meaningless. If life is indeed meaningless, what's the point of devoting so much effort and time on raising and bonding with my child?

I enrolled my daughter in full-time daycare last month. I'm not working. So I have more personal time to focus on myself. We hired a live-in nanny when my child was younger and she drove us nuts. My husband and I are very big on personal space and privacy. Having a semi-stranger live with us was intolerable.

@cant cry @Final Escape @Done at Fifty @Life+me=error You might find this intriguing:

There's a study done by psychologists from University of Virginia and Purdue University on the relationship between life satisfaction/happiness and household income. About 1 million people around the world were surveyed. They find that in every region of the world, after accounting for a person's age, gender, and marital status, people with higher incomes are happier. But they also find that there is a level of income at which happiness no longer increases with more money. They even find some evidence that in certain places, when incomes rise above the cutoff level/satiation point, life satisfaction gets lower. In the US in 2016, the satiation point is 105K. I suppose now it's higher taking inflation into account. The point being, it's a lot lower than what many people assume.

There's an interesting story from the Bible in Ecclesiastes of a king, and this king had it all - gardens, parks, vineyards, castles, slaves, concubines (both make AND female concubines) - but here's what he says, "I hated life. All this vanity and a chasing after wind and there's nothing to be gained under the sun." Compared to him, I don't have it all at all, LOL.

I think that could be because you don't have a goal or porpouse in life. I know that there are people that don't have any problem but want to end their lives anyway because they don't find a meaning in life (see Mitchell Heisman)

You're right I don't have a purpose in life. If I can't determine the meaning of life and don't know if it's meaningful or not, how can I set a goal or purpose in life?

As an FYI, DNR is typically ignored when it comes to suicide victims. Unfortunately plenty of human vegetables are living despite DNR notes.

REALLY??!!! OHH F***! I need to reconsider my method then. The possibility of ending up being a vegetable after a failed attempt is unacceptable. I need to find a more fail proof method. My second choice was jumping from a tall building immediately after quickly gulping down copious amounts of hard liquor.

 

[Are you lost too?]

,@Are you lost too? I made an appt to see a therapist next week since quite a few of you encourage me to give it a try. The reason why I haven't seen a therapist is that my husband said it was like talking to a bartender - he found his therapists dull and useless.

I am glad you made the appointment !
make sure you know which line the therapist follows ... I think since of all the "issues" with your mother and your daughter a psychoanalyst would be able to help you more, and he also goes into deeper questions, which may help you with all this meaning of life questioning. But this usually takes longer.
If they follow a comportamental line, (I don't know so much of this line) it's gonna be focused on behaviors you want to change and it's gonna "be quicker "

you really have to go shopping for a therapist - sometimes you have to try a few ones before you feel you can really connect with that person. also it's very important you're committed to the therapy... otherwise it's not gonna bring anything new to the table.
Best of luck :)

 

[LMFAO FOCKERS]

@LMFAO FOCKERS

One commonly used term for people getting married and starting a family is "settling down." It implies you stop being so spontaneous and start to make long term plans with your life partner together. You make commitments, compromises and sacrifices for each other.

"Settling down" looks different for many couples. There are couples who are active and head out together and there are others who dont. I know couples who do long distance successfully. I dont subscribe to one version of life. I personally dont think the term means stopping the fun things and being bored. People who do nothing but go home and go to work are those who have more sedentary interests (which is fine) or they are boring people. I'm not a boring person and my hobbies are not all sedentary.

I have had very high level professional jobs. Most of which required me to work seriously long days. I even had one where I worked remotely so I moved around a bit. This allowed me to have my cake and eat it too.

There are other things that play into marriage that may not affect you because you are of another culture. There are some cultures where most of the men dont believe in stay at home wives. In those cultures a woman then works 12-15 hours, puts her kids in day care, still cooks and finds time to f* her husband. That's just way too much. Unfortunately I come from one of such cultures, thereby I'm subjected to this ridiculous expectation from a woman.

If I stayed overseas with the first company I was with, I'm pretty sure I'd be married. I would have had better options with regard to dating. US just subscribes to hypercapitalism at all costs and I just dont agree.

I once dated a guy who created a startup from scratch. We had lots of fun together. He put 10-12 years of blood sweat and tears into the company. Guess what happened??? Venture capitalists took it over. So all that sacrifice was for nothing. I'm not saying it a stupid choice. I just realized long ago that working yourself into the ground while life passes you by is a useless endeavor. As an FYI, I have bust my a$$ to get to where I am in life so dont think that just b/c I like to have fun it means I'm not responsible. To the contrary I have lots of fun because its balance for busting my a$$. And there has to be balance in everything we do.


EDIT: FYI, I'm also glad you made an appt to see a therapist. I'm rooting for you!!!

 

[azucaramargo]

From the outside, I should have every reason to be happy - a good marriage, financially well off, loved ones still around, physically healthy, can work if I want to but don't need to work if I don't want to, grew up in a loving family, being smart and good-looking, etc - it's that top 1% life that most people wish for but can't have.

I'm so envious of you! Props to you for recognizing your good fortune.

They realize the carrots don't taste as good as they expected. The joy from eating the carrots fades after a while. They don't have particularly strong greed and vanity so they don't really desire more or bigger carrots.

Your incisive writing is making me swoon.

I gave birth to my first child two years ago

Congratulations!

Hello folks. I've been contemplating suicide every single day for the past ten years. I just turned 31. I'm certain I'll end my life. I just don't know when it will happen - it depends on when my parents and my husband will pass. I'm still around because I don't want to ruin my loved ones' lives.

From the outside, I should have every reason to be happy - a good marriage, financially well off, loved ones still around, physically healthy, can work if I want to but don't need to work if I don't want to, grew up in a loving family, being smart and good-looking, etc - it's that top 1% life that most people wish for but can't have.

I've been thinking hard about what keeps people going. The answer I've come up with is "hopes to achieve certain goals with the belief that those goals are attainable" and "most people's inability to accurately predict how happy they'll be in the future based on what's happening to them." I also can't help wonder why people like Anthony Boudain, Kate Spade and Robin Williams committed suicide, and why that woman named one of Atlanta's most powerful and influential woman of 2019 killed her two adult children before turning the gun on herself.

Here's a good metaphor: people are like donkeys. A stick is tied to the bridle of a donkey so that it extends above and in front of the animal's head, and the carrot hangs on a string from the far end of the stick, just out of reach of its mouth. Attracted by the sight and smell, the donkey steps forward to bite at the carrot, but as it is attached to the stick, the carrot also moves forward and remains out of reach. The donkey repeats the same ineffective strategy ad infinitum, thereby pulling or carrying whatever or whomever it's laden with. The carrot is common life goals such as owning a home free and clear, having a stable well paying job, finding true love, etc.

It's easy to understand why people who struggle to make ends meet and those with crappy upbringing want to end their existence. They're probably at the brink of collapsing on the ground from all the weight they've been carrying. Even if they want to eat the carrot, they're too exhausted to move forward.

There are also people like me on the opposite end of the spectrum who've tasted all the carrots they wanted. They realize the carrots don't taste as good as they expected. The joy from eating the carrots fades after a while. They don't have particularly strong greed and vanity so they don't really desire more or bigger carrots.

Most people fall in the middle of the spectrum, setting one life goal after another and focus on achieving those goals. Some people are so goal-oriented that they don't bother to self reflect and think about the meaning of life.

I recently watched a Yale University lecture about scientific research on happiness. Many of the results are interesting and counter-intuitive. The studies reveal that people radically overestimate the effects of many life events. Some events feel really big when they happen, but after 6 months or a year later, people adapt and their happiness level goes back to the previous level, which is the idea of "hedonic treadmill" (you keep on running, but no matter how fast you run, you stay where you are). We think those events would have permanent and profound effects but they often don't. There's even a technical term for this: affective forecasting, which most of us are bad at doing. Another interesting finding is that our happiness level is rather fixed, in part genetically, in part we get used to what happens in our lives.

I bet I'm genetically predisposed to depression and suicide - my maternal grandma hung herself.

Some people conduct their lives according to religious doctrines. I think the popular religions and scientific theories might provide a piece of the puzzle, a sneak peek of the reality, but none provides the full picture. Given how religions are also tied to politics, atrocities have been committed in the name of religion, how humans possess limited knowledge of the cosmos and how consciousness can arise out of something unconscious, etc, I remain agnostic. I don't judge anyone being religious but I can't fully adopt any belief system either. Me being a brain in a jar or in a simulation run by an advanced civilization is also plausible.

I lack some instincts that the majority of my fellow humans possess, such as maternal instinct and survival instinct. I gave birth to my first child two years ago. She's sensitive and timid in nature, but overall healthy. I've been struggling to bond with her. I wish she does not exist and I love my cat more than her. I never liked children - I find them too loud, messy, boring, needy, repetitive, and stupid. My mom told me my maternal instinct would kick in once I give birth and said I would feel differently about my own child vs other ppl's children - not in my case. Spending time with my toddler is an unpleasant chore.

I'm on the antidepressant, Lexapro, taking the max dose. It takes some edges off and reduces my impulses. But it's at best a bandage over a wound. Me ending my life won't be an impulsive decision. No medication, no therapists, no helplines can change my view on life in general.

My deepest fears are there's an afterlife, reincarnation, and physical pain. I imagine when my loved ones pass, I'd be devastated and feel part of me die with them, but at the same time, I'd feel relieved that one fewer person will trap me in this world.

I have this feeling that my soul (if there's one) is a slave/prisoner to my genetic materials that just want to be replicated and passed down.

I also feel that there's a ceiling for happiness. Once past that ceiling, too much happiness turns into pain, but there's no limit to mental agony. When I learned about the different substances and drugs in medical school, the effects they create are often compared with orgasm. For instance, the euphoria people feel on heroin is about 250 times stronger than orgasm. I'm not sure how that's measured since euphoria is a subjective experience and can't really be calibrated. Anyway, I remember feeling euphoric from acid trips. It was so intense that I couldn't take it. It makes sense. Orgasms typically last a short time and feel good, but imagine having a 4 hr orgasm - that would be exhausting.

I'm able to feel joy. But I'd readily give up the opportunities of feeling joy in exchange for not being able to feel any pain. There's more joy than pain in my life right now, but I want to feel zero pain.

I passed out from alcohol poisoning about 13 years ago. It was an accident, not a suicide attempt. I was rushed to the ER and had my stomach pumped, put on a ventilator. The last thing I remembered before I woke up from the ER was me falling asleep on my bed. No pain felt before and during my blackout. I hope a successfully executed suicide will feel the same. I haven't decided on a method. I don't have a substance abuse problem. I barely drink any alcohol; I went on acid trips and smoked weed a couple of times but never got addicted.

I'd be interested in hearing stories from suicidal people who have a "perfect" life and their take on the meaning of life and their future plans.

Not to trivialize your struggle, but could we switch lives, please?

Also, I wanted to tell you that my mom is someone who did not revel in childrearing. There is an audio recording of my mom reading me a story when I was like 4, and intermittently throughout the story and my little questions, Mom'd say to my dad, "This is exhausting!"

In spite of this, my mom is a good mom who fought and sacrificed for her 3 daughters' education; she is a champion of her childrens' health. I just want you to know that not every woman delights in childrearing. Your baby is very lucky to have such a smart, sensitive, soul-searching mother.

my maternal grandma hung herself.

I'm so sorry about this!

Hello, @CrushedHopes . I read your story and I'm sorry to hear what you went through and the depressing situation you're in at this moment.

You mentioned that you grew up in a privileged family with little struggles, but started to have behavioral issues when you entered your teenage years and you have a vitriolic personality. As I was reading your story, I was immediately reminded of a family friend's daughter (let's call her EB for short). EB was adopted at 8 months old. She was a sweet and normal kid until she became a teenager. She started to become impulsive, unpleasant, unable to pick up social cues, suicidal. Her adoptive mother took her to a bunch of therapists and doctors, did a bunch of exams and assessments. It turned out she had ADHD, mild autism, growth hormone imbalance, depression. She's been on medication, therapy, put in a special needs school - she's doing much better.

Lots of mental illnesses don't manifest until teenage years and are often overlooked as worse than average teenage behaviors. Most mental illnesses come with genetic predisposition - the girl you fell in love with might have been a trigger of mental illnesses you were genetically predisposed to, but not necessarily the cause.

Do you feel strong self loathe because you believe you ruined your life? All of us need an acceptable self image to live on.

It seems that what's driving you to about to CTB is you can't do what you love for a living or even as a hobby. You're rejected by the community you were part of. I agree it is indeed a sticky situation, and I can understand the deep regret and helplessness you feel. At least you can identify the hurdle in front of you that's preventing you from enjoying a fulfilling and meaningful life. If you can work out a way to jump over it, you'll thrive. People like me, on the other hand, have the world as my oyster but I just feel hollowness and boredom - oysters taste like bland cardboard after a while.

We all have the tendency of daydreaming about "if I didn't make that mistake, my life would have been so much better." The reality is, no matter which path you pick, you'll hit bumps, trip over and fall. But since you're already on the path you're walking and can't go back to pick another path, it's difficult for you to imagine what bumps you could hit on the other paths, so you idealize them.

I'm considering using nitrogen to CTB - that's why my username here is nitrogen. I signed a DNR order years ago. When the time comes, I'll put on my medical necklace and bracelet with DNR engraved on them, write DNR with a permanent marker all over my body and then pull the exit bag over my face.

Nitrogen, your writing is making me so emotional. Perhaps you are accustomed to turning heads and creating lasting impressions. I don't know if you'd be interested to know that a 41-year-old spaz is lying on her parents' couch crying to read your words.

You write so eloquently! Your posts are well-organized and thoughtful, and I just find myself being so jealous of you. Putting aside your pain for a moment, your life is how I always thought mine would be. Or, maybe I'd hoped it would be like yours.

I just wish we could trade places so badly. You are so smart I'm sure you could right the shipwreck that is my life, and if I were in your shoes, I would just hurl my accomplishments and financial freedom in the faces of all my detractors.

Sorry if I sound like an insaniac. But, your writing just really does something to me. I'm so sorry for your anguish. But, I really wish I could be you.

 

[azucaramargo]

because you are of another culture.

I'd give my right arm to know about the distinct cultures that spawned two awesome women like LMAO Fockers and nitrogen!

 

[azucaramargo]

ADHD/2E

What is a 2E brain?

 

[nitrogen]

@Irunfar @cant cry @Are you lost too? @Life sucks @Alec @woxihuanni @TimeToBiteTheDust @Hotsackage @Final Escape @Plushy @MeltingHeart @Done at Fifty @Lethe @Life+me=error @zeroambition @Kodama

I might end up mindf*** my therapist rather than being enlightened by him/her:

I prepared a list of questions for my therapist, such as:

The dubious history of psychotropic drugs, treatment of "mental illness" and validity of psychiatry as a medical specialty. I want to know the therapist's thoughts on the absence of objective tests on brain chemistry levels and the fact that there are no proven physiological causes of most of those so-called mental illnesses in DSM-V, the bible that "mental health specialists" use to diagnose mental illnesses. I also want to know his/her thoughts on the fact that the majority of the psychiatrists on APA panel who decide what to include in DSM have financial ties to drug companies & most patient advocacy groups are funded by drug companies & the mechanism of action of most drugs are labeled "unknown" & FDA drug advisory panel allows ppl with financial ties to drug companies to sit on them & loopholes in the clinical trials, etc.

I also plan to ask the therapist some questions about the research on happiness that I mentioned in my earlier posts and cutting edge research on human consciousness and evolution, such as this one:

A professor of cognitive science from UC Irvine ran thousands of computer simulations of evolution in his lab with different randomly chosen worlds and organisms that compete for resources in those worlds. Some of the organisms see all of the reality (parameters set by the researchers), others just see part of the reality, and some see none of the reality. Btw, evolution is a mathematically precise theory with its formidable looking equations which allows such simulations to be run and predictions to be made. Who wins and ends up passing down their genetic materials generations after generations?

It turns out, perception of reality goes extinct - counterintuitive. The organisms that see none of the reality but just tuned to fitness drive to extinction all the organisms that perceive reality as it is. The bottom line is, evolution does not favor veridical perceptions of reality. All living organisms including us humans rely on certain tricks and hacks to react quickly to environmental stimuli to maximize survival - the inevitable result is we don't see the whole picture of reality and see objective reality as it is.

Here's a funny example of this - the story of Australian jewel beetles. Those beetles have been around for millions of years. The females are dimpled, brown, and glossy. The males rely on these traits to identify females. Australian men used to occasionally throw beer bottles that are dimpled, brown, and glossy into the outback. The male beetles can't distinguish beer bottles from the females - many ditched the females for the bottles. The species were almost driven to extinction until the government banned those beer bottles.

Anyway, I know a bunch of interesting scientific studies that I can use to tickle the therapist's brain with - I'll spare you the details as this post is already verbose.

If the therapist can't give me satisfactory answers, then he/she is a quack or brainwashed by drug companies and the key opinion leaders from their residency training programs. PS, psychiatry isn't one of those competitive specialties - docs who ended up practicing psychiatry are usually not the brightest in their med school class.

@SinisterKid I agree that life is all about choice. While we're on this topic, I feel that having choices isn't always a good thing. It's easy to understand having no choice sucks. But on the other hand, having too many choices can be confusing and overwhelming. Also, I've seen it many times that people make a seemingly insignificant choice/decision, then a chain of events quickly follows, and then all of a sudden, it becomes a choice of life and death. On a side note, from my experience of experimenting with all sorts of investments, I've come to the conclusion that the choices we make often matter more than the strategies we deploy - investment is all about timing.

@LMFAO FOCKERS
My husband co-founded his current company from scratch and it's 100% funded by venture capital firms. He founded two failed startups before this current one though. Many factors have to fall in line for a startup to take off and most startups fail even if the founders have brilliant business ideas. He put in a lot of blood sweat and tears into his first two failed startups, but he says the failures prepared him for this 3rd (by far) successful startup.

You didn't give any details on how your ex-bf's company was taken over by VCs. But in general, VC investors are the ones who bear the highest risks - if the startup fails, they lose millions. The founders and employees not only don't take money out of their own pockets to run the company, but also make salaries and the salaries come from VC investors. The founders have a fiduciary duty to the VCs to run the company at the best of their ability and effort. If the VCs find evidence that the founders slack off or act recklessly, they can sue the founders for financial losses, and the founders can be forced to use their own money to pay off company debts or file bankruptcy.

My husband and I have summarized 3 levels of the ways people make money:

1: Make money from their lives - an extreme example is Indian sewer cleaners who wear little protective gear and die young from job hazards

2: Make money from their time - white-collar employees who work 9-5 jobs

3: Make money from money - best way to financial freedom & don't need to answer to anyone

Our goal had always been #3. My husband did grad school at Stanford. Apparently everybody who goes there catches an entrepreneurial bug and wants to be the next Steve Jobs or Elon Musk. Doing startup was not just his ambition, but his religion.

Questions for you:

Why did you hate your parents by age 6? Were you an unwanted child?

You had lots of fun traveling around. Does that no longer interest you?

Are you still working or retired?

Btw, you made a really good point in an earlier post about not to intellectualize too much. You're not the first person who's pointed it out to me. I do have that tendency.

@azucaramargo I'm glad you find my posts interesting. I wanted to at least make the readers of my post think harder or rethink their previous assumptions. I write eloquently? I'm flattered. I always feel that my writing is full of awkward expressions and grammatical errors. I immigrated to the US at age 17 (originally from China) but somehow just can't speak and write like a native English speaker. The only courses that I never got As in were writing haha. LMFAO FOCKERS is obviously a more sophisticated writer.

@CrushedHopes Have you tried medication and therapy? They work wonders on some ppl, but not others. The worst that can happen is you conclude they're useless - that's why I'm now open to try therapy even though I still seriously doubt it'll help me. At least when you CTB, you can say, "Well, I tried my best and this is indeed the only way to end my misery."

@Jojojo Isn't it normal for people to have a strong attachment to their mothers? If someone has been neglected or abused by his/her mother, then that's of course, a different story. Could it be that you suffer from PTSD after witnessing gore and violent acts?

 

[azucaramargo]

I immigrated to the US at age 17 (originally from China) but somehow just can't speak and write like a native English speaker.

I can't believe you are not a native English speaker. I'm getting more and more agitated by your talent and achievements. I guess being so intelligent must be lonely. I'd just love to be where you are. I'm so tired of failure. I want to see the world through your eyes. Acceptance and love and success and a voice that matters. I picture you guys living in Silicon Valley, and I don't know, having the world by the short and curlies. Your opinion counts, you know? When you speak, people listen and are interested.

Inelegantly, I covet so badly your success. I want to experience that for just a little bit. Failure is killing me, and breaking me down. I want to be like you. I want talent, insulation from the riff raff, and to feel effective. I imagine you have had to work very hard for what you have. I don't know, but to work hard and to succeed must be something else. I'm sorry to be such a loser. The green monster has overtaken me. I'm sorry.

 

[LMFAO FOCKERS]

What is a 2E brain?

2E = Twice exceptional. Giftedness with "disability". The "disability" can mask or equalize giftedness such that person performs average, has wide disparities like college level math in grade school but grade school level reading (for example) or just completely underperforms. The giftedness and the disability each have to be addressed individually in order for the person to reach their full potential.

The disability can be anything from ADHD, dyslexia to more challenging issues as autism. Most of these students fall through the cracks because teachers/parents arent trained to identify it and deal with it due to the masking nature of the disability. Some dont even figure it out until they are in college or on the job because they were able to "get by" in elementary school. 2E individuals often also have social challenges because they dont fit into social norms. They may be highly sensitive, stubborn or a host of other things that may challenge their ability to interact, adjust and flourish in social settings.

Contrary to what people may think people dont outgrow the disabilities and social challenges. Undiagnosed adults often dont figure it out until they are adults seeking out counseling because their lives are falling apart.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twice_exceptional

 

[nitrogen]

I can't believe you are not a native English speaker. I'm getting more and more agitated by your talent and achievements. I guess being so intelligent must be lonely. I'd just love to be where you are. I'm so tired of failure. I want to see the world through your eyes. Acceptance and love and success and a voice that matters. I picture you guys living in Silicon Valley, and I don't know, having the world by the short and curlies. Your opinion counts, you know? When you speak, people listen and are interested.

Inelegantly, I covet so badly your success. I want to experience that for just a little bit. Failure is killing me, and breaking me down. I want to be like you. I want talent, insulation from the riff raff, and to feel effective. I imagine you have had to work very hard for what you have. I don't know, but to work hard and to succeed must be something else. I'm sorry to be such a loser. The green monster has overtaken me. I'm sorry.

@azucaramargo I don't consider myself exceptionally talented, intelligent or successful. I'd say I'm above average but not on the genius level like my husband and some of our friends. I'm luckier than most people, that's for sure.

I don't have a career and I'm not quite employable, which used to bother me and made me feel insecure. My husband and I went to the same college for undergrad, but went to different grad schools in different states. We started dating in college Freshmen year. By the time he finished grad school and was about to jump on his first startup, we had been in a temporary long-distance relationship for three years. We were deeply in love and really missed each other. He asked me to quit pursuing a medical career, and instead, marry him and support his startup dream. He promised he'd make more than double a doctor makes; and since half of his income would belong to me, it'd be equivalent to me making a doctor's salary but having the freedom to do whatever I wanted. So that's what I did and his promise eventually came true. A medical degree is useless without field experience.

It's not lonely to be somewhat intelligent. There are plenty of people way smarter than me. I'm surrounded by them. I never look down on anyone with contempt, nor do I ever have a sense of superiority. I also try not to judge people or force my own values on others. With everyone out there, even if they're less lucky than I am, there's always something they're better than I'm at. I often chat up homeless people and ask about their life stories, which amaze me all the time.

I'm ok with being dominated by an alpha male. That doesn't mean I take an inferior role in the relationship, nor does it mean I'm submissive across the board. I'm ferocious when it comes to guarding my family's interests. I do whatever makes people buckle under or back off - from the old boring legal threats to black magick rituals of summoning demons. Btw, I've been exploring the realm of supernatural phenomenon and making some startling discoveries.

My parents think it's a waste of my talent to be a stay-at-home wife. I shared that sentiment before. Now I'm past it. All my husband does is providing for the family and I do everything else. Believe or not, it's no easy work. By far, I've been good at it. If one day he dies of some freak accident, I'd just live off our savings, then CTB. I won't bother going back to school or work for somebody.

No need to envy me or yearn for the carrots I've gathered. Like I've pointed out in my earlier posts, a surprising fact about happiness is that it stays rather fixed, in part due to genetics and in part due to we adapt quickly. Even if you get what I have, after a short while, you'd be as happy as you're right now.

What "failures" are breaking you down? What brings you to this website?

 

[Conker]

I can relate in some way. I am 23 as of right now, and I have been bored in life since childhood. With every new step in life I thought I'd find something to my liking, but nothing ever came up. I never had any problems in my childhood or school years, by that I mean: never bullied, not abused by adults or any other negative life changing moments, had friends, had girlfriends and some other positive moments. My family has been always supporting me both mentally and financially: supported me throughout life despite my horrible teenage attitude and always provided me with extra amount of funds to live a life. And as of present, I have plenty of opportunities and funding to flourish in life.

In a nutshell, my point is that I don't have a single reason to seek for a way to end my life from a perspective of a reasonable person. But despite that, I was never truly happy in life - always felt out of the place in this world. I lost interest or passion in anything I tried within short periods of time: from hours to months, but never longer. I have been in several relationships - all of them failed within weeks with the longest one for 3 weeks. I simply rapidly lost any interest in a person.

The reasoning to that behavior is that I was bored at the start, and I after a certain life event I realized: life is not worth living. It was one and only time in my life when I completely forgot that I have a brain. Instead, I let emotions take over and committed a series of suicide attempts which obviously failed since I had no guts to execute them. Funny enough, no one ever found it about them except for my mother who, I think, had some suspiciously extra caring behavior towards me during that time. Nevertheless, after first couple of weeks reign returned to brain, and I started to think. I started to pay more attention to others, and what was happening in the world in general. I was reading news, surfing the internet, social media and all other mass media.

Watching certain videos, reading certain news, witnessing in real life brutal and inhuman actions - all that had a strong negative impact on my view of the human kind and life. I started to have anger issues, and lost control very easily which caused self-harm both mentally and physically. At some point, being a human - felt disgusting , so as living in this maniacally hypocritical modern society. And this isn't just blind hate - I know there is good people and moments to live for. I just can't live with this understanding - pros of life simply cant outweigh cons in my case. There is just too much bad in the world for me, and I can't ignore it. I stopped trying to achieve anything in life since then.

As of right now, I think I am at the point when it is time for me. The only reason that kept me here for that long is my mother. I am the only child, and just thinking of what she will have to go through... It's the only thing that I can feel, and it tremendously hurts me. But I never had any interest in life to start with, and if my mother wasn't alive - I would end this pointless existence without any second thought. So, I believe I am making a right choice for both of us since my future existence will only hurt her - I can't force myself to pretend anymore

Darkness definitely has overtaken this part of the universe, hopefully this will be over soon in order to pave way for an actual golden age. Would be cool to see humanitree wage a war against the moon before everybody nukes each other during WW3. What if all along the solution to all of Earth's problems, the cure to this Draconian virus has always been obliterating the moon?

 

[Hadenuf]

Yes me i have messed up

 

[I'm exhausted]

We have completely polar opposite life. It hurts to know that even with all the money that can be used for treatment s, some people still suffer from treatment resistant illnesses and then there are people like me that can get better with treatments but can't because I'm disabled to a point where I can't work and can't afford the treatment and now going to CTB. Illnesses are really an equal opportunist. It has robbed me of my life and my passions and my dreams of helping animals and people and starting my business.

@nitrogen, I loved your donkey analogy. It sucks we can't have what we want. I just wanted to live pain free like you but pain knows no boundaries.