Method Carbon monoxide megathread

[BPDvic]

It's the same thing with drug overdoses, more likely to die on accident than on purpose. As for the house and charcoal it all depends on the person, I'm probably going to rent an average sized single family house and get 16 lbs of charcoal (which is more than enough) but I'm also going to be producing hydrogen cyanide which is 35 times more lethal than carbon monoxide.

How did you get the cyanide?
And why would you use carbon when you have hydrogen cyanide?

 

[Liebestod]

How did you get the cyanide?
And why would you use carbon when you have hydrogen cyanide?

I'm trying to gatekeep how I'm going to produce the cyanide for now, but I want to use both because they have a synergistic effect that make them even more toxic and lethal in an environment.

 

[BrunoDante]

I'm curious: it's frequently suggested here and elsewhere that using a modern vehicle for CO s'cide in an enclosed space or running a hose from the exhaust to the cabin is ineffective due to catalytic converters removing most of the CO. And yet just some quick research reveals people are still dying from CO emissions from modern vehicles, whether deliberately or by accident.

I always assumed the modern wisdom about catalytic converters was correct and yet it seems to be contradicted by quite a few examples.

 

[bellaisdonewithlife]

Charcoal method seems ineffective. Better to use a tank of "calibration" gas of carbon monoxide like Kevorkian used. You can get tanks with 20% carbon monoxide + 80% nitrogen online. Google... "Portable Carbon Monoxide Calibration Gas"

Wait, hold up. Charcoal is not that effective? So it's more effective to buy a tank of 20% carbon monoxide + 80% nitrogen?

 

[BrunoDante]

Can someone please outline the detailed protocol using this calibration gas? Supplies, procedure, etc?

 

[bellaisdonewithlife]

Can someone please outline the detailed protocol using this calibration gas? Supplies, procedure, etc?

Yeah, that's what I was hoping to see too although it seems that in my area the gas tanks aren't available for the public to purchase. It looks like I'll have to stick to charcoal.

 

[BPDvic]

I'm curious: it's frequently suggested here and elsewhere that using a modern vehicle for CO s'cide in an enclosed space or running a hose from the exhaust to the cabin is ineffective due to catalytic converters removing most of the CO. And yet just some quick research reveals people are still dying from CO emissions from modern vehicles, whether deliberately or by accident.

I always assumed the modern wisdom about catalytic converters was correct and yet it seems to be contradicted by quite a few examples.

"Modern cars use filtration systems to trap soot (black carbon) and other pollutants before they leave the tailpipe, primarily to protect public health and meet environmental standards."

 

[BrunoDante]

Yes, I understand that. But I continue to see cases where people are dying from CO derived exhaust from modern vehicles, both deliberately and accidentally.

The common wisdom doesn't quite jibe with what I'm seeing is all. Not sure what to make of it.

 

[BPDvic]

Yes, I understand that. But I continue to see cases where people are dying from CO derived exhaust from modern vehicles, both deliberately and accidentally.

The common wisdom doesn't quite jibe with what I'm seeing is all. Not sure what to make of it.

Sometimes people die from a small forgotten amount of barbecue charcoal inside a tent. It seems simple when it's an accident. But remember: you only hear about the rare cases that make the news, while tens of thousands of people don't die for these reasons.

 

[Liebestod]

Charcoal method seems ineffective. Better to use a tank of "calibration" gas of carbon monoxide like Kevorkian used. You can get tanks with 20% carbon monoxide + 80% nitrogen online. Google... "Portable Carbon Monoxide Calibration Gas"

Does the ppm of the tank matter in this case or does it depend on where you open it or if you connect a mask/exit bag.

 

[InOverMyHead]

Greetings. I've been a lurking member for awhile. I just inherited a 1970 Buick Skylark convertible. I'm not a car guy but I'm guessing it's pre catalytic converter. There isn't much info on ctb this old fashioned way. I know a garage is preferable which I don't have. I do have part ownership in a 24x50 storage unit_ is that too big of an area?

 

[Chronic]

Does the ppm of the tank matter in this case or does it depend on where you open it or if you connect a mask/exit bag.

Yes, you want at least 12,000 ppm. If you Google the phrase I quoted you can find up to 20% which is 200,000 ppm. You need a flow meter too set to 15 lpm and a 550L tank which will supply gas for ~35 minutes at this rate.

 

[isthisthingon]

Greetings. I've been a lurking member for awhile. I just inherited a 1970 Buick Skylark convertible. I'm not a car guy but I'm guessing it's pre catalytic converter. There isn't much info on ctb this old fashioned way. I know a garage is preferable which I don't have. I do have part ownership in a 24x50 storage unit_ is that too big of an area?

Roadtrip!

 

[Ioneliness]

is burning the charcoal in your garage an option? outdoors is risky as people might see

 

[tourn/ait/ne/nera]

The more I read about this method, the less convinced I am, I already bought a meter though, but I am seeing too many people commenting of their failed attempts. Is there some posts about the logisitics of it with a vehicle ? Like why do people leave it burning ? Chances of things melting ? Logistics of entering, doesn't opening an enclosed space temporarily make the concetration too low now ? I feel like there are so many grey zones ughhh

 

[isthisthingon]

Is anyone else actively planning a carbon monoxide exit? What are your plans?

I have a tent, 2x grills, 2x chimney starter on Wednesday I will drive out to my location and start my camping trip.

This seems like a very good method, but not a ton of activity here. Looking to hear from other like minded members on what your plans are.

 

[BPDvic]

Is anyone else actively planning a carbon monoxide exit? What are your plans?

I have a tent, 2x grills, 2x chimney starter on Wednesday I will drive out to my location and start my camping trip.

This seems like a very good method, but not a ton of activity here. Looking to hear from other like minded members on what your plans are.

Hello! What type of tent did you buy?

 

[Ioneliness]

Is anyone else actively planning a carbon monoxide exit? What are your plans?

I have a tent, 2x grills, 2x chimney starter on Wednesday I will drive out to my location and start my camping trip.

This seems like a very good method, but not a ton of activity here. Looking to hear from other like minded members on what your plans are.

I am, i have 4 disposable grills, and have ordered the malwai tent. Really have no idea why sn is more popular than this method

 

[isthisthingon]

I am, i have 4 disposable grills, and have ordered the malwai tent. Really have no idea why sn is more popular than this method

I think the idea of ingesting something which you can do in the comfort of your own residence is what makes SN the popular choice.

Do you plan on going to a campground?

Hello! What type of tent did you buy?

A one person pop-up tent off Amazon, but also purchased a roll of heavy duty plastic liner and gorilla tape to seal the vents.

 

[Ioneliness]

I think the idea of ingesting something which you can do in the comfort of your own residence is what makes SN the popular choice.

Do you plan on going to a campground?

its been hard to access, especially now that dsl is down. Im planning on doing co in my garage.

 

[isthisthingon]

its been hard to access, especially now that dsl is down. Im planning on doing co in my garage.

that sounds like an ideal spot for the method. The SN crackdown is real, soon enough it will be taken away.

I think at that time more people will look into this method as there is an idea that it can be peaceful enough.

 

[hdead]

Can someone please outline the detailed protocol using this calibration gas? Supplies, procedure, etc?

I worked with these. The calibration gas is a very low ppm for safety reasons. It's used to calibrate CO detectors that are widely used in petrochemical industries. Even if you were able to get a 20%/80% CO/NO2 tank I highly doubt you'll be able to create a high enough concentration with it.

Charcoal, however, can produce copius amounts of CO when in the right state, quickly creating an atmosphere that has a high ppm (5000-10000) which will be very effective.

I am, i have 4 disposable grills, and have ordered the malwai tent. Really have no idea why sn is more popular than this method

I think it's because SN is quicker, more direct. CO takes patience. You have to prep a lot, and wait for the coals to be in the right state - which takes hours. You'll have a lot of time thinking about what you're doing and you can't do it in your bedroom. You'll likely be in a (somewhat) public area. It's just a competely different ballgame. Also, if rushed and improperly prepared, the CO method will not work. You'll have to test and make sure you can get the concentration high enough, quick enough. Otherwise you might be in for a nice splitting headache for a day, maybe two.

I've seen people writing about CO being heavier than air. This is not true. CO is slightly lighter than air - so the buildup will start higher up in the confined space until it makes it's way down. Something to take into consideration. Also takes a bit of calculation to get it all right and if you want to be 100% sure you'll need to do a testrun, preferably with a somewhat relialble CO meter.

 

[Chronic]

I worked with these. The calibration gas is a very low ppm for safety reasons. It's used to calibrate CO detectors that are widely used in petrochemical industries. Even if you were able to get a 20%/80% CO/NO2 tank I highly doubt you'll be able to create a high enough concentration with it.

Charcoal, however, can produce copius amounts of CO when in the right state, quickly creating an atmosphere that has a high ppm (5000-10000) which will be very effective.


I think it's because SN is quicker, more direct. CO takes patience. You have to prep a lot, and wait for the coals to be in the right state - which takes hours. You'll have a lot of time thinking about what you're doing and you can't do it in your bedroom. You'll likely be in a (somewhat) public area. It's just a competely different ballgame. Also, if rushed and improperly prepared, the CO method will not work. You'll have to test and make sure you can get the concentration high enough, quick enough. Otherwise you might be in for a nice splitting headache for a day, maybe two.

I've seen people writing about CO being heavier than air. This is not true. CO is slightly lighter than air - so the buildup will start higher up in the confined space until it makes it's way down. Something to take into consideration. Also takes a bit of calculation to get it all right and if you want to be 100% sure you'll need to do a testrun, preferably with a somewhat relialble CO meter.

A tank of 20% Carbon Monoxide and 80% Nitrogen (which is N2 not NO2) is a carbon monoxide ppm of 200,000. Combined with a hood or non-rebreather mask a 550L tank set to 15 lpm on a flow meter will cause death in 5 to 8 min. Charcoal is unreliable imo. A carbon monoxide tank was kevorkian's alternative method and worked for many assisted suicides he helped with. I personally have the supplies (tank, regulator, flow meter, and non-rebreather mask) and will be using this method combined with meds to relax me when the time is right. 100% Nitrogen (N2) will also work but 20% carbon monoxide + 80% nitrogen is even more effective because the human body actually prefers carbon monoxide over oxygen so it's guaranteed to have no feeling of suffocation.

 

[hdead]

I've been thinking on this method, especially the failures and the reasoning behind them. Also trying to figure out why people get an easy exit with CO by accident, and fail when trying to do it with the intent to CTB.

Before I write this; I am not trying to encourage anyone to go on with this method. I'm sharing my findings, my thoughts and my explorations thusfar for 'entertainment purposes'.

People have been going nuts, in this thread and others, about getting the highest possible CO concentration so they get to pass out and die quickly. I don't think this is the way to go.

When people die on accident by CO poisoning it's likely that the concentration isn't all that high and they slip away due to a prolonged period of time in an environment with moderate CO levels. There are many sources and charts that contradict, but it is likely that CO can become fatal from as low as 500ppm, when exposed for a few hours. The trick is to breathe in CO, no matter how much, for long enough. Once it binds, it's bound. The rest added on is compounded and it will build it in your system. In accidental cases I cannot imagine the amount of CO is very high, as onset of symptoms is usually described as slow, flu-like and drowziness. Not extreme enough for people to become alarmed, but enough to make them want to go to sleep. Our catch is; we do not want to be found in time.

You also have to take into account the mechanism of CO production and burning in general. CO is produced by incomplete combustion. But, for combustion to even occur (complete or incomplete) there has to be oxygen. If you push up the CO levels in a sealed room quickly, I think it's rather likely that oxygen becomes depleted rather fast causing the combustion to cease thus stopping the creation of any new CO.

For CO to work there is actually no need to get rid of any oxygen. CO does not change into CO2 by simply coming into contact with oxygen. It needs some spark, or thermodynamic catalyst for it to convert into CO2 when reacting with O2. Read up on catalytic converters, they are made for this purpose. At room temperature, or slightly above, the CO bond won't break and the gas will remain intact. The oxygen content within the burning coal is already low enough (dense coal, stack, etc), and that is where the CO is produced. CO binds a lot more effectively to hemoglobin than oxygen does, so if the two are mixed in an atmosphere there should be no problem. I think the failed attempts are most likely due to the source of CO becoming extinguished either due to oversealing or improper/irregular burning of coals. I'm not going into the acid mixing method; it seems far too dangerous, uncomfortable and complicated for me. I'd rather go about and finding a way to replicate the accidental CO poisoning.

I think it's not essential to drive up CO levels to an insane amount. It will cause shock, and it will likely cause SI to kick in, making it hard to go to sleep naturally. You'll be awake to experience the CO poisoning knowing your goals. Even if you try to simulate a more accidental environment, for example with a propane heater/bbq/improper fireplace setup inside; if you do it with the knowledge that you're intending to CTB I think it's going to be tough to go to sleep as if you'd normally do. Again. SI will likely kick in and make you anxious. That's why people will use alcohol or sleeping pills to help them fall asleep in such an environment, with the hopes of not waking up. However, there are a few case studies that show alcohol/ehtanol actually improve your chances of surviving CO poisoning. So, when I attempt this I will NOT be drinking alcohol.

If you were to use a sleeping aid you must take into account that it slows your breathing. Normally an adult will breathe about 12-20 breaths per minute, also during sleep. Anything lower than 10-12 is considered unhealthy and is associated with some form of apnea or other condition. With prescribed doses of benzos your anxiety will be dampened and breathing should not be affected. In higher doses, or combinations of benzos, your breathing potentially slows down to 4-5 breaths per minute. It doesn't take a wizard in maths to realize that you'd need 2 to 3 times the amount of time of exposure to CO to reach deadly levels. Therefore, overdosing on benzos while trying this method will likely help you fail it drastically.

I'm thinking that a combination of natural CNS (valerian, passionflower) combined with a healthy dose of sleep depravation and maybe 10-20mg of valium should do the trick if you want to CTB more or less reliably with this method. If you can create an environment that produces sufficient CO for long enough you don't need to have these crazy high PPM to CTB. You just need a long enough exposure for the CO to slowly build up and off you. This is probably why people die on accident with faulty geisers, fireplaces or bbq's inside the house.

I've ordered 20kg of marabu charcoal which has a carbon content of at least 75%. Sources differ when it comes to burn time, varying from 4-5hrs all the way up to 12-15hrs. I intend to test this before I even go for a serious attempt. Sufficient oxygen in the room is not going to be a problem. CO is produced within the coal stack itsself, that's where a lack of oxygen comes into play. With dense coal, this should not be a problem. The rest of the room isn't the issue. Sealing the room should also not be necessary. Considering you're close enough to the source of CO you're going to breathe it in. If it burns for long enough it will produce CO for a long enough time and you'll likely breathe in enough to CTB. It's all a bit of a gamble, of course. Sadly, there are no certainties. If there were, I would be taking it every single day. Anybody got a reliable source of barbiturates already?! ;)

You can't really try this stuff out - but if you look at the succesful cases it's unusual to see people taking in a lot of charcoal. It's usually a few bricks, one bbq, one heater, or something like that (talking accidental cases and intentional CTB cases). If you were to seal off a confined space hermetically, the oxygen would be depleted faster and more effectively, thus stopping combustion all together. To stop combustion is to stop the production of CO and minimizing the amount of time exposed to this fine gas. I reason that the ultimate trick to this method working is to create an environment that is not well ventilated, neither hermetically sealed and to make sure any CO produced passes you before it dissipates. Put the source close to yourself and make sure it can keep burning for hours on end. This would likely help you to succeed. I think nobody would feel comfortable waking up in a miserable state - which is totally a possibility. Because of that I can imagine why people romanticize the idea of pushing the CO limits to a level of 10000+PPM, but it's just not proving to be either easily achieved and certainly not easily maintained.

In short; get yourself a nice cold house with small rooms and convince yourself it's a good idea to bring a BBQ with smokeless coal inside to heat yourself up. Get cosy, don't drink alcohol. Favor chamomille/valerian tea with a single or double benzo. Doze off and hope for the best.

 

[Ioneliness]

I have everything I need, I will update this thread or my goodbye thread showing my process and if successfully ctb.

 

[Cat-soul]

I've been thinking on this method, especially the failures and the reasoning behind them. Also trying to figure out why people get an easy exit with CO by accident, and fail when trying to do it with the intent to CTB.

Before I write this; I am not trying to encourage anyone to go on with this method. I'm sharing my findings, my thoughts and my explorations thusfar for 'entertainment purposes'.

People have been going nuts, in this thread and others, about getting the highest possible CO concentration so they get to pass out and die quickly. I don't think this is the way to go.

When people die on accident by CO poisoning it's likely that the concentration isn't all that high and they slip away due to a prolonged period of time in an environment with moderate CO levels. There are many sources and charts that contradict, but it is likely that CO can become fatal from as low as 500ppm, when exposed for a few hours. The trick is to breathe in CO, no matter how much, for long enough. Once it binds, it's bound. The rest added on is compounded and it will build it in your system. In accidental cases I cannot imagine the amount of CO is very high, as onset of symptoms is usually described as slow, flu-like and drowziness. Not extreme enough for people to become alarmed, but enough to make them want to go to sleep. Our catch is; we do not want to be found in time.

You also have to take into account the mechanism of CO production and burning in general. CO is produced by incomplete combustion. But, for combustion to even occur (complete or incomplete) there has to be oxygen. If you push up the CO levels in a sealed room quickly, I think it's rather likely that oxygen becomes depleted rather fast causing the combustion to cease thus stopping the creation of any new CO.

For CO to work there is actually no need to get rid of any oxygen. CO does not change into CO2 by simply coming into contact with oxygen. It needs some spark, or thermodynamic catalyst for it to convert into CO2 when reacting with O2. Read up on catalytic converters, they are made for this purpose. At room temperature, or slightly above, the CO bond won't break and the gas will remain intact. The oxygen content within the burning coal is already low enough (dense coal, stack, etc), and that is where the CO is produced. CO binds a lot more effectively to hemoglobin than oxygen does, so if the two are mixed in an atmosphere there should be no problem. I think the failed attempts are most likely due to the source of CO becoming extinguished either due to oversealing or improper/irregular burning of coals. I'm not going into the acid mixing method; it seems far too dangerous, uncomfortable and complicated for me. I'd rather go about and finding a way to replicate the accidental CO poisoning.

I think it's not essential to drive up CO levels to an insane amount. It will cause shock, and it will likely cause SI to kick in, making it hard to go to sleep naturally. You'll be awake to experience the CO poisoning knowing your goals. Even if you try to simulate a more accidental environment, for example with a propane heater/bbq/improper fireplace setup inside; if you do it with the knowledge that you're intending to CTB I think it's going to be tough to go to sleep as if you'd normally do. Again. SI will likely kick in and make you anxious. That's why people will use alcohol or sleeping pills to help them fall asleep in such an environment, with the hopes of not waking up. However, there are a few case studies that show alcohol/ehtanol actually improve your chances of surviving CO poisoning. So, when I attempt this I will NOT be drinking alcohol.

If you were to use a sleeping aid you must take into account that it slows your breathing. Normally an adult will breathe about 12-20 breaths per minute, also during sleep. Anything lower than 10-12 is considered unhealthy and is associated with some form of apnea or other condition. With prescribed doses of benzos your anxiety will be dampened and breathing should not be affected. In higher doses, or combinations of benzos, your breathing potentially slows down to 4-5 breaths per minute. It doesn't take a wizard in maths to realize that you'd need 2 to 3 times the amount of time of exposure to CO to reach deadly levels. Therefore, overdosing on benzos while trying this method will likely help you fail it drastically.

I'm thinking that a combination of natural CNS (valerian, passionflower) combined with a healthy dose of sleep depravation and maybe 10-20mg of valium should do the trick if you want to CTB more or less reliably with this method. If you can create an environment that produces sufficient CO for long enough you don't need to have these crazy high PPM to CTB. You just need a long enough exposure for the CO to slowly build up and off you. This is probably why people die on accident with faulty geisers, fireplaces or bbq's inside the house.

I've ordered 20kg of marabu charcoal which has a carbon content of at least 75%. Sources differ when it comes to burn time, varying from 4-5hrs all the way up to 12-15hrs. I intend to test this before I even go for a serious attempt. Sufficient oxygen in the room is not going to be a problem. CO is produced within the coal stack itsself, that's where a lack of oxygen comes into play. With dense coal, this should not be a problem. The rest of the room isn't the issue. Sealing the room should also not be necessary. Considering you're close enough to the source of CO you're going to breathe it in. If it burns for long enough it will produce CO for a long enough time and you'll likely breathe in enough to CTB. It's all a bit of a gamble, of course. Sadly, there are no certainties. If there were, I would be taking it every single day. Anybody got a reliable source of barbiturates already?! ;)

You can't really try this stuff out - but if you look at the succesful cases it's unusual to see people taking in a lot of charcoal. It's usually a few bricks, one bbq, one heater, or something like that (talking accidental cases and intentional CTB cases). If you were to seal off a confined space hermetically, the oxygen would be depleted faster and more effectively, thus stopping combustion all together. To stop combustion is to stop the production of CO and minimizing the amount of time exposed to this fine gas. I reason that the ultimate trick to this method working is to create an environment that is not well ventilated, neither hermetically sealed and to make sure any CO produced passes you before it dissipates. Put the source close to yourself and make sure it can keep burning for hours on end. This would likely help you to succeed. I think nobody would feel comfortable waking up in a miserable state - which is totally a possibility. Because of that I can imagine why people romanticize the idea of pushing the CO limits to a level of 10000+PPM, but it's just not proving to be either easily achieved and certainly not easily maintained.

In short; get yourself a nice cold house with small rooms and convince yourself it's a good idea to bring a BBQ with smokeless coal inside to heat yourself up. Get cosy, don't drink alcohol. Favor chamomille/valerian tea with a single or double benzo. Doze off and hope for the best.

I have a question. I'm using Google Translate. I'm thinking of buying a tent and putting the charcoal inside. My question is whether it's necessary to completely seal the tent, meaning make it totally airtight, or if it's okay if it's not completely sealed because of what you said about oxygen for combustion. It's still a tent for camping, so what do you think? Thanks.

 

[hdead]

I have a question. I'm using Google Translate. I'm thinking of buying a tent and putting the charcoal inside. My question is whether it's necessary to completely seal the tent, meaning make it totally airtight, or if it's okay if it's not completely sealed because of what you said about oxygen for combustion. It's still a tent for camping, so what do you think? Thanks.

The people who died on accident never sealed their tent, so I don't think it's neccessary. I think it's a gamble to do it in a tent - I suggest to do it in 0 wind and perhaps seal the top vent. The trick should be is to inhale enough CO. I can't give you any guarantees.

 

[isthisthingon]

The people who died on accident never sealed their tent, so I don't think it's neccessary. I think it's a gamble to do it in a tent - I suggest to do it in 0 wind and perhaps seal the top vent. The trick should be is to inhale enough CO. I can't give you any guarantees.

Are you preferring a car or small room over a tent?

 

[hdead]

Are you preferring a car or small room over a tent?

Yeah, if I decide to go this route I'm surely doing it inside a small room. Not even sure if I'm going to tape anything off. Just going to make sure that the coals are sufficient and burn for long enough, and be close to them. Oh yeah, no drafts. A lack of decent ventilation should be more than enough to do the trick. Prolonged exposure is the way to go, in my humble opinion.

 

[Cat-soul]

Las personas que murieron en accidentes nunca sellaron su tienda, así que no creo que sea necesario. Creo que es arriesgado hacerlo dentro de una tienda; sugiero hacerlo sin viento y quizás sellar la ventilación superior. El truco consiste en inhalar suficiente CO. No puedo darte ninguna garantía.

Lo entiendo, pero lo único a lo que tendría acceso es a una tienda de campaña; no tengo nada más.
¿Qué consejo me puedes dar?