Where do you draw the line between a healthy skepticism towards politics and the news and being conspiracy brainwashed?

[noname223]

I ask myself this when I choose the media I follow. In the past I watched Fox News and Russia Today to understand their perspective but I stopped it there are too many lies and I want to spend my time on better sources. I think one thinking fallacy I had was the following. If I followed media outlets from the whole political spectrum I would have the full picture. But it is important to understand the underlying logic of the media system to understand the game which is played. There are facts which you will never read in any newspaper or on any TV channel.

At the same time listening to Alex Jones "spitting facts" is also a flawed approach. lol. Independent media is far from perfect.

 

[DarkRange55]

FDR said, "In politics, nothing happens by accident. If it happens, you can bet it was planned that way."

It all depends on how much circumstantial evidence makes you through up some red flags. Some people they just don't see the red flags. And some people the red flags go up right away. JFK is an example. There's no actual proof of the conspiracy but there's a lot of circumstantial evidence. So it all depends on how much circumstantial evidence do you need for any particular conspiracy theory.

I believe that the government is corrupt. Some conspiracies are real. We all know the government lies. Through discussing things we will never loose knowledge. Google "Gulf of Tonkin" and find out about a fake attack on Americans they made up to get the US into Vietnam.
There's big ones like Enron. There's wise people that think the 2008 housing crisis was all on purpose that these guys built this bubble up. There have been great books written on the housing bubble, Michael Lewis's book the Big Short is a good book on it. There's been a lot of research, too many bankers is the problem.

I think conspiracy theories far too often get a bad rep. Skeptics like to throw around the terms nuts or if you're a conspiracy theorist you're a nut job. And I don't think that, that's fair at all. People have a lot of faith in our government that a lot of times maybe they shouldn't have. People trust our government to tell us things and I am as certain as I can be that our government is hiding thins from us, is keeping things from us. The question isn't is our government hiding things from us, it's why is our government hiding things from us. There could be some legitimate reasons why the government keeps things from us. If there's something that would cause mass panic and mass chaos when the government really has a handle on something then it does make some sense for them to keep things from us. But I think that in many cases and I don't know for sure, I don't know everything. But I think in a lot of cases they keep things from us that we really should know. Conspiracy theories really in many cases are more valid than the public likes to believe.

The people that want to believe, they believe in conspiracies with everything. It's very attractive to people that are schizophrenic. Schizophrenic people think that everything is a conspiracy from top to bottom, every single interaction that people have is some sort of a staged event thats trying to take them down or control this or mind control that. Thats a big factor in a lot of this conspiracy theory shit is mental illness.

Examples that turned out to be true:

• Gulf of Tonkin Incident
• Operation Northwoods
• Iran Contra Scandal
• MK Ultra
• Operation Mockingbird
• US Army Beef Scandal
• Tuskegee Syphilis Study
• Jeffrey Epstein was trafficking women and children for some very elite people on a temple island... crazy but true
• The CIA has a special gun that shoots dissolvable darts that leave no trace and cause people to get a heart attack. It was dismissed as a conspiracy theory before the gun actually turned out to be true during a trial where it was demonstrated by CIA operatives.

I ask myself this when I choose the media I follow. In the past I watched Fox News and Russia Today to understand their perspective but I stopped it there are too many lies and I want to spend my time on better sources. I think one thinking fallacy I had was the following. If I followed media outlets from the whole political spectrum I would have the full picture. But it is important to understand the underlying logic of the media system to understand the game which is played. There are facts which you will never read in any newspaper or on any TV channel.

At the same time listening to Alex Jones "spitting facts" is also a flawed approach. lol. Independent media is far from perfect.

I would also add I don't think you need a formal conspiracy when interest converge…

 

[derpyderpins]

Examples that turned out to be true:

• Jeffrey Epstein was trafficking women and children for some very elite people on a temple island... crazy but true

I don't believe you. If that were true some of those elite people would have been prosecuted and would be in prison, right?

jk.

I would also add I don't think you need a formal conspiracy when interest converge…

I like this take. A "conspiracy" doesn't need people to meet in a closed room wearing hoods and discussing their plans for world domination, with said plans thoroughly documented so they can be exposed at some point. They just have to have positions of power and aligning interests, look across the room and knowingly nod as they work towards the same goals.

 

[DarkRange55]

I don't believe you. If that were true some of those elite people would have been prosecuted and would be in prison, right?

jk.

I like this take. A "conspiracy" doesn't need people to meet in a closed room wearing hoods and discussing their plans for world domination, with said plans thoroughly documented so they can be exposed at some point. They just have to have positions of power and aligning interests, look across the room and knowingly nod as they work towards the same goals.

Exactly. I don't believe in a smoke-filled room. These people went to the same prep schools, churches, universities, fraternities, neighborhoods, boards of directors, country clubs - they have like interests, they don't need to call a meeting (necessarily), they know whats good for them. There were seven oil companies, its now 3, two political parties, a handful of insurance companies about 6 or 7 information companies but 23 flavors of donuts because its the illusion of choice but no real freedom of important choice.


The Knights Templar existed a long time ago and had a lot of money, they were very powerful during the Crusades. They loaned a lot of money but loaning a lot of money got them a lot of enemies and the Vatican and a bunch of other people killed them all. They're gone.
A lot of the presidents were Freemasons but let me explain it this way - rich people run the world. All the presidents for the most part have been rich people (senators, too). A lot of them just also just happen to be Freemasons because they are rich. Go to Bloomfield Hills. One of the richest cities in the country. Maybe all the men in that city belong to the local country club. Does that mean the *country club* is running the affairs of the city? No! The people that are *in* the country *happen* to be in charge. But that doesn't mean that the *country club* is conspiring to rule over the city. Its the rich people, its not the organizations they happen to belong to.

Smoke-filled room - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[Adûnâi]

I watched Fox News and Russia Today to understand their perspective but I stopped it there are too many lies

Wait, isn't RT English spreading actual Russophobic takes? I can't quote, only heard some from Rolo Slavskiy.

One issue I might take with the OP is that you're coming to this from a strictly Anglo perspective. Whereas in Russia so many people consider Putin to be a fake puppet of the globalists. And from all the different angles - be it Bolshevik, anarchist or liberal.

I don't believe you. If that were true some of those elite people would have been prosecuted and would be in prison, right?

One thing I could draw your attention to is the very nature of the culture at play here. Why do we consider Epstein "evil"? What he did is considered normal in all non-Christian cultures around the world. It's the Christian matrix that makes so many people yearn for a revolution and a renewal of the world, where the last shall become first.

FDR said, "In politics, nothing happens by accident. If it happens, you can bet it was planned that way."

And he died on April 12th, 1945. Was it planned as well? /jk

I would also add I don't think you need a formal conspiracy when interest converge…

This is actually a great response to the corona virus conspiracies - no need to conspire if all countries would like to enlarge their power, and probe for dissidents (or maybe even train for biological war).

A lot of the presidents were Freemasons but let me explain it this way - rich people run the world.

My take is still different. Even the rich and the stately do obey the greater surrounding culture. Why was Epstein prosecuted at all? Even if he ran afoul of someone, going with the #me2 movement is still so ungentlemanly, can you imagine a nobleman in the Middle Ages beheaded by a fellow nobleman? Preposterous.

And the grander trajectory? The human rights everywhere, for everyone? Is that a rich man's trick, too? No, my idea is that they all obey the internal logic of the water Christendom is swimming in, and cannot stray from it even if they wanted to. Look at Trump - that fraud was talking about a wall as opposed to shooting illegals on sight. Because that would be unChristlike.

 

[derpyderpins]

One thing I could draw your attention to is the very nature of the culture at play here. Why do we consider Epstein "evil"? What he did is considered normal in all non-Christian cultures around the world. It's the Christian matrix that makes so many people yearn for a revolution and a renewal of the world, where the last shall become first.

If Christianity is needed to tell society that it is bad to sell humans as sex objects, then fuck yeah! thank you Christianity and non-christian cultures must suck.

Of course, that's not true. Top of my head, because I'm familiar with it, Korea is mostly non-religious and then the remainder is split between Christians and Buddhists. I can assure you doing what Epstein did is still considered evil there. Christianity may have introduced most of our modern ethics, but it doesn't control them.

 

[Dr Iron Arc]

I don't follow any of the news or anything else really. I just go by what everyone around me is saying and assuming the opposite may or may not be true.

 

[Mirrory Me]

Well, it's all "partisan propaganda" if it concerns political concepts... Who benefits from spreading that information, when the knowledge is power? Some people only talk for their own benefit.

 

[Adûnâi]

If Christianity is needed to tell society that it is bad to sell humans as sex objects, then fuck yeah! thank you Christianity and non-christian cultures must suck.

Again, you're talking from the Christian milieu. They "suck" only to the Christians. Muslims, Hindus, Confucians, they all saw slavery as fine and natural. And even in the West, aren't prisons basically slave-farms? Aren't children slaves to their parents, at their mercy to be beaten and/or drugged (and even raped)? Christianity is so funny, trying to remove natural parts of the human condition. (And here in the Ukraine I'm basically a slave to this president who wants to kill me if I dare to leave my room.)

Believe me, I consider all existence disgusting. So why even stop at slavery?

(I feel like mods are gonna ban me now. I support slavery AND then support mortalism because slavery is disgusting, but so is life in general lmao.)

 

[derpyderpins]

Again, you're talking from the Christian milieu. They "suck" only to the Christians. Muslims, Hindus, Confucians, they all saw slavery as fine and natural.

You just kinda ignored my thing about Korea, huh

And even in the West, aren't prisons basically slave-farms?

No. I see the comparison, but no, punishment for breaking laws is not the same as traditional slavery. If we want to talk about prison reform, that's a good talk to have.

Aren't children slaves to their parents, at their mercy to be beaten and/or drugged (and even raped)?

No. Laws try to prevent it best we can. Backed by those pesky prisons.

Believe me, I consider all existence disgusting. So why even stop at slavery?

That's really sad for you. Sorry you feel that way.

 

[Adûnâi]

You just kinda ignored my thing about Korea, huh

Apologies, was caught up in the response. Korea? Korea is literally a state where every citizen is a happy slave to the Führer Kim Jong Un from the divine line of Kim Il Sung? Hello?

And if you mean the occupied Korea, then they are Christians, true, so they don't really count. Although their pagan roots do objectify women in their media - see how they're all pretty and cute, as opposed to America where anarchism and self-expression have triumphed? To see the beauty of the non-existent soul, and so on?

That's really sad for you. Sorry you feel that way.

Yeah, curiously enough, I cannot take this existence seriously at all. Other people get possessed, and I simply cannot. I will always call a spade a spade. Like children will get raped, and there's nothing you can do. Life is built to suffer gruesomely and then die in a pile of diarrhoea. Works for both humans and animals. Nothing else is foreseen by evolution.

 

[derpyderpins]

Apologies, was caught up in the response. Korea? Korea is literally a state where every citizen is a happy slave to the Führer Kim Jong Un from the divine line of Kim Il Sung? Hello?

And if you mean the occupied Korea, then they are Christians, true, so they don't really count. Although their pagan roots do objectify women in their media - see how they're all pretty and cute, as opposed to America where anarchism and self-expression have triumphed? To see the beauty of the non-existent soul, and so on?


Yeah, curiously enough, I cannot take this existence seriously at all. Other people get possessed, and I simply cannot. I will always call a spade a spade. Like children will get raped, and there's nothing you can do. Life is built to suffer gruesomely and then die in a pile of diarrhoea. Works for both humans and animals. Nothing else is foreseen by evolution.

I meant South Korea, and no they are mostly atheist. Maybe something like 30% Christian. Definitely not a controlling portion.

I hear you on feeling powerless. Crimes against children really upset me. But I figure all I can do is be good to people around me and talk to others and try to get them to do the same.

 

[DarkRange55]

It's all propaganda regardless of the news source. If it's not state-sponsored then it's a corporation with its own agenda to make money. It's all hysteria.
I think financial news can be important and political news that pertains to me maybe like firearms (some people for example hunt or like skeet shooting). But the rest of that shit I could give a damn.
All of the news is lies, exaggerated hyperbolic bs.

Research & read.

 

[Adûnâi]

I meant South Korea, and no they are mostly atheist. Maybe something like 30% Christian. Definitely not a controlling portion.

Well, by "Christian", I mean all of Western teachings - including liberalism, captalism and communism. So in that regard, southern Korea is at least 80% Christian, 20% pagan. And the pagans have been losing terribly. Still a much better country than anything in the West - including Belarus, Poland and Russia, of course. Yes, my view of Europe is that dire that a country with a sub 1 fertility rate I consider better.

I hear you on feeling powerless. Crimes against children really upset me.

The issue is that birthing children is already a crime. The main crime is by existence itself. Who knows, if those populations that beat and torture their kids replace the meek and gentle ones, it is being gentle that is deemed a crime in the eyes of biological evolution.

*If there is any confusion regarding my attitudes to children, my political and personal morals are at odds with each other. I do love politics, but I hate life. So I do love the idea of a population's survival, but I also despise the idea of having kids on an individual level. They are not contradictory if kept separate. And it's not like I engage in society anyway to be hypocritical.

 

[DarkRange55]

I ask myself this when I choose the media I follow. In the past I watched Fox News and Russia Today to understand their perspective but I stopped it there are too many lies and I want to spend my time on better sources. I think one thinking fallacy I had was the following. If I followed media outlets from the whole political spectrum I would have the full picture. But it is important to understand the underlying logic of the media system to understand the game which is played. There are facts which you will never read in any newspaper or on any TV channel.

At the same time listening to Alex Jones "spitting facts" is also a flawed approach. lol. Independent media is far from perfect.

A lot times conspiracy theories will site newspaper articles written the day of, day after, a couple of days after when its very chaotic and a lot of misinformation typically comes out in the early hours of a major news event. Also when the least information is available. Over time with further research and good reporting you can sift through those things and you can make progress in getting to the truth.

 

[noname223]

A lot times conspiracy theories will site newspaper articles written the day of, day after, a couple of days after when its very chaotic and a lot of misinformation typically comes out in the early hours of a major news event. Also when the least information is available. Over time with further research and good reporting you can sift through those things and you can make progress in getting to the truth.

Recently I read articles of Internationale Politik (in English it is available as Internationale Politik Quarterly) on the topic misinformation. There were various perspectives on it. And one article claimed that the majority of misinformation stems from traditional news media. And it is even worse because the trust in these outlets is way higher than in other platforms.