Resource Stability of SN and N

[cme-dme]

But would the vacuum sealed bag be enough or would it go bad if it's not put in a second container? I assume it's probably stored like that for a long time anyway and ships that way so probably but does anyone know in more detail

I think its fine as long as it remains in the sealed bag.

 

[SchrodingerIsDed]

Nitrate does not produce nitrogen dioxide in reaction with these acids. Commercially available curing salt can be used as a comparison, it will have a reaction, but it is not going to be significant. Sodium nitrite is an important chemical, there will always be a demand for it. Some crazy kids on YT are experimenting with it, and these videos can be used as a reference.

So you need the reagent not the commercially available version? Will the commercially available still work? Not the obviously unpure ones that actively state 10%. I guess I just need to know the purity of it, but obviously the reagent would be better, if more difficult to find.

I assumed mine was 99%, because that's what I searched for. Went through significant barriers to even get that. But, it's sounding like the commercially available sort is a mixture of various compounds, whereas the reagent is pure.

I'm guessing if it comes in a plastic bag in multiple KGs it's probably not pure, huh.

What about melting point tests? Any issues with those? Should be 271C melting point for sn. Simply using a capillary tube, heat source/Bunsen burner, and a thermometer. Wouldn't be able to determine total purity, but if it melts at 271C should be relatively pure.

 

[unworthy_]

I assume the purity is good to go ?

 

[artificialpasta]

Onto Nembutal, although it isn't talked about much anymore

I haven't been here in a while. I thought N was the default? Has something changed since? Not that I'd have access to it anyway...

 

[user671]

I have a question: I got my SN in a black plastic screw cap bottle (im not sure if it is HDPE or PP), it came sealed, but I broke the screw cap seal to open it (i did it only once) to check it out, screw it back, and now the plastic bottle is inside a box in my drawer.
It seems well closed like a normal bottle would be. I opened and closed it over a month ago.
It was manufactured in 2024 and the expiration date says 2030. I don't intend to CTB soon, for now i'm just perfecting the plan,so I'm thinking of keeping it until it expires. But reading this and other threads I got quite confused...
Can the air particles that the closed SN bottle is exposed to be enough to diminish it's shelf life to, let's say, 1 year, or some months instead of 6 as stated by the manufacturer? As I said the closed bottle was opened a month ago, I'm not sure if I diminished its potency (I couldnt find aquarium test strips to test its purity where I live, I really tried) to the extent it became unusable.
Also, there's a considerable gap between the salt and the cap, like just a tad more than the half of it.
If so, should I order another SN batch and just trust the same manufacturer and never check it this time around and put the sealed bottle in a kitchen airtight jar?
I've read that I should put the SN in an airtight container, or that I should keep it in its original bottle, some sources claimed that it couldn't be a "normal airtight kitchen jar"...
I'm afraid of asking these questions to the manufacturer and raise suspicions...

Thanks!

 

[happier than ever]

can we mix the solution a few hours in advance?

 

[user671]

If you mean the small clear glass bottle with a black cap, these are for display. But relocating the NaNO2 into a glass container is a step in the right direction. This chemical almost always ships in a plastic container or even in a plastic bag. According to research done for the U.S. Department of Homeland Security, around 525 micrograms of water diffuses through HDPE each year.
NaNO2 in a solution should be stored in a refrigerator.

Is there a difference if it's stored in neutral or alkaline glass? I just know it's got to be amber colored

 

[georgec1992]

Could someone please private message me where I can buy sodium nitrate in the UK. Thank You

 

[Trappednocure]

Regarding stability of N. So it would probably still work like 2 years after expiration date for instance then but since we would generally consume it by drinking, wouldnt the taste be absolutely unbareable if you used it past expiration date? If I understand correctly you need to take anti vomit pill when using it and you are not allowed to drink anything else or mix it with anything else. And If u do drink something else it should be a shot of something or something small with a lot of taste to remove the after taste?

 

[jc2121]

I'd like to preface this to hopefully help people not make rash decisions due to the fear that their suicide method will go "bad" and they feel forced to take it before they truly want to. Freedom of choice means everything.

There is a lot of misconception on here about how long both of these chemicals last before they are no longer useable. both SN and N are highly stable compounds in general when stored in a cool, dry, dark environment and unopened the change in potency will diminish very slowly over time. Even when stored in "unstable" conditions, they both will last for a very long time and the loss of potency is negligible. Almost all chemicals are good past their expiration date, an expiration date is not what you may think, " Since a law was passed in 1979, drug manufacturers are required to stamp an expiration date on their products. This is the date at which the manufacturer can still guarantee the full potency and safety of the drug." [1] most drugs will last for decades past expiration, some even for centuries. In the US expired drugs are sold to the military at a discounted price since legally they are no longer acceptable to be sold to the general public.

Stability of Sodium Nitrite

First we will look at SN since it is far more commonly used. "Curing salt has no hard expiration date. If your curing salt is only salt and sodium nitrate or sodium nitrite, it's good forever. Salt itself never goes bad, though yellowing and other discoloration is common. Moisture is a potential problem as it attracts microbes. To prevent such threats, store curing salts in dry, moisture-lock, airtight containers and in a cool dry place, such as your pantry or a dry goods storage closet. Do not refrigerate or freeze curing salt." [2]

Some people are worried that clumping lowers it's efficacy, this is not the case. Here is a picture of pure sodium nitrite [3] and as you can see there is clumping. Small compounds will slowly stick together over time, it is natural and usually has nothing to do with it's efficacy.

View attachment 128403

Another article showing that is it highly stable
click here

This is a picture of an aquarium test strip that was used on SN that has been sitting in a bottle of tap water with a cap on for almost a year. previously it was believed you needed to use distilled water to insure sodium nitrite would breakdown into sodium nitrate at a much slower rate. considering this SN is still useable in very subpar conditions shows this is not the case as well as shows how stable it is as a compound.

View attachment 128405

This shows Sodium Nitrite is much more stable than previously thought, even in unpleasant environments.

Stability of Nembutal (pentobarbital)

Onto Nembutal, although it isn't talked about much anymore I still think it would be a good idea to show some information regarding it. In the past there was a lot of fear that it would go bad past the due date, as well as once it was opened you had to drink it in a certain amount of time. I would like to showcase why this is wrong.

I believe these two articles are the most notable and shows N in both it's stable and unstable environment and how it reacts.

Article 1: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/26234474/

The biggest takeaway from this is, "We determined that the drug degraded at a maximum of 0.5% per year in our preparation (alkaline water/propylene glycol/ethanol) when stored in the dark at room temperature. "

Article 2: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/23982045/

The biggest takeaway from this is, "the pentobarbital sodium in injection appears to be very stable, because the loss in potency was only about 6.2% after it was boiled in water for 1.5 hours."

This isn't really related but I thought I'd share this as well. There is an anecdotal report on Erowid about a person who took N recreationally for an extended period of time. The biggest thing to note is they found expired vet N had a worse taste. "some of the bottles were past a use-by date they seemed to be the most foul to drink and provided an inferior experience". An inferior experience in this context refers to the high and possibly that the potency of N was only slightly diminished.

Pentobarbital - Erowid Exp - 'Nice but Zombie Effects Long Term'

An Experience with Pentobarbital. 'Nice but Zombie Effects Long Term' by Whynot

www.erowid.org

As you can see N is also a highly stable compound and will last long past it's shelf life with very little loss in potency. When the liquid turns cloudy it means nothing in terms of efficacy loss and is just an arbitrary rule in determining it is no longer good for sterile use in a medical setting.


I hope this thread has helped to clear up the air that Sodium Nitrite and Nembutal do not go bad quickly. You do not have to make a rushed decision to ctb because of the fear that either compound will not work. both substances are highly lethal decades past expiration. Exercise caution and make sure ctb is the right choice for you.





[1] https://www.health.harvard.edu/staying-healthy/drug-expiration-dates-do-they-mean-anything
[2] https://www.leaf.tv/articles/does-curing-salt-expire/
[3] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sodium_nitrite

Did you have to give a reason to buy SN? I am stuck on what to say?

 

[Chocoflo]

J'aimerais commencer par ceci afin d'aider les gens à ne pas prendre de décisions hâtives par crainte que leur méthode de suicide ne tourne mal et à ne pas se sentir obligés de la prendre avant même d'en avoir vraiment envie. La liberté de choix est primordiale.

Il existe de nombreuses idées fausses sur la durée de conservation de ces deux produits chimiques avant qu'ils ne deviennent inutilisables. Le SN et le N sont des composés très stables. En général, lorsqu'ils sont conservés dans un endroit frais, sec et sombre, et non ouverts, leur efficacité diminue très lentement avec le temps. Même stockés dans des conditions « instables », ils se conservent très longtemps et la perte d'efficacité est négligeable. Presque tous les produits chimiques sont utilisables après leur date de péremption, et une date de péremption n'est pas ce que l'on pourrait croire. « Depuis l'adoption d'une loi en 1979, les fabricants de médicaments sont tenus d'apposer une date de péremption sur leurs produits. C'est la date à laquelle le fabricant peut encore garantir la pleine efficacité et la sécurité du médicament. » [1] La plupart des médicaments se conservent des décennies après leur date de péremption, voire des siècles pour certains. Aux États-Unis, les médicaments périmés sont vendus à l'armée à prix réduit, car ils ne sont plus légalement autorisés à la vente au grand public.

Stabilité du nitrite de sodium

Commençons par le sel de salaison, beaucoup plus couramment utilisé. « Le sel de salaison n'a pas de date de péremption précise. Si votre sel de salaison est composé uniquement de sel et de nitrate ou de nitrite de sodium, il est utilisable indéfiniment. Le sel lui-même ne se périme jamais, bien que le jaunissement et d'autres décolorations soient fréquents. L'humidité est un problème potentiel car elle attire les microbes. Pour éviter ces risques, conservez le sel de salaison dans des récipients secs, hermétiques et à l'abri de l'humidité, dans un endroit frais et sec, comme votre garde-manger ou un placard à produits secs. Ne pas réfrigérer ni congeler le sel. » [2]

Certains craignent que l'agglutination diminue son efficacité, mais ce n'est pas le cas. Voici une photo de nitrite de sodium pur [3] : comme vous pouvez le constater, il y a agglomération. Les petits composés s'agglutinent progressivement avec le temps, ce qui est naturel et n'a généralement rien à voir avec son efficacité.

View attachment 128403

Un autre article montrant qu'il est très stable
Cliquez ici

Il s'agit d'une photo d'une bandelette de test d'aquarium qui a été utilisée sur du SN qui est resté dans une bouteille d'eau du robinet avec un bouchon pendant près d'un an. Auparavant, on pensait qu'il fallait utiliser de l'eau distillée pour garantir que le nitrite de sodium se décomposerait en nitrate de sodium à un rythme beaucoup plus lent. Considérant que ce SN est toujours utilisable dans des conditions très médiocres, cela montre que ce n'est pas le cas et montre à quel point il est stable en tant que composé.

View attachment 128405

Cela montre que le nitrite de sodium est beaucoup plus stable qu'on ne le pensait auparavant, même dans des environnements désagréables.

Stabilité du Nembutal (pentobarbital)

Passons maintenant au Nembutal. Bien qu'on n'en parle plus beaucoup, je pense qu'il serait judicieux de montrer quelques informations à son sujet. Autrefois, on craignait qu'il ne se périme après la date limite de consommation, et une fois ouvert, il fallait le boire dans un délai déterminé. J'aimerais expliquer pourquoi c'est faux.

Je pense que ces deux articles sont les plus remarquables et montrent N dans son environnement stable et instable et comment il réagit.

Article 1 : https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/26234474/

Le principal enseignement à tirer de cette expérience est le suivant : « Nous avons déterminé que le médicament se dégradait à un maximum de 0,5 % par an dans notre préparation (eau alcaline/propylène glycol/éthanol) lorsqu'il était conservé dans l'obscurité à température ambiante. »

Article 2 : https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/23982045/

Le principal enseignement à tirer de tout cela est que « le pentobarbital sodique injectable semble être très stable, car la perte de puissance n'était que d'environ 6,2 % après avoir été bouilli dans l'eau pendant 1,5 heure. »

Cela n'a pas vraiment de rapport, mais je voulais aussi partager ceci. Il existe un témoignage sur Erowid concernant une personne ayant consommé de la N à des fins récréatives pendant une période prolongée. Le plus important à noter est qu'ils ont constaté que la N vétérinaire périmée avait un goût plus prononcé. « Certaines bouteilles étaient périmées ; elles semblaient être les plus désagréables à boire et offraient une expérience de qualité inférieure. » Dans ce contexte, une expérience de qualité inférieure fait référence à l'effet euphorisant et, peut-être, à une légère diminution de la puissance de la N.

Pentobarbital - Erowid Exp - 'Nice but Zombie Effects Long Term'

An Experience with Pentobarbital. 'Nice but Zombie Effects Long Term' by Whynot

www.erowid.org

Comme vous pouvez le constater, l'azote est un composé très stable qui se conserve bien au-delà de sa date limite de consommation avec une perte d'efficacité minime. Lorsque le liquide devient trouble, cela ne signifie aucune perte d'efficacité ; il s'agit simplement d'une règle arbitraire permettant de déterminer s'il ne convient plus à une utilisation stérile en milieu médical.


J'espère que cette discussion vous aura permis de clarifier les choses : le nitrite de sodium et le nembutal ne se dégradent pas rapidement. Il n'est pas nécessaire de se précipiter pour prendre du CTB par crainte que l'un ou l'autre de ces composés ne soit pas efficace. Ces deux substances sont hautement mortelles des décennies après leur date de péremption. Soyez prudent et assurez-vous que le CTB est le bon choix pour vous.





[1] https://www.health.harvard.edu/staying-healthy/drug-expiration-dates-do-they-mean-anything
[2] https://www.leaf.tv/articles/does-curing-salt-expire/
[3] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sodium_nitrite

Bonjour, Je viens de m'inscrire sur ce site et découvre votre publication très intéressant. Pouvez-vous me suggérer des lieux, sites, ... fiables pour se procurer le SN? Je réside en France. Un grand merci pour vos informations.

 

[DivineGirl]

Can anyone tell me a reliable source to get SN?

 

[funtimes]

I'd like to preface this to hopefully help people not make rash decisions due to the fear that their suicide method will go "bad" and they feel forced to take it before they truly want to. Freedom of choice means everything.

There is a lot of misconception on here about how long both of these chemicals last before they are no longer useable. both SN and N are highly stable compounds in general when stored in a cool, dry, dark environment and unopened the change in potency will diminish very slowly over time. Even when stored in "unstable" conditions, they both will last for a very long time and the loss of potency is negligible. Almost all chemicals are good past their expiration date, an expiration date is not what you may think, " Since a law was passed in 1979, drug manufacturers are required to stamp an expiration date on their products. This is the date at which the manufacturer can still guarantee the full potency and safety of the drug." [1] most drugs will last for decades past expiration, some even for centuries. In the US expired drugs are sold to the military at a discounted price since legally they are no longer acceptable to be sold to the general public.

Stability of Sodium Nitrite

First we will look at SN since it is far more commonly used. "Curing salt has no hard expiration date. If your curing salt is only salt and sodium nitrate or sodium nitrite, it's good forever. Salt itself never goes bad, though yellowing and other discoloration is common. Moisture is a potential problem as it attracts microbes. To prevent such threats, store curing salts in dry, moisture-lock, airtight containers and in a cool dry place, such as your pantry or a dry goods storage closet. Do not refrigerate or freeze curing salt." [2]

Some people are worried that clumping lowers it's efficacy, this is not the case. Here is a picture of pure sodium nitrite [3] and as you can see there is clumping. Small compounds will slowly stick together over time, it is natural and usually has nothing to do with it's efficacy.

View attachment 128403

Another article showing that is it highly stable
click here

This is a picture of an aquarium test strip that was used on SN that has been sitting in a bottle of tap water with a cap on for almost a year. previously it was believed you needed to use distilled water to insure sodium nitrite would breakdown into sodium nitrate at a much slower rate. considering this SN is still useable in very subpar conditions shows this is not the case as well as shows how stable it is as a compound.

View attachment 128405

This shows Sodium Nitrite is much more stable than previously thought, even in unpleasant environments.

Stability of Nembutal (pentobarbital)

Onto Nembutal, although it isn't talked about much anymore I still think it would be a good idea to show some information regarding it. In the past there was a lot of fear that it would go bad past the due date, as well as once it was opened you had to drink it in a certain amount of time. I would like to showcase why this is wrong.

I believe these two articles are the most notable and shows N in both it's stable and unstable environment and how it reacts.

Article 1: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/26234474/

The biggest takeaway from this is, "We determined that the drug degraded at a maximum of 0.5% per year in our preparation (alkaline water/propylene glycol/ethanol) when stored in the dark at room temperature. "

Article 2: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/23982045/

The biggest takeaway from this is, "the pentobarbital sodium in injection appears to be very stable, because the loss in potency was only about 6.2% after it was boiled in water for 1.5 hours."

This isn't really related but I thought I'd share this as well. There is an anecdotal report on Erowid about a person who took N recreationally for an extended period of time. The biggest thing to note is they found expired vet N had a worse taste. "some of the bottles were past a use-by date they seemed to be the most foul to drink and provided an inferior experience". An inferior experience in this context refers to the high and possibly that the potency of N was only slightly diminished.

Pentobarbital - Erowid Exp - 'Nice but Zombie Effects Long Term'

An Experience with Pentobarbital. 'Nice but Zombie Effects Long Term' by Whynot

www.erowid.org

As you can see N is also a highly stable compound and will last long past it's shelf life with very little loss in potency. When the liquid turns cloudy it means nothing in terms of efficacy loss and is just an arbitrary rule in determining it is no longer good for sterile use in a medical setting.


I hope this thread has helped to clear up the air that Sodium Nitrite and Nembutal do not go bad quickly. You do not have to make a rushed decision to ctb because of the fear that either compound will not work. both substances are highly lethal decades past expiration. Exercise caution and make sure ctb is the right choice for you.





[1] https://www.health.harvard.edu/staying-healthy/drug-expiration-dates-do-they-mean-anything
[2] https://www.leaf.tv/articles/does-curing-salt-expire/
[3] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sodium_nitrite

Hi thanks for the info. Now just trying to get supply

 

[Lefty]

Is it still possible to get SN from legit places?

 

[Douggy82]

Seems like if you had a batch of SN that started at 99% purity and degraded to like 75%, you could just use some of the methods on YouTube for turning sodium nitrate into sodium nitrtite to make it pure agin

 

[Saturnrings20]

I'd like to preface this to hopefully help people not make rash decisions due to the fear that their suicide method will go "bad" and they feel forced to take it before they truly want to. Freedom of choice means everything.

There is a lot of misconception on here about how long both of these chemicals last before they are no longer useable. both SN and N are highly stable compounds in general when stored in a cool, dry, dark environment and unopened the change in potency will diminish very slowly over time. Even when stored in "unstable" conditions, they both will last for a very long time and the loss of potency is negligible. Almost all chemicals are good past their expiration date, an expiration date is not what you may think, " Since a law was passed in 1979, drug manufacturers are required to stamp an expiration date on their products. This is the date at which the manufacturer can still guarantee the full potency and safety of the drug." [1] most drugs will last for decades past expiration, some even for centuries. In the US expired drugs are sold to the military at a discounted price since legally they are no longer acceptable to be sold to the general public.

Stability of Sodium Nitrite

First we will look at SN since it is far more commonly used. "Curing salt has no hard expiration date. If your curing salt is only salt and sodium nitrate or sodium nitrite, it's good forever. Salt itself never goes bad, though yellowing and other discoloration is common. Moisture is a potential problem as it attracts microbes. To prevent such threats, store curing salts in dry, moisture-lock, airtight containers and in a cool dry place, such as your pantry or a dry goods storage closet. Do not refrigerate or freeze curing salt." [2]

Some people are worried that clumping lowers it's efficacy, this is not the case. Here is a picture of pure sodium nitrite [3] and as you can see there is clumping. Small compounds will slowly stick together over time, it is natural and usually has nothing to do with it's efficacy.

View attachment 128403

Another article showing that is it highly stable
click here

This is a picture of an aquarium test strip that was used on SN that has been sitting in a bottle of tap water with a cap on for almost a year. previously it was believed you needed to use distilled water to insure sodium nitrite would breakdown into sodium nitrate at a much slower rate. considering this SN is still useable in very subpar conditions shows this is not the case as well as shows how stable it is as a compound.

View attachment 128405

This shows Sodium Nitrite is much more stable than previously thought, even in unpleasant environments.

Stability of Nembutal (pentobarbital)

Onto Nembutal, although it isn't talked about much anymore I still think it would be a good idea to show some information regarding it. In the past there was a lot of fear that it would go bad past the due date, as well as once it was opened you had to drink it in a certain amount of time. I would like to showcase why this is wrong.

I believe these two articles are the most notable and shows N in both it's stable and unstable environment and how it reacts.

Article 1: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/26234474/

The biggest takeaway from this is, "We determined that the drug degraded at a maximum of 0.5% per year in our preparation (alkaline water/propylene glycol/ethanol) when stored in the dark at room temperature. "

Article 2: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/23982045/

The biggest takeaway from this is, "the pentobarbital sodium in injection appears to be very stable, because the loss in potency was only about 6.2% after it was boiled in water for 1.5 hours."

This isn't really related but I thought I'd share this as well. There is an anecdotal report on Erowid about a person who took N recreationally for an extended period of time. The biggest thing to note is they found expired vet N had a worse taste. "some of the bottles were past a use-by date they seemed to be the most foul to drink and provided an inferior experience". An inferior experience in this context refers to the high and possibly that the potency of N was only slightly diminished.

Pentobarbital - Erowid Exp - 'Nice but Zombie Effects Long Term'

An Experience with Pentobarbital. 'Nice but Zombie Effects Long Term' by Whynot

www.erowid.org

As you can see N is also a highly stable compound and will last long past it's shelf life with very little loss in potency. When the liquid turns cloudy it means nothing in terms of efficacy loss and is just an arbitrary rule in determining it is no longer good for sterile use in a medical setting.


I hope this thread has helped to clear up the air that Sodium Nitrite and Nembutal do not go bad quickly. You do not have to make a rushed decision to ctb because of the fear that either compound will not work. both substances are highly lethal decades past expiration. Exercise caution and make sure ctb is the right choice for you.





[1] https://www.health.harvard.edu/staying-healthy/drug-expiration-dates-do-they-mean-anything
[2] https://www.leaf.tv/articles/does-curing-salt-expire/
[3] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sodium_nitrite

This is very useful. I was thinking about this or helium. I was also wondering if a helium tank could be stored for a longer time and not lose the helium