Resource SN megathread

[Shay]

There's nothing wrong with being sceptical, that's the reason why there's fifteen pages in this thread. I'm just saying that you could have access to the most peaceful pill available - which nitrite isn't, this is only an example - and still use a different method if you were misinformed or even unaware that you had it. After all, only a minority kill themselves using nembutal, despite it being almost definitely the best substance out there.

Is that because it's hard to get? It seems the best way to go ...

 

[IfHeDiesHeDies]

There's nothing wrong with being sceptical, that's the reason why there's fifteen pages in this thread. I'm just saying that you could have access to the most peaceful pill available - which nitrite isn't, this is only an example - and still use a different method if you were misinformed or even unaware that you had it. After all, only a minority kill themselves using nembutal, despite it being almost definitely the best substance out there.

Why are so hell bent on defending this method when there is so much evidence out there saying that it isn't peaceful or reliable? You can see my and others posts history on that.

 

[Duqu]

Is that because it's hard to get? It seems the best way to go ...

Yes its very expensive and difficult to import.

As to Tagamet, I believe the only reason it was recently introduced was because it was a change in the PPeH. It used to be sodium bicarbonate now it recommends 800mg tagament.

 

[windingdown]

im a little skeptical too. It's 10 dollars. If it was so successful and easy wouldn't this be a top choice of many? It seems easy to get and cheap.. why would people choose other methods if this is as simple as it sounds

One thing is that SN as a suicide method is quite new, I believe. It was identified as a humane method for killing feral pigs in Australia relatively recently (I think within the past couple of years - I may be wrong on this). I believe Nitschke (Exit International) began discussing it as a viable method in 2017. And his org. has an active program of research going on around SN. I think that just not a great deal is known about it. We all are probably contributing to the development of knowledge around it on this forum.

And there's again that problem that people who use it, die. So they're not able to come back and give us intel on it. As OfficerK said, we're all rather in the same boat, trying to get our heads around it.

 

[Shay]

Why are so hell bent on defending this method when there is so much evidence out there saying that it isn't peaceful or reliable? You can see my and others posts history on that.

If someone couldn't get N (it seems very hard to Get here in US) what is another more effective peaceful form

 

[Deutschv2]

im a little skeptical too. It's 10 dollars. If it was so successful and easy wouldn't this be a top choice of many? It seems easy to get and cheap.. why would people choose other methods if this is as simple as it sounds

Well, you do need non otc antiemetics and tagamet right? and if you ask me charcoal is easier. it's like $5 for briquettes and you just take benzos and never wake up again, assuming you already have a grill and starter. partial hanging is free, gunshot is well known, n is also well known... there are many methods out there that may seem like "why can everyone not do this" - fact is, there are just many methods of suicide like them, and this so happens to be one of them

 

[Somerando]

Oops I should've posted here instead. What does dying from SN feel like? How does it kill?

 

[Shay]

Well, you do need non otc antiemetics and tagamet right? and if you ask me charcoal is easier. it's like $5 for briquettes and you just take benzos and never wake up again, assuming you already have a grill and starter. partial hanging is free, gunshot is well known, n is also well known... there are many methods out there that may seem like "why can everyone not do this" - fact is, there are just many methods of suicide like them, and this so happens to be one of them

Just seems N and Gun shot are more reliable. But I don't have either

 

[OfficerK]

Why are so hell bent on defending this method when there is so much evidence out there saying that it isn't peaceful or reliable? You can see my and others posts history on that.

I have yet to find any evidence which states that it's a terrible method in cases where a 'suicidal' dose combined with antiemetics (and gastric acid inhibitor) is very painful. The same goes for any evidence that proves it's unreliable in cases where you receive no medical attention.

I would honestly appreciate it very much if you could present me with the sources that claim this - part of the reason why I'm still here is because I'm sceptical about whether it'll work as intended. It could very well be that you've given them somewhere on this forum, but you have a few too many posts for me to able to look through all of them. What I can remember you writing here has only been anecdotal, and as I think I've stated before I have slightly more trust in EXIT's claims than yours, anecdotal or not.

 

[Deutschv2]

Just seems N and Gun shot are more reliable. But I don't have either

if you don't want to do sn, charcoal is fairly reliable and if you get the timing right it's good. partial hanging is also good accessibility. would recommend getting drunk before though

 

[Deutschv2]

someone made athread to discuss pain of sn https://sanctioned-suicide.net/threads/how-does-sn-kill-what-does-it-feel-like.5302/
i think it would be more organized to speak on it there

 

[windingdown]

I have yet to find any evidence which states that it's a terrible method in cases where a 'suicidal' dose combined with antiemetics (and gastric acid inhibitor) is very painful. The same goes for any evidence that proves it's unreliable in cases where you receive no medical attention.

I would honestly appreciate it very much if you could present me with the sources that claim this - part of the reason why I'm still here is because I'm sceptical about whether it'll work as intended. It could very well be that you've given them somewhere on this forum, but you have a few too many posts for me to able to look through all of them. What I can remember you writing here has only been anecdotal, and as I think I've stated before I have slightly more trust in EXIT's claims than yours, anecdotal or not.

I feel just the same...

 

[IfHeDiesHeDies]

I have yet to find any evidence which states that it's a terrible method in cases where a 'suicidal' dose combined with antiemetics (and gastric acid inhibitor) is very painful. The same goes for any evidence that proves it's unreliable in cases where you receive no medical attention.

I would honestly appreciate it very much if you could present me with the sources that claim this - part of the reason why I'm still here is because I'm sceptical about whether it'll work as intended. It could very well be that you've given them somewhere on this forum, but you have a few too many posts for me to able to look through all of them. What I can remember you writing here has only been anecdotal, and as I think I've stated before I have slightly more trust in EXIT's claims than yours, anecdotal or not.

There is not going to be any good or terrible method regarding suicide on the internet. I have presented my first hand account on treating sn poisoning. Sure it is anecdotal, you can believe what you wish as i am not in a position to go any further due to confidentiality constraints. Why are you so skeptical on the method when u vouch for its reliability and peacefulness in your previous posts ? If I were you, if I am unsure of anything, i wouldn't vouch for it as it's people's lives we are talking about here.

 

[IfHeDiesHeDies]

https://www.amazon.com/Medical-Toxicology-Review-Pearls-Wisdom/dp/0071464530

This is a beginner's guide to substance poisoning, pls read it.

 

[IfHeDiesHeDies]

I feel just the same...

lol

 

[IfHeDiesHeDies]

I would urge @windingdown and @OfficerK to stop spreading misinformation on SN. This is irresponsible and cruel.

 

[Shay]

https://www.amazon.com/Medical-Toxicology-Review-Pearls-Wisdom/dp/0071464530

This is a beginner's guide to substance poisoning, pls read it.

I'm interested in your POV. Can you share your antecodotes and more about what you know. I know you're a surgeon and would love a medical perspective

 

[windingdown]

There is not going to be any good or terrible method regarding suicide on the internet. I have presented my first hand account on treating sn poisoning. Sure it is anecdotal, you can believe what you wish as i am not in a position to go any further due to confidentiality constraints. Why are you so skeptical on the method when u vouch for its reliability and peacefulness in your previous posts ? If I were you, if I am unsure of anything, i wouldn't vouch for it as it's people's lives we are talking about here.

I definitely don't want to get into a divisive debate! It's not the kind of person I am. I think everyone should do their own research on methods - read everything they can, and make the choice they feel most comfortable with. I am certainly not vouching for a given method, just sharing based on everything I have read about the SN method, taken together.

There are methods that sound horrifying to me that other people feel comfortable with and go with. It's not irresponsible or cruel or spreading misinformation to share what I've read in the PPH, toxicology reports, and news articles, and watched Philip Nitschke speak about in videos. It is just sharing. Everyone is free to make up their own mind, based on their reading, as I am making up mine. I am an intelligent person, and everything I've read about methods over the past year suggests that SN is the best one for me, based on the factors that are meaningful to me. I would prefer Nembutal, but unfortunately cannot access it.

 

[IfHeDiesHeDies]

I'm interested in your POV. Can you share your antecodotes and more about what you know. I know you're a surgeon and would love a medical perspective

Feel free to go through my post history. i have attended to 3 SN deaths and heard many others from colleagues.

 

[IfHeDiesHeDies]

I definitely don't want to get into a divisive debate! It's not the kind of person I am. I think everyone should do their own research on methods - read everything they can, and make the choice they feel most comfortable with. I am certainly not vouching for a given method, just sharing based on everything I have read about the SN method, taken together.

There are methods that sound horrifying to me that other people feel comfortable with and go with. It's not irresponsible or cruel or spreading misinformation to share what I've read in the PPH, toxicology reports, and news articles, and watched Philip Nitschke speak about in videos. It is just sharing. Everyone is free to make up their own mind, based on their reading, as I am making up mine. I am an intelligent person, and everything I've read about methods over the past year suggests that SN is the best one for me, based on the factors that are meaningful to me. I would prefer Nembutal, but unfortunately cannot access it.

What have u read on SN deaths? just the PPH?

 

[IfHeDiesHeDies]

I definitely don't want to get into a divisive debate! It's not the kind of person I am. I think everyone should do their own research on methods - read everything they can, and make the choice they feel most comfortable with. I am certainly not vouching for a given method, just sharing based on everything I have read about the SN method, taken together.

There are methods that sound horrifying to me that other people feel comfortable with and go with. It's not irresponsible or cruel or spreading misinformation to share what I've read in the PPH, toxicology reports, and news articles, and watched Philip Nitschke speak about in videos. It is just sharing. Everyone is free to make up their own mind, based on their reading, as I am making up mine. I am an intelligent person, and everything I've read about methods over the past year suggests that SN is the best one for me, based on the factors that are meaningful to me. I would prefer Nembutal, but unfortunately cannot access it.

Nitschke also said azide is instantaneous like cyanide. google azide od , there were reports of people living over 48 hrs...

 

[windingdown]

What have u read on SN deaths? just the PPH?

Oh, well I've already outlined that in my post you quoted.

I've just trawled through the 5 pages of your posts that show up, and none of the posts have any info on your medical experience with SN poisoning, except here you mention that violent vomiting is commonplace (but this isn't cited - is it based on what you've seen?):
https://sanctioned-suicide.net/threads/sn-megathread.1156/page-14#post-80844

So unfortunately there is no helpful info people can refer to from your experiences. But no doubt that if you want to share more here, many people will be interested to hear it. I think it's important to distinguish also between large doses taken and accidental ingestion of smaller doses, as the two scenarios are likely to lead to very different experiences/outcomes. Ideally we would also know the outcome if a person took an anti-emetic first, because hopefully that would address the vomiting problem.

 

[IfHeDiesHeDies]

Oh, well I've already outlined that in my post you quoted.

I've just trawled through the 5 pages of your posts that show up, and none of the posts have any info on your medical experience with SN poisoning, except here you mention that violent vomiting is commonplace (but this isn't cited - is it based on what you've seen?):
https://sanctioned-suicide.net/threads/sn-megathread.1156/page-14#post-80844

So unfortunately there is no helpful info people can refer to from your experiences. But no doubt that if you want to share more here, many people will be interested to hear it. I think it's important to distinguish also between large doses taken and accidental ingestion of smaller doses, as the two scenarios are likely to lead to very different experiences/outcomes. Ideally we would also know the outcome if a person took an anti-emetic first, because hopefully that would address the vomiting problem.

https://sanctioned-suicide.net/threads/azide-quantity.4516/#post-67657

Click on find older messages to find my clinical findings on NaNo2 poisoing.

 

[OfficerK]

Feel free to go through my post history. i have attended to 3 SN deaths and heard many others from colleagues.

What if I say that I also happen to be a medical professional and that I've actually attended four peaceful deaths? It would hold as much weight as what you claim. It is pointless to discuss anything without either referring to medical reports or individuals who we can say are likely to have expertise on the subject.

Let me reiterate that I unironically would appreciate links to reports that directly dispute what the PPH claims. If it truly is the case that death by SN is intensely painful or unreliable, then I would prefer to avoid it myself.

I've never urged anyone to use sodium nitrite. In fact, on several occasions I have even made it clear that it is possible to receive brain damage fron nitrite poisoning (link, link2). I have also said that dying by nitrite is probably at least somewhat unpleasant, and that I urge everyone who can to use N instead. Beyond that I have simply restated what is being said in the PPH, in addition to refuting some statements that I disagree with, such as the one earlier today.

If restating what Nitschke has written or said is "spreading misinformation", should we then ban all discussion of the PPH on the forum?


Also, could you please link me the report(s) that say you can survive for over 48 hours after an azide overdose?

 

[IfHeDiesHeDies]

What if I say that I also happen to be a medical professional and that I've actually attended four peaceful deaths? It would hold as much weight as what you claim. It is pointless to discuss anything without either referring to medical reports or individuals who we can say are likely to have expertise on the subject.

Let me reiterate that I unironically would appreciate links to reports that directly dispute what the PPH claims. If it truly is the case that death by SN is intensely painful or unreliable, then I would prefer to avoid it myself.

I've never urged anyone to use sodium nitrite. In fact, on several occasions I have even made it clear that it is possible to receive brain damage fron nitrite poisoning (link, link2). I have also said that dying by nitrite is probably at least somewhat unpleasant, and that I urge everyone who can to use N instead. Beyond that I have simply restated what is being said in the PPH, in addition to refuting some statements that I disagree with, such as the one earlier today.

If restating what Nitschke has written or said is "spreading misinformation", should we then ban all discussion of the PPH on the forum?


Also, could you please link me the report(s) that say you can survive for over 48 hours after an azide overdose?

See link above.

see this one in particular:

https://www.astm.org/DIGITAL_LIBRARY/JOURNALS/FORENSIC/PAGES/JFS12818J.htm

see these 2 on nitrites

https://sanctioned-suicide.net/threads/sodium-nitrite-attempt.2902/

https://sanctioned-suicide.net/threads/sn-failed-attempt.4919/#post-76896

So you are a physician now?

 

[OfficerK]

See link above.

see this one in particular:

https://www.astm.org/DIGITAL_LIBRARY/JOURNALS/FORENSIC/PAGES/JFS12818J.htm

So you are a physician now?

No, I'm trying to say that what you claim to be is irrelevant unless you can prove that you have a background or education which makes you more knowledgeable than the people at EXIT. You can, however, produce other reports and cases that dispute what they claim.

Thanks for the link.

Edit: I've read both of these before, and obviously neither of them are actual case reports. I feel like me and others have already discussed the potential reasons for why they failed, but I can reiterate that here.

Vomiting was induced in both cases. In the first because of a lack of anti-emetics, and in the second case they strangely started vomiting immediately, which makes me doubt that it was actually caused by the nitrite. The major variable when it comes to reliability is whether you receive medical attention, and both of them did indeed get medical care.

 

[IfHeDiesHeDies]

No, I'm trying to say that what you claim to be is irrelevant unless you can prove that you have a background or education which makes you more knowledgeable than the people at EXIT. You can, however, produce other reports and cases that dispute what they claim.

Thanks for the link.

how would you like me to prove it

 

[OfficerK]

how would you like me to prove it

probably hard to do while remaining anonymous

 

[IfHeDiesHeDies]

probably hard to do while remaining anonymous

Then can you please show me reports that the dying is peaceful and quick?

 

[Justanotherconsumer]

Not knowing amounts of sn or other info, like was the sn poisoning accidental or suicidal. Its impossible to get a true picture on the effectiveness or peacefulness of a method. Sn is very commonly sold as a meat preservation preservative but as a pre made salt with very little actual sn 3%-6%. If you look at the poison side effects you would never touch the stuff but the same can be said of nembutal as well, people can survive Methb levels of 30%-40% without medical intervention, but i imagine the suffering would be great, and likely from accidental ingestion. In poorer countries shops are likely to self treat there own meat with poorly trained food workers, so i would think that accounts for the greater number of sn poisonings there. I have read cases of people dying from sn even after treatment at a hospital but i suspect that is from med. staff either misdiagnosis and possibly the patient not knowing what made them ill.