Your offer to help with a GoFundMe is much appreaciated but right now I'd be not ready for it. That was an idea several years ago already. I have no idea of potential costs and it would also become too "private" from here onwards. Other issues would also have to be solved in the same time. I will "bookmark" this for now and I have to think about it whether this could really be a suitable option for me. Thanks. If I come to the onclusion that this would be worth trying I'd come back to you.
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Listen to me man if it takes a pilgrimage or a journey to find you're self and help you get out of you're depression i swear on my god i will try and raise as much awareness of it as possible
Please find what you truly need and chase it ferociously until you make the world give in and finally give you what you need and deserve
This is where I guess we're never going to see eye to eye though- I'm not looking to 'better my life'. I don't want to exist- full stop. I simply don't have the will to live that you have. I truly wish that I'd never been born to begin with. Sorry if that sounds incredibly toxic to you (I expect it does.) Still- I hope that you can understand that if someone resents being alive to begin with- there really isn't a desire to invest in more life.
This is why it's good that the mod's have moved your thread to the 'Recovery' section. Here you will likely find people who DO want to better their lives and might be grateful for your insight. A lot of people in the 'Suicide Discussion' section WANT to give up on life. (Including me. We don't actually welcome being told what we could or worse- SHOULD and shouldn't be doing.)
The only obligation I have towards living is because I believe it would upset my Dad greatly if I CTB while he was alive. I've already hung on for 33 years for him and others. I think it was respect and love for him that made me do that. I don't really believe in an afterlife- so- once he's gone- I don't believe my suicide would hurt him.
In terms of 'dishonouring' his memory- if I'm honest- I'm tired of having to live up to the expectations of dead people. I have already lost most of my close family members- most in early childhood.
To be brutally honest and harsh about this- life seems very much to be about the expectations of others- which you either internalize or you don't. Where do you think they got those expectations from? Their parents? Society? Religion? If the main message is: Become a fit and productive member of society- who do you think that benefits ultimately? I'd say the rich people at the top so- capitalism. I'm tired of being a cog in a machine. I want out.
Ultimately- I didn't choose to be born. If my family somehow have lived on after death- I'd hope they realise how unhappy I've been in life. How I DID actually make an effort for them to keep going- for 33 plus years. They don't even realise I'm suicidal and have been since I was a child- I've tried to spare them that. I'd hope that they had enough love and compassion for me that they'd be relieved if I one day chose to end it- rather than be disappointed at what a failure I was.
Put it this way- if someone you knew and cared about was really struggling in life- would you want them to carry on? Even if things didn't improve for them? Would you keep on pushing them and nagging them to join a gym, journal, volunteer- because that will solve their problems? Even if they insisted that they had already tried all that? How long would you insist that they had to live because change is just around the corner- and they owe it to themselves and to you and to the memories of all the people they have lost?
I'm 43 with 33 years of ideation behind me. I'm terribly stubborn and a pessimist. With the one person I love the most in the world dead, no friends or family around me, likely back in some wage slave job I hate- what are the chances of me being motivated to turn my life around?!!
Of course- it wouldn't be what my Dad or Mum would have wanted. I really wish they hadn't given birth to me to begin with though and I've 'forgiven' them. I know they didn't do it with the intention that things would turn out like this. People don't CTB to intentionally hurt their loved ones either. They do it because they don't feel like they can fight any more or they don't want to.
You asked me what I have against putting in effort? I'd say- absolutely nothing. I applaud people who put in effort. What do you have against choice? Why is it not acceptable for people to CHOOSE whether or not they want to put in that effort?
Put it this way- WHO do you feel this obligation to live and fight to? Yourself- because you owe it to yourself to fulfill your own potential and because life itself has intrinsic value? Fine- if you want to believe that. I don't have those feelings for my own life. Your parents? Yes- I agree- which is why I'm still here. Dead relatives memories? Fine- if you think it benefits them. I personally don't- I'd hope my dead relatives have enough love and respect to see me as my flawed self rather than be disappointed that I hadn't lived up (quite literally) to their expectations. God? Fine- but we don't 100% know there is one.
Ultimately- I guess what I want to express is gratitude that you care for people enough to want to help them. Still- at the same time- a fond farewell- because I'm too stubborn to change for someone else- and I certainly won't be guilted into doing or not doing something because of things other people believe.
I'd say- you do you and good luck to you. I strongly suspect that there are people in this section who will strongly resonate with you and you can all support one another. All the best to you and thank you for sharing your perspective.
You're existence and everyone else's existence has a meaning.Weather u chose it or not,might as well make the time you're on here worth it right?You are VERY talented in one thing or another,you just have to find that thing that you love truly.Honestly i'd say that what would help greatly is hanging around good people just hear me out if you start hanging around nice people who help and support you,and do things with their life and have everything together it WILL rub off on you thats human nature.The thing is as well when you say how long would i nag someone ,truth fully ,if they followed What i'm saying legitimately and not for others and tweaked things catering to their own needs.Then not long because the results would show quickly.The reason i'm against You guys not putting effort in is because each and every one of you here has a talent in something even that funeralcry dude who insulted me and stuff.The thing is why would you want to end it all when you could have so many fun years and happiness instead.Happiness is objectively what everyone wants,and killing yourself isn't making you happy,its not what any one who was in you're life wants.Truthfully what killing yourself is just an escape.When i had a knife to my chest for a few moments i was like o i feel HAPPY its over.But why would i want to be HAPPY for only like a couple of minutes when instead i can be HAPPY for my whole life.You me or any other dingus head here wouldn't kill themself if they aren't HAPPY doing it right?Like isn't that what ur talking abt with choice?If u choose to CTB,u should be HAPPY when ur about to do it right.But if that happiness is what ur chasing,then u can be happy for so much longer by actually living a good fulfilling life and bouncing back from the WORST things.
@lifeandeath I salute you overcoming your issues and your determination. I hope you maintain your recovery and your strength. I note that you seem to be quite young. This forum as a general rule promotes recovery in people who are let's say under 25. I remember when I was young I had hope therapy would help me, I had more energy and cycled and played football. I went to work. I fought, survived, was angry with my childhood and tried to live, faked my life the best I could. My mental illness was not as severe as it is now. I could laugh.
Now, the only reason I am able to get out of bed and do basic tasks like food shopping is because my medication is currently helping me. I have constant suicidal thoughts all day every day and I feel totally powerless against them. I read recently that some people with severe depression are unable to raise their own arm. Imagine that. I was personally bed-bound for two years. I would force myself to go for a walk in the late afternoons for maybe the first year as I wanted to keep mobility, and the whole of each walk I would fantasise about hanging myself or jumping in the river. Constant agitation.Waves of shame. All day, every day. After years of fighting to keep working, keep active, keep some kind of life.
My medication is helping me enough that I am thinking about joining a gym. So I will aim to follow a little of your advice. However, I don't think I will ever be free of these suicidal thoughts and my life is torture with them. I also have some kind of social dysfunction, loneliness, life in tatters, boredom and as for a reason to live - I used to think I could stop climate change! Now, in my local area they are asking for people to sponsor and water the trees in the park because the trees are going thirsty.
So I am pleased with you sharing your inspirational story and your determined advice for those of us with a little fight left in us or who are deciding to endure life a little longer. And I know that without my medication helping me get out of bed and walk down the street your advice would be impossible to follow. And for others, their ills are also not all solvable.
Now, the only reason I am able to get out of bed and do basic tasks like food shopping is because my medication is currently helping me. I have constant suicidal thoughts all day every day and I feel totally powerless against them. I read recently that some people with severe depression are unable to raise their own arm. Imagine that. I was personally bed-bound for two years. I would force myself to go for a walk in the late afternoons for maybe the first year as I wanted to keep mobility, and the whole of each walk I would fantasise about hanging myself or jumping in the river. Constant agitation.Waves of shame. All day, every day. After years of fighting to keep working, keep active, keep some kind of life.
My medication is helping me enough that I am thinking about joining a gym. So I will aim to follow a little of your advice. However, I don't think I will ever be free of these suicidal thoughts and my life is torture with them. I also have some kind of social dysfunction, loneliness, life in tatters, boredom and as for a reason to live - I used to think I could stop climate change! Now, in my local area they are asking for people to sponsor and water the trees in the park because the trees are going thirsty.
So I am pleased with you sharing your inspirational story and your determined advice for those of us with a little fight left in us or who are deciding to endure life a little longer. And I know that without my medication helping me get out of bed and walk down the street your advice would be impossible to follow. And for others, their ills are also not all solvable.
Thing is- I have my own (predictably) negative view on people and their talents. Ultimately- what talents/gifts to any humans have that either- don't benefit other humans? Or- try to limit or reverse some of the damage we have already done in the environment and/or to other humans? As you can probably tell- I don't like the human race much. I think we are a parasite on this earth. The earth can barely support the 8 billion of us already here. All I'm realistically going to do is pollute this earth the longer I stay. I really doubt that recycling etc does much to lessen the impact. Like the amazing comedian Shaun Lock said: 'It's like bringing a dustpan and brush to an earthquake zone.'
Again- I'm happy for you that you found your talent in life. I also did- and I used it and enjoyed it and hopefully, it made one or two other people happy too. Again though- the way I see it is- it belongs to me. If I retired tomorrow- that would be up to me. My life- my choice. The chances are far more likely for me that financial responsibilities will make me have to quit. Lots of people in this world simply aren't able to even express or use their talents if they aren't needed- not in terms of their job anyhow. How many Artists out there do you think actually make it in life? So many of our jobs are now being done by computers!
Again- you seem to just assume that we live in this utopia where everyone can just pick out what they are good at and enjoy- and then excel in it. That requires other people to support you financially- which most people don't have. How many people do you know that are working a job they want and studied for? For me- it isn't many- but then- I'm from the Arts side of things. Doing it as a hobby isn't always enough for people.
In terms of mixing with the 'right kind of people', this is a major conundrum for people here- ESPECIALLY here in the 'Recovery' section. I agree- in order to recover- it likely is a good idea to be around positive minded people. The thing is though- for people who are seriously considering CTB- and for those who care about what impact that may have on those left behind- we tend to make a deliberate effort to withdraw. Most of us certainly don't go out our way to form new friendships and relationships- for the very real fear we may hurt them one day by CTB.
You're assuming everyone can, will and wants to recover. EVEN some people who WANT to recover can't always seem to. Hopefully- you'll start to see that here. In essence, people sometimes end up making a trap for themselves where- they may feel better initially but if/when those suicidal feelings return- now they are surrounded by people who they don't want to hurt. They feel probably the worst loneliness of all- being lonely in a crowd because their new positive friends likely can't fathom how they feel. They either won't tell them- to spare their feelings and/or lectures/platitudes- or- they will tell them and get a very negative, unsympathetic response or- be abandoned all together as a 'toxic' influence. I expect you will start to see the very real anguish that people who are in this position feel here. I definitely wouldn't invite that upon myself- or them.
In terms of 'happiness'. It isn't a constant state- people have their highs and their lows. The lows for people here are usually worse than the highs. None of us can eradicate pain in our lives. We can adjust how we cope with it but that takes a lot of effort and in our experience- it isn't worth the effort. I'm guessing you're in your 20's? If so- I'm over double your age! I know myself pretty well I think. I know what things I am willing to put effort in to and change. I know I'm stubborn too- I won't do things because other people think they know best about my life. It's not necessarily that they're wrong- it's because that choice is up to me.
Even if I could be guaranteed a happy life from now on- which NO ONE can guarantee- I would likely STILL prefer to die. You may think that's wrong. You may think that everyone here can recover- that they should be forced to recover. Ultimately though- you don't get to choose what other people do with their lives. Again- it's lovely that you care but I hope on some level you appreciate that the right of autonomy is crucial if you respect free will. Forcing people to do things because you're certain you know best really isn't supportive. Still- I reckon in this section- you will find people who will welcome your support and I wish you all the best with it.
Ultimately though- we're not going to agree. You think your way is right and it should be how everyone feels- or- it should appeal enough to people to make themselves like you. I respect that everyone in life feels differently. I don't want you to change how you feel about your life. I also think that for people who WANT to change- you could be a great influence. I'm not looking for that though- so- while I respect your opinions and what you're trying to do- they're not for me. Still- all the best to you here. I'm sure you'll find some people to help.
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Honestly one thing I don't really understand is why most people on here think i had some goody two shoes happy life.I was extremely depressed at on point and literally had a knife to my own chest.And a lot of people ik were depressed and suicidal but managed to bounce back as well.If you are thinking of joining a gym,just do it.Also don't just go to a gym and expect happiness.There's many other things to it.Like gym isn't even the most important part in my method.You NEED to do altruistic things,spend more time in nature or just going outside in general and have an actual purpose in ur life if u want to be happy in my experience.Listen at least try and do all of the things i mentioned for about 2 months or 3 months and see the difference it will have in you're life.
Imma be honest u never really responded to my point about how,if u were to suicide,u should feel HAPPY to CTB.But if feeling happy for that is what u desire,why not just live a happy life and have many happy years.No body can guarantee a happy life yes thats true.And the world isn't all happy and stuff.But as well no one can guarantee that u will have an extremely sad life after as well.Ultimately tho if u put in the effort and live in the present and stuff ur probability of living a happy life skyrockets.
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Honestly you are talking bollocks. I spend time walking in nature every day. And my suicidal thoughts come with me. So bollocks to you. I spent years working in the charity sector and was still depressed. Before that I was a teacher and still depressed. Patronise somebody else.
I absolutely don't think joining a gym cures depression. Weight lifting boosts dopamine but with chronic mental illness thst is treatment resistant happiness is a concept my brain does not do.
@lifeandeath go and preach your ministy in the psych wards. Tell them all to go spend time with trees as the secret to happiness. And to find their purpose. Lol.
First of all u need to tie everything together like doing it all.As well tho u could be the most buff guy, go on walks everyday and do charity and shit but if u don't have an actual goal or purpose in ur life u'll still be depressed no matter what happens.Also u talk abt psych wards.Yes in certain cases insane ppl can't do the things i said but as well some ppl can recover from the ward and while those ppl have to take meds to stop insanity again they can still do the things i said.Ik this because i literally know someone who bounced back from going full on mentally insane.
@lifeandeath I can see the discussion is moving on. I join but without refering to my case in particular, just general discussion.
if u don't have an actual goal or purpose in ur life u'll still be depressed no matter what happens. This is perfectly true. What is the solution? One can only find their own goals on their own, maybe they reached all goals already (mainly older people), or the goals they want to reach are so far away, they can never be achieved.
Yes a few people can recover and can live with meds. My opinion regarding psych meds is, in very rare cases they might be able to help but in most cases they just set the brain under drugs and make it think and see the world in a different way. Once meds stopped, unless one became addicted, the reality becomes visibible again and everything is like before.
"Healing" a psychological illness is not as straight forward as healing physical illnesses as the roots of the illness have to be healed. A tree cannot stay alive with dead roots regardless the amount of fertilizer it may get.
Imo there are 3 groups:
1. Group: has just a short depressive episode and with an early treatment and help their situation changes fast enough so they have positive feelings and expectations again and go back to life as their expectations are met, ofc need needs a lot of work. Some may even be able to help themselves in this early stage.
2. Group: Severe depression, therapy and meds, maybe several times, this group splits up into 2 parts. The one group can be "healed" and live a life with meds accepting their fate and the other group is sick of meds and therapy because their life does not change in the way they wish for. They become the 3rd group.
3. Group: Has practicularly given up, because nothing's gonna change for them from their point of view. and this group meets here because nobody out there who's life is at least halfway going well and following the way they wish for, can understand, how one can reach such deep depressed levels of life full of mental pain and suffering and so on.
I could never understand why someone would commit suicide while my life was in order and going the way I wanted it to go, but I was aware that maybe they did not see another way out of their misery and took the last available option. Now, I can fully underdstand this decision very well, as it affects me directly.
if u don't have an actual goal or purpose in ur life u'll still be depressed no matter what happens. This is perfectly true. What is the solution? One can only find their own goals on their own, maybe they reached all goals already (mainly older people), or the goals they want to reach are so far away, they can never be achieved.
Yes a few people can recover and can live with meds. My opinion regarding psych meds is, in very rare cases they might be able to help but in most cases they just set the brain under drugs and make it think and see the world in a different way. Once meds stopped, unless one became addicted, the reality becomes visibible again and everything is like before.
"Healing" a psychological illness is not as straight forward as healing physical illnesses as the roots of the illness have to be healed. A tree cannot stay alive with dead roots regardless the amount of fertilizer it may get.
Imo there are 3 groups:
1. Group: has just a short depressive episode and with an early treatment and help their situation changes fast enough so they have positive feelings and expectations again and go back to life as their expectations are met, ofc need needs a lot of work. Some may even be able to help themselves in this early stage.
2. Group: Severe depression, therapy and meds, maybe several times, this group splits up into 2 parts. The one group can be "healed" and live a life with meds accepting their fate and the other group is sick of meds and therapy because their life does not change in the way they wish for. They become the 3rd group.
3. Group: Has practicularly given up, because nothing's gonna change for them from their point of view. and this group meets here because nobody out there who's life is at least halfway going well and following the way they wish for, can understand, how one can reach such deep depressed levels of life full of mental pain and suffering and so on.
I could never understand why someone would commit suicide while my life was in order and going the way I wanted it to go, but I was aware that maybe they did not see another way out of their misery and took the last available option. Now, I can fully underdstand this decision very well, as it affects me directly.
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This is the issue though.People think to themself there is no possible other goal i could work for when there always is.You can always be a better version of urself,you can always try new things and you can always improve.Truthfully a good purpose/goal in life is one that u will never full "achieve"but u keep striving to do as much as u can.For example with me and fighting i'm never going to be completely satisfied as i'm always setting new standards on myself.If i beat one opponent who i've been thinking about or do a new move while training then thats great but i then focus on beating someone else or trying something new.You need to have a general theme for the goals you have and keep setting new standards for yourself and thats how u live a fulfilling life imo.You can't live in the past or live in the future you need to live in the present,that rule applies for goals as well.If you'v achieved something already,try achieve something even BIGGER than what you previously achieved and do this over and over,constantly try to one up urself basically.In our modern world we've been basically bumfucked by everything.Our food has a shit ton of chemicals,we work jobs we don't like to buy things we don't need to impress people we don't like.And all of that shitfuckery society has given us removes purpose for so many men and women.Like I am very confident that none of you replying to this thread have a clear cut goal ur working to right now,that ur passionate about and that when you achieve this goal you will set an even bigger one for your self and achieve it as well.
I think it's important that when u set goals,its not the actual bit of you achieving the goal thats the best part,the best part is you working your way up to achieve this goal.Its like acceleration,when ur accelerating to a high speed thats what ur feeling,going to that high speed but if u were to just be at that high speed normally you wouldn't feel anything.So continuously set more and more challenging goals for urself and ur journey to reach these goals is what gives happiness
My post is replying to this
I think it's important that when u set goals,its not the actual bit of you achieving the goal thats the best part,the best part is you working your way up to achieve this goal.Its like acceleration,when ur accelerating to a high speed thats what ur feeling,going to that high speed but if u were to just be at that high speed normally you wouldn't feel anything.So continuously set more and more challenging goals for urself and ur journey to reach these goals is what gives happiness
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I'm not gna answer cuz i'm not gna reveal anything abt myself on a forum like this unless i have to considering all the stuff i've heard abt it.
It makes me sad that so many young people out there have such problems, depression, no goals, no perspectives at all, probably for them there could be a strategy developed. This is a big task for our "modern" society.
But the older you are the harder it is to climb up the ladder again, starting from 0 oder from a deeply depressed state. Just imagine someone being past 50, this should be the best part of ones life time, when you worked hard to have a good life when one reaches that age and then imagine this fails. Either this one has a backup that holds him, or there is no backup at all, most people do not have the power again to start from 0, either they accept a life they probably don't want to live and they did not work for so hard, or they decide to end it.
Alr so it seems we're getting closer to a common ground but the only difference there is right now is that you're saying its harder and harder the older you get right?
I'm not looking for blissful happiness- no. I'm looking for relief. Yes- the idea of not waking up tomorrow fills me with a wonderful sense of calm. (Please don't tell me to meditate next...) I suppose it IS in fact effort that I want to get away from- you're right. Shit loads of effort with an unequal sense of achievement. I don't want to put in that effort... again and again and again. I've done it for 43 years already- I've done all the stuff on your list. I'm not willing to follow your or anyone elses life coaching... again but with more effort to see if you're right. No matter what 'reward' I might or might not get... Unless that is- that I change my mind but it will be my own doing and at that point- I likely would do the stuff on your list. Not because someone else has told me to though- I need to want that myself.
Please just accept that you can't 'help' everyone. You can't change people's minds if they don't want to change. You can't 'help' people that aren't willing to help themselves. You can't convince people that hate life to love it- unless they want to change. No- I don't want what you're offering in terms of a 'happy' life.
Will CTB make me happy? Of course not! It's likely to be painful, frightening and lonely. I'm really upset that I'm going to have to do it to myself if I really want out but- there we go. Life has been a challenge. Death likely will be too. The ideal solution would be to have never been born to begin with but- there we go- we're not given the choice sadly.
Like I say though- I'm stubborn and I don't want to be 'saved'. Other people- most especially in this section might. Good luck.
But the thing is ofc its harder to get back up from life as you get older.But since it's harder the reward will be all the more better when you do it.Please don't take it in a rude way but i feel you know that finding a purpose for ur life and having goals and setting new standards is the way to live a happy life,however you can't do it because ur old or u don't have enough fuel.But honestly man it doesn't matter if ur old or whatever.All of us,if we know we can live a happy life we should.me you and anybody else should stop making excuses for ourselves and work hard to live a life we want.Just because ur old doesn't mean ur whole life is now just fucked completely.Many people found success later in life and just because life knocked you down once doesn't mean you should just stay down.The reward for u will be all the more better when u work hard to be happy.I mean tribal people don't experience the problems we have in the modern society today because they have a clear purpose and goals.When you lose that basic biological need ofc ur life will go to shit.But if u don't ever even try to find it ur life will never ever get better my friend.Even rn some ppl say they can't afford a gym they can't afford weights well u definitely have a floor so u can go do press-ups can't u?(this is an example).My point is u and any1 else on this forum has potential u just need to find ur purpose.And would you rather get out of ur depression right now,find ur goals and live a fulfilling life or would u just end it all now when there was so much more you could do with ur life.People overestimate what they can do in a year but underestimate what they can do in 5 years or 6 years.
This was replying to praestat
The meditation thing actually made me chuckle honestly but as well i'm still confused by this point of view.Ur saying u love the idea of not waking up tomorrow ,but when u get a happy life waking up tomorrow won't even be a bad thing,and plus u'll be able to be happy in the morning u wake up,over and over.If u CBT there wouldn't even be anything,sure u'd achieve the same thing as living a happy life(getting away from waking up tmrw)but u wouldn't be around to experience the happiness.Living a happy life is objectively better than ctb'ing because the thought of waking up tmrw won't be bad and also u'll be there to experience happiness.I'm not looking for blissful happiness- no. I'm looking for relief. Yes- the idea of not waking up tomorrow fills me with a wonderful sense of calm. (Please don't tell me to meditate next...) I suppose it IS in fact effort that I want to get away from- you're right. Shit loads of effort with an unequal sense of achievement. I don't want to put in that effort... again and again and again. I've done it for 43 years already- I've done all the stuff on your list. I'm not willing to follow your or anyone elses life coaching... again but with more effort to see if you're right. No matter what 'reward' I might or might not get... Unless that is- that I change my mind but it will be my own doing and at that point- I likely would do the stuff on your list. Not because someone else has told me to though- I need to want that myself.
Please just accept that you can't 'help' everyone. You can't change people's minds if they don't want to change. You can't 'help' people that aren't willing to help themselves. You can't convince people that hate life to love it- unless they want to change. No- I don't want what you're offering in terms of a 'happy' life.
Will CTB make me happy? Of course not! It's likely to be painful, frightening and lonely. I'm really upset that I'm going to have to do it to myself if I really want out but- there we go. Life has been a challenge. Death likely will be too. The ideal solution would be to have never been born to begin with but- there we go- we're not given the choice sadly.
Like I say though- I'm stubborn and I don't want to be 'saved'. Other people- most especially in this section might. Good luck.
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Yes the age is a potential factor, as well as the life experience one had before the depressive episode, but ofc there are always a few exceptions in all age ranges. The longeer the depressive epiosode was the harder it is to get outa there. Yes it's harder and harder and it needs more and more energy, to climb up the ladder again. Can the one climb up again alone or do they need help? Whatever could help them.
U urself know if u can do this alone or with help,some ppl need help and that is completely ok.Like i said,i am not shitting u if what u need is a pilgrimage i myself will try make a gofundme with a friend of mine and help u out.But as well,why don't u atleast try.I had a bunch of shitty ass life experiences.Watching relatives go insane,abuse,seperation,and its not just me many MANY others have had these things happen to them and bounce back.Truthfully here no bullshit there is always a voice trying to hold us back,telling us to stay in out comfort zone,and that voice makes up all kinds of bs excuses to stop us from working hard.Eradicate that voice,david goggings had a shitty life for example but did he stop?no he healed.Its ALWAYS possible to heal just step out of ur comfort zone.And u keep on talking abt that yes what i'm saying is right but its hard,buts it harder to live everyday of ur life weighed down by ur depression,its hard to wake up in the morning and not want to exist.Its HARDER to do that everyday then get ur shit together man.I've done both,my friends did both and they can tell u,its harder to live ur life depressed and miserable,then put some effort into things and have a clear goal and wakeup everyday having a purpose and goal.Yes for u its harder than for a young teen or something,but for u also the reward will be much greater,u'll feel a lot better because it was harder,u'll respect ur self more than the teen would(even tho he'd still respect himself)Because it was harder.The harder it is the bigger the reward,nothing comes easy to us,we have to work for it,build up ur discipline and find ur purpose,and i guarantee that that'll be a lot easier than waking up and living ur life constantly weighed down from sadness
@lifeandeath "But since it's harder the reward will be all the more better when you do it."
What someone sees a reward is as individual as everyone out there. And there is still the unanswered question: What should people so? They need a goal, you found yours, others don't find one or don't find one any more. This the crucial point here.
What someone sees a reward is as individual as everyone out there. And there is still the unanswered question: What should people so? They need a goal, you found yours, others don't find one or don't find one any more. This the crucial point here.
whatevs
Mining for copium in the weirdest places.
- Jan 15, 2022
- 2,914
You are delusional. This poster is in no way trolling. Although mostly useless for me, I respect the effort OP made to try and help others.
You are really young and out of your depth here but thanks for your good will. A 19yo will never be a good source of life advice. Many suicidal people face practically or actually unfixable hardships, especially the older you get.
Ur first point is kinda dumb icl.Happiness is objective,its a feeling u get,fulfilment is a feeling u get.Whats subjective is the way u choose to get this happiness,but happiness itself is an emotion that every1 knows what it is.As for what should people pursue.I state this already,people should pursue something that interests them and something that'll keep them working and striving for things.Ur probably thinking rn"what if they have no interests"well then they can at least pursue the most basic thing of getting in physically good shape at least.As well people can always explore what things interest them.And what things don't.They need to be responsible and decide for themselves what they want in life,is that decision a hard one?yes,does it give us rewards?YES a shit ton of them.
Firs thnx for being defending me.2nd of all what am i saying thats wrong exactly
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I simply don't believe I will ever have a 'happy life' though- no matter what I do. I've already tried all that I want to do to make me happy. I don't feel either the obligation to live or be happy. I'm a pessimist. Being happy doesn't even feel safe because it usually signals I'm falling into the trap of feeling hope- which hurts even more when those hopes are dashed.
Death is appealing because I don't believe you can regret things in death. I don't think you feel anything after that. That's what I want- a complete lack of awareness and feeling. I'd take that over 'happiness'. It's BECAUSE happiness requires effort and it isn't a constant. It's not an emotion I trust because the deepest unhappiness tends to follow periods of hope. I'm VERY unlikely to have a happy life. It's good you enjoy all aspects of struggling because that's likely what's coming! I personally, don't.
I could bet you I'd still be suicidal living your life. I probably don't feel the same sense of reward from life that you do. We all have our own histories that have formed us into who we are. You've found your vocation and it's given you a real drive in life- great. My vocation was found via avoidance- avoiding life basically- a coping mechanism because I'm pretty sure I grew up with a narcissist that made my life hell. I maybe don't have the positive associations you do with your passion. It IS my purpose in life- it's the thing that brings me the most fulfilment but even then- it's probably different to you in terms of making me feel a sense of achievement/happiness.
This is kind of intrusive and I don't really expect you to answer- I appreciate you don't want to reveal your identity. Still- from what you have said- I get the impression maybe your family aren't the greatest- but that they DO support you financially? Maybe I'm wrong but your initial post about when you just spent the whole day scrolling YouTube and wanking makes it sound like you've not had a job yet. Maybe you have- maybe I'm wrong. In which case- I appologise. What I'm trying to get at is- your life may be very different to people here. Finances are a big deal. If you have to support yourself and can't do it through a job you like- you likely end up with something you hate- and it grinds you down. Ironically- it was while I was stuck in a shitty retail job that I was doing most of the the things on your list. I was unhappy though- because it wasn't my purpose.
It's pretty difficult to juggle everything in the real world. If you're managing it- then- absolutely- hats off to you. If you're financially catered for though- you're life IS going to be easier. I could definitely have a better bash at life if the wolf wasn't at the door. Life's quite probably great if you don't have to compromise. Most people do though. Many people can't fund themselves through their 'passion' and working full time can just sap all the energy they have left.
As for journaling- I do that. I used to go for long walks a lot and I've worked in care before. I work in what I believe is my purpose and I used to take care of my health. I have ticked those boxes. Yes- things COULD improve for me if I did ALL those things again- all at once. I don't WANT things to improve though. I simply don't believe in your utopian view (for me anyhow.) So- that's why I'm really not interested in putting all of that effort in.
Ultimately- I'm a pessimist and a cynic. I don't believe in 'happily ever after' fairytale stuff. You're right when you say you have to work for it- I don't want to- no matter how blissfully you paint it- I simply don't believe I would feel that and I'm not willing to try. (For now anyway.)
I do understand that you don't understand. Sorry- I've written reams again. What I really should have just said was- I don't believe in your vision of living 'happily ever after' for EVERYONE if they only follow your guidelines. For some people- it may well work. I don't think it would for me...
Try going into your next fight believing you will lose. You wouldn't- right? You can't MAKE people put shit loads of effort into something they don't believe in in the first place- ie. a 'happy' life. Does that make any kind of sense?!!
If u believe that u will never ever get happy.Then u won't.Also you say that i enjoy struggle?????I don't i never fucking ever did,no one does truthfully.But it's disciplining urself. As for my family ur right,some of them can and have succeeded in ruining my life.But still even they can change and get better.
The thing is this,objectively speaking,everyone wants happiness ,in ur case, u feel happy by CTB'ing and ending it all right.
Like look if i ask u rn r u happy to CTB,ur argument crumbles.
If u say ur happy to CTB,then that makes no sense as you'd get even more happiness by living a fulfilling life.You admit u most
Likely never merged everything together and u don't think u can be happy but why don't u just try it.I mean if life is so meaningless and ur gna want to CTB anyway why not at least try to get better before finally ctb'ing.And try ur hardest to get better before u ctb.
If u say ur not HAPPY to ctb then why should you do it?You urself aren't even happy doing it then.
I asked the same question before and never really got a clear answer from you because imo questions like that,when h genuinely think abt it could destroy all the brainwashing on here
I'm DEFINITELY not brainwashed by anyone on here! Plus- nothing you're saying is new to me. Of course- I've considered that- seeing that I'm stuck here for now- waiting for my Dad to go first- shouldn't I try to make life better for myself? We're back to the same old argument- lots of effort for something I don't believe will help me- because I've tried before and don't have the will to do it. I'm tired and I don't want to keep fighting- let alone fight harder! I'd rather just tread water for now. Get by as best I can and- when my Dad does pass- I'll make my decision.
I don't need to make you understand for it to make sense to me! As I've said previously- I am grateful that you want to help people here. I don't think we can go any further in this conversation though.
I've given you the answer that I don't want to keep trying because 43 years of experience has taught me what does and doesn't work FOR ME. I've also emphasized how important choice and belief is- so as you said- if you believe you'll never be happy you won't be= exactly my point. I DON'T BELIEVE I'LL EVER BE HAPPY! I firmly believe you need to commit to recovery for it to be successful and I neither believe in it (for me) or want to make the effort to do it.
Just because someone else thinks I'm wrong- it won't change my mind. I don't know how else I can put it. It doesn't matter if you don't think I've made my argument clearly- or- that it doesn't make sense to you. Ultimately- I respect you for what you want to do with your life but what you think has no bearing on my life and what I choose to do with it.
I'll say goodbye now and wish you all the very best because all I can really see happening is this getting nastier and nastier as we both get frustrated with one another for not understanding or accepting one another's standpoints.
As I've said multiple times before- people in this section may be open to your ideas but I do actually belong in the other section of this site. I'm not looking to 'recover' at the moment. Thanks though and- all the best.
I am totally alone for the whole weekend.
I walk down the street crying with mental illness and loneliness
I did look around a gym today with a view to joining
I did go for a walk and manage to do my food shopping
I went to the library and read one whole book to distract myself
Tomorrow the torment begins again, and I am still agitated and needing to distract myself.
I feel desperation and despair at the reality that my mental health may never be better than this. That I am currently trying one of the last medications available to me and this is torture every day. I am really not enjoying being alive. It is not a choice. It is brain chemistry and genetics.
OP you are very young and you have not lived years fighting mental illness. I hope you don't have to. Many of us would not wish this suffering even on our worst enemies.
I don't really want a reply to this.It is my vent post for my utter desperation and torment and how I wake up with suicidal thoughts, go to sleep with suicidal thoughts, and walk with loneliness.
I am one of the lucky ones. I don't have children. I am estranged from my mum. I am relatively free to CTB, but I don't want to inflict this pain. But how long can I endure this suffering.
Please don't reply. I don't want to swear at you.
I walk down the street crying with mental illness and loneliness
I did look around a gym today with a view to joining
I did go for a walk and manage to do my food shopping
I went to the library and read one whole book to distract myself
Tomorrow the torment begins again, and I am still agitated and needing to distract myself.
I feel desperation and despair at the reality that my mental health may never be better than this. That I am currently trying one of the last medications available to me and this is torture every day. I am really not enjoying being alive. It is not a choice. It is brain chemistry and genetics.
OP you are very young and you have not lived years fighting mental illness. I hope you don't have to. Many of us would not wish this suffering even on our worst enemies.
I don't really want a reply to this.It is my vent post for my utter desperation and torment and how I wake up with suicidal thoughts, go to sleep with suicidal thoughts, and walk with loneliness.
I am one of the lucky ones. I don't have children. I am estranged from my mum. I am relatively free to CTB, but I don't want to inflict this pain. But how long can I endure this suffering.
Please don't reply. I don't want to swear at you.
You don't believe in something u have never fully committed to.The reason ik this is because u urself later on admitted to being afraid of effort.Just take that first step,it always the hardest,but after everything becomes easier
Source Energy
I want to be where people areN'T...
- Jan 23, 2023
- 705
I'll bite. I go to the gym, got the abs, do things for others when I can...but when it comes to life goals/what I want most in life...not being able to have that is one reason I want to ctb. How about ppl like me?
Having a burning wish in life that you just can't achieve makes you wanna die like nothing else.
I agree with healthy lifestyle and positive attitude in general - but there is no one size fits all.
I suggest joining a gym and making friends with some of the people there.Trust me they are nice af.U'll start to feel less lonely when u go.Ik ur gna swear at me right now,but once ur in a clear mind just read this post carefully
Yeah thats great and all but what purpose do u urself have.U need to start thinking and trying ur hardest to find a genuine purpose.Yes it might be hard but its also hard for you to live a life where everyday is a struggle.
Ok- this will (hopefully) be the last reply... Some of what you're saying makes sense- I'm not going to deny it in terms of my situation- I COULD try harder... I don't want to- I probably won't. If you want to believe I missed the incredible opportunity to live a fulfilled and happy life whether I CTB or not- go ahead.
There are some people here though who have tried EVERYTHING with all they have and they're still struggling. When will it be enough? When it works? What if it doesn't work though? Are you just going to tell them they didn't try hard enough- because it worked for you? Can you not see how insulting that is for some people?!! People who's situations are entirely different to yours. Very possibly a whole lot worse. So many people have now said the same thing- this 'one size fits all' doesn't work for everyone.
To me- it doesn't bother me. I'm willing to admit I'm lazy when it comes down to it. I'd also say it was about choice but you don't seem to think people have the right to choose. So- we can't really go any futher than that.
I'll concede that my life COULD get better if I changed my mindset and gave recovery a chance but I'll likely choose not to. It's up to everyone else now as to whether they want to take you up on your advice.
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