etherealgoddess

etherealgoddess

perseverance is inevitable success
Dec 8, 2022
193
If you see this, this is a sign you have hope! I have overcome depression and learned to effectively cope with anxiety all by myself because therapy nowadays can be so horrendous, and I'm here to answer questions! Love you guys.
 
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Rairii

Rairii

Is it necessary?
Nov 27, 2022
133
well that's incredibly nice for you and I'm glad you could but for some people it's not that simple or really possible. Everyone has different life experiences that either get in the way or help them in improving their symptoms of mental illness. I'm sorry but hearing some random person who I know nothing about overcome their own issues, will not magically give me hope lol. Obviously life and mental illness is not that simple, if it was then no one would really be here.
 
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Lonerzepam

Lonerzepam

O'lord! I Have My Doubts
Sep 2, 2022
620
No offense but it just doesn't work that way. Everyones depression and other illnesses have different causes. It can't be generalized. I'm glad you're doing better and just trying to help out. But it just doesn't work that way. Every individual has different causes, symptoms and life experiences. Some things can be fixed. Some can't. Only the person expierencing their symptoms themselves can understand the root of which causes them and how to eventually fix it.
Nonetheless I'm happy for you you're doing better you're on a good path now šŸ™Œ
 
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etherealgoddess

etherealgoddess

perseverance is inevitable success
Dec 8, 2022
193
well that's incredibly nice for you and I'm glad you could but for some people it's not that simple or really possible. Everyone has different life experiences that either get in the way or help them in improving their symptoms of mental illness. I'm sorry but hearing some random person who I know nothing about overcome their own issues, will not magically give me hope lol. Obviously life and mental illness is not that simple, if it was then no one would really be here. I am not saying that people need to feel pressured, but I do want to be a resource for people who are looking to ease some of the pain without death. :)
This is just a drop of hope for people who do want to recover, even if the smallest bit inside them wants to. I thought there was no light in the tunnel, but I did find it. I firmly believe that if anyone who is reading this wants to recover that they can, however, I absolutely understand why people may not be able to bear the journey and eventually end up committing because it is not an easy one. I am not invalidating people's reasons to suicide... absolutely not. I mean, I was so close to killing myself twice. I understand how it felt to never see any hope. But I do believe that with an amount of time and determination that anyone COULD recover, and I do not say this in the sense that someone is "better" than someone else for being able to recover or that me recovering rather than committing suicide means I am "better" than you or other people. It's just... if someone is wanting to recover, I totally believe in them and believe they can do it! I believe that misery comes from the mind and your perception of the circumstances, not the circumstances. However, some people may really not find a single part of themselves that wants to recover. But please, do not take this in a bad way. I am literally on this website because I want to help people.
 
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Rairii

Rairii

Is it necessary?
Nov 27, 2022
133
I firmly believe that if anyone who is reading this wants to recover that they can, however, I absolutely understand why people may not be able to bear the journey
! I believe that misery comes from the mind and your perception of the circumstances, not the circumstances.
These are pretty shitty statements to make, i'm sorrry.
Not everyone has the privilege of having support (like some people are completely alone, even on the professional front, and have no way of getting out of that), not everyone has the mental, intellectual, or physical capacity to recovery, not everyone has it good financially (which plays a huge role in mental health whether you want to admit it or not), then some people can't get a job which keeps their finances even lower, or some people can only get very low paying jobs, etc. There are so many circumstances that make it so difficult to recover and at times actually impossible. what you're basically implying is "ay everyone has the ability to recover and if they don't then its their own personal failing as a human being." and these people very well probably want to recover, it just sucks that we live in a world that sometimes makes it impossible or extremely difficult to do so.

also, do you not realize how bad circumstances can get? you can only remain so positive in a shit situation. Should I have been happy at age 13 when my brother was choking me out on the ground to the point where I thought I was going to die, while my mother stood back and laughed at me? and that's not even the worst thing they did to me. You sound like you've lived a rather privileged life to be able to make these comments or at least haven't experienced really bad horrors that would change your mind on what you're saying. I'm glad you haven't, no one should have to. However, you should respectfully keep your mouth shut about experiences and circumstances and things you don't truly know about.

I am literally on this website because I want to help people.
this isn't a site to help people, there are other sites for that.
 
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MidnightDream

MidnightDream

Warlock
Sep 5, 2022
735
I can maybe, maybe understand why you would post this in the recovery section.
But the suicide discussion section? No.
As a new account with no post history? Absolutely no.
Such weird energy
 
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N

noaccount

Enlightened
Oct 26, 2019
1,099
! I believe that misery comes from the mind and your perception of the circumstances, not the circumstances.
Well, yes, because I have a soul. My soul doesn't want to block out the feeling of misery in response to horrible circumstances. I don't want to manipulate my mind to feel positively about awful things. The mind's ability to feel misery - of course we would not feel miserable without a mind - but that ability is a good thing. I don't consider myself "un-recovered" because of my suicidality, nor do I consider my agreement to keep living for the time-being "recovery" per se, just, the deal I'm currently striking.
 
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Zegers

Zegers

Enlightened
Dec 15, 2021
1,761
It's not easy to get out of the quicksand of depression, in my case it's chronic so there's not much hope.

Congrats.
 
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J

jamie_

Specialist
May 21, 2022
334
I'm happy for you, envious even.
I believe that misery comes from the mind and your perception of the circumstances, not the circumstances
On the other hand, what the fuck is this^ ā€“ seriously. One step from going full Andrew Tate and telling me depression isn't even real.
I am literally on this website because I want to help people
You're going to have to walk me through a bit more on how you stumbled upon this website.
 
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Himalayan

Himalayan

"Wake up to reality, nothing ever goes as planned"
Sep 30, 2022
422
I hope my problems are gone by tomorrow, only positive thinking... Joking. Glad you recovered mate.
 
hans0solo

hans0solo

Member
Dec 10, 2021
75
environmental factors contribute a lot, like poverty, disability. If you live in a rat-infested room and don't have food, you can't just 'wish' yourself to 'be happy'. If you are in constant physical pain or like many people with Long Covid/ME/CFS, your life is pretty horrible because you can't do much beyond sleep, lie in bed and watch tv.
 
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L

LonelyEmerald

Experienced
Nov 26, 2022
232
yea like I want to listen to a woman who calls herself "goddess"
 
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Ineedtodie

Ineedtodie

Shame, Avoidance, hopelessness, lonliness, cbt, pm
Nov 9, 2022
403
Not to be pessimistic but some people depression become chronic and develop different symptoms along their life time and personalty proble. But despairing as I sound. I m not giving up especially with the anxiety symptoms because that's key is . Other effetcts..etc.. I can't even start wIth others symptoms that are harder to manage. But of course with resources nd tools in your disposal, entourage, finacial support, luck. Everything is possible but we all know that's almost a myth. Of course some are lucky enough ironicly to better there life tremendously and make big leaps, they never imagined possible.
 
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Life_and_Death

Life_and_Death

Do what's best for you šŸ•Æļø Right now, I'm stressed
Jul 1, 2020
6,899
this isn't a site to help people, there are other sites for that.
granted they also had this post in suicide discussion which is not a sub forum to help people, however this is the recovery sub forum where the intention is to help people. That's why it's called recovery. As long as they aren't being pushy and stay in the recovery section, people like this should stay to help the people that do want to recover. If we don't allow it and if we keep going on about how it's "not a site to help people" we might as well delete the recovery section and prove all the pro lifers right because that's all you're doing. (youre in reference to people in general).
Pro choice, yet we keep throwing the recovery section out the window. I have a discord where its purpose is the let the suicidal and non suicidal talk so one can understand and one can get help if they desire. If we keep drawing these lines between the suicidal or not then we're never going to get anywhere. Why even have the recovery section? Everyone here is suicidal so it's not exactly like they're the best for answering recovery questions if they haven't themselves.
This divide is stupid and unproductive.

Edit: this pro life stuff is going to far. I can't speak for others but I know I dont bother with recovery things here. Meaning whether you're openly doing it or not, you're still encouraging suicide because you're making people fear to ask for help and most people here have no other place to ask for help.
 
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Rairii

Rairii

Is it necessary?
Nov 27, 2022
133
granted they also had this post in suicide discussion which is not a sub forum to help people, however this is the recovery sub forum where the intention is to help people. That's why it's called recovery. As long as they aren't being pushy and stay in the recovery section, people like this should stay to help the people that do want to recover. If we don't allow it and if we keep going on about how it's "not a site to help people" we might as well delete the recovery section and prove all the pro lifers right because that's all you're doing. (youre in reference to people in general).
Pro choice, yet we keep throwing the recovery section out the window. I have a discord where its purpose is the let the suicidal and non suicidal talk so one can understand and one can get help if they desire. If we keep drawing these lines between the suicidal or not then we're never going to get anywhere. Why even have the recovery section? Everyone here is suicidal so it's not exactly like they're the best for answering recovery questions if they haven't themselves.
This divide is stupid and unproductive.

Edit: this pro life stuff is going to far. I can't speak for others but I know I dont bother with recovery things here. Meaning whether you're openly doing it or not, you're still encouraging suicide because you're making people fear to ask for help and most people here have no other place to ask for help.
Yeah, I wasn't looking at what section this was posted under initially. I shouldn't have made that comment in this sub. Even once I realized it, I was already unironically triggered by their savior complex characteristics (I've had people like that in my life use their complex as a form of abuse) hence why it struck such a cord in me. Regardless, still not an excuse. I apologize for making the environment more uncomfortable(? Sorry, I can't find the right word) by saying that this isn't a place to help.

Also, I do want people to get help if they want it. I'm in the process of it myself even though I still feel like I'll end up CTB at the end of the day. I just don't like others preaching that if recover isn't going well or as planned then it's more or less your fault. Like this person was doing. Since that is very harmful in itself.
 
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Life_and_Death

Life_and_Death

Do what's best for you šŸ•Æļø Right now, I'm stressed
Jul 1, 2020
6,899
Yeah, I wasn't looking at what section this was posted under initially. I shouldn't have made that comment in this sub. Even once I realized it, I was already unironically triggered by their savior complex characteristics (I've had people like that in my life use their complex as a form of abuse) hence why it struck such a cord in me. Regardless, still not an excuse. I apologize for making the environment more uncomfortable(? Sorry, I can't find the right word) by saying that this isn't a place to help.

Also, I do want people to get help if they want it. I'm in the process of it myself even though I still feel like I'll end up CTB at the end of the day. I just don't like others preaching that if recover isn't going well or as planned then it's more or less your fault. Like this person was doing. Since that is very harmful in itself.
I was talking about more then just you so don't take what I said too personally šŸ¤— I'm sorry if you did. Also people make mistakes and I understand that once you're there (already upset by something) it's difficult to let it go :heart:. (I'd say uncomfortable was a good word.)
You're right about the recovery thing. I'm trying as well but my method is still within reach (literally lol).
 
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Rairii

Rairii

Is it necessary?
Nov 27, 2022
133
I was talking about more then just you so don't take what I said too personally šŸ¤— I'm sorry if you did. Also people make mistakes and I understand that once you're there (already upset by something) it's difficult to let it go :heart:. (I'd say uncomfortable was a good word.)
You're right about the recovery thing. I'm trying as well but my method is still within reach (literally lol).
Oh no, it's okay. I didn't take it too personally, even though rereading it looks like I did...lol. thank you though!
 
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S

squarely

Member
Nov 29, 2022
12
I also recovered from suicidality on my own, though i still have other mental issues to work on. How did you do it? For me it was a (really) long list of books that convinced me to continue living.
 
deadliftEnjoyer

deadliftEnjoyer

Member
Nov 9, 2022
44
I also recovered from suicidality on my own, though i still have other mental issues to work on. How did you do it? For me it was a (really) long list of books that convinced me to continue living.
Which books were those?
 
etherealgoddess

etherealgoddess

perseverance is inevitable success
Dec 8, 2022
193
How did you do it?
as well as @theboy

I started understanding that the world, in our eyes, is through 1) the neutrality of objects and 2) the lens through which we see it the world that divides things into positive, negative, and indifferent. Some people were saying that I was claiming that depression isn't real and that I am invalidating it because it's just mindset, but that's literally what depression is. It's basically just having a perception of life that makes the world look horrible.

Look at Nick Vujicic. He has absolutely no limbs, and he probably needs someone to help him with literally every aspect of his life. But what makes him successful and happy? He chooses to have a lens that is positive in the sense that he puts an intentional focus on looking for the good things in his life. He was utterly depressed, but he did overcome it!

The whole premise is that there is the law of polarity in this world. You can literally see ANYTHING as positive or negative, and you can choose whether you choose to focus on the good or the bad because it is existent literally anywhere. That's why literally ANY point of view on the world is valid. You CAN find the world to have absolutely no meaning because you choose to focus on all of the cons. A positive lens CAN find the world to be so beautiful, interesting, and fun by choosing to look at the good sides of things. This basically brings to light that any opinion on the world is valid. It's just up to you whether you want to have the most negative opinion on it or not.

This may be a very unusual, strange, alien experience when you have been depressed for a while. It will feel kind of fake in the beginning. But if you keep trying to do it and keep practicing it, you will start seeing how you can change your outlook on things by simply CHOOSING to focus more on the good rather than the bad. It will not be overnight because shutting down negative thought patterns and developing your control over those thought patterns through mindfulness takes time.

For example, you can be sad that your ex-partner was a complete asshole. Through my lens (I CHOOSE to focus on the good things), I believe that the world has lessons. If it hadn't been this specific person as my ex, it would have been someone else inevitably (And it's usually true). Of course, there may be "bad luck," but ultimately, I do believe that there are lessons in every moment that you believe to be unpleasant and thus, this helps to have more of a positive view of the world. I take this bad ex-partner as a lesson to avoid and dump people who act a certain way towards me, and I am thankful for this bad experience because it helps me to live my life in the present and future even better! You can also choose to think about how he made you feel so depressed and ruminate on negative emotions. That is a very valid way to look at things. But is that really how you want to choose to think? Also based on another of the aspects of overcoming depression, I take the lesson to use it in the present. Instead of thinking about the experience in the past, I focus a lot more on how I can use the lessons in the future and what situations I could use them in rather than the actual experience and how it felt in the past.

Do not tell me that you cannot choose how you think. It's not because you cannot choose. It's just because you need to develop that muscle where you can be mindful to accept and reject thoughts that pop into your brain through thought patterns. I will talk about that in a bit.

Another thing to point out is that being positive does not mean that I ignore my negative emotions or am perfect and happy 24/7. Absolutely not. It's just that I have emotional distress techniques where I know how to deal with my emotions once they start getting too negative, and then once I can calm down, I can try to change my perspective. Once you start feeling a 5/10 in feeling bad, you have to start calming yourself down so you can deal with your emotions in that logical sense where you can "choose your lens." If you feel utterly depressed and start trying to change your lens right now through "choosing to look at the positive side," it's not going to work because you are already indulged in an emotion that is flooding your brain with depressed thoughts that align with the emotion rather than actually being able to consciously think.

So, how do you change that lens? Mindfulness and meditation, the hierarchy of needs, emotional distress techniques, finding/doing/committing to hobbies, having self-discipline, and being present (stop thinking).

If you brush over mindfulness, you will forever be depressed. No joke. Mindfulness is based on the factual idea that our brains have thought patterns, and that 90% of what you thought yesterday is what you will think today. It's not because those thoughts are correct. It's just because they just pop into your brain. If you do not have any mindfulness of your thoughts, you will literally accept any thought that you randomly get popped into your mind and take it as the truth. For example, maybe you failed a test. Then you think, "Shit, I am a fucking failure." That is a THOUGHT PATTERN, not necessarily the truth. Like, should you really identify your entire self as a failure because of one screwed-up test? Hmm... That's why mindfulness is about taking a step back from your thoughts and seeing your thoughts as if you were looking in the eagle's eye of a chessboard. You see all of the chess pieces, but you aren't one of them. This analogy is in the sense that your thoughts and emotions are the chess pieces, and you notice them without judgment instead of actually embodying and identifying with the emotions and thoughts. In that sense, you have the choice to reject or accept them consciously because again, you have the choice. This is not going to be very easy, and the key thing here is having patience with yourself and not judging/scolding yourself for having negative thoughts. The key here is to notice WITHOUT judgment.

Meditation is the biggest thing for helping with mindfulness. It's about staying present, focusing on your breath, and then observing thoughts as they roll in without any judgment. It is especially good for focus and having "control" over your thoughts. You do not have control over the fact that random thoughts pop in your head. But you have the choice on whether you want that to be the truth of your reality because remember, by the law of polarity, every single thought can have truth. Choose the thoughts that you want to highlight as the truth of your reality.

The hierarchy of needs consists of having food, having some form of social interaction, having a purpose (can be as simple as living because that's my purpose honestly--my purpose is to simply be), etc. You do not need every single form to be satisfied (life purpose is based on your personal values--search up a list of values and find the ones you like--they can't be concrete goals), but it can help to boost your mood. For me, I would say that my life purpose is to be literally just alive and have peace and optimism and be grateful. I enjoy just sitting in the present in peace when I take a break after doing some huge homework assignments. Just being alive, for me, is my sense of purpose. The purpose of one's life is more about aligning with values rather than achieving a goal. For example, you value hard work, quality relationships, and peace. You then act accordingly in the best that you can. Read about all of the things in the hierarchy of needs and look at every single one and analyze how your life fulfills that need. Then see if change needs to be done. Change will be done through the act of self discipline, doing stuff even though you really don't want to do it because you don't feel like it.

Emotional distress techniques are the most important. When you get overwhelmed with emotion, you end up ultimately having thoughts that go out of control. You start thinking that everything is absolutely shit, especially when you're depressed or sad. The key to this is just checking online for techniques to handle emotional distress and see which one really appeals to you. Then, when you feel "not right" and feel kinda bad at least on a 5/10, you need to start using the emotional distress techniques to calm yourself down as much as possible. The reason for this is that if you read the entire text that I wrote here, it will not make sense or process through a mind that is overwhelmed with negative emotions. You need to do something that can calm you down and bring you closer to a state of peace. Then you can start seeing the logic to push away negative emotions. Even just having the feeling of "not feeling right" or feeling lost and confused are states of mind that you need to use emotional distress techniques to deal with. Just research on the internet about them and choose the one that seems the best for you.

Find hobbies and things to do and stop spending time on devices. There is a lot of research about the use of social media and how it perpetuates anxiety, depression, and a lack of concentration and focus. Get off of it and find other stuff to do with your life! Search up hobbies, and even if something SLIGHTLY interests you, do it. When you're depressed, you may think that every hobby is boring. But nah, you go off and try it! Try drawing, search up tutorials, etc. If that hobby didn't work for you, try another one. However, do try to commit a little before you switch to the next hobby. Sometimes, after you develop a new skill for the hobby, you may enjoy it a lot more. So be patient and try stuff out!

Self discipline is key. You cannot expect to get out of depression without absolutely forcing yourself to do stuff that you do not want to do at first. You have to FORCE yourself to take a shower, brush your teeth, and comb your hair no matter how much you don't want to do it. The key for me is to do a 5-second countdown and then doing it. 5 4 3 2 1 and then push myself off my seat and walk towards the task I need to do and then start doing it. You're going to do stuff that you do not like. But you have to do it for your well-being. This relates to the hierarchy of needs. You need to force yourself to take care of the needs to the most of your ability.

Being present is the key. Dwelling in the past = depression, and dwelling in the future = anxiety. Things are actually not that difficult when you don't think too much about it. Things seem very difficult in your head, but when you spend 99% of your time doing and the 1% thinking about what you are doing, you will be 10x happier. You do not need a perfect plan on what to do. Just start implementing random stuff and keep building on it. Spend as much time as you can in the present. The future and the past literally DO NOT exist--they only exist in your mind. The only thing that you have a grasp on is the present moment.

Also, set up downtime for yourself. Overstimulation is a problem in society where people feel the need to constantly stimulate themselves with either work or entertainment. You need at least 3.5 hours of downtime a day. You can do light reading (more entertainment and not too dramatic or sad) or showering or taking a walk or etc.

There is probably more, but this is what I thought of immediately. This got me out of depression without some shitty therapist because a lot of mental health services are a fucking joke. This is why I am becoming a psychiatrist so I can actually teach people to have happier lives rather than saying, "I understand," and asking robotic questions that make you feel pissed off.
Yeah, I wasn't looking at what section this was posted under initially. I shouldn't have made that comment in this sub. Even once I realized it, I was already unironically triggered by their savior complex characteristics (I've had people like that in my life use their complex as a form of abuse) hence why it struck such a cord in me. Regardless, still not an excuse. I apologize for making the environment more uncomfortable(? Sorry, I can't find the right word) by saying that this isn't a place to help.

Also, I do want people to get help if they want it. I'm in the process of it myself even though I still feel like I'll end up CTB at the end of the day. I just don't like others preaching that if recover isn't going well or as planned then it's more or less your fault. Like this person was doing. Since that is very harmful in itself.
I didn't realize that you see the savior complex as a form of abuse. I am sorry that you had to go through that. But at least you have the life experience to help your life in the present and the future.

Also, I do not think that if recovery isn't going well or as planned that it is your "fault." I feel like that idea is more the idea of scolding yourself and hating yourself. For me, I would say more of my perspective is dealing with recovery without judgment or expectations or scolding yourself or etc. I just do believe that there are things that you can do, and as someone's willpower and self-discipline develops, they can overcome their depression. I think depression is a mindset.
 
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Rairii

Rairii

Is it necessary?
Nov 27, 2022
133
I didn't realize that you see the savior complex as a form of abuse. I am sorry that you had to go through that. But at least you have the life experience to help your life in the present and the future.
you can quite literally go fuck yourself
so glad for you to not have experienced horrific abuse but don't act like it isn't bad or like its a fucking gift. Its not that I see a savior complex as a form of abuse, these people are abusers quite often. I would literally give anything to have not been abused from my birth to the age of 25, all those years straight full of abuse, no break from it. I did not need these "lessons" i would have functioned so much better without it.

edit: now that i am less angry, shouldn't have said the first part but I'm not gonna remove it and pretend I didn't say it. you're still saying pretty insensitive things though and it's not okay.
 
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deadliftEnjoyer

deadliftEnjoyer

Member
Nov 9, 2022
44
as well as @theboy

I started understanding that the world, in our eyes, is through 1) the neutrality of objects and 2) the lens through which we see it the world that divides things into positive, negative, and indifferent. Some people were saying that I was claiming that depression isn't real and that I am invalidating it because it's just mindset, but that's literally what depression is. It's basically just having a perception of life that makes the world look horrible.

Look at Nick Vujicic. He has absolutely no limbs, and he probably needs someone to help him with literally every aspect of his life. But what makes him successful and happy? He chooses to have a lens that is positive in the sense that he puts an intentional focus on looking for the good things in his life. He was utterly depressed, but he did overcome it!

The whole premise is that there is the law of polarity in this world. You can literally see ANYTHING as positive or negative, and you can choose whether you choose to focus on the good or the bad because it is existent literally anywhere. That's why literally ANY point of view on the world is valid. You CAN find the world to have absolutely no meaning because you choose to focus on all of the cons. A positive lens CAN find the world to be so beautiful, interesting, and fun by choosing to look at the good sides of things. This basically brings to light that any opinion on the world is valid. It's just up to you whether you want to have the most negative opinion on it or not.

This may be a very unusual, strange, alien experience when you have been depressed for a while. It will feel kind of fake in the beginning. But if you keep trying to do it and keep practicing it, you will start seeing how you can change your outlook on things by simply CHOOSING to focus more on the good rather than the bad. It will not be overnight because shutting down negative thought patterns and developing your control over those thought patterns through mindfulness takes time.

For example, you can be sad that your ex-partner was a complete asshole. Through my lens (I CHOOSE to focus on the good things), I believe that the world has lessons. If it hadn't been this specific person as my ex, it would have been someone else inevitably (And it's usually true). Of course, there may be "bad luck," but ultimately, I do believe that there are lessons in every moment that you believe to be unpleasant and thus, this helps to have more of a positive view of the world. I take this bad ex-partner as a lesson to avoid and dump people who act a certain way towards me, and I am thankful for this bad experience because it helps me to live my life in the present and future even better! You can also choose to think about how he made you feel so depressed and ruminate on negative emotions. That is a very valid way to look at things. But is that really how you want to choose to think? Also based on another of the aspects of overcoming depression, I take the lesson to use it in the present. Instead of thinking about the experience in the past, I focus a lot more on how I can use the lessons in the future and what situations I could use them in rather than the actual experience and how it felt in the past.

Do not tell me that you cannot choose how you think. It's not because you cannot choose. It's just because you need to develop that muscle where you can be mindful to accept and reject thoughts that pop into your brain through thought patterns. I will talk about that in a bit.

Another thing to point out is that being positive does not mean that I ignore my negative emotions or am perfect and happy 24/7. Absolutely not. It's just that I have emotional distress techniques where I know how to deal with my emotions once they start getting too negative, and then once I can calm down, I can try to change my perspective. Once you start feeling a 5/10 in feeling bad, you have to start calming yourself down so you can deal with your emotions in that logical sense where you can "choose your lens." If you feel utterly depressed and start trying to change your lens right now through "choosing to look at the positive side," it's not going to work because you are already indulged in an emotion that is flooding your brain with depressed thoughts that align with the emotion rather than actually being able to consciously think.

So, how do you change that lens? Mindfulness and meditation, the hierarchy of needs, emotional distress techniques, finding/doing/committing to hobbies, having self-discipline, and being present (stop thinking).

If you brush over mindfulness, you will forever be depressed. No joke. Mindfulness is based on the factual idea that our brains have thought patterns, and that 90% of what you thought yesterday is what you will think today. It's not because those thoughts are correct. It's just because they just pop into your brain. If you do not have any mindfulness of your thoughts, you will literally accept any thought that you randomly get popped into your mind and take it as the truth. For example, maybe you failed a test. Then you think, "Shit, I am a fucking failure." That is a THOUGHT PATTERN, not necessarily the truth. Like, should you really identify your entire self as a failure because of one screwed-up test? Hmm... That's why mindfulness is about taking a step back from your thoughts and seeing your thoughts as if you were looking in the eagle's eye of a chessboard. You see all of the chess pieces, but you aren't one of them. This analogy is in the sense that your thoughts and emotions are the chess pieces, and you notice them without judgment instead of actually embodying and identifying with the emotions and thoughts. In that sense, you have the choice to reject or accept them consciously because again, you have the choice. This is not going to be very easy, and the key thing here is having patience with yourself and not judging/scolding yourself for having negative thoughts. The key here is to notice WITHOUT judgment.

Meditation is the biggest thing for helping with mindfulness. It's about staying present, focusing on your breath, and then observing thoughts as they roll in without any judgment. It is especially good for focus and having "control" over your thoughts. You do not have control over the fact that random thoughts pop in your head. But you have the choice on whether you want that to be the truth of your reality because remember, by the law of polarity, every single thought can have truth. Choose the thoughts that you want to highlight as the truth of your reality.

The hierarchy of needs consists of having food, having some form of social interaction, having a purpose (can be as simple as living because that's my purpose honestly--my purpose is to simply be), etc. You do not need every single form to be satisfied (life purpose is based on your personal values--search up a list of values and find the ones you like--they can't be concrete goals), but it can help to boost your mood. For me, I would say that my life purpose is to be literally just alive and have peace and optimism and be grateful. I enjoy just sitting in the present in peace when I take a break after doing some huge homework assignments. Just being alive, for me, is my sense of purpose. The purpose of one's life is more about aligning with values rather than achieving a goal. For example, you value hard work, quality relationships, and peace. You then act accordingly in the best that you can. Read about all of the things in the hierarchy of needs and look at every single one and analyze how your life fulfills that need. Then see if change needs to be done. Change will be done through the act of self discipline, doing stuff even though you really don't want to do it because you don't feel like it.

Emotional distress techniques are the most important. When you get overwhelmed with emotion, you end up ultimately having thoughts that go out of control. You start thinking that everything is absolutely shit, especially when you're depressed or sad. The key to this is just checking online for techniques to handle emotional distress and see which one really appeals to you. Then, when you feel "not right" and feel kinda bad at least on a 5/10, you need to start using the emotional distress techniques to calm yourself down as much as possible. The reason for this is that if you read the entire text that I wrote here, it will not make sense or process through a mind that is overwhelmed with negative emotions. You need to do something that can calm you down and bring you closer to a state of peace. Then you can start seeing the logic to push away negative emotions. Even just having the feeling of "not feeling right" or feeling lost and confused are states of mind that you need to use emotional distress techniques to deal with. Just research on the internet about them and choose the one that seems the best for you.

Find hobbies and things to do and stop spending time on devices. There is a lot of research about the use of social media and how it perpetuates anxiety, depression, and a lack of concentration and focus. Get off of it and find other stuff to do with your life! Search up hobbies, and even if something SLIGHTLY interests you, do it. When you're depressed, you may think that every hobby is boring. But nah, you go off and try it! Try drawing, search up tutorials, etc. If that hobby didn't work for you, try another one. However, do try to commit a little before you switch to the next hobby. Sometimes, after you develop a new skill for the hobby, you may enjoy it a lot more. So be patient and try stuff out!

Self discipline is key. You cannot expect to get out of depression without absolutely forcing yourself to do stuff that you do not want to do at first. You have to FORCE yourself to take a shower, brush your teeth, and comb your hair no matter how much you don't want to do it. The key for me is to do a 5-second countdown and then doing it. 5 4 3 2 1 and then push myself off my seat and walk towards the task I need to do and then start doing it. You're going to do stuff that you do not like. But you have to do it for your well-being. This relates to the hierarchy of needs. You need to force yourself to take care of the needs to the most of your ability.

Being present is the key. Dwelling in the past = depression, and dwelling in the future = anxiety. Things are actually not that difficult when you don't think too much about it. Things seem very difficult in your head, but when you spend 99% of your time doing and the 1% thinking about what you are doing, you will be 10x happier. You do not need a perfect plan on what to do. Just start implementing random stuff and keep building on it. Spend as much time as you can in the present. The future and the past literally DO NOT exist--they only exist in your mind. The only thing that you have a grasp on is the present moment.

Also, set up downtime for yourself. Overstimulation is a problem in society where people feel the need to constantly stimulate themselves with either work or entertainment. You need at least 3.5 hours of downtime a day. You can do light reading (more entertainment and not too dramatic or sad) or showering or taking a walk or etc.

There is probably more, but this is what I thought of immediately. This got me out of depression without some shitty therapist because a lot of mental health services are a fucking joke. This is why I am becoming a psychiatrist so I can actually teach people to have happier lives rather than saying, "I understand," and asking robotic questions that make you feel pissed off.

I didn't realize that you see the savior complex as a form of abuse. I am sorry that you had to go through that. But at least you have the life experience to help your life in the present and the future.

Also, I do not think that if recovery isn't going well or as planned that it is your "fault." I feel like that idea is more the idea of scolding yourself and hating yourself. For me, I would say more of my perspective is dealing with recovery without judgment or expectations or scolding yourself or etc. I just do believe that there are things that you can do, and as someone's willpower and self-discipline develops, they can overcome their depression. I think depression is a mindset.
I understand. That makes sense. But changing your lenses is arguably the hardest thing you could do in your life.

Do you have any resources that teach meditation? I found that after I tried to "speak" with God in some extreme moments of despair, I felt somewhat peaceful, maybe that counts as meditation.

I HAVE to spend countless hours on devices since I work on IT. Do you think that exercising counts as downtime? If there is one thing I'm disciplined about is lifting (hence my nickname).
 
ncmxm

ncmxm

Experienced
Jun 9, 2021
232
as well as @theboy

I started understanding that the world, in our eyes, is through 1) the neutrality of objects and 2) the lens through which we see it the world that divides things into positive, negative, and indifferent. Some people were saying that I was claiming that depression isn't real and that I am invalidating it because it's just mindset, but that's literally what depression is. It's basically just having a perception of life that makes the world look horrible.

Look at Nick Vujicic. He has absolutely no limbs, and he probably needs someone to help him with literally every aspect of his life. But what makes him successful and happy? He chooses to have a lens that is positive in the sense that he puts an intentional focus on looking for the good things in his life. He was utterly depressed, but he did overcome it!

The whole premise is that there is the law of polarity in this world. You can literally see ANYTHING as positive or negative, and you can choose whether you choose to focus on the good or the bad because it is existent literally anywhere. That's why literally ANY point of view on the world is valid. You CAN find the world to have absolutely no meaning because you choose to focus on all of the cons. A positive lens CAN find the world to be so beautiful, interesting, and fun by choosing to look at the good sides of things. This basically brings to light that any opinion on the world is valid. It's just up to you whether you want to have the most negative opinion on it or not.

This may be a very unusual, strange, alien experience when you have been depressed for a while. It will feel kind of fake in the beginning. But if you keep trying to do it and keep practicing it, you will start seeing how you can change your outlook on things by simply CHOOSING to focus more on the good rather than the bad. It will not be overnight because shutting down negative thought patterns and developing your control over those thought patterns through mindfulness takes time.

For example, you can be sad that your ex-partner was a complete asshole. Through my lens (I CHOOSE to focus on the good things), I believe that the world has lessons. If it hadn't been this specific person as my ex, it would have been someone else inevitably (And it's usually true). Of course, there may be "bad luck," but ultimately, I do believe that there are lessons in every moment that you believe to be unpleasant and thus, this helps to have more of a positive view of the world. I take this bad ex-partner as a lesson to avoid and dump people who act a certain way towards me, and I am thankful for this bad experience because it helps me to live my life in the present and future even better! You can also choose to think about how he made you feel so depressed and ruminate on negative emotions. That is a very valid way to look at things. But is that really how you want to choose to think? Also based on another of the aspects of overcoming depression, I take the lesson to use it in the present. Instead of thinking about the experience in the past, I focus a lot more on how I can use the lessons in the future and what situations I could use them in rather than the actual experience and how it felt in the past.

Do not tell me that you cannot choose how you think. It's not because you cannot choose. It's just because you need to develop that muscle where you can be mindful to accept and reject thoughts that pop into your brain through thought patterns. I will talk about that in a bit.

Another thing to point out is that being positive does not mean that I ignore my negative emotions or am perfect and happy 24/7. Absolutely not. It's just that I have emotional distress techniques where I know how to deal with my emotions once they start getting too negative, and then once I can calm down, I can try to change my perspective. Once you start feeling a 5/10 in feeling bad, you have to start calming yourself down so you can deal with your emotions in that logical sense where you can "choose your lens." If you feel utterly depressed and start trying to change your lens right now through "choosing to look at the positive side," it's not going to work because you are already indulged in an emotion that is flooding your brain with depressed thoughts that align with the emotion rather than actually being able to consciously think.

So, how do you change that lens? Mindfulness and meditation, the hierarchy of needs, emotional distress techniques, finding/doing/committing to hobbies, having self-discipline, and being present (stop thinking).

If you brush over mindfulness, you will forever be depressed. No joke. Mindfulness is based on the factual idea that our brains have thought patterns, and that 90% of what you thought yesterday is what you will think today. It's not because those thoughts are correct. It's just because they just pop into your brain. If you do not have any mindfulness of your thoughts, you will literally accept any thought that you randomly get popped into your mind and take it as the truth. For example, maybe you failed a test. Then you think, "Shit, I am a fucking failure." That is a THOUGHT PATTERN, not necessarily the truth. Like, should you really identify your entire self as a failure because of one screwed-up test? Hmm... That's why mindfulness is about taking a step back from your thoughts and seeing your thoughts as if you were looking in the eagle's eye of a chessboard. You see all of the chess pieces, but you aren't one of them. This analogy is in the sense that your thoughts and emotions are the chess pieces, and you notice them without judgment instead of actually embodying and identifying with the emotions and thoughts. In that sense, you have the choice to reject or accept them consciously because again, you have the choice. This is not going to be very easy, and the key thing here is having patience with yourself and not judging/scolding yourself for having negative thoughts. The key here is to notice WITHOUT judgment.

Meditation is the biggest thing for helping with mindfulness. It's about staying present, focusing on your breath, and then observing thoughts as they roll in without any judgment. It is especially good for focus and having "control" over your thoughts. You do not have control over the fact that random thoughts pop in your head. But you have the choice on whether you want that to be the truth of your reality because remember, by the law of polarity, every single thought can have truth. Choose the thoughts that you want to highlight as the truth of your reality.

The hierarchy of needs consists of having food, having some form of social interaction, having a purpose (can be as simple as living because that's my purpose honestly--my purpose is to simply be), etc. You do not need every single form to be satisfied (life purpose is based on your personal values--search up a list of values and find the ones you like--they can't be concrete goals), but it can help to boost your mood. For me, I would say that my life purpose is to be literally just alive and have peace and optimism and be grateful. I enjoy just sitting in the present in peace when I take a break after doing some huge homework assignments. Just being alive, for me, is my sense of purpose. The purpose of one's life is more about aligning with values rather than achieving a goal. For example, you value hard work, quality relationships, and peace. You then act accordingly in the best that you can. Read about all of the things in the hierarchy of needs and look at every single one and analyze how your life fulfills that need. Then see if change needs to be done. Change will be done through the act of self discipline, doing stuff even though you really don't want to do it because you don't feel like it.

Emotional distress techniques are the most important. When you get overwhelmed with emotion, you end up ultimately having thoughts that go out of control. You start thinking that everything is absolutely shit, especially when you're depressed or sad. The key to this is just checking online for techniques to handle emotional distress and see which one really appeals to you. Then, when you feel "not right" and feel kinda bad at least on a 5/10, you need to start using the emotional distress techniques to calm yourself down as much as possible. The reason for this is that if you read the entire text that I wrote here, it will not make sense or process through a mind that is overwhelmed with negative emotions. You need to do something that can calm you down and bring you closer to a state of peace. Then you can start seeing the logic to push away negative emotions. Even just having the feeling of "not feeling right" or feeling lost and confused are states of mind that you need to use emotional distress techniques to deal with. Just research on the internet about them and choose the one that seems the best for you.

Find hobbies and things to do and stop spending time on devices. There is a lot of research about the use of social media and how it perpetuates anxiety, depression, and a lack of concentration and focus. Get off of it and find other stuff to do with your life! Search up hobbies, and even if something SLIGHTLY interests you, do it. When you're depressed, you may think that every hobby is boring. But nah, you go off and try it! Try drawing, search up tutorials, etc. If that hobby didn't work for you, try another one. However, do try to commit a little before you switch to the next hobby. Sometimes, after you develop a new skill for the hobby, you may enjoy it a lot more. So be patient and try stuff out!

Self discipline is key. You cannot expect to get out of depression without absolutely forcing yourself to do stuff that you do not want to do at first. You have to FORCE yourself to take a shower, brush your teeth, and comb your hair no matter how much you don't want to do it. The key for me is to do a 5-second countdown and then doing it. 5 4 3 2 1 and then push myself off my seat and walk towards the task I need to do and then start doing it. You're going to do stuff that you do not like. But you have to do it for your well-being. This relates to the hierarchy of needs. You need to force yourself to take care of the needs to the most of your ability.

Being present is the key. Dwelling in the past = depression, and dwelling in the future = anxiety. Things are actually not that difficult when you don't think too much about it. Things seem very difficult in your head, but when you spend 99% of your time doing and the 1% thinking about what you are doing, you will be 10x happier. You do not need a perfect plan on what to do. Just start implementing random stuff and keep building on it. Spend as much time as you can in the present. The future and the past literally DO NOT exist--they only exist in your mind. The only thing that you have a grasp on is the present moment.

Also, set up downtime for yourself. Overstimulation is a problem in society where people feel the need to constantly stimulate themselves with either work or entertainment. You need at least 3.5 hours of downtime a day. You can do light reading (more entertainment and not too dramatic or sad) or showering or taking a walk or etc.

There is probably more, but this is what I thought of immediately. This got me out of depression without some shitty therapist because a lot of mental health services are a fucking joke. This is why I am becoming a psychiatrist so I can actually teach people to have happier lives rather than saying, "I understand," and asking robotic questions that make you feel pissed off.

I didn't realize that you see the savior complex as a form of abuse. I am sorry that you had to go through that. But at least you have the life experience to help your life in the present and the future.

Also, I do not think that if recovery isn't going well or as planned that it is your "fault." I feel like that idea is more the idea of scolding yourself and hating yourself. For me, I would say more of my perspective is dealing with recovery without judgment or expectations or scolding yourself or etc. I just do believe that there are things that you can do, and as someone's willpower and self-discipline develops, they can overcome their depression. I think depression is a mindset.
I skimmed through what you wrote and basically it's the most generic boiler plate basic shit advice any self help book will give you

So what makes you and your experience in any way unique and what gives you the right to go into the suicide section of this forum where you preach your live laugh love positivity

You seem to be incredibly full of yourself, maybe stopping that is the next lesson you need to learn
 
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WorthlessTrash

WorthlessTrash

Worthless
Apr 19, 2022
2,415
This literally says it all
Is cancer a mindset too? Or is it just mental illness you don't believe in
She is an air head. Someone privilaged and having such menial problems thinking everyone can be cured with stupid books and shit.

People like her who invalidate people here by calling depression a mindset shouldn't be allowed on this forum.
 
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Pluto

Pluto

Meowing to go out
Dec 27, 2020
4,029
That was a good summary of self-help concepts, but arguing that circumstances don't matter at all is an extreme position that is only makes sense from a highly advanced spiritual state of ego death - one generally inaccessible to most people. Nobody in that state goes out of their way to help others, either, as they view the entirety of creation as perfect as is.

Self-help advice is very effective for people ruminating over mild to moderate grievances. It becomes questionable or even harmful in more severe cases, however. Examples include terminal illness, the elderly age group, chronic physical pain and certain disabilities. If the quality of life of a pet dog drops below a certain point, the normal solution is euthanasia. Though much more complicated, the same should ultimately apply to some degree for humans in unworkable situations.

Unless these techniques will always be 100% for all people in all circumstances, the implication is that people who fall through the cracks are 'choosing to be negative', 'wallowing in self-pity' or 'obsessing over the past'. In my own case, I have religiously followed not only the generic self-help techniques but some more advanced pathways as well. I have worked extremely hard at many levels until burnout set in, yet ageing, poverty, social isolation and chronic physical discomfort are reaching a point where any reasonable person would respect my desire for rest.

Better to draw a line in the sand and find ways to inspire people with manageable quality-of-life issues, yet respect that many people find themselves on this website precisely because conventional approaches have not proven infallible.
 
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S

squarely

Member
Nov 29, 2022
12
Which books were those?
First I read Plato's republic, then some by neitzsche (zarathustra, beyond good & evil, geneology of morality), camus (the stranger/outsider, myth of sisyphus), a bunch by Carl Jung (I read them back to back so they kind of blended into one), apocryphal christian texts and hermetic corpus, a book on buddhism (i cant remember the name sorry). I'm continuing to read to hopefully continue to recover, since im not fully out of this hole yet (maybe i never will be). But ive been free from suicidality and real depression for almost 3 years now and I cant see myself going back any time soon.

This set of books was very moving to me, but it may or may not be to you.

I had a philosophy on existence that was prone to causing suicidality (wasn't terribly accurate either). This philosophy could be boiled down to a few pillars
1) Existence is presented as-is (everything is purely physical; only atoms and space) and you are simply reacting to it
2) Evil can be described as anything that causes harm or pain
3) Good is anything that brings happiness or pleasure
Therefore --> since life is what it is and I have no agency to stop it (pillar 1 + my life experiences), and since life is mostly suffering (2) with very little happiness or pleasure (3), continuing to live is a net-negative ethically and the most logical and ethical solution is suicide.

(I think this philosophy-- ill call it the modern hedonistic worldview -- is actually fairly common even among normal people, but most people dont take it all the way to its logical conclusion)

Plato's Republic is mostly about the nature of good & evil (though its really about a lot of things). It put cracks all 3 of the pillars above. It is too potent to really try to summarize on here.

Neitzsche is all about deconstructing your prior beliefs. Most of us are driven by what Neitzsche called the "slave mentality" which I believe causes suicidality when its religious component is removed (I think this is why the rise in atheism corresponds to the rise in suicide. Though staying in the religious slave mentality is not necessarially better). I would recommend not to start with zarathustra (unless you want to lol).

Camus' myth of sisyphus is directly about suicide. His belief is similar to Neitzsche's amor fati: the only logical solution is to enjoy the absurdity/suffering. Overall, Camus work is very absurdist to me, but thats why i like it.

Carl Jung's work is probably third (to plato and neitzsche) in order of most helpful to me. His approach to psychology (and philosophy) was practically very useful to me. I employed his dream framework and immediatelly saw (small) results.

After reading Jung, I wanted to reconnect with my childhood religion (i was raised catholic but would now consider myself closer to an atheist) so i read semi-christian texts and it helped me to see things through a different cultural lens. The myths and stories you're told do have a strong effect on you.

I was curious about other mythologies as well so I read a book on buddhism that i dont remember the name of. I thought it was very interesting how similar buddhist thought was to the 4 authors above.

sorry if this got a bit long. I hope it was helpful though.

_________________________________________________________________________________________________

What the etherealgoddess (lol) said above is not necesarially wrong, but is not really possible for most people on this site yet (imo). If you are really deep in the hole (what i call the severe chronic life consuming depression I was in) this kind of self help will not be accessible to you. youll have to have some moment of radical change. For me this was my last suicide attempt which made me lose (almost) everything including everything I believed in. To somebody who isnt there yet, what etherealgoddess saif can sound incredibly patronizing, but i do agree that its the way to go. Even then, its not for everybody.
 
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Ashu

Ashu

novelist, sanskritist, Canadian living in India
Nov 13, 2021
717
Two impostors in two days coming here to hate, and they're just the latest in a trend that reflects the unwelcome publicity the group has been receiving. I don't suppose there's really any way to screen them out, all you have to do to get in is lie.
 
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