Discussion Does it mean you are mentally ill if you want to CTB?

[eve2004]

You sound like you are a functioning depressive (correct me if I am wrong) - and people often overlook people like that because they seem to just get on with it, but it is just as serious, in my opinion, and they need treatment, also. *hugs*

I used to hold a 40-50h IT job complete with overtime and all, thank gd with benefits too... after my husbnd died they pressured me into a higher responsibility project where I was basically going to be "irreplaceble" ie: I could take time off but work would accumulate... I had suicidal thoughts very soon after this started although I could hold down a good stressful job I was constantly distracted by whether I should jump in the subway today... within year my concentration, thoughts and depression degraded fast and even my psychs suggested I needed to go on disbility. To this day if I had not, I'm sure I would have impulsively jumped or botched many attemps.

Im no longer functional, and if living is job, I am feeling constantly on the verge of quitting or getting fired.

Psychs believe that (according to some form I've filled out dozens of times) that you could score decently on everything but if you hve strong cbt urges, you're majorly depressed...

When I was still somewhat functional but grieving and had CBT thoughts/desires, I didn't think i had MDD. For a long time I womdered if you could be very suicidal and not depressed but according to psychology/psychiatry, they go hand in hand.

 

[MAIO]

I feel quite normal, rational and able to function reasonably ok. I have a good job, rent my own place. Been married, now divorced. Have kids etc. But still want to ctb. I have suffered with depression most of my life but feel quite calm and rational about how I'm thinking. I could have quite a discussion with a doctor about life and why I feel it's pointless. Would they consider me mentally ill and section me? Is that what society makes them do because it's not socially acceptable to want to die?

Depends on what country are you in. But since psychology founding they knew people with no illnesses want to off themselves or off themselves. If it was an illness psychiatrist wouldn't have one of the highest rates of suicide out of any profession. That's a value judgment. It's like saying you are mentally ill if you think blue is better than red.

Wanting to CTB doesn't mean you are mentally ill. At least not so black and white. Lets say if someones' beloved family dies from a tragic accident, which leaves the person feeling life becoming meaningless and wants to CTB... that is normal. Or someone suffering from intense physical pain everyday due to health issues, with no end in sight, and they rather CTB. Or someone going bankrupt and losing all life savings and foresees the next 20 years to be shitty... and so forth. It depends on the situation. But of course doctors will always make it out to be some sort of illness, or label it with some special term, and literally just blindly go by the books

All of human knowledge does not know what life, death or being alive are, so no one knows if life is better than death or vise verse. Its more like people in western society are raised and have tribal factors that make them see death as an enemy currently, as always it's more about mutual collectivism, underlying functions than what they claim to believe. If you actually believed what the majority are implying and thought it through it would be terrifying. You know that thing you can never avoid, may happen on accident and it's going to happen to you for eternity in compassion to life as far as we can tell? It's the worst thing ever, you are in such a better state right now, etc. That would be terrible.

 

[GreyMonkey]

I have a growing theory that essentially "mental illness" is when the stress one is facing outweighs the resilience to be able to cope with it.

Stress, particularly when traumatic, can be compounded throughout life and if not properly processed and healed by natural release through the nervous system adds up until we hit breaking point.

Resilience is provided to us both genetically, in terms of temperament and sensitivity, and also through the environmental circumstances of our upbringing, e.g. nurturing, attunement, mirroring, teaching of life skills, appropriate attachment, etc.

Often low resilience and high stress (trauma) go hand in hand for children in problematic households... leading to early onset of mental health afflictions.

For others, more like me, there may have been somewhat adequate nurturance early on, yet not enough to really develop high resilience, coupled with high sensitivity and then many minor stresses throughout later childhood (bullying, social isolation, injuries, unnecessary surgery, possible sexual abuse) followed by further bullying and social isolation in adolescence... leads to poor coping skills with stress. There was enough 'fuel' in the tank to keep sort of limping on, and recovering from collapses... yet there has hit a point now where I'm just too smashed by life.

I think many older people on here might be able to relate. A point where it's just too much and I'm already so disabled functionally, that I don't know how to keep going.

Whereas the younger ones on here i imagine fit into the levels of higher stress and lower resilience, leading to the onset of overwhelming difficulty much earlier.

A lot of mental masturbation, doesn't necessarily help much though.

 

[Bathsheba]

I am mentally ill, I know it, and I am deeply disturbed, too. Nobody gives a shit as long As I don't hurt or harm or even bother anyone, so, no help available. I am no physical thread and therefore of no interest. Better this way anyway.

This is my experience too. When I had my mental health appointment the other day (in the uk) they were definitely more interested in if I was going to hurt anyone else. But didn't seem to care that I explained at length why I'm definitely going to ctb and that I'm self harming every night. I'm not saying I want to be sectioned! But sometimes when I have a moment of clarity, I want to be saved. That's getting less frequent.
In answer to the original question.. no you don't have to be mentally ill to want to ctb. It's a rational choice. But then I would say that, being mentally ill.

 

[Aunt Paula]

In my opinion, some people are mentally ill for NOT wanting to CTB

That's a very interesting take on it.

 

[GeorgeJL]

From what I read here, if they suspect you have concrete plans to off yourself, they will commit you to psyche ward..

This

 

[Sweet emotion]

No I don't think so at all. I want to CTB because I have Complex Regional Pain Syndrome which is the highest ranking pain condition in medical history. I've had it for 14 years since I was 20. I'm 34 now and I've been isolated for those 14 years only seeing doctors and going to the hospital. The condition is actually known as the suicide disorder because there are no treatments and no cure. I've never experienced anything in life and I don't want to spend the rest of my years in an apartment alone. I can't physically care for myself a lot of the time. And I wouldn't be able to financially care for myself. In my opinion you'd be crazy to WANT to live like this. Some people that I know who have it say I have to stick around because there could be a cure tomorrow. No. I know all the info and we are thousands of years away from anything. This disease has only been around since the beginning of time and this is the first time people are hearing of it. Now if you want to die because you don't like trees or something then I would say you should probably get some help. But if you have a chronic illness or a progressive illness or a mental illness that just can't be helped, I think we should be able to rid ourselves of that pain. And I think we should be able to do it somewhere where it is going to go right, be done by a doctor, so we don't have to worry about pain or failed attempts.

From what I read here, if they suspect you have concrete plans to off yourself, they will commit you to psyche ward..

Once my pain management doctor wanted to commit me because I was crying and said I can't take this pain anymore. To me that's normal if you feel like you're being physically tortured every second id every day. To want to live like that would make me question someone.

Hi. I guess depression is classed as a mental illness. And with regards to speaking about suicide, I know here in the UK I can talk about self harm and being suicidal but they will not do much because of government cuts made to mental health funding..in England, especially. You have to be in danger for them to step in i.e have comitted suicide and be at risk. I am not sure where you are from, though.

I have a friend who lives in England and she is bipolar and I ask her all the time why won't someone help you? She never explained it to me as clearly as you did.

No, think about all the people who killed themselves because of a life changing event. Like a wall street guy who loses his career and jumps off a building

I think that would probably be the last straw. The wall street guy had to have underlying problems.

I have a growing theory that essentially "mental illness" is when the stress one is facing outweighs the resilience to be able to cope with it.

Stress, particularly when traumatic, can be compounded throughout life and if not properly processed and healed by natural release through the nervous system adds up until we hit breaking point.

Resilience is provided to us both genetically, in terms of temperament and sensitivity, and also through the environmental circumstances of our upbringing, e.g. nurturing, attunement, mirroring, teaching of life skills, appropriate attachment, etc.

Often low resilience and high stress (trauma) go hand in hand for children in problematic households... leading to early onset of mental health afflictions.

For others, more like me, there may have been somewhat adequate nurturance early on, yet not enough to really develop high resilience, coupled with high sensitivity and then many minor stresses throughout later childhood (bullying, social isolation, injuries, unnecessary surgery, possible sexual abuse) followed by further bullying and social isolation in adolescence... leads to poor coping skills with stress. There was enough 'fuel' in the tank to keep sort of limping on, and recovering from collapses... yet there has hit a point now where I'm just too smashed by life.

I think many older people on here might be able to relate. A point where it's just too much and I'm already so disabled functionally, that I don't know how to keep going.

Whereas the younger ones on here i imagine fit into the levels of higher stress and lower resilience, leading to the onset of overwhelming difficulty much earlier.

A lot of mental masturbation, doesn't necessarily help much though.

I'm 34 and have the highest ranking pain condition in medical history and can't do many things for myself. I have to be taken care of. Of course this has made be very depressed and ridden with anxiety. But all the problems stem from the physical illness.

 

[MeltingHeart]

I feel quite normal, rational and able to function reasonably ok. I have a good job, rent my own place. Been married, now divorced. Have kids etc. But still want to ctb. I have suffered with depression most of my life but feel quite calm and rational about how I'm thinking. I could have quite a discussion with a doctor about life and why I feel it's pointless. Would they consider me mentally ill and section me? Is that what society makes them do because it's not socially acceptable to want to die?

have you never spoken to a doctor about these feelings before with a doctor even though you have had deprssn most of your life? You can certainly talk about having suicidal thoughts to a doctor without being sectioned- that would only happen if you openly told the you had made a definite plan to do so- or that what you said gave them enough cause to concern- that you might act on that impluse in the very nr future-as this happened to me

Is not depression what leads to suicide most of the time. its hopelessness.

So yeah,most suicidals are not mentally ill or weird sickos. That's why most therapies don't work for most of us.

Someone on hear mentioned something called Maslow's Hierarchy of needs - a therory created by a psyhologist about what we as human beings need to have good psychological health and in turn 'happiness' or atleast some contentment. I think it is a VERY good concept in explaining what human beings need to feel fufillment and when too many of those are not met- we may end up with- no hope = desire to end life.

That's a very interesting take on it.

agree.

 

[AlmostFinished]

I have not visited any mental health specialist but I know that I am physically and psychologically healthy. I just want to end my life. If after my death they want to classify me as mentally ill, I agree, everyone needs a logical explanation to move forward.

 

[Rachel74]

No it doesn't, you will be deemed of having mental illness if you do want to commit suicide but there are many reasons why people do, from terminal illness, to pain and mental health issues.

 

[GreyMonkey]

I have not visited any mental health specialist but I know that I am physically and psychologically healthy. I just want to end my life. If after my death they want to classify me as mentally ill, I agree, everyone needs a logical explanation to move forward.

What is your reason for desiring to end your life then?

 

[Blackjack]

Absofuckinglutely NOT!

 

[Mr M]

I used to hold a 40-50h IT job complete with overtime and all, thank gd with benefits too... after my husbnd died they pressured me into a higher responsibility project where I was basically going to be "irreplaceble" ie: I could take time off but work would accumulate... I had suicidal thoughts very soon after this started although I could hold down a good stressful job I was constantly distracted by whether I should jump in the subway today... within year my concentration, thoughts and depression degraded fast and even my psychs suggested I needed to go on disbility. To this day if I had not, I'm sure I would have impulsively jumped or botched many attemps.

Im no longer functional, and if living is job, I am feeling constantly on the verge of quitting or getting fired.

Psychs believe that (according to some form I've filled out dozens of times) that you could score decently on everything but if you hve strong cbt urges, you're majorly depressed...

When I was still somewhat functional but grieving and had CBT thoughts/desires, I didn't think i had MDD. For a long time I womdered if you could be very suicidal and not depressed but according to psychology/psychiatry, they go hand in hand.

I don't fully agree, at least in my experience, I can have depression without feeling suicidal, and I can feel suicidal without being depressed. But my SI started with my depression. A way to ease the unbearable emotional pain, but then the SI takes its own form. I'm struggling with both right now, and just waiting for my depression to be high enough to give me all the motivation to cbt. Thing is that by spending time researching I lose the SI and also the intensity of the depression decreases, but they are still there.

In my case, I do believe this is a form of mental illness. Something is definitely going on very wrong with the chemistry of my brain when I get depressed. But when sometimes I come out of the depression, like really out and feel very calm, balanced and normal, then my SI also fades away. I can then see how irrational this SI is, and how insignificant depression is, but when I fall back into it, there is no hope for me.

 

[axorz]

From what I read here, if they suspect you have concrete plans to off yourself, they will commit you to psyche ward..

not really

 

[eve2004]

"GreyMonkey said:
I have a growing theory that essentially "mental illness" is when the stress one is facing outweighs the resilience to be able to cope with it.

Stress, particularly when traumatic, can be compounded throughout life and if not properly processed and healed by natural release through the nervous system adds up until we hit breaking point.

Resilience is provided to us both genetically, in terms of temperament and sensitivity, and also through the environmental circumstances of our upbringing, e.g. nurturing, attunement, mirroring, teaching of life skills, appropriate attachment, etc."


********* my response*******
Agreed! Not havimg the resiliency to live through each hour of each day of hopelessness drives the bus to destination, so to speak.

 

[Death_is_Escape]

This

If true, then it is a sindustry.

 

[eve2004]

If true, then it is a sindustry.

It is.

 

[khw777]

I was depressed too. I used an anti-depressant and discovered the magic of a blue pill. I could be happy despite my shitty situation. I still am. I understand that everything has to do with some chemicals in the brain. Before I started using anti depressants, I was asking myself how happy everyone is in this shitty world. I knew when I took the medicine. Everything was like that scene in the Matrix. My ideas about the world had not changed, everything was in place, but I could ignore it. I think in other people this mechanism was innate. Mine was broken. This is my story, of course.

I live in turkey. Thinking about CTB here won't put you in a mental institution. It is even taken less seriously than necessary. I would recommend it if you have not been treated for depression. I was very convinced it wouldn't work, but it did. The reason I'm here right now is economic. I wish the best for you would come true.

Translated by Holy Google

Do you still want to ctb after taking antidepressants.

 

[MeltingHeart]

I feel quite normal, rational and able to function reasonably ok. I have a good job, rent my own place. Been married, now divorced. Have kids etc. But still want to ctb. I have suffered with depression most of my life but feel quite calm and rational about how I'm thinking. I could have quite a discussion with a doctor about life and why I feel it's pointless. Would they consider me mentally ill and section me? Is that what society makes them do because it's not socially acceptable to want to die?

in answer to the title-many many people ctb without being mentally ill (though of course some will most certainly be)- the reasons are all unique, complex with many factors that could be involved in a persons desire to die. If you have depression-that is a form of mental illness- you sound like your depression while long term - is not severe- if you have depression- there is no reason why you should not or could not be able to discuss this with your doctor, u can even talk about suicidal ideation- after all that is a common component of depression, if you seem in utter despair, are acting in a v.erratic or distressed way- and if you mention you have 'a plan' or have any of the 'tools' needed- then of course that would give the doctor cause for concern-and they may take immediate action. I am not saying pills are the answer to everything- but have you tried a low dose anti-depressent? when I had mild depression (with anxiety) they were a life saver- and just gave me enough of a boost to alleviate my depression- I still felt low and a little sad sometimes- which was good - as I wouldnt want a drug that would have had me bouncing off the walls in a fake happiness kind of way (I think prozac is known for this), or to feel totally numb. After I had been on them for a little while-I just had that rather lovely feeling of waking up and being glad and hopeful for the day. It saved my life at the time it really did. (The reason I want to ctb now is another story!)

Is not depression what leads to suicide most of the time. its hopelessness.

So yeah,most suicidals are not mentally ill or weird sickos. That's why most therapies don't work for most of us.

So so soooooooo true!!

 

[metalchic_74]

Suicide is highest with bipolar 1. There are a lot of people who are not diagnosed unfortunately

 

[BridgeJumper]

I believe its highest in bpd, with more than 1 out of 10 of the sufferers killing themselves and almost all going through attempts
To answer the question, I think that mostly its an act committed by people who have mental problems, but there are also otherwise healthy people who simply dont want to live anymore because of something like death of their loved ones, crushing debt, terminal illness etc

 

[TAW122]

Absolutely not! In fact, there are many reasons and causes as to why people CTB and while some are mentally ill, I dare say the MAJORITY of people who attempt suicide (and even those who succeeded) are NOT mentally ill, but have shitty circumstances that caused them to do it. Also, there are certain quite a few rational suicides rather than only irrational ones as much as the mental health organizations and society like to claim. I would say that someone who has suffered greatly in life, thought deeply and thoroughly about whether to die or not is in fact WAY more rational than most people out there as most people lack the introspection to think for themselves let alone ask the difficult questions to themselves.