I think your Benadryl numbers are off? I always see 20-40mg/kg as the ld50 for adult humans. Your linked source lists 10mg/kg as the minimum lethal dose in humans. By the 20-40mg/kg numbers, about one 25mg pill per 2lbs body weight would be the math.
athiestjoe
Passenger
- Sep 24, 2024
- 405
I know this stuff can get confusing so let me clarify a few things:
(2) The number you seem to have given seems to have been pulled from this addiction/recovery 'resource' website. Take it for what it is!
(3) You might encounter terms like "toxic dose," which doesn't necessarily imply lethality; a toxic dose can make someone very ill without being fatal. You might also see "LD min," which refers to the minimum amount of a substance that can cause death—not "will" or "shall" or even "might at a 50% risk. Or you might also find "LDLO" (the minimum dose that has resulted in a lethal effect, though it does not quantify how often this occurs and also has some other inherent flaws such such as the wide individualized specifications of that person, etc). All those terms are distinct from LD50, and to reiterate, an LD50 for humans simply does not exist. I understand the possible confusion!
(4) Here are some further resources regarding the well established LD50 to further support what has already been listed here. However, as with anything and as encouraged in my original post, please conduct lots of your own research as well! Everyone makes mistakes and errors although I think contextually even if something was a little off it doesn't actually really change the 'big picture' of the post in any meaningful way.
Bottom line, please do not consider trying an attempt using Benedryl. It is a very unwise decision as delirium, psychosis, hallucinations, and seizures would not be enjoyable and is just more likely to cause potentially long-term effects rather than kill someone.
Hope that helps and hope you find everything you are looking for and get peace & serenity.
(1) -- you won't "always see" (let alone find) an LD50 for humans when it comes to medications. As discussed in the main post, LD50 represents the lethal dose derived from clinical trials on laboratory animals, where 50% of the subjects die. Just to clarify (and for a bit of humor), companies do NOT test increasing doses on groups of 100 humans until half of them die to determine an LD50. Simply woud be unethical for all the obvious reasons, not to mention all the other serious effects that would happen to people while trying to escalate to some lethal dose in 50% stat. Researchers can safely evaluate higher doses using lab animals without endangering human lives. Additionally, even if human trials were conducted to find what dose would kill 50% of the subjects, individual responses to drugs can vary greatly due to factors like genetics, age, weight, and health conditions, making it challenging to establish a standard number. That's simply not how these figures are derived.
(2) The number you seem to have given seems to have been pulled from this addiction/recovery 'resource' website. Take it for what it is!
(3) You might encounter terms like "toxic dose," which doesn't necessarily imply lethality; a toxic dose can make someone very ill without being fatal. You might also see "LD min," which refers to the minimum amount of a substance that can cause death—not "will" or "shall" or even "might at a 50% risk. Or you might also find "LDLO" (the minimum dose that has resulted in a lethal effect, though it does not quantify how often this occurs and also has some other inherent flaws such such as the wide individualized specifications of that person, etc). All those terms are distinct from LD50, and to reiterate, an LD50 for humans simply does not exist. I understand the possible confusion!
(4) Here are some further resources regarding the well established LD50 to further support what has already been listed here. However, as with anything and as encouraged in my original post, please conduct lots of your own research as well! Everyone makes mistakes and errors although I think contextually even if something was a little off it doesn't actually really change the 'big picture' of the post in any meaningful way.
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Diphenhydramine: Uses, Interactions, Mechanism of Action | DrugBank Online
Diphenhydramine is a H1 receptor antihistamine used in the treatment of seasonal allergies, and various allergic reactions including sneezing, runny nose, itchy/watery eyes, itching of nose or throat, pruritus, urticaria, insect bites/stings, and allergic rashes.
go.drugbank.com
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Diphenhydramine
Diphenhydramine | C17H21NO | CID 3100 - structure, chemical names, physical and chemical properties, classification, patents, literature, biological activities, safety/hazards/toxicity information, supplier lists, and more.
pubchem.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
As stated in the original post, my math may be not perfect and everyone is highly suggested to do their own calculations! I'm only human and definitely have been known to make some slip ups! Here, however, as indicated above with even more LD50 data for this medication, the math would be in line with this post's research purposes so the original math given is correct indeed.
Bottom line, please do not consider trying an attempt using Benedryl. It is a very unwise decision as delirium, psychosis, hallucinations, and seizures would not be enjoyable and is just more likely to cause potentially long-term effects rather than kill someone.
Hope that helps and hope you find everything you are looking for and get peace & serenity.
cracklingroses
Member
- Sep 10, 2023
- 57
I am just so curious on some people I know's deaths with OTC Diphenhydramine. They were even heavy abusers with a huge tolerance and still managed to pass away. Maybe there is more context like underlying health conditions or the combination of alcohol.
Which brings me to my question. I am sure the lethality rate raises when overdoses are used in conjunction with alcohol but I just wonder if it would really increase chances by much. I mean people do die from alcohol poisoning, so I always wondered if the combination would be more likely. Then again you would probably be more likely to puke...
I appreciate your info. Whether your calculations are accurate or not still is a good emphasis on the incredible likelihood that it won't be fatal. It is important to emphasize because of the risk of serious health complications so I am really glad this post was made. I agree about it being pinned.
I impulsively took a large overdose of DXM that put me on a ventilator in the ICU back in August despite doing research on how unlikely it would be that I succeeded. Plus I have a large tolerance already built.
It's just scary how easy it is to down a bunch of pills without thinking things through much when you are impulsive and desperate. I think I still had a part of me that was sure it was going to work.
I wonder if the outcome would have been any different if I had included alcohol and was not in a location where I could be found. Then I also wonder if I would have died if I wasn't found since I was unconscious and seizing. *sigh*
I just wish CTB wasn't so damn impossible. I know so many people who have been successful and always wonder how they managed to do it. What made them any different from me?
Which brings me to my question. I am sure the lethality rate raises when overdoses are used in conjunction with alcohol but I just wonder if it would really increase chances by much. I mean people do die from alcohol poisoning, so I always wondered if the combination would be more likely. Then again you would probably be more likely to puke...
I appreciate your info. Whether your calculations are accurate or not still is a good emphasis on the incredible likelihood that it won't be fatal. It is important to emphasize because of the risk of serious health complications so I am really glad this post was made. I agree about it being pinned.
I impulsively took a large overdose of DXM that put me on a ventilator in the ICU back in August despite doing research on how unlikely it would be that I succeeded. Plus I have a large tolerance already built.
It's just scary how easy it is to down a bunch of pills without thinking things through much when you are impulsive and desperate. I think I still had a part of me that was sure it was going to work.
I wonder if the outcome would have been any different if I had included alcohol and was not in a location where I could be found. Then I also wonder if I would have died if I wasn't found since I was unconscious and seizing. *sigh*
I just wish CTB wasn't so damn impossible. I know so many people who have been successful and always wonder how they managed to do it. What made them any different from me?
athiestjoe
Passenger
- Sep 24, 2024
- 405
This would definitely increase the risk of vomiting and potential liver or organ damage, depending on the amount and type of medication involved. It places significant strain on the body and can result in lasting harm, making it a particularly dangerous choice.
It's very likely that will be the case. Factors like underlying health issues and age often contribute to those rare instances of death, making it unreliable as a method for others to consider.
I'm truly sorry to hear about your experience and the pain you've endured. I agree that impulsivity or desperation often drives people to consider such a tragic option. As mentioned in the original post, just because it's within reach doesn't mean it's a viable choice. I believe that attempts involving overdoses are often made in a moment of desperation, and given the low chances of success and the high risks involved, it's certainly not worth it. I completely understand why some may be tempted, and I don't want to downplay the immense suffering that leads to such thoughts or actual attempts via OD. Many people might not realize the reality of these situations, thinking it's easier than what the media or movies portray, which is far from the truth.
Absolutely my pleasure.
With whatever you decide, I wish you all the best in your endeavors.
DunnoWhyButYeah
~*-*~
- Apr 3, 2020
- 385
A good reminder, thanks. In these, however, other things must be taken into account, such as tolerance, how the heart/lungs are doing, etc., what side effects will occur and whether they can already be fatal with a smaller amount. Every person is different and if you are not healthy (or the medicines work together in a certain way), the end result can be very different even with a much smaller amount as I know is the case with me.
