What do you think happenes after death

[leloyon]

reincarnation

 

[been__ready]

Yeah I mean it's mostly just wishful thinking on my part. I still think it's unlikely that we have anything more than nothingness after death But I often wonder how things would have been if I was born into different circumstances. Like I hate my life now, but I often long for a life where I was born into the right body and where I could be happy. I guess it's interesting to think about what could have been. I've come to accept whatever comes after.

Same - right body, right family, right circumstances…

I accept the Egg theory as a possibility - however would a knowing a loving god create iterations of himself that hurt and harm others (and therefore harm themselves) seems a bit counterintuitive to me…. And if some of us have reached a higher state of consciousness why haven't all of us attained it to create a utopic system that benefits us all…

Idk what to think!

reincarnation
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So what is your theory then in the case of those of us who CTB "before our time" and take it into our own hands? We reincarnate in the same set of circumstances?

 

[TastySorrow]

Great video! I looked it up and linking it here -




Really enjoyed reading this thread - I think something akin to an amalgamation of everything written here. It's hard to say…

If - according to the egg video, we are filled with the wisdom of previous lives I hope to make better choices in my next…

No one wants to suffer - inherently I think we all seek to leave meaningful and purpose driven lives but for whatever reason that hasn't been the case for us.. bc if it had been we wouldnt be here!

So why not take the chance of starting over in the next.

I wanted to rant negatively on this since I'm naturally more leaned into the materialistic debate, but it reminded me of why I came to terms with the concept of religion (without becoming religious myself, though) after blindly hating on it when I was younger. Besides their flaws and the horrors done in their name, there's a captivating way in which they abstract certain concepts to pass on their own systems of values that invites to critical thinking. Faith is not for everyone, but there's many interesting things to hear from a certain minority of those who practice it.

 

[bloodmania]

hopefully reincarnation . i read some webtoon a while ago where you meet the grim reaper and go over your life before you get reincarnated , that webtoon was one of my favorites and comforted me a lot so i imagine something like that will happen after i die

 

[leloyon]

So what is your theory then in the case of those of us who CTB "before our time" and take it into our own hands? We reincarnate in the same set of circumstances?

I think you misunderstand the graphic; when it says you "wind up in the same conditions when you die", it is referring to the death-state, the state you were in before birth. It says nothing about dying before your time or reincarnating in the same set of circumstances.

 

[E Butler]

I have a feeling there's something fundamental about the nature of reality and the universe that we've all forgotten. This will become apparent to us at the point of death.

 

[-nobodyknows-]

I have no idea. But I hope for either one of three things:

1. Comfort - if I woke up on the other side, and someone was there to comfort me ("It's okay, it's over now") I would really like that. Ideally they'd be able to cut away all of my pain and sadness so I wouldn't feel that way anymore.

2. Nothing - if I could simply fall asleep, and never wake up, I think I would be satisfied. No more pain or suffering. Of the three, this is my least preferable though; I don't really have a reason why.

3. Redemption - If there were a way for me to work things out on the other side, if I could go to a place that would allow me to experience certain things that would change me somehow, then that is ultimately what I'd prefer. I have come to see that, for so many of us in this world, there is simply no good way for us to actually work through things, or experience something that would change us for the better. I'm sure many of you have read stories in which a character has drastically changed for the better or found peace or happiness by the end. But for many of us, those sorts of things simply don't occur here in that way. If I could go somewhere where they did, where I could work through things and finally find peace and happiness with myself, then I think that would be wonderful. Even if it were hard, even if it really hurt along the way, I think I would choose that over anything else.

 

[MercenariesofMidgar]

No matter how much people have thought they've figured it out, we truly don't know. Even in the cases where someone dies there are conflicted stores.

A friend died and saw nothingness, yet felt a warmth and comfort to a level never experienced before.
Another didn't feel anything. They blinked and it was suddenly 3 weeks later.
One more was jolted into the sky, seeing their body as their dead grandmother disallowed them to get near the light that radiated behind them
You chalk it all up to hallucination... but that feels a bit dismissive. Especially when they speak of it in such vividness.

Personally, I believe in some sort of reincarnation, if I feel spiritually inclined that day I guess. That fact I am here now, makes me feel like there is a non-zero chance that as we pass into nothingness and a cold black fills our eyes... in time and we will open them again. Maybe as a different species, but most definitely a different mother, in a different time.

 

[Pulling a Sangwoo]

In my head I think nothing happens after death but somewhere deep down I hope reincarnation is a thing and I would hope to have another shot at life with better circumstances. I want to be happy even if it's not in this lifetime

 

[Eudaimonic]

Well, I'd like to believe that everything is simply done, that there's nothing happening and nobody to complain about being bored about it. Kind of like hoping for heaven, which would also be nice. My observations into consciousness seem to point to other possibilities. As I've grown closer to death these ideas are a bit terrifying. I'm not a neuroscientist or spiritual master, so it's not as though my own ideas have any bearing but…

If we are framing consciousness here as being the direct act of reality continuing itself in individual experience, then when I die, reality continues. I may be 'dead', but consciousness, this universe perpetuating the fact that it lives itself, will continue. Some spiritual systems call this 'reincarnation' but I view it as more of a natural continuation of consciousness on a mass scale.

Where am I going with this?
Well, while 'I' may be dead, the consciousness which I call 'I', the unique perspective I have on life and the universe, is not in itself unique in the sense that it inhabits every conscious being in this universe. Therefore, if 'I' die, the closest thing to anything I could name as being that 'I' in the first place can and will continue to inhabit various forms.

In other words, I may die, but that which makes the fact of my life significant does not die.

I do not say this optimistically, it causes me a sort of cosmic terror. I could kill myself, but consciousness would not end. It would continue inhabiting a seemingly endless number of forms which are equally a unique part of universal experience as I was. In that sense, what ever dies?

If there is ever anything real or solid enough to call 'me' that even can die, it would stand to reason that it is not limited to my body, and will continue to inhabit beings who will, suffer, experience tortures worse than I experience now. Joys too but…it's hard to look at the joys with the fact of the cruelty in this world.

Anyway, thanks for reading my pseudo philosophical rant.

This idea is known as "generic subjective continuity" or GSC. There are a few issues with it, but one in particular that I'd like to point out, which is the question of order of lives lived, further complicated by the absence of global time between lives.

Are you familiar with the vertiginous question? Phenomenologically, only one perspective can be 'live' at a time. Supposing that we are phenomenal realists (i.e., believe that phenomenal consciousness is real and not an illusion like illusionists claim) about consciousness and qualia, any metaphysical theory claiming to address questions of personal identity and consciousness must account for the phenomenal property of being oneself exclusively.

 

[WatchmeBurn]

It'll be just like it was before we were born. Remember that? No? Exactly. An eternal nothingness that is not even comprehensible in its emptiness.

 

[Eudaimonic]

As for my own views, I believe (and hope) that there is probably nothing.

 

[brittlemoth]

This idea is known as "generic subjective continuity" or GSC. There are a few issues with it, but one in particular that I'd like to point out, which is the question of order of lives lived, further complicated by the absence of global time between lives.

Are you familiar with the vertiginous question? Phenomenologically, only one perspective can be 'live' at a time. Supposing that we are phenomenal realists (i.e., believe that phenomenal consciousness is real and not an illusion like illusionists claim) about consciousness and qualia, any metaphysical theory claiming to address questions of personal identity and consciousness must account for the phenomenal property of being oneself exclusively.

Thank you for your perspective! I hadn't heard of this term before but from a quick glance the ideas I'm considering do seem to be in line with a lot of what is discussed around GSC. I'm not here to defend GSC as I don't believe it so much as I find it an interesting framework and similar to thought experiments I have engaged in with regard to these types of questions.

Okay I'm way too tired for philosophy right now but I'll attempt to engage anyway XD

I want to understand your position better.
When you say questions of order of lives or absence of global time between lives I don't have the context to understand your idea. Could you further break these terms down more for me so I can better understand them?

With regard to the second paragraph, you said, "any metaphysical theory claiming to address questions of personal identity and consciousness must account for the phenomenal property of being oneself exclusively."
This is a very important point that I do think gets glossed over a lot in discussions about consciousness. It's also a point I don't think I could substantively argue against, so in the context of this discussion I'll assume this idea to be valid.
If I understand your point about only one phenomenal consciousness being able to live fully at a time, I mean if I understand the way you are framing this correctly I don't think I find any meaningful disagreement upon analysis.
I find all of these ideas compelling.
With regard to the second paragraph and GSC, and with the vertiginous question in mind, how does a framework which takes into account these ideas and accepts them for the sake of analysis (only one perspective can be 'live' at a time, presupposing phenomenal realism) relate to the fact of other phenomenal perspectives seeming to exist even within the framework of a single living perspective? In other words, if we are accepting that these ideas can be grounded in a realistic assessment of the conscious situation, how do they then account for the fact that it then seems, even from within that framework, that other perspectives at least seem to live and act and breathe, seeming to be present in an (admittedly unique and self contained) conscious context?
I will stop there because I feel I have a somewhat surface level understanding of these ideas and am curious to know more about how you understand them. Thanks!

 

[MikuFOST]

my heart beats like crazy when i think about what's gonna happen after death i have a couple of christian friends who believe very much in it and they talk about christianity a lot in our voice chats could they be right and i just damn myself to hell forever for wanting to catch the bus or will be the egg or will it just be nothing if it is nothing after death then what is the point of catching the bus the you you are is and will always feel that pain of why you wanted to catch it in the first place there is no better feeling for you only pain and every other emotion you experience while conscious if it's truly nothing then what's the point if christian's are right you'll be damned forever if some religion that existed 1000 years ago practiced by like 5 people was right then everyone else is fucked and only those 5 people will find peace if it's reincarnation then you could have a chance at experiencing the same pain you are now and catching the bus again

 

[Roadrunner]

I'm quite certain it'll be just like before I was born!

 

[always_sad]

I believe reainacrnation might have been real, like, the mere fact that we exist is already crazy. The scale of space is mindblowing, just how is it even possible for living beings to exist. It's crazy that we have consciousness. It's crazy how biologically complex life is. The idea of reincarnation is not that insane when you think about it.
Near death experiences are somewhat unique, some people see nothing, some see their dead relatives, some find themselves walking in a sunny field and remembering their past lives. So who knows what is possible.
Nothingness seems unnatural, I cannot imagine non existence.
"Hell" and "heaven" are weird concepts and they don't make much sense to me.
I'm not sure what will happen after I die.

 

[The_Hunter]

reincarnation

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Very interesting diagram! Where's it from? (out of curiosity; a neat find, for sure!)

 

[leloyon]

Very interesting diagram! Where's it from? (out of curiosity; a neat find, for sure!)

Found it on 4chan's /x/ (paranormal) board, if I recall correctly. Wouldn't bother going there, it's 99% shit if I'm honest (as should be expected of halfchan).

 

[locked*n*loaded]

What do you think happenes after death(?)

You become food for maggots and such, which, in turn, becomes food for other organisms further fostering and nurturing new life. Such is the circle of life, the actual meaning and essence. In the end all things that live must die and they become "food" to bring about new life.

 

[cooki3]

I have a theory. It's labeled in my notes as deletion. To sum it up very briefly (but there is MUCH more detail), I believe it will just completely end you are deleted there is no after. As someone above said, it's just like before you were born there was nothing. However, what makes my theory different from just the concept of "there's nothing after death," I believe that the DMT rush that happens at the end is what people believe the afterlife to be. I've heard many stories of people taking DMT and losing all sense of time. Where minutes feel like years seconds feel like hours. Perhaps the reason people claim to have seen heaven or similar things when they've died but been resuscitated is because of that or at least something similar. I'm not sure of the exact chemicals that would happen if you didn't fully die brain wise, but I think perhaps it is a manifestation of your thoughts and beliefs or your worries. What I mean by this is that an atheist may still have heaven as something in the back of their mind, or someone who is agnostic and looking for the truth (religion wise) May see heaven or whatever after life they consciously or subconsciously thought of before death. However, I just believe this is a manifestation of your thoughts. I don't believe it's forever you may perceive it to be so because of the distortion of time, but it is factual that you are gone. There is no more activity a lot of people believe you have a soul that will go to heaven, but all we know now is that you will cease to exist entirely, but what you may experience in those last even milliseconds could provide you with some sense of your "afterlife," before it ends. And I do believe it simply does end. And you won't even know it. There will be nothing. That comforts me.

 

[zombiegirl]

i think your particles will get reused at some point in time to help create another consciousness, but you might end up being a mix of multiple organisms

 

[Eudaimonic]

When you say questions of order of lives or absence of global time between lives I don't have the context to understand your idea. Could you further break these terms down more for me so I can better understand them?

If the passage of time is understood as being strictly phenomenal as it is in a block universe, then global time does not pass between lives. Furthermore, if there is any passage in-between, it would exist outside of the context of 'global time.'

With regard to the second paragraph and GSC, and with the vertiginous question in mind, how does a framework which takes into account these ideas and accepts them for the sake of analysis (only one perspective can be 'live' at a time, presupposing phenomenal realism) relate to the fact of other phenomenal perspectives seeming to exist even within the framework of a single living perspective? In other words, if we are accepting that these ideas can be grounded in a realistic assessment of the conscious situation, how do they then account for the fact that it then seems, even from within that framework, that other perspectives at least seem to live and act and breathe, seeming to be present in an (admittedly unique and self contained) conscious context?

This is an excellent question. I don't have an answer for you because this is in fact part of the quadrilemma that faces any theory of consciousness. I will point you toward Christian List's work: https://academic.oup.com/pq/advance-article/doi/10.1093/pq/pqae053/7686655

 

[cantThinkOfName]

Don't know is the sensible one. Could be a anything since we have no way of knowing. Personally I think it's nothing. What it was like before you where born, before you developed a brain. On one hand it makes me feel at peace knowing its not suffering and don't have to worry about lucking into the afterlife of a god/gods who we have no way of knowing what they want or if its a god we even know of. But at the same time I i feel like shit knowing that the one life I had could have been good but I was born a freak in a shit world full of cruel, stupid, apathetic people, who have all decided to make trans peoples life miserable

 

[brittlemoth]

If the passage of time is understood as being strictly phenomenal as it is in a block universe, then global time does not pass between lives. Furthermore, if there is any passage in-between, it would exist outside of the context of 'global time.'

This is an excellent question. I don't have an answer for you because this is in fact part of the quadrilemma that faces any theory of consciousness. I will point you toward Christian List's work: https://academic.oup.com/pq/advance-article/doi/10.1093/pq/pqae053/7686655

Thanks for this response!

 

[whytrymyguy]

I guess I'm at a point in my life where I genuinely don't know what happens after I die.

I think the most likely possibility is that nothing happens, just like before you were born. Being a trans person If one of the religions are right then I'm screwed, religious people always told me that god still loves me but I'd probably end up going to hell. I feel like it's not very likely though. Something that always interested me was "the egg" story (kurzgesagt made a really interesting video on it). I mean as far as theories go it makes the most sense to me, if there is something after death. I do however think nothingness is more likely.

The one thing that always fascinated me with death was that there was no way to tell what happens with a 100% certainty. Whatever happens I'm kind of glad that I can leave this life behind at least. If there's a next one after death or not.

Nothing. I hate to always mention it, but it's more relevant on this forum than anywhere else, i've already died. Could be that you end up in whatever afterlife you believe in. I'm an atheist, there was nothing in my experience. Could be that souls exist and mine hadn't left my body, could be that an angel didn't carry my soul into the afterlife yet. No way to know.

 

[cooki3]

Nothing. I hate to always mention it, but it's more relevant on this forum than anywhere else, i've already died. Could be that you end up in whatever afterlife you believe in. I'm an atheist, there was nothing in my experience. Could be that souls exist and mine hadn't left my body, could be that an angel didn't carry my soul into the afterlife yet. No way to know.

So did you die and essentially feel like you immediately woke up? Were you aware of nothingness or did time not exist and there simply was nothing aside from death and you being brought back?

 

[G000pie]

Personally I like to believe in the multiverse, out of comfort if nothing else. That there are infinite universes out there and I'll just go to another one- hopefully to begin as an entirely new person in an entirely new world. I've had a few out of body experiences which after having hundreds of lucid dreams are different entirely so I'm 99% sure at this point spirits/souls/whatever are real. Sure maybe I'll burn in hell or fade into nothingness... but there's a chance there's something else out there. I can hope, anyway.

 

[happynuclearwinter]

I had a surgery, full anesthesia, unconscious. I didn't feel or think anything, as if there's a gap between those times.

I'd like to believe that's what after death feels like, just like before we were born, nothingness.

 

[SovietSuicide]

A deeper layer of hell.

 

[whytrymyguy]

So did you die and essentially feel like you immediately woke up? Were you aware of nothingness or did time not exist and there simply was nothing aside from death and you being brought back?

Exactly this. The way I've described it was teleportation, I was on the bed and then all of a sudden I was being revived by paramedics on the floor. It felt like no time had passed at all. As I was in the process of dying however, for just a little bit, I had weak awareness of noises around me and feelings, but I wasn't conscious enough for my brain to really process it or for it to mean anything. It's all a blur. There was nothing when I died, nothing at all. Try to think back to before you were born, just lack of existence. The void.