Discussion what do you consider as pro-death?

[whitetaildeer]

do you believe pro-death includes antinatalism, mortalism, etc.? or is it just preferring death over living? additionally, do you think there's any pro-death beliefs that are toxic/harmful? i'm not completely sure on my own stance, but i've seen people have differing ideas on what's pro-death and what isn't. if you have a clear idea of what you think is pro-death, please share and discuss! thank you in advance.

 

[idelttoilfsadness21]

Pro death involves many beliefs and ideas that — like anything in this confusing, interlocking world of many different opinions — it would involve all cases of many perspectives of ideologies. Think of the reason why antinatalism was created. Was it originally truly because they cared for the lives of those babies? Or was it because they saw themselves through the lens of being born. Death wasn't the originator of choosing what feels more alive. It was the thought of being without pain and without suffering. To be alive or wishing that, would be pro-death but more so in terms of personal ego and the affects of being in much pain long term. Pro death can only go toxic when you push an entire group — without fully considering much stance with rationalism each circumstance, and HOW COULD YOU NOT, That shit's hard — into the bounds of something more selfish, controlling, and vindictive into a god like complex, of feeling like it must be done this way.

Think of Inuyashiki or Light Yagami, when the main characters both played God.

They didn't have anyone truly in mind besides their own, and you even remove or completely erase the stance of someone's story, too, by just validating it with removal, without fully considering the WHAT!, basically almost like telling them to kill themselves but you are fully adding on WHAT YOUR LOGIC is into a twisted manipulative scheme of thoughts for yourself and the person who considers it.

For if there is any? It depends on what I shared above, but usually most have much thought when you put it into terms of actual thought matter and compassion with the same face of reason.

I think, to me, pro life is realistically having a choice into deciding your fate, all while succumbing into the horrors of this world but being strong regardless for others who may feel the same way, feeling that same empathetic embroil of conflicting emotions with your own and theirs.

It's sadly no way out of this hell

 

[Namelesa]

Obviously outright encouraging suicide is toxic pro-death actions as thats telling people to do something with their own live without considering their own feelings on it. With that same logic thats why I think encouraging someone to live is also bad.

To me pro-death is when you see death as preferable for everyone living no matter what. For someone to think death is better than a life that is more suffering than good is not in my opinion but what considers a life that is more suffering than good is subjective to the person so a person shouldn't force their own opinions of whats too much suffering onto others which should also be the same with forcing opinions on whether someone else's life is good enough living for.

Saying about the logic of why you think death is preferable and the believes of promortalism can maybe be considered pro-death but I would say it isn't toxic or immoral as there are genuine claims made with these statements to be made here and I think others should consider the claims but they are of course allowed to keep living as its their life and see potential reason in continuing it like benefiting other people they care about or that its okay and don't see what's the point in putting the effort into die now or the risks to the methods we can access. To me saying about why you want to die and saying about your logically reasons for it shouldn't be silenced. To me its also comforting to see people think this way as I feel more seen and heard and that death is an equal solution to my suffering and so suffer less which is ultimately what this site should strive for.

With the way I believe about live and death, I think this way:

good/neutral life = death/non-existence
bad life < death/non-existence​

So to me I would say I am death/suicide neutral and recovery neutral as to me both options are equally valid and ultimately end up with the goal of less/no suffering. I personally think recovery is more risky as we have no confirmation whether things get better when with death and non-existence there is no harm done and you can't regret dying as you can't feel, do, fear or desire anything there but people should be allowed to take the risk of continuing life if they want to as its their life not ours. With how effective methods are getting restricted and with suicide prevention at the moment there is of course risk to suicide and so that equally valid to not go for that option. We should be making both options as available and accessible as possible so there is less risks for each option so people can have ways of ending their suffering with whatever way they see fit.

Antinatalism is definitely not pro-death as someone who isn't born or exist yet can't die. People believe it as its unfair to force people into anything that has the risk of doing more harm to the individual which should include life itself. To me people shouldn't have had to put in the effort to ctb when they didn't want their life especially as they aren't disadvantaged by not existing as what I said previously. Cus of this it it goes against personal autonomy against innocent people and so is immoral.

I think the hypothetical button that kills everyone instantly and painlessly can be seen as toxic as that will end lives of people who would be fine with or want to continue life but I see it being not toxic to press it as in non-existence these people can't be disadvantaged while the people who didn't want to live benefit so overall more good is done than bad. I do think the button would be best pressed if people continue to procreate and not allow euthanasia for everyone as that creates unconsental suffering and so thats more toxic than to unconsental purely peaceful ends of lives but if all people agreed to do this then the button would be morally incorrect to press.

 

[Pluto]