Resource Useful Info About SN

[DepressedDude]

I found this table in an old thread and found it quite informative so thought I'd repost it.

Death .
Official	"SN Poisoning" Easily detectable, nothing more to it.
How does it work exactly?	Blood cells do not carry oxygen, though lungs continue to supply it, and brain is still working. Cells in body turn to anaerobic metabolism for a while and eventually die , after couple of hours . SN also causes blood cell destruction, plus circulatory disorder (blood cannot flow to tissue).
What's the medical state?	The body can be described as suffering: hemolytic anemia, "blood failure", or anemic hypoxia, "blood fails to deliver oxygen". Tissue slowly dies, but not due to lack of oxygen in cells (like cyanide) or lungs (like suffocation), rather due to 'bad blood' . It shares similarities with CO2 poisoning .
Is it like suffocation?	No. Suffocation (hypoxic hypoxia) is a stressful experience, involving reflexes, pain, and rapid damage within minutes. SN does not deprive oxygen from you body, but to individual cells within your body.
Will my brain continue to function?	Yes. Brain continues to function, even with 30% oxygen level. SN is a gradual slow process.
Will I feel death?	No, if regime followed. With low oxygen levels you faint and lose consciousness. Brain goes into "sleep mode" – everything keeps working, but you fall asleep.
Can it be disguised as accident?	Never . Your face turns blue and your blood turns dark -- that's visible . It cannot be disguised as hypothermia or suffocation
Can I donate organs?	Never. Suspicion of either suicide or poisoning forbids that. Autopsy and inquest required , cannot harvest organs (even if permitted) .
Do you "fall asleep" due to hypoxia or sedatives?	Either or both. SN: faint around 13m , unconsciousness around 20m. Benzo: taking several can knock out , in 15m-30m So either / both You may time to be asleep when SN affects
. Recovery .
SN fatal even in small dosages?	YES. DO NOT TRY OR TASTE IT.
Can I recover?	YES – with HOSPITAL CARE.
Can I recover on my own?	NO.
What happens in recovery/hospital?	Methylene Blue is an antidote. Minute dosage of it increases oxygen from fatal 20% to healthy 90% within 30-60m. Patients regain consciousness within 2-8 hours; dissmissed after 1-3 days; unless kept for psychiatric evaluation. Hospitals sometime follow further procedures, but these were not found to be crucial just supportive, may hasten recovery: Oxygen therapy, Ascorbic acid (MetHb elimination), Cimetidine (reduces hematotoxins).
Can I be rescued?	YES. Usually within 1-2 hours. Sometimes up to 3-4h after ingestion.
Will I have permanent damage?	NO – You either die or recover Plethora of SN poisoning cases with no medical evidence of damage. Probably due to mode of action – slow cell/tissue death until total collapse. In the meantime everything is working.
If only small amount digested can I recover alone?	NO . This is extremely rare .
Will I have permanent damage if SN taken without medical intervention?	No. You will not have permanent damage. But you won't survive – scenario very unlikely – without rescue 99% fatal.
Why SN does not cause brain damage?	Hypoxic brain injury (drastic reduction in oxygen) is much slower than anoxic brain injury (sudden shutoff of oxygen, kills brain cells in 4 minutes). Other organs die first . Heart, kidneys, etc collapse first – see research link Possible temporary damage to globus pallidus (basal ganglia) – spontanously healed after few days [1]
Chances of coma / becoming vegetable?	Currently 0% , as far as we know: Out of thousands poisoning cases throughout centuries – there are no such documented cases. [1] [2] "The Chinese Case" is not documented , we don't know patient background , and family claims malpractice . The child is not vegetative but brain dead (no chances of waking up). It is not a good case to study . [1]
Storage .
Primer	SN acts much like table salt (NaCl). Hygroscopic – absorbs water . Does not reactwith water but dissolves to ions , suspended between H20 molecules . Google "reactions vs ionic solution" . Dissolves readily up to 40% (see graph) Should not be heated . Combustible .
Solid​
Can I open and close bottle?	YES. Unless you're in a sauna .. It does not oxidize with oxygen , only with water (that solution is potent) Frequent exposure will damage it, but over time. Occasional won't. Clamps are fine Normal temperatures are fine . SN is transported in trucks/airplanes neither heated nor cooled . SN storage warnings mention only high heat, reagents, pressure, and combustion. That includes strong acids / bases / oxidizers . These may cause reaction .
Refrigerate?	No. SN is not reactive (only to moisture, heat, strong acid/base) In industry kept at room temperature for years – simple plastic container Refrigerators have moisture – don't overdo [1]
Extreme weather for transport/storage problem?	No. SN is transported in all climates without any heating/cooling. SN is simply not reactive – only to moisture, acid, extreme heat, etc
Solution (liquid)​
Will it go bad quickly?	NO. Only after few hours. Strong solutions (40%) are potent and durable . Weaker solutions will slightly react to create nitrates (aquarium) . Labs store 40% solution in room temperature, open and close it, so some oxygen is fine. Pure 100%, required in delicate biochem tests (DNA), must be prepared freshly ; but 99% is fine for us . Labs use purified water and under sterile condition.
How long is it potent?	At least several hours, if not more. It has nothing to react with – but minute minerals, dirt, etc in drinking water .
Should I refrigerate?	No. While labs store 40% solution, our water is "dirty", and we lack sterile environment. Cooling should not cause SN to change behaviour , but don't . See saturation/temperature graph (OP)
Should I use heated water?	No. SN , like salt , readily dissolves in room temperature water . Stir it . Heating will cause SN to change behaviour – don't.
Summary​
	Water Solution Few Hours Packed Air-Tight Few Years Clumps, temporary exposure to air , are okay Air Few Weeks Will lose potency slowly, due to humidity (H2O) not oxygen

SN Intake .
Common symptoms?	Stan's Guide Success/failure stories – provide full testimonies It's individual. Each member mentioned something else -- that another wasn't worried about.
"Pain"?	Issue are NOT painful, but bad sensory/mental experience for many
Burning throat	Some report mild painful – most haven't
Fast heart rate	Some report 200bpm – like strenuous sprinting but while sitting down – can be scary. Can induce anxiety – see Benzo, Beta-Blockers. Again others were not that bothered.
Taste​
Taste	SN tastes like salt [1] . In high concentration that is disgusting . Some report bad taste – others didn't care. Taste rarely causes vomiting itself Amitryptyline > N > SN (least horrible) Discomfort documented [1][2] – taste complaints "very disgusting" (few felt nothing)
Salt trial	This is not a recommended practice. If very worried – may test with regular kitchen salt. It is not required. Members tried [1] [2] [3] Mostly safe but careful , research Some reported SN taste – don't try! – see above threads .
How to take SN	Quick shot to back of throat – best practice. Don't sip [1] Straw (direct to throat) was suggested , some used – too slow sucking SN? Discussed dozens times, search threads.
Aftertaste	Something strong to overcome taste Without much calories , acidity , irritation Avoid ingestion – at least 10 minutes to allow SN intake [1]
Aftertaste – Tips	Suck ice cube before/after – reduce taste, soothes (see here) Drink 50ml ice water – refreshing (don't drink much) Gargle mouthwash (or water) Suck on: Chocolate tablet Mint Bit honey , jam Anything that won't be ingested / irritate stomach
Vomiting ​
Vomiting	SN fatal even if vomited 50ml on empty stomach (very little) – no prolonged / severe / violent vomitin
Servings / Vomiting practice	Stan's Practice – 3 Servings If vomit before fainting – drink next serving Don't force drink #2 – body already absorbed SN Following Stan practice, example: Serving Serving What happened Drank Vomited Absorbed #1 20g Drank all & vomited a lot 20g 15g 5g #2 20g Partially drank serving & vomited some 14g 7g 7g #3 20g Never used Total SN 12g (fatal) If vomit within 10m – may take more SN Fainting around 12m indicates fatality – sufficient SN absorption (no need for more)
PPH practice , vomiting	PPH Practice - 1 Big Serving Serving Size What happened Drank Vomited Absorbed #1 25g Vomited 25g 15g 10g Total SN 10g (fatal) If vomit within 10m – still fatal – no need for more SN
Dosage​
PPH / Stan	To absorb more SN despite possible vomit -- two strategies emerged: PPH increased dose through the years: 15g –> 20g –> 25g Stan's multiple serving – if vomit take more, 3 x 20g Notes: How many actually drank several servings? Unconfirmed [1] Too much SN may cause instant vomiting? Unconfirmed
Dosage	PPH = 1 x 25g Stan = 3 x 20g
Over 100kg	PPH = 1x 35g Stan = 3x 25g
Under 60kg *	This had been suggested by some , but not confirmed. PPH = 1x 20g Stan = 3x 15g * We have no evidence that special practice is required . PPH addresses old fragile people , many underweight .
Table per weight?	Not required . jgm63 table is mathematical/theoretical and may complicate preparation [1] . We have no info on those dosages , may use at own discretion .
Warnings​
Double dose?	DON'T. Double dose may do the opposite (vomiting all instead of some), though we don't know and PPH have doubled the dose through the years.
Routes of administration?	DON'T. Search threads. Enema – strong salts burn and literally destroy membranes . (example , more) Capsules – need quick SN and in intestines -- capsules interfere , not practical (details , absorption) IV / Injection -- Vein will collapse , SN won't enter blood (destroy membranes) [1] ; not practical [2] [3]
Alcohol	DON'T. Search threads. 100ml alcohol changes everything Stomach acidity, metabolism, and absorption (even 3h after drink) Vomit more and/or violently Opposite effects -- increase anxiety/headache Recommendation is to barely drink water for max SN absorption, additions are counter productive, don't mix poisons.
Weed / Marijuana / MDMA	DON'T. Search threads. Weed not strong antiemetic Psychoactive effects while ctb – hazardous Intensify feeling – panic & survival instinct Freak out , unpredictable Combining 2 extreme experiences in one Example , example , example , and plenty more
Can I drink after SN?	NO. Read members testimonies. Your stomach will be in turmoil , interacting with SN , with chances of vomiting -- adding more to the mix is bad. [1] Suggested aftertaste solutions, and small gulp of water, would do little harm.

~

Fasting .
Timeline	5h before SN– light meal – start fasting. Individual , may consider 4h or 6h Avoid alcohol Next 3 hours– water, non-acidic juices – moderation (glass or two) Avoid acidic, carbonated, caffeinated, fatty drinks. See snack options Next hour – Only water. Drink freely , that is few glasses (not litres) [1] Next hour – complete fast (no drinking) After SN– may have a small chocolate tablet or mint etc for taste Don't overdo – may cause nausea Example and discussion
Timeline (brief)	00:00 Light meal , start fasting Water ok Some snacks , light juices 03:00 Only water 04:00 Stop water 05:00 SN Intake
Juices	Juices/shakes made with either carrot, aloe, cabbage, beet, watermelon, spinach, cucumber, pear, etc You know your stomach better.
Snacks	Fruit & veg – simple non-acidic, small amount. Candy – simple sugars, no fat, up to 100 calories Apples are acidic and fiberous (long travel in intestines) but 1 small apple 4h before SN could be ok – you know your stomach.
Acidic, carbonated, caffeinated, fatty drinks?	Avoid. If must have – 3h before SN intake (at most 2h) Not recommended
Original PPH timeline (strict)	8h before intake – light meal , start fasting Next 6 hours: Some water. If must drink – small amounts of non-acidic juices Next 2 hours: Complete fast – no drinking
Why did it change?	Quick gastric emptying for fluids and simple sugars pH returns to normal 1h after emptying Intestines partially empty – is sufficient for SN absorption See detailed version with data

 

[doctordetritus]

thank you for reading my mind and then creating this post specifically for me. just one question. i've read that grapefruit juice can increase the absorption of some (though not all) medications. For instance: https://www.fda.gov/consumers/consumer-updates/grapefruit-juice-and-some-drugs-dont-mix "https://www.fda.gov/consumers/consumer-updates/grapefruit-juice-and-some-drugs-dont-mix." I wonder if it would work here.

 

[DepressedDude]

thank you for reading my mind and then creating this post specifically for me. just one question. i've read that grapefruit juice can increase the absorption of some (though not all) medications. For instance: https://www.fda.gov/consumers/consumer-updates/grapefruit-juice-and-some-drugs-dont-mix "https://www.fda.gov/consumers/consumer-updates/grapefruit-juice-and-some-drugs-dont-mix." I wonder if it would work here.

I've read on a SN megathread where it failed because they mixed it with orange juice, I'll try to find it.

 

[doctordetritus]

ah well fuck!

 

[DepressedDude]

ah well fuck!

Feel free to add me to the failures list

Failed Feb 2019

Reason: mixing with orange juice (vitamin c cancels SN)

Still became very ill. Still have minor health problems but I am alive.

 

[cowboypants]

I came across a study yesterday where they had successfully transplanter liver of someone who died by SN. But the person had called the ambulance after ingestion. So don't know how this affects things. Seems to be an experimental case

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9892231/

 

[Goku Black]

I always found Quarky00s posts on sn very valuable

 

[rozeske]

I understand you can be rescued if found within an hour but 2hrs and beyond that? I don't see how.....

 

[Praestat_Mori]

I understand you can be rescued if found within an hour but 2hrs and beyond that? I don't see how.....

I would say don't under estimate with how low amount of oxygen in the blood a body can keep up the most basic functions to survive. Sure, many personal factors and circumstances play a role here and especially whether the protocol was followed as best as possible or not.

 

[blackwave]

Thanks for sharing, is really precious

 

[rozeske]

I would say don't under estimate with how low amount of oxygen in the blood a body can keep up the most basic functions to survive. Sure, many personal factors and circumstances play a role here and especially whether the protocol was followed as best as possible or not.

That is true, how the protocol is followed is very essential, but after reading of cases that didn't make it even calling for help right after ingesting it, it makes you wonder if you have too much of a time window to be saved, let alone hours.

 

[Praestat_Mori]

That is true, how the protocol is followed is very essential, but after reading of cases that didn't make it even calling for help right after ingesting it, it makes you wonder if you have too much of a time window to be saved, let alone hours.

I'm wondering about that myself either but I don't think there is any accurate and official data available.

 

[Begotten]

Do we make much noises after lose consciousness by SN ?

 

[Alloutof_love]

Do we make much noises after lose consciousness by SN ?

I would also like to know this

 

[Onelegman]

Do we make much noises after lose consciousness by SN ?

Who knows...
What I can confirm is that when the body dies it produces a death rattle. Recently a familiar died in his sleep (a big blessing) and his wife knew about it immediately because she heard how he forcibly let out all his air (that's how she described it) and on another occasion, a person who recorded his shot with a shotgun in the It happened to him too... the sound in that video was quite terrifying to hear, it's the body losing all tension and releasing the air I guess...

 

[cowboypants]

That is true, how the protocol is followed is very essential, but after reading of cases that didn't make it even calling for help right after ingesting it, it makes you wonder if you have too much of a time window to be saved, let alone hours.

3 hours was the max reported in a study that compiled many SN cases

 

[rozeske]

3 hours was the max reported in a study that compiled many SN cases

Can you share the report?

 

[cowboypants]

Can you share the report?

Don't remember the study but this could be it...attached image below

 

[rozeske]

Don't remember the study but this could be it...attached image below

Unfortunately the paper is not publicly accessible. Are you referring to the 3hr shown on the screenshot or?

 

[doctordetritus]

Unfortunately the paper is not publicly accessible. Are you referring to the 3hr shown on the screenshot or?

looks like there is another link that provides more information on the same topic:

 

[rozeske]

looks like there is another link that provides more information on the same topic:

View attachment 142634

Yes, I saw that one, it gives a bit more info but not all. It indicates though death from SN poisoning and the toxicology and autopsy reports, nothing about a case of being rescued 3hrs after ingesting. I was curious if the case existed and if so how much SN they consumed.