Venting Those who made up their minds should not be lumped with all suicidal people and have their wishes (to die) respected!

[TAW122]

In the past and even to present day, there are two types of suicidal people, one whom is genuinely suicidal (those who made up their minds and do not want to be stopped) and another that are acutely suicidal or temporarily suicidal (meaning they won't likely become suicidal or will recover shortly after), and sadly society lumps both categories or types of suicidal people as the same and treats them all the same, regardless of context, or so. It is also one of existentialgoof's (an avid champion of pro-choicer philosophy and stance) gripes about how society makes no distinction between the two kinds of people. By this lumping of both the genuinely determined suicidal people along with the ones who are just temporarily suicidal, it creates a lot of problems and contention, where the ones who are determined will either try again (and fail) or resort to worse methods causing more collateral damage as a result of their attempts due to being denied reliable peaceful means, etc. though I digress.

Note: If anyone (who was on the subreddit SaSu prior to it's banning by shitty Reddit platform and before the founding of this platform, SaSu, there was a quote, comment, or maybe even a thread that talked about how people who are on that subreddit (SaSu, predecessor to this forum) and even SaSu forum here do NOT wish to be talked out of or even stopped (intervened against) their plans, or attempt at CTB. It has been such a long time, but I feel like it is still relevant even today and just doesn't get discussed enough.

So for this thread, this is going to be about the 'determined suicidal' person, the one who made up their mind. With that point established, society's issue is that they just simply do not respect the right to die (no surprise!) and even worse, especially in the most recent few years, they (society, the State and the populace, the masses) have only gotten more and more paternalistic with their suicide prevention effort, campaigns, and policies, even borderline (if not already) violating many civil rights, all in the name of protecting others from their own interests, and what not, all before bodily autonomy. Of course, bodily autonomy is thrown around by the masses and only when it pertains to things like abortion or other civil rights (womens' rights, minorities' rights, marginalized groups' rights, etc.). However, when it comes to oneself wanting to take matters into their own hands and end their own suffering, all of a sudden they are treated like criminals despite having harmed nobody, committed no illegal acts nor criminal acts, all because they are found or determined to have planned, attempted, or will attempt to CTB!

What should have happened with society and the populace (which sadly won't happen though) is for the actual suicidal people, those who already made up their minds clearly on what they want and have an unwavering, consistent and persistent wish for an extended time to be able to have them honored (otherwise what is the whole point of wills, directives, and other things, etc.) with only the person themselves able to cancel or change them. Then the ones who may only be temporarily suicidal, will get the intervention they seek or so. Ultimately, respect the wishes of those who already made up their minds, and I believe that people who are on SaSu already did so. It is really disgusting how most/all of society just seeks to shut down the only avenue of unfettered real discussion of methods, philosophy, and even just general talk of suicide and similar topics!

 

[_Gollum_]

I agree that making this distinction between the two groups would be a big step forward, but it's still a form of gatekeeping: your decision will still be in the hands of others who do not--cannot--experience your own subjective experience of life. Which is particularly problematic because the line between these groups isn't always clear. There are people who have chronic, serious suicidal ideation for years and then make full recoveries, whereas there are people who go much of their lives without suicidal ideation and then become extremely determined, convinced, and staunch over a relatively short period of time.

Ultimately, because I believe that death is not a harm for the individual, I think it should always be a sufficient justification just for someone to express that they want to die. Of course, I understand that society-wide, this is extremely unrealistic to hope for, and if we're talking about a government-run MAID program, it wouldn't be practical or desirable, but ideally that would be my position: unconditional pro-choice. It's your life, it's your choice.