TAW122
Emissary of the right to die.
- Aug 30, 2018
- 7,504
Of course, this isn't the first nor the last time the pro-lifers, anti-choicers are intellectually dishonest and disingenuous (in other words, arguing in bad faith) towards their positions and arguments over the feasibility and reality of CTB attempts. I may be preaching to the choir here at SaSu, but most of us here on SaSu, especially those who are familiar with methods know that many methods are not reliable and those that are reliable and likely peaceful (rather than reliable but brutal, violent) are heavily restricted, or even outright banned in many countries around the world (SN, N, inert gases, other means). Even when it comes to 'brutal and violent' methods (yet reliable), the State (as well as the populace, the masses) often try to impede those who want to escape even by desperate means.
One fairly recent example (link to this Reddit comment chain), which existentialgoof (pro-choice defender) argues with another anti-choice user (miseryofcourse) shows just how ignorant, and also disingenuous and dishonest (arguing in bad faith) some users are when it comes to the debate over the Spanish woman who sought out (and eventually, after a long grueling legal and medical system ordeal) the right to die, was finally granted euthanasia to end her suffering. The example of intellectual dishonesty shown in the quoted box:
During the heated debated between EG (existentialgoof) and some other random user, that other user continues to pedaling the old tired argument of "if said woman wanted to die badly, she would have done xyz!" while it is blatantly and patently false [which is backed by evidence]! Then there is the pivot towards a strawman argument where the user accuses the person instead of the argument (ad hominem) of not learning how to "love" a person. Then of course there is more than just that and some either just repeat their points, continue the hostility, while others just drop from the debate "pretending" they won or that they owned someone, but I digress.
Hypocrisy of society example:
Now, just imagine if someone (in the modern times, 21st century, maybe even the 90's or so) talked about how it "nobody is marginalizing said 'vulnerable' or marginalized group (other than pro-choicers, but like women, minorities, LGBT, any other groups, etc.), there would be immense outrage, cancellations, and society (and the masses) would lose their minds! Yet when it comes to the discussion the CTB act itself, the philosophy, or even methods of CTB, that doesn't happen and the intellectual dishonesty is incredulous!
Therefore, this is just one example (and will not likely be the last) of many people (including the example I gave) whom still ignorantly believe that CTB is easy and accessible. I would believe they fall into two categories, one whom is indoctrinated (not entirely their fault) by the media, their peers, and just ignorant, while the other category (or type) is one whom willfully and deliberately choose to be stubborn, ignorant, and refuse to educate themselves (do their own independent homework, research) on the topic before sounding off and giving their ignorant take (which is patently wrong as facts and evidence disproves their myths and claims) while acting pompous and arrogant then either becoming uncivilized or cowardly (running away by disengagement and blocking while acting like they 'won' or 'stuck it to the pro-choicer'). Either way, while both categories are different, the end result is still the same, the ignorance of the masses and misinformation about CTB method effectiveness, and what not, resulting in overall further harm for those who wish to end one's own suffering without all the hassle. In the end, it won't get better until the myths are debunked, but also does require those who are willing to be open minded and accept facts, evidence, as well as changing their attitude and perspective on CTB efficacy (easier said than done). All we could do is to call out the ignorance where we can (safely, of course, without endangering our own personal autonomy or bringing risk to ourselves).
One fairly recent example (link to this Reddit comment chain), which existentialgoof (pro-choice defender) argues with another anti-choice user (miseryofcourse) shows just how ignorant, and also disingenuous and dishonest (arguing in bad faith) some users are when it comes to the debate over the Spanish woman who sought out (and eventually, after a long grueling legal and medical system ordeal) the right to die, was finally granted euthanasia to end her suffering. The example of intellectual dishonesty shown in the quoted box:
| u/miseryofcourse said: It would not be difficult for someone to get pentobarbital on the dark web, a notoriously peaceful suicide method. If she is afraid of getting a laced drug, then she would become more committed and order drug tests before ingesting the pills. You think someone who truly wants to kill themselves is concerned with what is or what is not legal? Pentobarbital is not the only drug, it's just one example. She also could have synthesized any number of drugs herself. |
During the heated debated between EG (existentialgoof) and some other random user, that other user continues to pedaling the old tired argument of "if said woman wanted to die badly, she would have done xyz!" while it is blatantly and patently false [which is backed by evidence]! Then there is the pivot towards a strawman argument where the user accuses the person instead of the argument (ad hominem) of not learning how to "love" a person. Then of course there is more than just that and some either just repeat their points, continue the hostility, while others just drop from the debate "pretending" they won or that they owned someone, but I digress.
Hypocrisy of society example:
Now, just imagine if someone (in the modern times, 21st century, maybe even the 90's or so) talked about how it "nobody is marginalizing said 'vulnerable' or marginalized group (other than pro-choicers, but like women, minorities, LGBT, any other groups, etc.), there would be immense outrage, cancellations, and society (and the masses) would lose their minds! Yet when it comes to the discussion the CTB act itself, the philosophy, or even methods of CTB, that doesn't happen and the intellectual dishonesty is incredulous!
Therefore, this is just one example (and will not likely be the last) of many people (including the example I gave) whom still ignorantly believe that CTB is easy and accessible. I would believe they fall into two categories, one whom is indoctrinated (not entirely their fault) by the media, their peers, and just ignorant, while the other category (or type) is one whom willfully and deliberately choose to be stubborn, ignorant, and refuse to educate themselves (do their own independent homework, research) on the topic before sounding off and giving their ignorant take (which is patently wrong as facts and evidence disproves their myths and claims) while acting pompous and arrogant then either becoming uncivilized or cowardly (running away by disengagement and blocking while acting like they 'won' or 'stuck it to the pro-choicer'). Either way, while both categories are different, the end result is still the same, the ignorance of the masses and misinformation about CTB method effectiveness, and what not, resulting in overall further harm for those who wish to end one's own suffering without all the hassle. In the end, it won't get better until the myths are debunked, but also does require those who are willing to be open minded and accept facts, evidence, as well as changing their attitude and perspective on CTB efficacy (easier said than done). All we could do is to call out the ignorance where we can (safely, of course, without endangering our own personal autonomy or bringing risk to ourselves).
