“Saving” someone from suicide is selfish.

[Anxieyote]

Who are you to decide if someone's life is worth living or not? People don't trust that someone can sensibly arrive at the conclusion that their life is not worth continuing, and it's naive to assume that theirs will improve "if only they just stick around a little bit longer!!"

People treat suicidal people like children who have no intelligence or personal agency.

"Death bad, why you want death? " they say, confounded.

We're never raised to consider it as an option, because we're supposed to be chasing life's fruits. But when we find the fruits to be out of our reach, we're just told to "try harder".

You could be 60 years old, having never enjoyed any of life's pleasures, and people would still insist that a rewarding life is in the cards if you just wait long enough.

How unbelievably cruel to force someone to stay on this planet because of the off-chance that they stumble into a good life after theirs has careened off the rails. You could be suffering constantly, and people would tell you to "just hang in there". It makes my blood boil.

 

[deadverysoon]

what makes me to want to freak out is this:

you will just get help to not kill uourself - they talk to you like youre fucking retarded. thats very good for the ego if you have the suicide-crazy-mf- stigma. makes things a looot better...

and then you hang in - getting "rescued" again and again and again and things get worse and worse.

but help to fix the real issues?

nope.

just hang in - we wont help you. ahh okay we will - but just to suffer even more.

we will never give you the time, space and safetey you would need.

but dont die yet. were not finished.

etc.

etc.

 

[spinningharmonica]

What you say sounds all too familar. Where did you get this from?

 

[WatermelonMel]

Some people just wanna feel like heroes

 

[Wrennie]

Who are you to decide if someone's life is worth living or not? People don't trust that someone can sensibly arrive at the conclusion that their life is not worth continuing, and it's naive to assume that theirs will improve "if only they just stick around a little bit longer!!"

People treat suicidal people like children who have no intelligence or personal agency.

"Death bad, why you want death? " they say, confounded.

We're never raised to consider it as an option, because we're supposed to be chasing life's fruits. But when we find the fruits to be out of our reach, we're just told to "try harder".

You could be 60 years old, having never enjoyed any of life's pleasures, and people would still insist that a rewarding life is in the cards if you just wait long enough.

How unbelievably cruel to force someone to stay on this planet because of the off-chance that they stumble into a good life after theirs has careened off the rails. You could be suffering constantly, and people would tell you to "just hang in there". It makes my blood boil.

These are legitimately phrases I hear from people on a daily basis. I need to begin keeping count... though it'll be hard to remember to do so when my brain now automatically tunes them out the very moment that they open their mouths.

Excellent post. You truly summed up everything needing to be said.

 

[toforigivelife]

Who are you to decide if someone's life is worth living or not? People don't trust that someone can sensibly arrive at the conclusion that their life is not worth continuing, and it's naive to assume that theirs will improve "if only they just stick around a little bit longer!!"

People treat suicidal people like children who have no intelligence or personal agency.

"Death bad, why you want death? " they say, confounded.

We're never raised to consider it as an option, because we're supposed to be chasing life's fruits. But when we find the fruits to be out of our reach, we're just told to "try harder".

You could be 60 years old, having never enjoyed any of life's pleasures, and people would still insist that a rewarding life is in the cards if you just wait long enough.

How unbelievably cruel to force someone to stay on this planet because of the off-chance that they stumble into a good life after theirs has careened off the rails. You could be suffering constantly, and people would tell you to "just hang in there". It makes my blood boil.

It's also unbelievably cruel and not to mention selfish to expect someone to continue suffering so that you don't have to feel sad.

If people and society took the time to understand how badly a clinically depressed or otherwise mentally unhealthy person is suffering and what causes them to die by suicide they could accept their passing the same way that they could accept the passing of someone who died of a physical illness.

I have struggled with depression and suicidal feelings since childhood.

I went to high school with a girl who already had a major breakdown by the time she was in her third year. And we all know the pain and devastation of a mental breakdown.

I used walk home with her from the bus stop on an almost daily basis. Before her breakdown she was a pretty, academically successful and healthy girl who took care of herself.

After the breakdown she had put on weight, or maybe that was a side effect of her medications, and every single day, regardless of the season, she wore jeans, a t-shirt and a sweatshirt jacket. You could see the devastation and mental anguish just by looking at her.

I was friendly with her and did what I could to keep her company and make her laugh.

I just remember this kid trudging to and from the bus stop every day with her books, her t-shirt, jeans and her sweatshirt jacket. Every single day.

I never found out what she was diagnosed with but a major mental breakdown at such a young age usually, and her condition after the breakdown, usually signals a serious illness.

She managed to make it into her 50s before finally throwing herself in front of a speeding Metra train.

An option she took since those who want to "save" us make it a point to deny us the more peaceful and humane ways of ending our suffering.

She must have studied the timing of the trains, figured out the best spot to use in to jump in front of the train and she must've timed it so that the train would be going a certain speed when she stepped in front of it.

I couldn't believe the people who were shocked and baffled by her suicide. I was thinking, "Do you realize how long she held on? Do you realize how hard it was to hold on? Do you realize how painful those 50-plus years were?"

Educate yourself and instead of being mystified by these deaths wish them well-deserved peace, take comfort in that their suffering has ended, remember them well and say a prayer for them.

My siblings kept telling me that her mother was in "world of pain" after her death.

I'm sympathetic to a mother losing her child but, AGAIN!, her daughter had been sick and in pain for a very long time and propped herself up for as long as she could. Probably because her daughter was trying to avoid hurting others.

I'm sorry for her mother's pain but I don't think her mother would've tried to force her daughter to live if her daughter had been struggling for years with cancer or another painful, debilitating, fatal physical illness.

Newsflash; depression and mental illness are real, painful, debilitating, will rob you of your quality of life and can be fatal.

 

[cytokinestorm]

What I can't accept is that the Pro Lifers have absolutely nothing to offer a suicidal person. They prevent you from going, but then leave you to continue existing in terrible mental anguish. They get on with their lives quite happily and what do they think you're doing all the while?

People expect depressed people to behave like they're fine and not to offend others with their depressed behaviour.

It doesn't fucking work like that

 

[FuneralCry]

Yes, I agree that saving someone is selfish. In the case of family members for example, they just want to keep you alive for their sake and are disregarding your wishes. Saving someone is just prolonging the suffering the person is experiencing. We all have the right to take our lives at a time of our own choosing, it is our decision and nobody else has any say in that. People who have never been suicidal themselves will not be able to comprehend what it is like.

 

[Anxieyote]

What I can't accept is that the Pro Lifers have absolutely nothing to offer a suicidal person. They prevent you from going, but then leave you to continue existing in terrible mental anguish. They get on with their lives quite happily and what do they think you're doing all the while?

They'll cross "saved someone's life" off their personal bucket list, and feel great validation from doing such a heroic thing.

But in reality, they have either postponed the inevitable, needlessly prolonged that person's suffering—or both.

There's actually a great book by Gary Larson that illustrates the naivety and wishful thinking of your average pro-lifer. It's called "There's a Hair in My Dirt! A Worm's Story", which doesn't sound like it would have any profound messages, but for a kids book, it does contain some brutal truths about life.

It follows the average day of a "Snow White"-like character as she wanders through the woods and observes nature.

It's been a long time since I've read it, but it would start off with her interpretation of what was happening in front of her, and then a scientific explanation of what was actually going on.

There is one scene where she sees dragonflies "playing" over the pond, and zipping back and forth. She sees it as them "dancing", when in reality, the dragonflies are trying to rip each other apart to compete for mates.

Another scene is her "saving" a baby bird that has fallen from its nest, and climbing a tree to put it back in its nest. But as she strolls away, whistling with satisfaction, the mama bird throws it back onto the ground and kills it.

The book illustrates just how much people put their blinders on and actively delude themselves from acknowledging harsh realities.

You can save someone's life, but without considering the aftermath, or the context of why they want to take their life in the first place—you're part of the problem.

 

[Worndown]

They'll cross "saved someone's life" off their personal bucket list, and feel great validation from doing such a heroic thing.

But in reality, they have either postponed the inevitable, needlessly prolonged that person's suffering—or both.

There's actually a great book by Gary Larson that illustrates the naivety and wishful thinking of your average pro-lifer. It's called "There's a Hair in My Dirt! A Worm's Story", which doesn't sound like it would have any profound messages, but for a kids book, it does contain some brutal truths about life.

It follows the average day of a "Snow White"-like character as she wanders through the woods and observes nature.

It's been a long time since I've read it, but it would start off with her interpretation of what was happening in front of her, and then a scientific explanation of what was actually going on.

There is one scene where she sees dragonflies "playing" over the pond, and zipping back and forth. She sees it as them "dancing", when in reality, the dragonflies are trying to rip each other apart to compete for mates.

Another scene is her "saving" a baby bird that has fallen from its nest, and climbing a tree to put it back in its nest. But as she strolls away, whistling with satisfaction, the mama bird throws it back onto the ground and kills it.

The book illustrates just how much people put their blinders on and actively delude themselves from acknowledging harsh realities.

You can save someone's life, but without considering the aftermath, or the context of why they want to take their life in the first place—you're part of the problem.

Did someone try to save you or cause you to stay alive longer?
I know people post their frustrations here. Sometimes they will be asked questions on their reason and do delay or abandon their plans. There are many perspectives on this site and they often prove helpful. Without that back and forth conversation this would only be a place where people post their goodbyes.

 

[BetweenRadioStations]

I do agree with the statement, "Who am I to judge if someone wants to commit suicide?" It should be their right, not mine. I also believe that a genuine conversation, regardless of the outcome, is helpful and worth while with someone that's about to pull the trigger. What about those who jump out of impulse. The feeling they have to jump even if they don't want to. What about those who have attempted and are so grateful to be alive, to have been saved?

This site is prochoice, not projump.
I'm prochoice, whatever that choice may be.

 

[NormaJeane]

We have the right to determine how long we want to live, it is a human right, no one else has anything to do with it.

 

[Fakereality]

Having mental illness and high amount of depression, is like losing your whole hands or limbs and people asking you to pray and have faith that it will grow back one day and just be patient have "hope" no matter how much amount of time passes a hand or leg can never grow back once it's been cut off same is true true for brain it can never truly go back to the state it once was before it got depressive and affected by mental illness expecting and forcing someone to live or survive in that state is testament to sadistic nature of humans.

 

[Anxieyote]

Did someone try to save you or cause you to stay alive longer?
I know people post their frustrations here. Sometimes they will be asked questions on their reason and do delay or abandon their plans. There are many perspectives on this site and they often prove helpful. Without that back and forth conversation this would only be a place where people post their goodbyes.

I am a coward when it comes to ending my life. I own SN, but I haven't had the guts to do it.

I own several thousand dollars, which also prevents me from acting. I am curious how I could use the money to make myself happy before I die. I would like to think that if things got bad enough, I would quit my job, say "fuck it", and spend all the money at once on one last gambit.

 

[Worndown]

I can safely say we all have some cowardly traits or none of us would be here.
Many get solace possessing the SN. Having the ability can reduce the need. Not all are so lucky.
I hope you can get some ideas and relief from this community. Only you can decide when you need to go. We can be with you until that time.

 

[Bedrock48]

Might be a bit distressing, apologies.

I think it goes on a case by case basis. I agree we shouldn't jump to the unhelpful cliches. "It gets better" "Think of those you leave behind" etc etc. That stuff makes me so angry. However the kick of adrenaline and endorphins that come along with finding someone in the middle of an attempt makes it an very tricky position to be in. I can say I've "saved" someone, as in calling for ambulance and police. I had little other choice really, since I found them in a public park shaking and covered in gasoline. That first hit of adrenaline, I could barely form a sentence to say and they didn't want to talk to me. However, I really don't think they wanted to do what they were planning from the level of fear in that poor persons eyes. Whether they clicked that lighter out of genuine want or just to tell me how desperate they were I couldn't tell you. Little else I could do, its so incredibly tricky. I know the mental health system is trash and probably won't make things better but I couldn't just leave them in that position.

Yes, people have free will and choice but I think there are times taking agency might be of more use to that person.

 

[Under The Graveyard]

"Permanent solution to a temporary problem. "

This saying pisses me off more than anything. How do you know if my problem is temporary? You haven't asked me anything, I haven't told you anything, but yet, you know my life?

Fuck off..

 

[Superdeterminist]

Perfectly said.

 

[BeansOfRequirement]

"Permanent solution to a temporary problem. "

This saying pisses me off more than anything. How do you know if my problem is temporary? You haven't asked me anything, I haven't told you anything, but yet, you know my life?

Fuck off..

Isn't a permanent solution to a temporary problem better than a temporary solution? Sounds like a temporary fix would just fix the one temporary problem but a permanent fix would eliminate future temporary problems (especially in the case of suicide, lol).

 

[Deleted member 8579]

a) Existence implies the existence of problems.
b) If existence ceases, so do the problems.
c) If problems cease to exist, so does the need for solutions.

Therefore, suicide is technically not a solution, but by eliminating the problem, it renders the need for a solution obsolete.

As the venerable hotelbeneathground once remarked:

"There are always solutions if you don't mind the fact that they all ultimately just breed more problems."

 

[Anxieyote]

"Permanent solution to a temporary problem. "

Temporary for them, maybe.

Things like my chronic back pain will be a lifelong problem that I will carry with me until I die. And I also wouldn't consider debilitating mental illnesses to be a temporary problem.

People are too scared to evaluate their lives from the perspective of "pros vs. cons", because the answer might be:

"I don't have a very pleasant life right now, and it looks like I might not have a very pleasant life in the future."

 

[toforigivelife]

"Permanent solution to a temporary problem. "

This saying pisses me off more than anything. How do you know if my problem is temporary? You haven't asked me anything, I haven't told you anything, but yet, you know my life?

Fuck off..

There are countries, Canada and Portugal are two that I can name specifically but there others in Europe, that now include depression and mental illness under their right to die or assisted suicide laws.

To the "take a happy pill! think positive! life is what you make it!" crowd? That's how chronic and crippling clinical depression and mental illness can be.

In some cases a change in circumstances can be the solution, some say that antidepressants and medication has helped them but in a lot of cases depression and mental illness is crippling just like physical illnesses and can rob you of your quality of life and ability to function.

"Permanent solution to a temporary problem. "

This saying pisses me off more than anything. How do you know if my problem is temporary? You haven't asked me anything, I haven't told you anything, but yet, you know my life?

Fuck off..

Depression, clinical depression and mental illness are not temporary problems.

They are chronic, lifelong illnesses. No different than diabetes or asthma or...you name it.

In many cases dying from depression, clinical depression or mental illness is no different than dying from cancer or any other fatal illness.

The pharmaceutical, anti-depressant industry must be incredibly lucrative. Otherwise I can't understand the refusal to look at the brain as we look at other parts of the body.

 

[Seiba]

Isn't a permanent solution to a temporary problem better than a temporary solution? Sounds like a temporary fix would just fix the one temporary problem but a permanent fix would eliminate future temporary problems (especially in the case of suicide, lol).

ya reminds me of this. you shouldn't really expect logic from them though, it's just a brain dead phrase they inherited without any actual thought. they don't care if the statement is logical or not, same with the selfish meme.