Research sites wanted please

[Lostnotfound]

Please don't shoot me if this is not allowed (well .... actually... ) but can anyone tell me where I can look to see if.certain prescription medications (calcium channel blockers) are effective in a quest to ct? I believe they are but I don't want another fail So I am trying to research. I have a significant number but can't really find a lot of information about them. Any ideas on research would be gratefully received, if that's allowed that is. Thankyou

 

[Melkus2020]

Did you look at the mega threads that shows all the methods. Or the wiki?

 

[jgm63]

What do search engines say regarding lethal dose ?
Perhaps post what your research has found, then ask if anyone has additional input to offer...

 

[jgm63]

The PPH can be found here b.t.w.

Spoiler: pph-dec-2019

https://sanctioned-suicide.net/threads/pph-dec-2019.30370/

 

[Lostnotfound]

Thankyou to those that replied. I have found a variety of info online but still have a confidence failure. Possibly because there is so little information out there, ctb seems to follow a trend - you must do it this way or that way and thats what everyone reports on. I note on this forum it is mainly SN so there is a lot of info on it. I guess not every method can be covered all the time.

Anyway - the medication I have is the most popular calcium channel blocker prescribed for hypertension. I stopped taking my prescribed meds some time ago but still collect them. My theory is that this CCB will lower my blood pressure so much that I will go into hypotension and hypovalemic shock and then a load of other medical terms which basically means no blood flow / oxygen to the heart and it will stop. This is basically what it tells me on the internet. However I will be unconscious by then as a result of the hypotension and therefore wont know about any of it. This particular med is said to peak 6-9 hours after ingestion and has a half life of 30-50 hours. I have no issues with being found as my circumstances isolate me from the world, and before Xmas i spent 31 days in my bed without any kind of contact with anyone. Someone will only notice when the smell of a rotting corpse wafts out.

So the CCB info I can find ranges from a fatal dose being 2.3mg/kg in a 27 yr F to 400-600mg in a 57 yr M. I can find very few cases reporting the statistics. Weighing in around 95kgs makes it roughly 220mg being fatal but another site says there are reports of survival at 560mg so 200 will do nothing. I have around 2500mg but I am worried about the volume I would need to take. 250 pills is a lot to swallow especially after anti-emetics.

I also have some ACE inhibitors and some SSRI's that I can mix in but again its the volume of tablets and do they add anything. I am very confused.

The only other info I found was that it is generally agreed this medication is fatal in overdose due to the low blood pressure and resulting complications, that it is the number 1 presented overdose in heart medications and that of those who take it there is an 18% completed suicide rate.

This is where I have got to. Would appreciate any contributions if anyone has anything to add.

 

[Quarky00]

Pardon me , what the hack is "popular calcium channel blocker" and "This particular med is said" ?

I'll be more than willing to help , but don't send us on a wild goose chase lol

Sorry if came harsh (a bit of a mood here) You are allowed and feel free , be more specific...

Im honestly bit amused. Discussing the detailed pharmacokinetics of specific medication -- without knowing its name

 

[jgm63]

Pardon me , what the hack is "popular calcium channel blocker" and "This particular med is said" ?

I'll be more than willing to help , but don't send us on a wild goose chase lol

Sorry if came harsh (a bit of a mood here) You are allowed and feel free , be more specific...

Im honestly bit amused. Discussing the detailed pharmacokinetics of specific medication -- without knowing its name

@Lostnotfound
I PM-ed @Quarky00 to see if he could offer input due to his research skills.

But it seems we will need some more details, eg can you tell us which calcium channel blocker you are using ?

 

[Quarky00]

@Lostnotfound
I PM-ed @Quarky00 to see if he could offer input due to his research skills.

But it seems we will need some more details, eg can you tell us which calcium channel blocker you are using ?

Explaining the deranged librarian

 

[LMFAO FOCKERS]

​

Possibly because there is so little information out there, ctb seems to follow a trend - you must do it this way or that way and thats what everyone reports on. I note on this forum it is mainly SN so there is a lot of info on it. I guess not every method can be covered all the time.​

​

​

​

Sounds as if you're looking to be a suicide pioneer??

Why not try suicide by sex???


​

Most of us are not doctors here so @Quarky00 and @jgm63 would only be providing the same information that you can search for on the internet yourself. No one has a monopoly on the internet.

**For someone who's looking to suicide. You sure are making it difficult and vague!!!**
​

Don't mind my sense of humor....Good luck on your search!

 

[BPD Barbie]

Dunno if lostallhope is any good for things like this? I usually look on Wikipedia to see what overdosing etc can do and the mortality rate. Sometimes just Googling 'overdosing on XYZ' yeilds enough info.

 

[Quarky00]

Sounds as if you're looking to be a suicide pioneer??

Why not try suicide by sex???


View attachment 28283​

Most of us are not doctors here so @Quarky00 and @jgm63 would only be providing the same information that you can search for on the internet yourself. No one has a monopoly on the internet.

**For someone who's looking to suicide. You sure are making it difficult and vague!!!**
​

Don't mind my sense of humor....Good luck on your search!

Lol. Suicide by sex. Superb

Dunno if lostallhope is any good for things like this? I usually look on Wikipedia to see what overdosing etc can do and the mortality rate. Sometimes just Googling 'overdosing on XYZ' yeilds enough info.

Yeah , or LD50 (although it's mostly rats lol)

 

[jgm63]

​

​

Sounds as if you're looking to be a suicide pioneer??

Why not try suicide by sex???


View attachment 28283​

Most of us are not doctors here so @Quarky00 and @jgm63 would only be providing the same information that you can search for on the internet yourself. No one has a monopoly on the internet.

**For someone who's looking to suicide. You sure are making it difficult and vague!!!**
​

Don't mind my sense of humor....Good luck on your search!

t.b.h. I was being a bit lazy on this occasion and called in @Quarky00

 

[Lostnotfound]

Pardon me , what the hack is "popular calcium channel blocker" and "This particular med is said" ?

I'll be more than willing to help , but don't send us on a wild goose chase lol

Sorry if came harsh (a bit of a mood here) You are allowed and feel free , be more specific...

Im honestly bit amused. Discussing the detailed pharmacokinetics of specific medication -- without knowing its name

Sorry didnt know if I was allowed to say and dont want to break rules. I have around 250 Amlodopine 10mg which is a calcium channel blocker which lowers blood pressure.

Shock due to amlodipine overdose

Amlodipine is a commonly prescribed calcium channel blocker. Its toxicity is the leading cause of drug overdose seen in the practice of cardiovascular medicine. It can lead to profound hypotension and shock. Management involves early and aggressive supportive ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Amlodipine is a commonly prescribed calcium channel blocker. Its toxicity is the leading cause of drug overdose seen in the practice of cardiovascular medicine. It can lead to profound hypotension and shock. Management involves early and aggressive supportive measures and calcium infusion in large doses to overcome competitive blockade. We report one such case that presented with amlodipine overdose and was successfully managed.

Calcium channel blockers (CCB) are a leading cause (48%) of mortality resulting from drug overdose seen in cardiovascular medicine,[1] and amlodipine is a commonly prescribed long-acting CCB. A patient with amlodipine overdose may have profound refractory hypotension,[1] leading to tissue hypoperfusion and target organ damage. Its treatment involves aggressive supportive measures.[2] We present one such case of amlodipine overdose with a successful outcome.

And then i found some case studies which give the results mentioned earlier.

 

[LMFAO FOCKERS]

​

Sorry didnt know if I was allowed to say and dont want to break rules. I have around 250 Amlodopine 10mg which is a calcium channel blocker which lowers blood pressure.​

​

​

Why wouldnt you be able to talk about your prescribed meds???


....Uh, oh maybe I should be careful talking about my birth control??


...It's the pull out method.

**SHHHhhhh..**


​

------------------

EDIT: Interesting that you deleted your comment....maybe you know something others dont???

 

[GoodPersonEffed]

I only know about calcium channel blockers as they were mentioned on a propanolol OD discussion thread here on SS. In online research, I did find amlodipine mentioned with propanolol, as a calcium channel blocker mixed with a beta blocker will slow things down even more than using either one individually. I haven't researched calcium blocker ODs by themselves though.

Edit: As far as swallowing that many pills, my personal choice would be to dissolve them. May not be the same maker, but I have some amlodipine and it dissolves easily.

Also, the research about amlodipine OD being common with cardiac patients, I wonder if they're more likely to die because they're already cardiac patients. I didn't look at it closely, just noticed that one statement.

 

[Lostnotfound]

I also have Ramipril in the same sort of quantity although these are 5mg. Ramipril in an ACE inhibitor and the net says they will interact with amlodopine so i am thinking maybe a combination of both

 

[Quarky00]

Summary (preliminary results)

• Not very reliable -- dosage , results , and time vary greatly .
• Wildly contradictory specifications are published regarding onset and LD50.
• Death is mostly due to lungs filling with fluids , it takes time , and may be uncomfortable.
• May cause damage, though not common
• Data suggests new common pills (Pfizer) require massive dose
• Despite some hype, very few cases are actually fatal
• May be combined with other meds -- more research required

~~~~~~

Data points

• "oral toxicity (LD50): 37 mg/kg (mouse)"
• Pfizer
  • "Rat (M) Oral LD50 393 mg/kg
  • Rat (F) Oral LD50 686mg/kg"
• "Onset of action: Highest availability 6–12 hours after oral dose"
• "Duration of action: At least 24 hours"
• "Toxicity is seen in doses up to 5-10 times the therapeutic dose and sets within 30-60 minutes following ingestion"
• "Amlodipine is a potent vasodilator with a long half-life and delayed onset of action that is particularly concerning after an overdose."

Seriously? Wtf

A 51-year-old Caucasian male with past medical history of hypertension presented to our hospital after an intentional overdose of 50 10-mg tablets of amlodipine (total of 500 mg).
at toxic dosage (5–10 times usual dosage) pharmacological selectivity is lost and hypotension, bradycardia, and signs of heart failure can be seen.. results in excessive pulmonary capillary transudation leading to non-cardiogenic pulmonary edema [lungs filling with fluids, Q00]
Although CCB toxicity is associated with significant morbidity and fatal outcomes, surprisingly no formal guidelines exist

http://atm.amegroups.com/article/view/17958/html

Two fatal overdoses of the calcium channel blocker amlodipine are described. Postmortem samples were screened for volatiles and therapeutic and abused drugs. The concentrations of amlodipine are compared with previously reported fatal and nonfatal overdoses. The medical examiners ruled in both cases that the manner of death was suicide and the causes of death were mixed drug intoxication and amlodipine intoxication.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/16839474/

In the 28th Annual Report of the American Association of Poison Control Centers, cardiovascular drugs caused 128 cases of fatalities with 24 deaths (18.75%) due to amlodipine

Survival case:
A 27-year-old woman with no known illnesses or history of psychiatric disorders was admitted approximately 6 hours after attempting suicide by ingesting 150 mg of amlodipine. patient was conscious but lethargic with cold extremities.
Dihydropyridine CCBs have a predominant effect on vascular smooth muscle cells with little effect on cardiac pacemaker cells or contractility [4]. That explains why our patient presented with a refractory hypotension without cardiac conduction defects.

https://www.hindawi.com/journals/cric/2013/842606/

nonfatal intentional overdose of amlodipine.
42-year-old woman with a history of hypertension reported ingesting 50-100 mg amlodipine besylate and at least 40 ounces of beer in a suicide attempt.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/9220044/

A 28-years-old woman, with no significant past history, presented with giddiness, abdominal pain, vomiting, breathlessness, and reduced urine output 12 hours after consuming 50 tablets of amlodipine [of 5 mg strength]. She was successfully weaned off ventilator after 48 hours

Giddiness lol
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3902574/?report=classic


Lol this is a good one:

A case of severe amlodipine overdose with only mild symptoms is described. A 43‐year old man was seen by his general practitioner on the day after ingesting 350 mg of amlodipine in attempted suicide.
On the day after the ingestion of amlodipine the general practitioner found the patient fully conscious, mildly flushing, without oedemas and with a blood pressure. He complained of chest pain and fatigue. Admission to hospital was refused by the patient.
On the next day the patient was persuaded to hospital admission, arriving 46 hr after the ingestion of amlodipine. He had no complaints except for well‐known pain due to severe gout. Physical examination was normal except for slight tenderness in the upper right abdominal quadrant, a cushingoid appearance and some tophi on the extremities.

https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1111/j.1742-7843.2006.pto_318.x#


May worsen PRIOR conditions --

A 49-year-old white woman with known bilateral early optic atrophy presented to our hospital with hypotension and obtundation following a known ingestion of 150 mg of amlodipine. She was transferred to our intensive care unit where she was intubated, mechanically ventilated.
3 days later she was liberated from mechanical ventilation. Following extubation, she complained of new onset visual impairment, specifically seeing only red-green colors, but no objects. An ophthalmologic examination revealed that this was due to bilateral optic atrophy from prolonged hypotension during the first 24 hours after the overdose.

specifically seeing only red-green colors, but no objects. Not funny... but sorry, its funny.
https://jmedicalcasereports.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s13256-017-1374-4

Generally, the recommended duration of clinical observation for asymptomatic patients with significant exposure to CCBs is as follows

• Immediate-release products: 6 hours
• Standard-release products: 6-12 hours
• Extended-release or once-a-day preparations: 24-36 hours

In cases of intentional overdose, patients who remain asymptomatic after an adequate observation time may be referred for psychiatric

This report describes a severe overdose that resulted in prolonged and severe hemodynamic compromise for up to 10 days, but responded to aggressive therapy with calcium, glucagon, and other vasoactive medicines.

A 23 yrs old housewife presented to emergency room (ER) after 36 hours of ingestion of 45 tabs of 5mg amlodipine (220mg). She complained of multiple episodes of vomiting, facial puffiness along with dizziness. On examination, she was conscious, alert and well oriented. after 12 hours of hospital admission, she developed marked breathlessness with respiratory distress. She was shifted to the ICU. Over the next 48h, she showed gradual improvement in her clinical condition with decreasing oxygen requirements.

https://www.nepjol.info/index.php/NHJ/article/view/14541/11822

 

[Dark days]

Interesting, (serious) chats, injected with humour (or not)? Perception vs. Intention. All subject to interpretation and change. Thanks for sharing though.

 

[Quarky00]

The fact they say this type of pills is "leading cause of death" is the usual BS by medical associations.

Good headline for tabloids, may get some grants $$$ , and cover big pharma / insurance asses !

 

[Dark days]

Summary

• Not very reliable -- dosage , results , and time vary greatly .
• Wildly contradictory specifications are published regarding onset and LD50.
• Death is mostly die to lungs filling with fluids , it takes time , and may be uncomfortable.
• May cause damage, though not common
• Data suggests new common pills (Pfizer) require massive dose
• May be combined with other meds -- more research required

~~~~~~

Data points

• oral toxicity (LD50): 37 mg/kg (mouse)
• Pfizer
  • Rat (M) Oral LD50 393 mg/kg
  • Rat (F) Oral LD50 686mg/kg
• Onset of action: Highest availability 6–12 hours after oral dose
• Duration of action: At least 24 hours
• Toxicity is seen in doses up to 5-10 times the therapeutic dose and sets within 30-60 minutes following ingestion
• Amlodipine is a potent vasodilator with a long half-life and delayed onset of action that is particularly concerning after an overdose.

The potential detrimental effects of calcium channel blockers’ overdose and current available management - Agarwal - Annals of Translational Medicine

atm.amegroups.com

Two cases of fatal amlodipine overdose - PubMed

Two fatal overdoses of the calcium channel blocker amlodipine are described. Postmortem samples were screened for volatiles and therapeutic and abused drugs. Amlodipine was measured by liquid chromatography-atmospheric pressure photoionization-mass spectrometry. The heart blood amlodipine...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

A Survival Case in a Severe Amlodipine Intoxication

Calcium channel blockers (CCBs) are prescribed in a wide variety of cardiovascular conditions. Nevertheless, they remain a major cause of cardiovascular drug overdose that often leads to a lethal outcome. We report the case of an intoxication with amlodipine, which caused severe hypotension, in...

www.hindawi.com

Amlodipine overdose - PubMed

Amlodipine overdose produces prolonged hemodynamic effects and may lead to pulmonary edema. Due to a long elimination half-life and delayed onset of effects, patients with amlodipine overdose should receive aggressive decontamination therapy and may require extended clinical monitoring and...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Giddiness lol

Shock due to amlodipine overdose

Amlodipine is a commonly prescribed calcium channel blocker. Its toxicity is the leading cause of drug overdose seen in the practice of cardiovascular medicine. It can lead to profound hypotension and shock. Management involves early and aggressive supportive ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Lol this is a good one:

Error - Cookies Turned Off

onlinelibrary.wiley.com

May worsen PRIOR conditions --

specifically seeing only red-green colors, but no objects. Not funny... but sorry, its funny.

Bilateral blindness secondary to optic nerve ischemia from severe amlodipine overdose: a case report - Journal of Medical Case Reports

Background Calcium channel blockers are commonly prescribed medications; calcium channel blocker overdose is becoming increasingly prevalent. The typical presentation of a calcium channel blocker overdose is hypotension and decreased level of consciousness. We describe a case of a calcium...

jmedicalcasereports.biomedcentral.com

Wow! Extensive research. Impressive. Thanks for sharing.

 

[Lostnotfound]

@Quarky00 thankyou for your efforts for me. I found much of the same although I think you got a little more than me. My general opinion was more positive than yours in terms of fatality so I'm now second guessing myself. I have plenty of time I won't be found but I don't want to wake up after a day or two,. I will keep thinking and looking around but think this is my most accessible option.

 

[Quarky00]

One of the highest reported dosages had no effects ...

"On the next day the patient was persuaded to hospital admission, arriving 46 hr after the ingestion of amlodipine."

Lol The patient could have lied obv

It's not about "being found" but waiting for effects. In many cases it takes time , a person is awake and experience 'weird symptoms' , causing them to consult physician rather then 'wait and die' .

You don't know whether to wait 1 hour or 20 , when will you lose consciousness, or what symptoms you'll feel . Very few deaths statistically, most people survive, so you won't even know if it works.


Using that medication on its own to ctb is highly inadvisable

 

[Lostnotfound]

One of the highest reported dosages had no effects ...

"On the next day the patient was persuaded to hospital admission, arriving 46 hr after the ingestion of amlodipine."

Lol The patient could have lied obv

It's not about "being found" but waiting for effects. In many cases it takes time , a person is awake and experience 'weird symptoms' , causing them to consult physician rather then 'wait and die' .

You don't know whether to wait 1 hour or 20 , when will you lose consciousness, or what symptoms you'll feel . Very few deaths statistically, most people survive, so you won't even know if it works.


Using that medication on its own to ctb is highly inadvisable

Thanks. I will take this on board and consider alternatives

 

[Quarky00]

Please do We don't want you hurt, suffering, distressed, or in pain

Btw what led you to wish to ctb? Feel free

 

[Lostnotfound]

In shirt ... had good life close with 2 adult daughters both with issues so were always going to be home birds. Eldest had melt down made horrible allegations against me to police (unproven) caused both them to go to refuge where eldest found sex and youngest found popularity for disability benefits so they kept Harassing me, breaking in, stealing, abuse etc. Caused mental health, isolation, close of business, can't even walk in my home town because of what's been said, stole my dog etc and then told paramedics to let me die when I was admitted for heart issues. Lots more to it than that on but that's the gist of it and they continue to not give a shit about me even though they know they are the reason I'm doing this. One attempt I sent them a suicide note so they had me arrested and put in prison for 2 months then got restraining order so I can't call them when I'm 'ill'for want of a better word. They destroyed me in every capacity you could Imagine.

 

[Mm80]

Pardon me , what the hack is "popular calcium channel blocker" and "This particular med is said" ?

I'll be more than willing to help , but don't send us on a wild goose chase lol

Sorry if came harsh (a bit of a mood here) You are allowed and feel free , be more specific...

Im honestly bit amused. Discussing the detailed pharmacokinetics of specific medication -- without knowing its name

On the ball as always quarky. No need for secrets here. We are all on the same ship lol x

 

[Quarky00]

In shirt ... had good life close with 2 adult daughters both with issues so were always going to be home birds. Eldest had melt down made horrible allegations against me to police (unproven) caused both them to go to refuge where eldest found sex and youngest found popularity for disability benefits so they kept Harassing me, breaking in, stealing, abuse etc. Caused mental health, isolation, close of business, can't even walk in my home town because of what's been said, stole my dog etc and then told paramedics to let me die when I was admitted for heart issues. Lots more to it than that on but that's the gist of it and they continue to not give a shit about me even though they know they are the reason I'm doing this. One attempt I sent them a suicide note so they had me arrested and put in prison for 2 months then got restraining order so I can't call them when I'm 'ill'for want of a better word. They destroyed me in every capacity you could Imagine.

Such a terrible story I guess it's hard to let go of children and keep distance, even when they're abusive and you are jailed (?)
Wow this a real long list of harassment, abuse , shame , crimes , loss of livelihood, etc ...
~

Must add that most ODs are 100mg-500mg while you have 2.5g. I do not know effects, or if doable ..

Another idea that was floated is to add Ramipril. Now it may be contraindicated , I have no idea at all , I'm not knowledgable about that . But from what I recall Amlodipine doesn't have serious contraindications and overall very safe (If true it is a bit weird) .

I'm not taking a position here , but everything about Amlodipine is bit unclear ... If you do find more information feel free to share :)

 

[Lostnotfound]

Such a terrible story I guess it's hard to let go of children and keep distance, even when they're abusive and you are jailed (?)
Wow this a real long list of harassment, abuse , shame , crimes , loss of livelihood, etc ...
~

Must add that most ODs are 100mg-500mg while you have 2.5g. I do not know effects, or if doable ..

Another idea that was floated is to add Ramipril. Now it may be contraindicated , I have no idea at all , I'm not knowledgable about that . But from what I recall Amlodipine doesn't have serious contraindications and overall very safe (If true it is a bit weird) .

I'm not taking a position here , but everything about Amlodipine is bit unclear ... If you do find more information feel free to share :)

Thanks for your help And understanding. Yes it is a horrendous situation and has been and remains torture. We are in the middle of 14 court cases which may see one of us in prison for a long time so I have to protect myself and prove my innocence knowing that may put my daughter in prison for up to 14 years. The simple answer is for us all to drop the cases and seek therapy etc but the court orders do not allow any kind of contact so we can't even discuss it. The list of things that has happened is so long and now across 3 police counties that the police can't even keep up with it.

anyway, the amlodipine. From my knowledge, the drug itself is not a killer its what it does to your body, so the fact it lowers your blood pressure. as I understand it the blood pressure gets so low that it puts you into a hypovalemic shock and that's what kills. All research says that 5-10 times the daily dose is fatal and I think you came across that as well. That would suggest 100mg is fatal. I have a total of around 2500mg. I did find contraindicators of substances which lower blood pressure which of course ramipril does and I have around 1200mg of that. I think the hypovalemic shock should kick in within the 6 hours and that should put me in a coma. Prior to that I hope to sleep through sleeping tablets. I am now really worried that it won't work.

 

[Quarky00]

Shocking . I'd just cancel all lawsuits and runaway . Forget about it and start new . But that's just me and I understand it's hard . I understood you are all alone , and the lawsuits are daughters vs you . Right ?

Calcium Channel Blockers - Amlodipine ; ACE inhibitors - Ramipril ; Fatal or not ?​

1. Lethal Dosage Taken

That would suggest 100mg is fatal

Suggest , that perhaps , it may be fatal .

• So many used 100mg-400mg and survived . That "100mg" is just a number . It's not researched .

All research says that 5-10 times the daily dose is fatal

Not accurate .

• They say it is believed to be . They don't know .
• OD is simply "taken over recommended and causes harm" . It does not mean fatal .
• Other than rats LD50 (indicative and helpful but not reliable) -- this is based on reported admissions to hospital.
• 100mg causes harm but they don't know what dosage is fatal ; presumed to have chances to be fatal.

2. Lethal Dosage -- LD50

This discrepancy.

• "oral toxicity (LD50): 37 mg/kg (mouse)"
• Pfizer
  • "Rat (M) Oral LD50 393 mg/kg
  • Rat (F) Oral LD50 686mg/kg"

• Pfizer seem to be the common formulation .
• If 400mg per kg -- you don't have enough!
• I'm very puzzled by this LD50 , one source saying 37mg/kg , other 390mg/kg , that's X10 times ...
• Any ideas? As mentioned there are several formulations.

3. Documented Fatalities

How many documented amlodipine fatalities are there? Actual cases we can view . Looks like just a few -- 4-5 cases worldwide. That's not enough to reach a conclusion. Review 10 cases gives a picture of how it works. Not just a description of a certain medical process and alleged symptoms -- but actual vitals and outcome.


4. Combinations and Contraindications

I did find contraindicators of substances which lower blood pressure which of course ramipril does

Again there might be a misunderstanding here .

1. Contraindications are "may not be beneficial" through "could be harmful" and in rare cases only "fatal".
2. In fact Ramipril/Amlodipine combo is used to treat patients. These are of course small dosages of 10mg+10mg , and we talk about X100 stronger. But it's not contraindicated per se. Obviously working together this might (not should- we don't know) increase the chances of hypovalemic shock. But we don't know.
3. The indications are mild . Link :

Applies to: amlodipine and ramipril
Calcium channel blockers and angiotensin converting enzyme (ACE) inhibitors may have additive hypotensive effects. While these drugs are often safely used together, careful monitoring of the systemic blood pressure is recommended during coadministration, especially during the first one to three weeks of therapy.

So that assumption that it is fatal together does not rise up to expectations ...

Benefits of Fixed Dose Combination of Ramipril/Amlodipine in Hypertensive Diabetic Patients: A Subgroup Analysis of RAMONA Trial

Combination of angiotensin-converting enzyme inhibitors and calcium channel blockers has been successfully used in the antihypertensive therapy for many years. Fixed dose combinations of ramipril/amlodipine have a benefit effect for patients to achieve ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

5. Cause and Process of Death

Now for hypovalemic shock . IT TAKES TIME .

People with hypovolemic shock have severe hypovolemia with decreased peripheral perfusion. If left untreated, these patients can develop ischemic injury of vital organs, leading to multi-system organ failure.

1. I understand this could be very quick , or last hours . And that you plan on using a lot of sleeping pills ? If this thing lasts 20h you need special long lasting benzo (Vallium etc) .
2. Cases of hypovalemic shock are due to blood loss or fluid loss (your common injury). It's simply bleeding.. This is obviously not the case with Amlodipine. The mechanism would be different. Just like SN is not the ordinary 'oxygen deprivation' -- but a form of anemia.
3. All reports of fatalities and recoveries suggest pulmonary edema. That is the cause of death. That is a condition we need to explore.

6. Other Combos , Resource on Site

It have been mentioned that several combos are lethal . But these are certain medications , and not all channel blockers etc . Some resources here (haven't checked them thoroughly) .

Try using verapamil if you can't get digoxin. Where I live it's way easier to get. Not sure about where you live. Digoxin lowers the heart rate but so does verapamil. It's a calcium channel blocker. A calcium channel blocker and a beta blocker like Propranolol are a dangerous combination in lowering blood pressure quickly to a fatal level.

There's research there . Appears reliable . Verapamil has been banned in several places -- Amlodipine is not .

These are all combos with the beta-blocker propranolol, which is known to be fatal on its own. All resources speak of Amlopidine + Proplanolol being fatal , not just any meds.

 

[faust]

Dunno if lostallhope is any good for things like this? I usually look on Wikipedia to see what overdosing etc can do and the mortality rate. Sometimes just Googling 'overdosing on XYZ' yeilds enough info.

We live in such a pro-choice world where wikipedia and google helps us to die peacefully!