Venting Religious prolifers are the worst.

[Baskol1]

I think the religious prolifers and anti suicide crowd are the worst. Especially their platitudes are the worst. Like Jesus loves, you and if you pray to jesus you will not be depressed or suicidal anymore. You dont need therapy, just jesus. They do not offer any help, but will you criticize harshly if you are depressed. Especially if they know youre atheist, then they say you would not be depressed if you only acept jesus as your savior. Most religious fundamentalists are extremely judgmental too. And they blieve were only unhappy because of demons.

 

[marcusuk63]

Amen to that

 

[Baskol1]

Amen to that

Even worse are people who believe in faith healing.

 

[marcusuk63]

Even worse are people who believe in faith healing.

Humans are so gullible and easily brainwashed

 

[littlelady774]

I remember my first attempt. My brother was trying to convince us it was the evil spirits possessing me.
I had to tell him nope. It was all me.

 

[Baskol1]

I remember my first attempt. My brother was trying to convince us it was the evil spirits possessing me.
I had to tell him nope. It was all me.

According to christians you will end up in hell if you kill yourself. But why would god punish us twice? Is he sadistic?

 

[littlelady774]

According to christians you will end up in hell if you kill yourself. But why would god punish us twice? Is he sadistic?

I really hope there's no afterlife. I just want nothing

 

[Baskol1]

I really hope there's no afterlife. I just want nothing

As i said if god really throws people in hell for eternity he cant be good. Why? Well he created a world full of suffering, and then an afterlife full of suffering. If this would be a human, he would be considered a sadistic sociopath.

 

[Empty Smile]

I been drinking, so I'm gonna keep quiet on this religious bullshit...

*Cough* There is no hell, or god. *Cough*

 

[Baskol1]

And there are many sociopaths in real life who use religion to further their twisted agenda. I would go as far as to say religion was invented by sociopaths to control the populace.

 

[Lookingforabus]

According to christians you will end up in hell if you kill yourself. But why would god punish us twice? Is he sadistic?

Depends on the Christian, especially these days, because that's not anywhere in the Bible, and comes from one of the Roman emperors who wanted to distance official Christianity from ... what was essentially a death cult in the earlier days.

 

[Baskol1]

Depends on the Christian, especially these days, because that's not anywhere in the Bible, and comes from one of the Roman emperors who wanted to distance official Christianity from ... what was essentially a death cult in the earlier days.

Of course i mean the version who was used by the ruling class. Its obvoious why this version says you should obey your masters, be docile, and never kill yourself.

 

[calendulo]

I do not see any relationship between Christ and suicide, but it is obvious that depends on the point of view of each one.
My point is that Christ does not be care what you had done about your life while you do not hurt anyone else.

Guess bible is as weird old story and that's why I do not read it. Christ has a lot of advantages, he can be the first comunist ...... or he can be any sort of saviour ........or a old fashioned hippy or.....whatever.

 

[Nem]

Not sure why but the ones that claim to be Christian seem to be the ones that are most hypocritical. Like, they make God out to be a tyrant or something similar and try to ram a bible up ones ass.
Peace/hugs

 

[seekingoblivion]

Depends on the Christian, especially these days, because that's not anywhere in the Bible, and comes from one of the Roman emperors who wanted to distance official Christianity from ... what was essentially a death cult in the earlier days.

A number I've heard from take "thou shalt not kill" to extend to suicide.

 

[Lookingforabus]

A number I've heard from take "thou shalt not kill" to extend to suicide.

Which, in fact was the original justification, but there are two problems with that:

1) It's "Thou shalt not murder." The word choice is very deliberate and distinct in Hebrew, and "thou shalt not kill" is a deliberate mistranslation by a hypocritical English king (king James, as in the King James Version of the Bible), who didn't see any issue with sending men off to kill and die for him, or executing people for petty crimes and criticisms.

2) Even if suicide is a sin, that doesn't make it a one way ticket to hell under any reading of the Bible. Murderers can be forgiven and get into heaven, according to the Bible and Christian doctrine after all.

Not that I'm a Christian or espousing that point of view, but any Christian who tells you that suicide is a mortal sin doesn't know their Bible all that well, or is pushing a different, more judgemental point of view.

 

[Shamana]

Not sure why but the ones that claim to be Christian seem to be the ones that are most hypocritical. Like, they make God out to be a tyrant or something similar and try to ram a bible up ones ass.
Peace/hugs

In the Old Testament God is a tyrant. Moses walks down from the mountain with a set of commandments not to kill. Then he sees people worshipping the golden calf and he proceeds to murder hundreds women and children.

 

[marcusuk63]

In the Old Testament God is a tyrant. Moses walks down from the mountain with a set of commandments not to kill. Then he sees people worshipping the golden calf and he proceeds to murder hundreds women and children.

Is that the Directors cut ?

 

[seekingoblivion]

Which, in fact was the original justification, but there are two problems with that:

1) It's "Thou shalt not murder." The word choice is very deliberate and distinct in Hebrew, and "thou shalt not kill" is a deliberate mistranslation by a hypocritical English king (king James, as in the King James Version of the Bible), who didn't see any issue with sending men off to kill and die for him, or executing people for petty crimes and criticisms.

2) Even if suicide is a sin, that doesn't make it a one way ticket to hell under any reading of the Bible. Murderers can be forgiven and get into heaven, according to the Bible and Christian doctrine after all.

Not that I'm a Christian or espousing that point of view, but any Christian who tells you that suicide is a mortal sin doesn't know their Bible all that well, or is pushing a different, more judgemental point of view.

Interesting. I'm gonna have to look into the 1st point up there. And with regards to the 2nd people might reason that if the last thing you do is kill yourself then you have no chance of being forgiven cause you will not have asked for it after the "sin". Apparently there was a discussion at my dad's church after a young lady in the choir killed herself. Someone even brought up the scenario of someone having taken poison and then asking for forgiveness before they die should the poison not kill them immediately. He didn't tell me whether they came to any conclusion or not though. I haven't read a bible in a long long time (for obvious reasons) and I wouldn't even remember what conditions need be met for forgiveness to occur beyond the standard faith and being a good boy.

 

[Baskol1]

Interesting. I'm gonna have to look into the 1st point up there. And with regards to the 2nd people might reason that if the last thing you do is kill yourself then you have no chance of being forgiven cause you will not have asked for it after the "sin". Apparently there was a discussion at my dad's church after a young lady in the choir killed herself. Someone even brought up the scenario of someone having taken poison and then asking for forgiveness before they die should the poison not kill them immediately. He didn't tell me whether they came to any conclusion or not though. I haven't read a bible in a long long time (for obvious reasons) and I wouldn't even remember what conditions need be met for forgiveness to occur beyond the standard faith and being a good boy.

I dont think suicide is actually a sin according to the bible. But who cares? God ist not real anyway.

 

[bluesky1972-2019]

I think the religious prolifers and anti suicide crowd are the worst. Especially their platitudes are the worst. Like Jesus loves, you and if you pray to jesus you will not be depressed or suicidal anymore. You dont need therapy, just jesus. They do not offer any help, but will you criticize harshly if you are depressed. Especially if they know youre atheist, then they say you would not be depressed if you only acept jesus as your savior. Most religious fundamentalists are extremely judgmental too. And they blieve were only unhappy because of demons.

I hate to say this to the Jesus prolifers but.....Jesus was Jewish and even the Jewish people do not think he was the son of god. Just a good Jewish boy. Sort of shoots down the Christian belief really.

 

[Lookingforabus]

And with regards to the 2nd people might reason that if the last thing you do is kill yourself then you have no chance of being forgiven cause you will not have asked for it after the "sin".

Not Biblical, and nonsensical too. Logically, that would mean anyone who died having sinned after their last prayer would be hellbound as well, which is probably everyone. Think about it for a second. Does that mean someone who dies of a heart attack while having sex with someone other than his/her spouse is also going to hell? What about someone who tells a white lie or spreads gossip about someone else and then drops dead? Or someone who dies a violent death and whose last words are along the lines of "God damnit!" (using the Lord's name in vain)?

The ancient Jews death with that by performing "yearly" (probably actually monthly, based on lunar cycles - they were nomadic and don't have access to solar calendars) rituals including animal sacrifices and putting the sins of the community onto a goat, which they then banished into the desert (this is the origin of the term "scapegoat", incidentally). The Catholics have last rites and prayers for the deceased, and I think Eastern Orthodox Christians do something similar. Christian denominations that come from Protestantism, which is basically all the rest, note that being completely free of sin is not a Biblical requirement for salvation, and in fact, the Bible seems to indicate otherwise - "all have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God", the only thing required for salvation is an acceptance of Jesus (think that comes from the story of Jesus' crucification along side two other criminals). In fact, this was one of the top reasons for the Protestant Reformation - the Catholic Church fleecing folks by selling "indulgences" and last rites and post-death prayers to fast-track folks into heaven, despite none of that being remotely Biblical. In fact, 8 suicides are mentioned in the Bible, 3 of which are viewed at least somewhat positively, and 5 of which are related factually with no apparent value judgement whatsoever. None of the suicides in the Bible are condemned. If anything, that suggests the Bible says suicide can be a moral decision.

Of course, it's hard to ignore the usefulness of "suicide sends you to hell" as a money-making tool in the old days, and a social control method or a suicide prevention method among the religious these days, so that seems like the only reasonable explanation for the perpetuation of that particular point of view among Judeo-Christianity.

 

[Maravillosa]

As i said if god really throws people in hell for eternity he cant be good. Why? Well he created a world full of suffering, and then an afterlife full of suffering. If this would be a human, he would be considered a sadistic sociopath.

I think that the standard Christian response to this comment would be that God created people with free will. He allows people to suffer but did not make the suffering -- the first humans who sinned are the ultimate cause of suffering. People throw themselves into Hell, not God: God merely allows it. I tend to doubt the free will hypothesis (and would like to believe that Hell will be empty). I think that God is more unable than unwilling to help.

Of course, I am a practicing Catholic who opposes abortion, war, and the death penalty -- pro-life in most aspects. However, I do think that adults without obligations to others (e.g., parents, spouse, children) should be free to ctb without fear of damning themselves eternally. I have not ctb yet because I do not want to devastate my poor mother and because I want to have at least one of my novels published before I die. But after Mom is dead and my novel is published, then I would feel free to go.

 

[TAW122]

I have to agree since the people who I've come across (usually very religious - some of which are fundamentalists while others are more level-headed and moderate, but still reeks a strong anti-suicide stance) are strongly opposed to suicide and would be the type to intervene and/or get others to intervene (ie alerting law enforcement and/or mental health professionals to act). Also their platitudes and sentiments are the worst indeed. It is not only illogical but also anti-freedom and anti-free will. Since religion doesn't have the authority it used to like many centuries ago, the government now holds the power and oftenly they use the line about 'mental illness' and that suicide is 'irrational', which most of us knows it's bullshit. Not all suicides are a result of mental illness nor irrational nor are all of them impulsive. I also hate the fact that they just beat you down with experience and overtalking you. There is almost no point to engage in arguing with them, let alone arguing about death and suicide (might even be very dangerous because they can get authorities to use forced intervention against you and your will, threatening your freedom in the name of health and public safety).

It's one of the most fucked up things in society, suicidal people are treated like criminals even though they (most of the time) didn't break the law or do anything wrong other than wanting to 'die' and yet they are forced against their will, locked up against will, and often treated poorly (like a criminal - but at least a criminal has the right to a lawyer and/or other civil rights while waiting to post bail and/or trial).

 

[lifeisbutadream]

There is nothing against suicide in either the Old or New Testaments, nor in Hindu, Buddhism, Shinto, etc. I don't know if there are any religions that condemn suicide. Men make those laws not God.

 

[TAW122]

@lifeisbutadream Indeed, that is the same view I hold as well, especially for Christianity. Being someone who has read the Bible and attended church (I'm an atheist btw), I can safely assert that there is NOWHERE in the Bible that explicitly states suicide to be a sin. In fact, it is neutral at best and there are instances of indirect suicides (as well as intentional suicides) in the Bible and the people who did that did not go to Hell. In fact, if any did go to Hell, they were for non-CTB reasons. Additionally, I believe it was the Roman Catholic Church back in the Middle Ages that forbid suicide and in which still carries to this day. The RCC did not want to lose their followers so they decreed it a sin to suicide and invented the idea of going to Hell for suicide to scare the masses into living.

 

[HGL91]

I went to Home Depot recently and saw women of The Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints (FLDS). Their hair and long dresses made them look like they were from the 1800s. For those who don't know, they are Mormons that practice polygamy, so those were all wives to one man.

 

[riverstyx]

People have a right to their opinions, but not the right to tell others what to do.

 

[Baskol1]

According to the bible christian serial killers can go to heaven and their atheist victims go to hell.