Quick backstory.

[sh142312]

Hello all. First post here. I've been a member about a month? Maybe more? Time has blurred much recently. but haven't had the courage to do CTB.

Not because I feel any differently.

But because, when the moment came and I was saying my goodbyes (not actual goodbyes but just telling everyone I loved them) I couldn't put my daughter through it.

Less than a year ago, my brother overdosed and passed. His face at the funeral still haunts me.

I myself have a father who CTB on my birthday some years ago.

I know how that felt. The guilt. Wondering what I could have done differently. The neverending cycle of pain, even to this day obviously.

To put my own child through that, daughter of 10 who's just going through the phase where she thinks she's older than she is but still sweet and loves her dad.

I know, that a father who feels the way I do and who doesn't want to be here is worthless to her.

I know it would be better off happening now while she is young than later while she is older, like I was when it happened. And of course, it would never happen on her birthday.

But of everyone I knew I would hurt, it was her face in my mind in those final moments that stopped me. Even with a goodbye letter some part of her forever would think it was her fault and I can't bear that.


Do I live, then, until natural causes take me? Do I consign myself to an existence unwillingly, for the sake of a daughter when it may not even be the best decision?

IS it the best decision?

Ultimately I think I would suffer this way the rest of my life for her if I honestly thought it would result in the best outcome for her life.

But for me to suffer this way needlessly, and end up rubbing my own mental issues onto her over the years as she grows, and end up doing more harm than good - that would be the absolute worst outcome imo.


Id love to hear any opinions, others who could relate or advice on the topic.

I'm sorry if I broke any rules here.. I'm not.100% familiar with them yet. Thank you all and appreciate the long read.
Commenting just to add: I think this site is amazing. Whether or not I decide to actually CTB in the long run, it's brilliant that I have an outlet where I can speak my mind, truthfully (and to others who can relate) without fear of being put on a list and treated with the taboo and stereotype that has been associated with feeling this way.

 

[Dot]

Membrs cnnt tll u or advse u whthr or nt u 'shld' ctb bt cn listn & spport u whle sharng thr own insghts abt ur stuatn

 

[sh142312]

Membrs cnnt tll u or advse u whthr or nt u 'shld' ctb bt cn listn & spport u whle sharng thr own insghts abt ur stuatn

Understood - probably didn't word that the best. I was just looking for similar situations/relating opinions etc. ultimately, and no matter what anyone says, the decision will always be my own. Thank you.

Membrs cnnt tll u or advse u whthr or nt u 'shld' ctb bt cn listn & spport u whle sharng thr own insghts abt ur stuatn

I can't figure out how to edit anything but the title or I would go back and change my wording. I'll post another comment clarifying.

Hello all. First post here. I've been a member about a month? Maybe more? Time has blurred much recently. but haven't had the courage to do CTB.

Not because I feel any differently.

But because, when the moment came and I was saying my goodbyes (not actual goodbyes but just telling everyone I loved them) I couldn't put my daughter through it.

Less than a year ago, my brother overdosed and passed. His face at the funeral still haunts me.

I myself have a father who CTB on my birthday some years ago.

I know how that felt. The guilt. Wondering what I could have done differently. The neverending cycle of pain, even to this day obviously.

To put my own child through that, daughter of 10 who's just going through the phase where she thinks she's older than she is but still sweet and loves her dad.

I know, that a father who feels the way I do and who doesn't want to be here is worthless to her.

I know it would be better off happening now while she is young than later while she is older, like I was when it happened. And of course, it would never happen on her birthday.

But of everyone I knew I would hurt, it was her face in my mind in those final moments that stopped me. Even with a goodbye letter some part of her forever would think it was her fault and I can't bear that.


Do I live, then, until natural causes take me? Do I consign myself to an existence unwillingly, for the sake of a daughter when it may not even be the best decision?

IS it the best decision?

Ultimately I think I would suffer this way the rest of my life for her if I honestly thought it would result in the best outcome for her life.

But for me to suffer this way needlessly, and end up rubbing my own mental issues onto her over the years as she grows, and end up doing more harm than good - that would be the absolute worst outcome imo.


Id love to hear any opinions, others who could relate or advice on the topic.

I'm sorry if I broke any rules here.. I'm not.100% familiar with them yet. Thank you all and appreciate the long read.
Commenting just to add: I think this site is amazing. Whether or not I decide to actually CTB in the long run, it's brilliant that I have an outlet where I can speak my mind, truthfully (and to others who can relate) without fear of being put on a list and treated with the taboo and stereotype that has been associated with feeling this way.

Commenting again to clarify that I'm not looking for anyone to tell me whether or not I should CTB, or should do anything actually.

This was just me posting my struggles and wondering if anyone related or has maybe a different viewpoint I hadn't considered, etc. hope this clears that up.

 

[Dot]

I know, that a father who feels the way I do and who doesn't want to be here is worthless to her.

Wht mkes u thnk tht u r wrthlss

& in wht wy d/ u thnk ur mentl hlth issus r harmng hr atm

I know it would be better off happening now while she is young than later while she is older, like I was when it happened. And of course, it would never happen on her birthday.

Slf wll jst sy

Slf undrstnd Y u wn2 leav & am srry fr evrythng tht u hve gne thru - n.e1 wth ur xperncs wld b 4rgivn fr feelng hw u r

Hwevr wth rgards t/ ur dghtr -- u cld b givng hr mch mre thn u realse

& losng fathr @ 10 yrs old & rght b4 teenge uncertnty wll defntly affct hr

Thn thre = questn of wh/ tkes ur plce if u ctb - slf persnlly knw ppl wh/ wre sexlly abusd b/ stp-fathrs aftr thr bio fathr passd awy & thre wll b mny of thse on th/ frum also

 

[sh142312]

Wht mkes u thnk tht u r wrthlss

& in wht wy d/ u thnk ur mentl hlth issus r harmng hr atm



Slf wll jst sy

Slf undrstnd Y u wn2 leav & am srry fr evrythng tht u hve gne thru - n.e1 wth ur xperncs wld b 4rgivn fr feelng hw u r

Hwevr wth rgards t/ ur dghtr -- u cld b givng hr mch mre thn u realse

& losng fathr @ 10 yrs old & rght b4 teenge uncertnty wll defntly affct hr

Thn thre = questn of wh/ tkes ur plce if u ctb - slf persnlly knw ppl wh/ wre sexlly abusd b/ stp-fathrs aftr thr bio fathr passd awy & thre wll b mny of thse on th/ frum also

I don't know how to reply individually to parts of comments but I will list in order:

1 and 2) I don't think I'm worthless entirely but just meant that I may be doing more harm than good. I know firsthand how my mental health issues could affect her. I've seen it already both from my father towards me, and already in me towards her. She is already showing some of my anxious and depressive tendencies despite being only 10 years old. And when she was younger, she took much more after her mother in both thought process and personality.

Nature versus nurture I know but this only gets worse as she gets older. It was that way with me, the more time I spent with my father although I loved him dearly the more I started to think like him. I was once an extremely happy, musically talented (could have gotten record label deals potentially), young man with good grades, intelligence and a bright future. Maybe it was entirely genetics and I would have turned out this way regardless? But my realistic mind tends to think that is unlikely.

3) that is of course horrible. Another thing I experienced as a child from two different people, and yes in fact because my mother at the time was raising me alone because the first instance was from a babysitter's son.

I feel horrible for anyone who has gone through this and of course I worry about this, even as I live and breathe because her mother and I are separated as well and I only see her on my time - though our coparenting relationship is far from the worst I've seen.

Do you mind if I ask what slf means? If it's something that should be obvious I'm sorry.

 

[Linda]

Hello all. First post here. I've been a member about a month? Maybe more? Time has blurred much recently. but haven't had the courage to do CTB.

Not because I feel any differently.

But because, when the moment came and I was saying my goodbyes (not actual goodbyes but just telling everyone I loved them) I couldn't put my daughter through it.

Less than a year ago, my brother overdosed and passed. His face at the funeral still haunts me.

I myself have a father who CTB on my birthday some years ago.

I know how that felt. The guilt. Wondering what I could have done differently. The neverending cycle of pain, even to this day obviously.

To put my own child through that, daughter of 10 who's just going through the phase where she thinks she's older than she is but still sweet and loves her dad.

I know, that a father who feels the way I do and who doesn't want to be here is worthless to her.

I know it would be better off happening now while she is young than later while she is older, like I was when it happened. And of course, it would never happen on her birthday.

But of everyone I knew I would hurt, it was her face in my mind in those final moments that stopped me. Even with a goodbye letter some part of her forever would think it was her fault and I can't bear that.


Do I live, then, until natural causes take me? Do I consign myself to an existence unwillingly, for the sake of a daughter when it may not even be the best decision?

IS it the best decision?

Ultimately I think I would suffer this way the rest of my life for her if I honestly thought it would result in the best outcome for her life.

But for me to suffer this way needlessly, and end up rubbing my own mental issues onto her over the years as she grows, and end up doing more harm than good - that would be the absolute worst outcome imo.


Id love to hear any opinions, others who could relate or advice on the topic.

I'm sorry if I broke any rules here.. I'm not.100% familiar with them yet. Thank you all and appreciate the long read.
Commenting just to add: I think this site is amazing. Whether or not I decide to actually CTB in the long run, it's brilliant that I have an outlet where I can speak my mind, truthfully (and to others who can relate) without fear of being put on a list and treated with the taboo and stereotype that has been associated with feeling this way.

Has it occurred to you that if you can find a way to fix your problems, you would also be helping your daughter fix hers, because it sounds as though she may well face the same problems later in life.
The first thing you would need to find out is whether all the family history of suicide is coming directly from something genetic (i.e. from some gene(s) directly affecting your brain) or from something in your family environment. (DNA might play a part in the latter, but not via a direct effect on your brain.)
Looking into those kinds of things is a job for a professional. I can't advise you, and I don't think there will be many people here who can.

 

[Dot]

I don't know how to reply individually to parts of comments but I will list in order:

Jst clck cursr t/ tht plce in txt & prss Nter

1 and 2) I don't think I'm worthless entirely but just meant that I may be doing more harm than good. I know firsthand how my mental health issues could affect her. I've seen it already both from my father towards me, and already in me towards her. She is already showing some of my anxious and depressive tendencies despite being only 10 years old. And when she was younger, she took much more after her mother in both thought process and personality.

Nature versus nurture I know but this only gets worse as she gets older. It was that way with me, the more time I spent with my father although I loved him dearly the more I started to think like him. I was once an extremely happy, musically talented (could have gotten record label deals potentially), young man with good grades, intelligence and a bright future. Maybe it was entirely genetics and I would have turned out this way regardless? But my realistic mind tends to think that is unlikely.

Th/ fct tht u r nt wth hr all th/ tme cld b a postve in tht rgard -- u hve mre hed-spce in betwn vists rdy fr th/ nxt 1

C/ u tke angr out on hr or n.ethng lke tht

3) that is of course horrible. Another thing I experienced as a child from two different people, and yes in fact because my mother at the time was raising me alone because the first instance was from a babysitter's son.

I feel horrible for anyone who has gone through this and of course I worry about this, even as I live and breathe because her mother and I are separated as well and I only see her on my time - though our coparenting relationship is far from the worst I've seen.

Xactly - membrs hve thr own opinns bt persnlly slf thnk if u r abl t/ sty arnd fr hr as lng as u cn thn = wld prbbly benft hr mre

Thre r mre protectve factrs of u stayng arnd thn if u ctb frm wht u hve dscribd

Do you mind if I ask what slf means? If it's something that should be obvious I'm sorry.

Own 1st-persn refrnce- am trappd in langug whch distncs slf frm identty etc

 

[sh142312]

Has it occurred to you that if you can find a way to fix your problems, you would also be helping your daughter fix hers, because it sounds as though she may well face the same problems later in life.
The first thing you would need to find out is whether all the family history of suicide is coming directly from something genetic (i.e. from some gene(s) directly affecting your brain) or from something in your family environment. (DNA might play a part in the latter, but not via a direct effect on your brain.)
Looking into those kinds of things is a job for a professional. I can't advise you, and I don't think there will be many people here who can.

Thanks for the response. I'm no way do I mean to sound rude, but of course that has occured to me. That's been the driving factor in why I've still been pushing forward (until lately when I finally felt like taking action).

I guess I should have clarified that life has been a constant struggle for me for the past 10 years or so, one knockdown after another, pushing through it to be "stable" again, only to wait for the next knockdown.

Some may say "that's life" and if so I can't imagine why anyone would want it.

Perhaps those people would mistake the "stable" periods for periods of happiness. Ups and downs with downs being sad and tough but ups being happy and enjoyable, maybe that I could get behind. I don't know. It's been so long since I was happy I couldn't tell you.

Per your question about professional help and whether it was attempted - my father fought hard, for years, possibly much longer than I have. It was only in hindsight and with the benefit of personal experience that I understood his struggle.

But he did search for help. Several doctors, psychiatrists, medications, periods of seeming success, and then (again only recognized this in hindsight) he was just resigned. For a period of time there was a resigned existence until there was a knock on my door at 10pm on my birthday one night. I mistook this period for another low. Whatever help he searched for/found, it didn't help.

Personally, yes, I have been to counselling/therapy/rehab/psychiatrist myself. Medicated and unmedicated. Self-help, anything anyone has ever suggested that made the slightest bit of sense.

It's almost just like a void in my soul at this point, if I believe in a soul.

 

[Linda]

Thanks for the response. I'm no way do I mean to sound rude, but of course that has occured to me. That's been the driving factor in why I've still been pushing forward (until lately when I finally felt like taking action).

I guess I should have clarified that life has been a constant struggle for me for the past 10 years or so, one knockdown after another, pushing through it to be "stable" again, only to wait for the next knockdown.

Some may say "that's life" and if so I can't imagine why anyone would want it.

Perhaps those people would mistake the "stable" periods for periods of happiness. Ups and downs with downs being sad and tough but ups being happy and enjoyable, maybe that I could get behind. I don't know. It's been so long since I was happy I couldn't tell you.

Per your question about professional help and whether it was attempted - my father fought hard, for years, possibly much longer than I have. It was only in hindsight and with the benefit of personal experience that I understood his struggle.

But he did search for help. Several doctors, psychiatrists, medications, periods of seeming success, and then (again only recognized this in hindsight) he was just resigned. For a period of time there was a resigned existence until there was a knock on my door at 10pm on my birthday one night. I mistook this period for another low. Whatever help he searched for/found, it didn't help.

Personally, yes, I have been to counselling/therapy/rehab/psychiatrist myself. Medicated and unmedicated. Self-help, anything anyone has ever suggested that made the slightest bit of sense.

It's almost just like a void in my soul at this point, if I believe in a soul.

Yes, I understand. You don't sound rude at all.
But there must be some reason why so many in your family have died by suicide, or are likely to do so in the future. There might be a way to get your DNA tested to see whether you have any of the genes that make suicide more likely. There is research going on in this area. I'm not familliar with most of it, but here is one such paper published recently:

Largest-Ever Genetic Study of Suicide Finds New Risk Factors

A new study has identified 12 DNA variants, or variations in the human genetic code, that are associated with risk of attempting suicide.

healthcare.utah.edu

If you are unlucky enough to carry several such genes, that might explain a lot.

Whatever you decide to do, I wish you well.

 

[sh142312]

Yes, I understand. You don't sound rude at all.
But there must be some reason why so many in your family have died by suicide, or are likely to do so in the future. There might be a way to get your DNA tested to see whether you have any of the genes that make suicide more likely. There is research going on in this area. I'm not familliar with most of it, but here is one such paper published recently:

Largest-Ever Genetic Study of Suicide Finds New Risk Factors

A new study has identified 12 DNA variants, or variations in the human genetic code, that are associated with risk of attempting suicide.

healthcare.utah.edu

If you are unlucky enough to carry several such genes, that might explain a lot.

Whatever you decide to do, I wish you well.

Thank you again for clarifying what you meant and for the source. There might be something there.

But there has only been myself and my father so far who considered CTB and my father alone who took action.


My brother, as mentioned in the post but could have been misinterpreted, overdosed by accident. He was troubled but not suicidal.

There isn't a large amount of family that have chosen this route as far as I know.

Just myself (had a date set and now further back but still considering) and my father.

I wish you all the best as well.

Yes, I understand. You don't sound rude at all.
But there must be some reason why so many in your family have died by suicide, or are likely to do so in the future. There might be a way to get your DNA tested to see whether you have any of the genes that make suicide more likely. There is research going on in this area. I'm not familliar with most of it, but here is one such paper published recently:

Largest-Ever Genetic Study of Suicide Finds New Risk Factors

A new study has identified 12 DNA variants, or variations in the human genetic code, that are associated with risk of attempting suicide.

healthcare.utah.edu

If you are unlucky enough to carry several such genes, that might explain a lot.

Whatever you decide to do, I wish you well.

I quickly skimmed the article but doesn't it seem to you that- though the author him/herself doesn't display the usual stigmatic disposition towards suicide - it does highlight the helplessness of the scientific community in regards to mental health stigma and associated results? Science has always progressed so fast. Planes flew 100 years before man thought they would. Cars ran on electricity decades prior to predictions. Flying cars EXIST.


And the brain is understood on a chemical level yet suicide is still considered to be "weak".

That pisses me off.

Maybe this comment should be another thread but your response and article prompted the thoughts so apologies if so.

Perhaps this isn't the fault of the scientific community but community as a whole.

Judgemental people left behind or onlooking.

As for your article, I counted 4 of the symptoms displayed in the prefix.

 

[Linda]

Thank you again for clarifying what you meant and for the source. There might be something there.

But there has only been myself and my father so far who considered CTB and my father alone who took action.


My brother, as mentioned in the post but could have been misinterpreted, overdosed by accident. He was troubled but not suicidal.

There isn't a large amount of family that have chosen this route as far as I know.

Just myself (had a date set and now further back but still considering) and my father.

I wish you all the best as well.

I quickly skimmed the article but doesn't it seem to you that- though the author him/herself doesn't display the usual stigmatic disposition towards suicide - it does highlight the helplessness of the scientific community in regards to mental health stigma and associated results? Science has always progressed so fast. Planes flew 100 years before man thought they would. Cars ran on electricity decades prior to predictions. Flying cars EXIST.


And the brain is understood on a chemical level yet suicide is still considered to be "weak".

That pisses me off.

Maybe this comment should be another thread but your response and article prompted the thoughts so apologies if so.

Perhaps this isn't the fault of the scientific community but community as a whole.

Judgemental people left behind or onlooking.

As for your article, I counted 4 of the symptoms displayed in the prefix.

The science of understanding the brain is still in its infancy. Trying to understand how mental states, such as depression, are linked to what is actually happening in the neurons (and other bits) of the brain has proven to be very difficult. We have more understanding than we did when I was a child, but it's still nowhere near enough to produce effective treatments for most conditions. But progress is being made, even if it's slow.

 

[sh142312]

The science of understanding the brain is still in its infancy. Trying to understand how mental states, such as depression, are linked to what is actually happening in the neurons (and other bits) of the brain has proven to be very difficult. We have more understanding than we did when I was a child, but it's still nowhere near enough to produce effective treatments for most conditions. But progress is being made, even if it's slow.

I'll grant you this, and also that the flying cars analogy was bad as science wasn't ahead of that one predictively (except by maybe 5 years).

But my point however poorly made was that stereotypes and community norms and stigmas persist long after science debunks or proves/disproves anything.

People are so jaded, so quick to judge - even Christians who are told in their scripture not to in one of the most famous lines..

How many hundreds, thousands, 100ks, millions, tens of.millions or more have to die before people start to see this as a real problem and not just "a sign of weakness"?

I'm the strongest person I know for being alive right now.

I'm sure many of those on this forum feel the same way and there are probably those who's strength of will would pale mine by comparison.

But when it's finally too much we are called weak by the world.

Except of course those specific family members who experience it and honestly even sometimes they are the guiltiest "judges".