A

Arak

Enlightened
Sep 21, 2018
1,176
Domperidone versus metoclopramide. Nitschke claims (at least for N) that domperidone is accetable. For me, even 5 mg meto is a bit harsh. Domperidone feels weak.

Is that 20 mg of domperidone really effective to prevent vomiting ?
 
  • Like
Reactions: Dartz, lv-gras, Deafsn0w and 3 others
L

Lifeisatrap

Arcanist
Oct 5, 2018
408
Can't get a hold of neither but if I could I would choose domperidone. Meto sounds stronger and more risky from what I've read.
 
  • Like
Reactions: lv-gras, Deafsn0w and RaphtaliaTwoAnimals
D

dartanian

Member
Aug 19, 2018
64
Can't get a hold of neither but if I could I would choose domperidone. Meto sounds stronger and more risky from what I've read.
why risky?
 
  • Like
Reactions: lv-gras, Lizzie S., Deafsn0w and 1 other person
L

Lifeisatrap

Arcanist
Oct 5, 2018
408
why risky?
Can cause muscle spasms, involuntary twitching, stiffness... I forgot what the disorder it may lead to is called, my memory is trash. I just remember reading about some unpleasant possible side effects which made me weary of it. Of course this won't be the case for everyone.
 
  • Like
Reactions: lv-gras, Strumgewehr, Deafsn0w and 1 other person
hikikomori

hikikomori

Attention whore and regular whore
Oct 23, 2018
209
also if ppl know can i use it for SN 2?
 
  • Like
Reactions: Dartz, lv-gras, Deafsn0w and 2 others
A

Arak

Enlightened
Sep 21, 2018
1,176
The last couple of posts drift away from the question. Maybe anyone is in contact with Nitschke ? I guess anyone could send him a tweet (twitter)... It would be such a waste to throw up N after taking domperidone. I just react very strongly to 5 mg, I wouldn't want to take much higher doses. Ultra sensitive.

Liking this post won't help me a bit ... please don't.
 
  • Like
Reactions: RaphtaliaTwoAnimals, Fcancer and Deafsn0w
Threads

Threads

Warlock
Jul 13, 2018
721
I have a background in pharmacology. I can answer this question for you.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1810356

Dopamine antagonists are effective anti-emetics. Domperidone does not readily cross the blood-brain barrier and is less likely to cause central nervous system side-effects than metoclopramide. However, a direct comparison of the safety and efficacy of the two drugs has not hitherto been made. Ninety-five patients, with symptoms of nausea and vomiting due to a variety of oesophageal or gastric disorders, were recruited into a randomised, double-blind, three-part, parallel-group comparative study of controlled release metoclopramide 15 mg (Gastrobid Continus tablets, Napp Laboratories) given twice daily, and domperidone 10 mg or 20 mg given three times daily. Assessments for nausea, vomiting, reflux symptoms and adverse events were made on entry to the study. Patients were randomly allocated to one of the three treatment regimes for a period of seven days, throughout which daily symptomatology and use of escape medication were recorded on a diary card. At the end of the treatment period, nausea, vomiting and reflux symptoms, adverse events and a global assessment of patients' symptom control were recorded by the investigator. Both controlled release metoclopramide and high and low dose domperidone significantly reduced symptoms of belching, flatulence, distension, heartburn, regurgitation, reflux, nausea and vomiting compared to baseline. There were no significant differences between the three treatments in efficacy or in the number and severity of side-effects.

https://www.hon.ch/OESO/books/Vol_3_Eso_Mucosa/Articles/ART097.HTML

Meto

Although the clinical benefits of metoclopramide (methoxy-2-chloro-5-procainamide) are restricted to the upper intestinal tract, experimental studies demonstrate a significant effect on intestinal smooth muscle. Metoclopramide has both peripheral and central dopamine receptor antagonist effects. The action on the gastrointestinal tract appears to be dependent on the release of acetylcholine from intrinsic cholinergic neurons: atropine antagonizes its effect on the LES. Vagotomy does not reduce the effect of metoclopramide. Metoclopramide has no effect on gastrin acid secretion and serum gastrin level. Metoclopramide's central antidopaminergic effects explain the effective antiemetic action, this benefit in counterpart by some extrapyramidal side effects (akathisia, dyskinesia), more common in children and the elderly

Domp

Domperidone is a benzimidazole derivative that specifically antagonizes the inhibitory effects of dopamine, which seems to be an important inhibitory transmitter. It has no cholinergic activity and is not inhibited by atropine. Domperidone has limited ability to cross the blood-brain barrier and therefore acts primarily as a peripheral antagonist. Thus, in contrast to metoclopramide, domperidone rarely causes dystonic or extrapyramidal symptoms and it may increase prolactin levels and occasionally female patients may develop galactorrhea.

https://link.springer.com/chapter/10.1007/978-3-642-73055-9_74

Two reviews on domperidone and metoclopramide have recently been publsihed [1, 2]. The efficacy of the two drugs is identical for improving symptoms of dyspepsia and for preventing postoperative vomiting or that induced by chemotherapy, but there is a difference in terms of gastroesophageal reflux. Most pharmacodynamic resuhs agree in showing that the acute intravenous or oral administration of metoclopramide (Table 1) increases the resting lower esophageal sphincter pressure (LES P) in both normal subjects and in patients with gastroesophageal reflux. However, the effect of metoclopramide is more clearcut in healthy volunteers than in patients, and the degree of the response depends on the basal LES P, on the dose and on the route of administration.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/27530760

BACKGROUND:
There is increased awareness about risks and benefits of using domperidone to treat gastroparesis.

AIM:
To describe the outcome of treating patients with refractory gastroparesis symptoms with domperidone.

METHODS:
Domperidone 10 mg QID or TID was prescribed to patients with refractory gastroparesis symptoms; follow-up obtained at 2-3 months assessing symptoms and side effects. Patients filled out Patient Assessment of Upper GI Symptoms prior to treatment and at follow-up along with Clinical Patient Grading Assessment Scale (CPGAS, +7 = completely better; 0 = no change).

RESULTS:
Of 125 patients initially prescribed domperidone, 7 did not take this medication and 3 were lost to follow-up. Of the 115 known patients treated with domperidone, 88 had idiopathic, 16 diabetic, and 9 postsurgical gastroparesis. Side effects were reported by 44 patients (most common-headache, tachycardia/palpitations, diarrhea); 14 patients stopped treatment. Hundred and one patients were seen at follow-up taking domperidone (2.4 ± 2.7 months, average dose 36 ± 13 mg/day). CPGAS averaged 2.7 ± 2.7 (p < 0.01) with 69 patients reporting symptom improvement and 45 patients at least moderately improved with CPGAS ≥ 4. Improvements were seen in most symptoms, especially postprandial fullness, nausea, vomiting, and stomach fullness.

CONCLUSIONS:
In this large single-center study of patients treated with domperidone, side effects necessitating discontinuing treatment occurred in 12 %. The majority of patients remaining on treatment experienced an improvement in symptoms of gastroparesis, particularly postprandial fullness, nausea, vomiting, and stomach fullness. Thus, domperidone treatment is beneficial for many patients with symptoms of gastroparesis. This study provides needed benefit and risk information concerning treating patients with domperidone. FDA IND Number: 71,089.


TL:DR

Meto is always going to be more effective. If you're going to use Doperidone, try to build it into your system over the period of a week or ten days.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Dartz, killing me softly, lv-gras and 8 others
A

Arak

Enlightened
Sep 21, 2018
1,176
@Threads ,

Thank you. I'm not sure about he relevance of 'gastroesophageal reflux.'
The studies suggest domperidone would be about equally effective. TL:DR means ?

'Meto is always going to be more effective. If you're going to use Doperidone, try to build it into your system over the period of a week or ten days.' Meto certainly feels much stronger. But I feel that statement is a bit contradictory to the studies.
 
  • Like
Reactions: lv-gras, RaphtaliaTwoAnimals and Deafsn0w
Nem

Nem

Drs suck mega ass!
Sep 3, 2018
1,489
They're both generally antipsychotic drugs used as antiemetics, supposedly dompetidone claims to not cross the blood brain barrier but that theory has a few flaws.
Peace
 
  • Like
Reactions: RaphtaliaTwoAnimals, Deafsn0w and Lifeisatrap
A

Arak

Enlightened
Sep 21, 2018
1,176
@Nem , @Threads ,

That's indeed not 100 % but for me that's a difference between day and night.

As far as the physical side effects are concerned, meto feels like an antipsychotic. My jaws were stiff from that one tiny 5 mg dose and have been for quite some time, as well as some other effects that did not last as long. Maybe I could take 10 mg of meto and some domperidone, I wouldn't want to risk more or less severe acute effects from one high dose of 30 mg.
 
  • Like
Reactions: lv-gras and RaphtaliaTwoAnimals
Nem

Nem

Drs suck mega ass!
Sep 3, 2018
1,489
I've always thought that the effects from reglan (meto) are pretty severe. The reviews on regular make yu wonder how the heck this med got approved in the first place?! Domperidone isn't perfecteither and it does seem weaker, I guess you can't have everything. How long has the jaw been an issue and what other effects did you note?
Peace!
 
  • Like
Reactions: lv-gras, RaphtaliaTwoAnimals and Lifeisatrap
A

Arak

Enlightened
Sep 21, 2018
1,176
@Nem ,

Jaws maybe almost two weeks,not painful but enough to notice. Got less bad after a week or so. Other effects (general muscle stiffness etc.) dissipated faster, mostly with a week.
 
  • Like
Reactions: lv-gras, RaphtaliaTwoAnimals and Lifeisatrap
Nem

Nem

Drs suck mega ass!
Sep 3, 2018
1,489
Those are the extra pyramidal effects, sorry to hear that. It's a very dangerous drug, domperidone isn't completely innocent either, supposedly it doesn't cross the blood brain barrier but there is no guarantee of it
Peace!!
 
  • Like
Reactions: lv-gras, RaphtaliaTwoAnimals and Lifeisatrap
A

Arak

Enlightened
Sep 21, 2018
1,176
@Threads , all,

What's the logic of taking meto or domperidone on consecutive days ?
I take it one can 'test', but anything else ? For me it'd be harsher and more problematic.
 
  • Like
Reactions: lv-gras, RaphtaliaTwoAnimals and Lifeisatrap
A

Arak

Enlightened
Sep 21, 2018
1,176
@Threads , @Chinaski , all/whoever,

I encountered this medscape article.

https://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/429668_3

I'm not sure if you can fully read it with a login. About metoclopramide. Quote 'Metoclopramide also has 5-HT3-receptor antagonist and some 5-HT4-receptor agonist properties in addition to it antagonism of dopamine receptors.' Seems like a drug like ondansetron could be added for the 5ht3 receptors ?

From another source, not at hand, a statement that meto has strong antiemetic effects at the brain stem. Which can cause all kinds of issues.

For me, 30 mg meto could be a problem. 5 mg was not a picknick. On the one hand, it may not matter a great deal if one dies anyway, on the other hand it may matter if it interferes with its intended action. I have a messed up CNS.

My personal focus is at N for the moment, although I don't preclude anything else. I know domperidone, it feels weak. I could do up to 10 mg meto, maybe even 15 tops without real problems. Mixed with domperidone. I'm not sure how that would work out.

Choosing domperidone instead of meto leaves out the action on the 5ht3 and 5ht4 receptors. Anyone, comments ? I haven't seen suggestions of using ondansetron for N. Vomiting, choking in your own vomit or something like that would be really unpleasant.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Didymus, Lifeisatrap, RaphtaliaTwoAnimals and 1 other person