Venting Nobody has empathy for virgins

[pollux]

Most relationship advice is either bad, people projecting their personal issues or people trying to convince themselves of something. Keep this in mind for what I'll write next because I probably am doing this too.

The only practical advice I've ever gotten was "try to meet more people and try to become someone people might want to stay with." That's it. There's nothing else you can do. If no one wants you even then, well...too bad.

The problem about relationship advice is that it isn't about you. You can't force someone to like you. Think about giving advice to someone about being funny. What would you try to say? Maybe you tell them to say something unexpected or try to give them advice about a certain topic, but if people aren't laughing at their jokes then they just aren't funny. You can't force someone to think you're funny.

No one will ever understand you or give you support because there's no support to be given. Relationships are something that happen between two people; it isn't some task or skill you can learn. Most people don't understand this because they never had to interpret it as a problem to be solved to begin with.

I'm not sure if this makes you feel better or not, but I think you should think about in this way: if you're doing what is expected of you, not by society or anyone but by the virtue and decency that is expected of a human being, then you did your job. You aren't bad or immoral or a lesser person just because you are a virgin. It may be hard to accept that there may not be anyone who appreciates you enough to stay with you, but you wouldn't want to be with someone that didn't like you either would you? So it goes.

 

[xandermax]

I'm a bit of a strange case because I've had a pretty active sex life growing up. At some stages i even got addicted to Tinder and dating.

But now I'm 41, single, and my combination of psychiatric medications basically erase all my sexual impulses. I barely look at a good looking lady. It's weird. Like a whole domain and reason for living has been erased from my existence. I'm a pharmaceutically induced asexual.

As someone who's had a pretty active dating life in the past, the only bit of advice i can give to those that struggle with the opposite sex is to approach it like you're a character in a video game. (Don't take this literally aspies and turn up to a bar dressed like an assassin from assassin's creed). I found in the past that playing it like you're in a video game detaches the ego from the fear of rejection.

Feel free to dm me if you want to chat about what it's like to be ok without sex, or if you want to connect about this stuff on any level. No I'm not selling anything i just think it's a shame to see guys ctb over something that can be solved.

 

[mrnamoshi]

it's over bro

 

[sugarb]

The annoying part is that I'm content with being a virgin most of the time.

I'm not completely against dating and I do think about companionship on rare occasions, but I also kinda just don't want to go through all the effort involved. I don't want to go on dates. remember birthdays, move in with someone, give anyone a significant chunk my time, worry about getting abused or cheated on, stress about making mistakes, and I also don't particularly want to touch or be touched 90% of the time, sexually or otherwise. if I'm being honest I just don't enjoy other people's company that much or find anyone especially interesting.

But because social expectation that you mash privates with somebody I'm automatically associated with mass shooters and hyper-misogynistic internet scumbags, making me a creepy gross violent rapey loser by proxy in some people's eyes until I mash privates with somebody. It's stupid. like leave me alone I literally don't do anything

 

[pyx]

the distance between virgins and nonvirgins is obviously quite vast so there is little empathy in what is perceived as something quite natural in obtaining for most. construct or not, what is perceived as a nonissue is rooted in social realities, which are biologically derived. there is a level of social inadequacy in remaining a virgin, so a clear marker for social integration consists in being able to enter into relationships (which involve sex), a purely contractual step

those who think otherwise curb the problem and reinforce the idea that we should not rely on the community for value. to be consigned to the values of the community is an inescapable fact of life

 

[Deleted member 8119]

you will always crave sex (or romance) no matter what others say

You literally can not crave it. Specially when there's a realistic chance OP may never experience such things, it's much more possible to just understand the source of his desire first and work on what stresses him. And then if any chance of sex happen, he can take it, but if not it's literally OK because he would've learned to manage it.

I feel like part of the issue that people forget about the fact that sex is not just seen as some activitiy, it's an expectation. Sex is seen as something that men and boys must try to lose as soon as possible and woman and girls must avoid yet, at the same time, they must submit (lest they be a "prude"). When people say things like "I've has sex before and it wasn't anything amazing", they completely miss this point. When someone complains about never having sex before, it's because they feel like they have been left behind and are failing to meet societal expectations, whether they are conscious of it or not.

Along with that, the whole "I've has sex before and it wasn't anything amazing" or that it "didn't fill the void inside you" or anything else along those lines, reminds me of back in grade 12, when we found out that we were not going to have prom because of the pandemic. I didn't care but a lot of my peers did. One of my teachers made an interesting point, which was that prom was overrated but that she can only say this as someone who has been to prom before. If you've never had been to prom before then there isn't any way for you to know this first-hand. Talking about how overrated sex is to someone who has never had sex before isn't going to do shit. They will still want to have sex because they want to experience it. They won't just be like "yeah man, you are so right. Sex is overrated", because they have never had any experience with it before. Saying something is overrated and not as good as others make it out to be only works in retrospect. If you have never experienced said thing before and this is something that feel like it is expected of you and is presented as a major milestone that we are all supposed to experience, then you will likely still want it.

That's a very interesting point. You are mostly correct, but at the same time, what else can people really say?

I also think it won't and it isn't solving OP's problem, but I still think such answers help just a little. Sure the core issue of feeling failed is there, but if OP had high expectations, he may have less incentive to care about it, even if not fully.

As a personal note I think the people who say "everyone has a compatible one!!1!" are way, way less helpful because not only it doesn't help OP's failed expectations, but it's literally "life always gets better", "stay strong bro" but translated to dating. Yeah no thanks.

 

[ms_beaverhousen]

Do you talk to girls in the manner of your post? In a honest and natural fashion. That helps, because first impressions can go a long way; and sometimes the first impression is all you're given, if that. If you're meek and withdrawn with a girl then that's not giving her the best version of you and she'll move on. You don't have to be alpha and robustly confident, even quiet confidence is attractive. Knowing you're good enough is important, even if others don't realize that yet. You're funny, and girls like funny. When in doubt, ask girls a question. Get to know them. Hear them. Respond to them. If you like something about them, tell them. Don't fear them. Be choosy/picky. The pressure is probably harder than the real thing. It's supposed to be fun after all.
One user gave the advice of "What would you advise to someone in your shoes?" and I think that's helpful. I was older than you before I finally had full-fledged sex. I never put myself out there, for my own reasons; but once I did, it paid off in kind. I thought it would be a turn off for guys, but it wasn't at all. Then again I realize I'm the girl... but, if you're okay with being a late-bloomer, then they will too.
I hate seeing Ctb requests over lack of/failed relationships and sex, as I know they're both hard to find, but everyone can have a romantic/sex life if they want to. They just can. You seem astute enough not to follow the prostitute route so I won't go further into that. Good luck

 

[Sadbanana]

Thank you for your comments and support. I see there are people on this website that have or had similar issues. And it is true I'm still only 23, so maybe there is a chance, but it's hard for me to force to try again, I don't want to feel rejected again, it will make my mental health issues a lot worse.

For those that think sex isn't important and I should move on, I would say it is not as simple. This ruined my life in so many different ways. My issues caused me to isolate myself and to end a lot of friendships, It made me through away future. Becuase I started focusing more one trying to develop my social skills. It gave me major cptsd and made me lose all hope.

I've tried tinder for almost a year and all that it gave me is lot of heartbreak and feeling of disgust for this whole fucking game and how stupidly it works.

And I believe there are lot of things that would have helped me if somebody tought them to me earlier. Like that I should let my options more open, don't get atached too fast and similar things which tinder toght me. I sure schools should teach social skills. I'm bit autistic, but I'm good at masking and I can learn a lot of things. I was very wierd as kid, but you met me you probably wouldn't notice now.

But schools just teach you social skill by throwing you amonh kids which is not very useful for people like me. They teach you useless crap from which you won't use 90 percent and have a lot of useless teachers that hate kids, especially autistic kids and bully them.

My suffering is hard to relate, but I asure you my suffering is huge and I dont want blame anyone, but it could have been avoided if someone cared enough to help, when I needed it the most.

 

[SonicFan1994]

Id argue my life was easier when I was a virgin. But i get it, the loneliness and feeling like ur not doing what everyone else is doing.

Its one of those situations where you think the grass is greener on the other side.

Thank you for your comments and support. I see there are people on this website that have or had similar issues. And it is true I'm still only 23, so maybe there is a chance, but it's hard for me to force to try again, I don't want to feel rejected again, it will make my mental health issues a lot worse.

For those that think sex isn't important and I should move on, I would say it is not as simple. This ruined my life in so many different ways. My issues caused me to isolate myself and to end a lot of friendships, It made me through away future. Becuase I started focusing more one trying to develop my social skills. It gave me major cptsd and made me lose all hope.

I've tried tinder for almost a year and all that it gave me is lot of heartbreak and feeling of disgust for this whole fucking game and how stupidly it works.

And I believe there are lot of things that would have helped me if somebody tought them to me earlier. Like that I should let my options more open, don't get atached too fast and similar things which tinder toght me. I sure schools should teach social skills. I'm bit autistic, but I'm good at masking and I can learn a lot of things. I was very wierd as kid, but you met me you probably wouldn't notice now.

But schools just teach you social skill by throwing you amonh kids which is not very useful for people like me. They teach you useless crap from which you won't use 90 percent and have a lot of useless teachers that hate kids, especially autistic kids and bully them.

My suffering is hard to relate, but I asure you my suffering is huge and I dont want blame anyone, but it could have been avoided if someone cared enough to help, when I needed it the most.

Didnt lose mines until i was 25, Didnt really change anything, doesnt change much unless its a person you legit love and they care about you. (i even started having panic attacks after because i felt like i tainted my pureness)

im still the same person, just with more experience with women. You kind of lose your childlike innocence once you lose your virginity too, Like i said the grass is not always greener.

also went thru the tinder phase, It makes me feel shallow. Dont use any online dating stuff anymore, because i dont care for the "hot or not" vibe.

 

[Aloneandinpain]

I hate seeing Ctb requests over lack of/failed relationships and sex, as I know they're both hard to find, but everyone can have a romantic/sex life if they want to. They just can.

You really have no idea what life is like for a slightly below average guy.

I tried almost every dating app for over two years, doing all the recommended steps such as getting my photos rated. It resulted in one match per year and was only interested in one of those two women. She disappeared before we could even meet. I later requested my swipe data on one app to see if my profile was being hidden, but no there were just tens of thousands of left swipes.

I'm definitely too introverted, but every woman I ask out has rejected me and that just lowers my self esteem and I can only take so much rejection and it really harms my mental health. The only thing that varies is whether the rejections are polite or just nasty.

No women show any interest in me, I'm now in my 40s and I doubt I'll ever even have my first kiss let alone sex.

 

[Deleted member 8119]

For those that think sex isn't important and I should move on, I would say it is not as simple.

Yeah, but you don't seem to have the choice, based on everything you said. It seems the desire is completely unidirectional.

This ruined my life in so many different ways. My issues caused me to isolate myself and to end a lot of friendships, It made me through away future. Becuase I started focusing more one trying to develop my social skills. It gave me major cptsd and made me lose all hope.

You mean trying to develop social skills gave you C-PTSD, and that you trying to develop social skills ruined your future? Because if this is the case, literally why keep doing something it absolutely ruined you in every way?

Your future is not gone. You have many possibilities, but love in particular may not be one. It's literally OK. There's so much else you can still do. You will grow more, and can realize the error of meeting expectations that didn't need to be met, that it deviated you from what truly matters in life. To be loveless isn't a waste, but chasing it for nothing is, and those are the years that won't come back.

So, I'll say again. It's not that moving on isn't simple. It's that you have little choice about it. You must move on regardless. So work on that first, and you may have success on sex later. But please move on, and then you can keep trying.

 

[swankysoup]

I slept around a lot in my 20s . Sex isnt that great its a temporary high. Its only good with someone you care about and even then its so temporary

Good point, but notice how you have this opinion only after sleeping around? If you never got the chance to do it in the first place, would you still feel the same way now?

 

[Sadbanana]

Yeah, but you don't seem to have the choice, based on everything you said. It seems the desire is completely unidirectional.


You mean trying to develop social skills gave you C-PTSD, and that you trying to develop social skills ruined your future? Because if this is the case, literally why keep doing something it absolutely ruined you in every way?

Your future is not gone. You have many possibilities, but love in particular may not be one. It's literally OK. There's so much else you can still do. You will grow more, and can realize the error of meeting expectations that didn't need to be met, that it deviated you from what truly matters in life. To be loveless isn't a waste, but chasing it for nothing is, and those are the years that won't come back.

So, I'll say again. It's not that moving on isn't simple. It's that you have little choice about it. You must move on regardless. So work on that first, and you may have success on sex later. But please move on, and then you can keep trying.

I probably phrased it wrong. Finding love being treated like shit bt girls and sexlessness gave me cptsd. So I neglected shool etc. despite being quite gifted.

For me without love, I just don't care. Without love there is nothing. Sure I can just take some stimulants go studying and chase success while suffering tremendously. But I kinda feel like suicide is the less obnoxious and pointless.

 

[EvisceratedJester]

Finding love being treated like shit bt girls and sexlessness gave me cptsd. So I neglected shool etc.

We're you diagnosed with CPTSD (not trying to he rude, just asking)?

 

[Deleted member 8119]

I probably phrased it wrong. Finding love being treated like shit bt girls and sexlessness gave me cptsd. So I neglected shool etc. despite being quite gifted.

For me without love, I just don't care. Without love there is nothing. Sure I can just take some stimulants go studying and chase success while suffering tremendously. But I kinda feel like suicide is the less obnoxious and pointless.

Yeah, the wording is different but this search ruined you the same... It drove you to leave school, frustration and over-fixation on a subjective problem. You see it's bad, do you?

I'm sorry to say suicide is, indeed, obnoxious and painful. You'll realize that if you try, though I hope you never reach that point. The feeling of fighting your whole body and mind sucks. Not that I oppose autonomy at all, but understand the bads too, it's not a magic bullet against suffering.

Without love, the good things begin for many. But you are holding too much and passing love as an absolute which in no way is.

 

[Aloneandinpain]

Loneliness sucks, sexlessness sucks and it can really fuck up someone's psyche. And you feel like you are missing out becuse everyone is advertising how great sex and love is.

Did you ever have any nice experience? Like a kiss or holding hands.

I had a hug once and hoped it was romantic but turns out the woman just felt sorry for me and probably realised I needed it (plus I guess she needed one too, albeit only half as much)

 

[Sadbanana]

I already tried mate. If it was easy I would be dead already. It's maslow hierarchy of needs, if I don't have girlfirend, friends and sex, nothing has any value to me. I've heard somewhere "people that never lacked money or sex will always say that they don't need it". Well I don't know you, but it feels like you have no idea how I'm feeling. I appreciate that you are trying to help tho.
I'm diagnosed with trauma, cptsd isn't a psychological term in my country, but I'd say it fits better.

I worded it wrong. I was lots of things that gave me cptsd, mostly girls in middle school, at they age they didn't really know how to reject someone politely

 

[EvisceratedJester]

I'm diagnosed with trauma, cptsd isn't a psychological term in my country, but I'd say it fits better.

Trauma is not a diagnosis and cptsd is typically developed after having experienced chronic trauma, especially from a young age (e.g., war, child abuse, sex trafficking, exposure to long-term DA, imprisonment, etc). Being a virgin typically wouldn't give you PTSD, let alone CPTSD.

 

[Sadbanana]

Trauma is not a diagnosis and cptsd is typically developed after having experienced chronic trauma, especially from a young age (e.g., war, child abuse, sex trafficking, exposure to long-term DA, imprisonment, etc). Being a virgin typically wouldn't give you PTSD, let alone CPTSD.

Well it's not just that. But you probably know nothing about it, it is more than enough.

 

[WhatAFish]

Do you talk to girls in the manner of your post? In a honest and natural fashion. That helps, because first impressions can go a long way; and sometimes the first impression is all you're given, if that. If you're meek and withdrawn with a girl then that's not giving her the best version of you and she'll move on. You don't have to be alpha and robustly confident, even quiet confidence is attractive. Knowing you're good enough is important, even if others don't realize that yet. You're funny, and girls like funny. When in doubt, ask girls a question. Get to know them. Hear them. Respond to them. If you like something about them, tell them. Don't fear them. Be choosy/picky. The pressure is probably harder than the real thing. It's supposed to be fun after all.
One user gave the advice of "What would you advise to someone in your shoes?" and I think that's helpful. I was older than you before I finally had full-fledged sex. I never put myself out there, for my own reasons; but once I did, it paid off in kind. I thought it would be a turn off for guys, but it wasn't at all. Then again I realize I'm the girl... but, if you're okay with being a late-bloomer, then they will too.
I hate seeing Ctb requests over lack of/failed relationships and sex, as I know they're both hard to find, but everyone can have a romantic/sex life if they want to. They just can. You seem astute enough not to follow the prostitute route so I won't go further into that. Good luck

I know you mean well, but this comes off as talking down to someone that is living that experience.

But it is nice to hear your perspective

 

[kimcoffee_]

If you ever go to Vegas... pm me. I Iived in a casino a couple years. I know things. If you're truly a virgin id recommend a Vegas prostitute its legal there. On the strip it's 100% legal. In any hotel its 100% legal. And you are guaranteed privacy.

Sorry bro that sucks. Go to Amsterdam or Japan.

This is not true btw I belive prostitutes are only legal in small countys, like 1+ hour away from the strip. That said there are still a ton of prostitutes around (Same as any big city)

 

[Peter Skellern]

It's maslow hierarchy of needs,

They still peddle that do they in Motivational Theory terms?

 

[swankysoup]

Trauma is not a diagnosis and cptsd is typically developed after having experienced chronic trauma, especially from a young age (e.g., war, child abuse, sex trafficking, exposure to long-term DA, imprisonment, etc). Being a virgin typically wouldn't give you PTSD, let alone CPTSD.

This is a bit of an oversimplification. Missing out on sexual development usually comes with abandonment, isolation, alienation, emotional neglect, shaming etc. Those things can cause c-ptsd, it's not just about the "big stuff" you mentioned earlier.

 

[moonstroll]

Put yourself in social situations which you don't feel comfortable in, force yourself into a job which involves a lot of socialising, travel way outside of the environment you grew up in and try to be a new version of yourself. Doesn't work the first time? Doesn't matter, just by trying once you will have learnt and grown a great deal. Keep doing this, and eventually life will surprise you

 

[_Minsk]

imo sex is overrated

 

[vitbar]

imo there is empathy for virgins as everyone has been one, and it's pretty common to feel pressure to lose it. It's also common for the urgency to seem silly in retrospect. Makes it difficult to take super seriously, and is why you get people suggesting you not take it seriously either.

 

[fallingleaves]

There is nothing wrong with not having sex. I see and acknowledge your frustration and pain. Loneliness is one of the things that hurts me the most, and I am going out on a limb to suggest that loneliness itself may be worse than sexlessness, for you. If so, I empathize. I'm not neurotypical either and I feel like shit too but on my better days I really think us weirdos can make a place for ourselves in this often unforgiving world. I don't know, I just have to believe.

 

[Crematoryy]

Society's rules don't care if you're neurotypical or neurodivergent; the only thing that really matters is your appearance. Sexual gratification for the beautiful (whether autistic or not) and social exclusion for the ugly (even if they have extraordinary talents). The materialism of the world is terrifying. When I leave this life -- and leave this world -- I will spit on my grave for life having denied me the sex I incessantly desired. @fallingleaves

 

[fallingleaves]

Society's rules don't care if you're neurotypical or neurodivergent; the only thing that really matters is your appearance. Sexual gratification for the beautiful (whether autistic or not) and social exclusion for the ugly (even if they have extraordinary talents). The materialism of the world is terrifying. When I leave this life -- and leave this world -- I will spit on my grave for life having denied me the sex I incessantly desired. @fallingleaves

All I want to do is offer my empathy and understanding even if I'm one of the pretties.

 

[ClippedWings]

My virginity is a dagger in my lungs. I can barely breathe. I'm excited to die soon because the unknown offers a higher chance of achieving what I want than the known. I like the idea that I will be cremated and burned back to ashes. I should be completely atomized. It would be a monumental fuck-up for me to have children and risk the recreation of myself, or worse. I am proof that having children is evil. One thing to remember, that even though virginity is an obvious source of suffering, so too is procreation. All human suffering has birth, and thus sex, as a contingency. So that lust and seduction you feel is the engine that perpetuates the land of suffering. So you suffer the lack of sex to incentivize the human race to continue suffering. An incredibly tiny fraction of human beings are able to deny such a strong force, and hence, they produce people like me. Their euphoria via orgasm produces decades of immense suffering. But they can't help themselves. The force is too strong. I know it as well as anyone what you risk if you deny the reproductive urge. That energy will kill you. Either, you foist that energy unto another so they may suffer it, or you kill yourself.

It may sound like cope, but it's actually true; beauty is a seduction to propagate the land of suffering. Like me, incurable humans will be born. There is a bug injection rate in the human code. I will be born again. You could be king of the world and own the universe and still not save me. There are incurable humans. These are guaranteed to be born at some rate. Money, connections, intelligence, strength, beauty, charisma, whatever, nothing will save these people. You are tortured to reproduce, which has a non-zero chance of creating an incurable human. So, yes, your subsystems will be well regulated once you smash the living fuck out of enough pussy. But all you do is pass that torture unto the next person. Such is life.

Everyone on this forum is the product of a non-virgin.