Help How to manage therapist if I CTB?

[brokensea]

I feel I'm getting closer to my decision to CTB. Unfortunately I am seeing a therapist I meet with twice a week and he wants me to text him every day. Ideally I'd like to stop therapy before I CTB to spare him the ordeal of knowing I'm gone or feeling guilty or dealing with that.

I worry if I ask to stop therapy he will be suspicious. If I stop messaging him or he messages me and I don't respond I worry he'd call someone out to check on me. He's also texted me late/early.

I am planning the SN method. I'm worried about it going wrong because of my therapist.

Is there anything I can do or a plan to stop therapy where I can make an exit without worrying about intervention?

 

[Jrmull1993]

Is this therapist hired by someone else? I don't see why you can't just stop your sessions if your not interested in going to therapy.

Is there any reason you can't lust lie when the therapist messages you and put on an illusion that your okay?

 

[brokensea]

Is this therapist hired by someone else? I don't see why you can't just stop your sessions if your not interested in going to therapy.

Is there any reason you can't lust lie when the therapist messages you and put on an illusion that your okay?

I can stop the sessions but him knowing I'm suicidal and he's doing such intensive therapy with me I feel like he would suspect the reason and create issues for me.

 

[Jrmull1993]

@brokensea Sounds like you answered your own question. If he messages you than I'd just act as if nothing out of the ordinary is going on.

 

[brokensea]

I've heard it can take hours at times to die with SN. I worry if he doesn't hear the next day maybe I'm still alive he calls someone out etc

 

[LaVieEnRose]

If you suicide shortly after you stop the relationship, then it will be clear to him that you did that for that purpose. If you give no indication of wanting to suicide, then he can't be expected to be able to predict that so he won't be on the hook for it at all. Perhaps he will feel guilty nonetheless but this is an emotional reaction you can't control.

 

[brokensea]

If you suicide shortly after you stop the relationship, then it will be clear to him that you did that for that purpose. If you give no indication of wanting to suicide, then he can't be expected to be able to predict that so he won't be on the hook for it at all. Perhaps he will feel guilty nonetheless but this is an emotional reaction you can't control.

He knows I'm suicidal and extremely depressed. I'm not sure how long it would take to convince him that I'm fine now.

 

[theboy]

I do not know the number of psychiatrists who have had a patient who committed CTB but you will not be the first or the last. If you tell him that you want to stop therapy, he will be suspicious even if you give him various reasons. I recommend that you keep talking until you commit CTB.
Can this therapy really help you? Maybe you can find help by following your therapy

 

[summers]

I feel I'm getting closer to my decision to CTB. Unfortunately I am seeing a therapist I meet with twice a week and he wants me to text him every day. Ideally I'd like to stop therapy before I CTB to spare him the ordeal of knowing I'm gone or feeling guilty or dealing with that.

I worry if I ask to stop therapy he will be suspicious. If I stop messaging him or he messages me and I don't respond I worry he'd call someone out to check on me. He's also texted me late/early.

I am planning the SN method. I'm worried about it going wrong because of my therapist.

Is there anything I can do or a plan to stop therapy where I can make an exit without worrying about intervention?

He'll be fine. Probably has patients who kill themselves all the time. Just keep going to therapy as normal.

 

[Worndown]

People die. A good therapist should know that.
They will feel bad whenever they find out so there is no way to avoid that.

 

[LittleJem]

can you tell him you can't afford it anymore? or I guess you could say you are giong on holiday and will be out of reception. It sounds like he is checking on you a lot so tricky

 

[Secrets1]

He'll be fine. Probably has patients who kill themselves all the time. Just keep going to therapy as normal.

From my research this is something therapists can experience. Some do, some don't. It'd be exceedingly rare if a therapist experienced this "all the time". There is a medical review done after suicides by and for practitioners with active patients who CTB. So, if someone experienced it frequently, I imagine they would eventually quit or an oversight group would take steps to implement changes or take away someone's license if they don't care that their active patients regularly CTB.

 

[summers]

From my research this is something therapists can experience. Some do, some don't. It'd be exceedingly rare if a therapist experienced this "all the time". There is a medical review done after suicides by and for practitioners with active patients who CTB. So, if someone experienced it frequently, I imagine they would eventually quit or an oversight group would take steps to implement changes or take away someone's license if they don't care that their active patients regularly CTB.

Yes, because I'm sure at the review hearing the doctor is going to say they don't care about their patients killing themselves. Imagine a doctor who is assigned high-risk patients - how would it be their fault they have a high-risk group.

Also, explain how you would ever prove someone cares or doesn't? Unless you can find concrete evidence like journal entries, texts/messages, or a recording of a conversation, all you can do is take the person at their word.

 

[Mtnwildflowers]

I feel I'm getting closer to my decision to CTB. Unfortunately I am seeing a therapist I meet with twice a week and he wants me to text him every day. Ideally I'd like to stop therapy before I CTB to spare him the ordeal of knowing I'm gone or feeling guilty or dealing with that.

I worry if I ask to stop therapy he will be suspicious. If I stop messaging him or he messages me and I don't respond I worry he'd call someone out to check on me. He's also texted me late/early.

I am planning the SN method. I'm worried about it going wrong because of my therapist.

Is there anything I can do or a plan to stop therapy where I can make an exit without worrying about intervention?

This seems like a very odd therapy set up. I've never heard of a therapist requesting to message a client everyday. That sounds excessive and like it crosses professional boundaries for an outpatient therapist. Unless you're in some kind of IOP or PHP, that's not typical of a therapist and seems overbearing. Most therapists don't chase clients. Maybe it's different in your country or something but requesting daily contact as an outpatient therapist would be very weird here. You could actually report him for making requests like that. Tell him you think it's excessive and crossing your personal boundaries, and if he doesn't back off, you could take other outlets I'm sure.

 

[Secrets1]

Yes, because I'm sure at the review hearing the doctor is going to say they don't care about their patients killing themselves. Imagine a doctor who is assigned high-risk patients - how would it be their fault they have a high-risk group.

Also, explain how you would ever prove someone cares or doesn't? Unless you can find concrete evidence like journal entries, texts/messages, or a recording of a conversation, all you can do is take the person at their word.

If there's an overwhelming pattern it doesn't matter what the therapist says. If they're an outlier in regards to data it shows they aren't equipped for the role, contributing to harm. Oversight bodies and insurance companies don't stand for that shit which practitioners need to operate.

 

[Jrmull1993]

Oversight bodies and insurance companies don't stand for that shit which practitioners need to operate.

When it comes to suicide, Health insurance companies are in Heaven.

This comical video sums it right up:

 

[Hollowillow]

I feel I'm getting closer to my decision to CTB. Unfortunately I am seeing a therapist I meet with twice a week and he wants me to text him every day. Ideally I'd like to stop therapy before I CTB to spare him the ordeal of knowing I'm gone or feeling guilty or dealing with that.

I worry if I ask to stop therapy he will be suspicious. If I stop messaging him or he messages me and I don't respond I worry he'd call someone out to check on me. He's also texted me late/early.

I am planning the SN method. I'm worried about it going wrong because of my therapist.

Is there anything I can do or a plan to stop therapy where I can make an exit without worrying about intervention?

I see you're being watched. I think the women in the Terminator movie slowly "improved" until she said she's good & think she can be released now. They didn't believe her.

Rent a cabin in the woods? Or... Just the woods? I saw a movie of a guy who dug a tunnel, got in, then used dinamite. Boom. Instant grave. He was more independent in death than I am in life.

I wish I had the means... I wish I could say something helpful. Best wishes. I envy that you have some attention, I hope the therapist is kind & not just a control freak

 

[Secrets1]

Yes, because I'm sure at the review hearing the doctor is going to say they don't care about their patients killing themselves. Imagine a doctor who is assigned high-risk patients - how would it be their fault they have a high-risk group.

Also, explain how you would ever prove someone cares or doesn't? Unless you can find concrete evidence like journal entries, texts/messages, or a recording of a conversation, all you can do is take the person at their word.

It's not about this at a certain point. It's if they're equipped for job. Related to caring. And ability to perform the job at an acceptable level. Which an advisory board would determine

When it comes to suicide, Health insurance companies are in Heaven.

This comical video sums it right up:

Hell of a thorough analysis . There have been psycho doctors like this. Thinking it's the norm is simply a conspiracy theory? Have you ever worked in healthcare or discussed these isssues with trustworthy providers? Do you trust any practitioners of healthcare? I understand having a jaded view of the world and healthcare system. Doctors are overwhelmingly not psychopathic.

 

[brokensea]

People die. A good therapist should know that.
They will feel bad whenever they find out so there is no way to avoid that.

Yeah I just do feel guilty you know you try to help someone and it doesn't work out you feel bad and am worried if I don't check in he might text me and if I don't answer and he calls someone.

can you tell him you can't afford it anymore? or I guess you could say you are giong on holiday and will be out of reception. It sounds like he is checking on you a lot so tricky

Yes I could say I lost one of my jobs I'm working and it's hard for me to pay for it. This may work hm. Thanks.

This seems like a very odd therapy set up. I've never heard of a therapist requesting to message a client everyday. That sounds excessive and like it crosses professional boundaries for an outpatient therapist. Unless you're in some kind of IOP or PHP, that's not typical of a therapist and seems overbearing. Most therapists don't chase clients. Maybe it's different in your country or something but requesting daily contact as an outpatient therapist would be very weird here. You could actually report him for making requests like that. Tell him you think it's excessive and crossing your personal boundaries, and if he doesn't back off, you could take other outlets I'm sure.

I've never had a therapist say I can text them as much as I want and reaches out to me for check ins. I feel like he's just worried. He's mentioned do I need to go to some ward or something idk. But it is a new experience I haven't had before. He never says anything inappropriate to me during any texts. I did want to try for help but I realize nothings going to help it was just a last try I guess but I don't feel any different. So I do feel a little worried if I try to CTB he will ruin it for me

I see you're being watched. I think the women in the Terminator movie slowly "improved" until she said she's good & think she can be released now. They didn't believe her.

Rent a cabin in the woods? Or... Just the woods? I saw a movie of a guy who dug a tunnel, got in, then used dinamite. Boom. Instant grave. He was more independent in death than I am in life.

I wish I had the means... I wish I could say something helpful. Best wishes. I envy that you have some attention, I hope the therapist is kind & not just a control freak

You know I'm dumb this would solve all my problems I can just get a rental somewhere a vacation cabin away from receptions and turn off my phone. Hopefully no emergency services would be able to track me on my last location on my phone if I shut it off when I'm there. This makes me feel a little better. Thanks.

 

[not-2-b-the-answer]

Sorry for your situation. I'm not in therapy but that seems extreme. You said you have to check in once a day.
Is it the same time every day? And then if you don't, will he check on you? Is it random?
I can't imagine a therapist requiring you to check in after you go to sleep. I can't tell you what to do but if it were me, I would take S.N. after a check in. Are you required to check in more than once daily? I may have missed that part.

 

[brokensea]

Sorry for your situation. I'm not in therapy but that seems extreme. You said you have to check in once a day.
Is it the same time every day? And then if you don't, will he check on you? Is it random?
I can't imagine a therapist requiring you to check in after you go to sleep. I can't tell you what to do but if it were me, I would take S.N. after a check in. Are you required to check in more than once daily? I may have missed that part.

He had texted me late even around 11pm at night or early morning. He said I can text him as much as I want and can text him every day and then he has sent messages checking in on me if I don't message.

 

[not-2-b-the-answer]

He had texted me late even around 11pm at night or early morning. He said I can text him as much as I want and can text him every day and then he has sent messages checking in on me if I don't message.

Sounds really strange. I don't even text my friends that much. I certainly don't check on them if they don't text me daily. I know it's your therapist but still it seems unusual.
Even with texting @ 11pm SN shouldn't take all night to work. How early does he text?
Have you tried not texting back right away. Especially early in the morning. If I don't have to work, I don't get out of bed until noon. People are allowed to have a life. I don't know, I don't want to tell you the wrong thing.

 

[wait.what]

Where I live, therapists generally try to get someone into an inpatient program if they think they need to be watched around the clock. This is an odd-sounding situation. Does this fellow never sleep? Is he not aware that you might want to sleep sometimes? I think it would be awkward for everyone involved if you missed a call or text because you took a nap or a shower or some such thing, and the next thing anyone knows, the cops are kicking your door down. If you live in the United States, I hope your therapist knows better than to call the police to do a "wellness check" on you. Sending armed and usually minimally-trained police officers after a suicidal person tends not to end very well, for obvious reasons.

I don't know how sure you are that this is your time to ctb, but if there are any doubts in your mind, spending some time on a hospital psyche floor might be less overall annoying than having your therapist constantly texting you as if he were your clingy middle-school boyfriend.

Also, for what it's worth: You are absoutely not responsible for your therapist's feelings, although I can see how that boundary could get blurred if he's been messaging you at all hours of the day and night.

 

[brokensea]

Where I live, therapists generally try to get someone into an inpatient program if they think they need to be watched around the clock. This is an odd-sounding situation. Does this fellow never sleep? Is he not aware that you might want to sleep sometimes? I think it would be awkward for everyone involved if you missed a call or text because you took a nap or a shower or some such thing, and the next thing anyone knows, the cops are kicking your door down. If you live in the United States, I hope your therapist knows better than to call the police to do a "wellness check" on you. Sending armed and usually minimally-trained police officers after a suicidal person tends not to end very well, for obvious reasons.

I don't know how sure you are that this is your time to ctb, but if there are any doubts in your mind, spending some time on a hospital psyche floor might be less overall annoying than having your therapist constantly texting you as if he were your clingy middle-school boyfriend.

Also, for what it's worth: You are absoutely not responsible for your therapist's feelings, although I can see how that boundary could get blurred if he's been messaging you at all hours of the day and night.

Well after saying all this stuff about how I could rely on him for support and felt like at least someone cared about me, he said today I need to go to in person or outpatient therapy and I'm too suicidal so he can't see me anymore until I get more help. I saw him virtually because it's hard to leave my house so I guess I don't have to worry about anything anymore.

 

[Sick of it all]

Well after saying all this stuff about how I could rely on him for support and felt like at least someone cared about me, he said today I need to go to in person or outpatient therapy and I'm too suicidal so he can't see me anymore until I get more help. I saw him virtually because it's hard to leave my house so I guess I don't have to worry about anything anymore.

Well that worked itself out. At least you won't be smothered by your therapist. I am in therapy(not in person, only via zoom) but I've never told my therapist about my suicidal thoughts so I don't know if I would be smothered or if they would tell me to go to a psych ward. I feel like they care but I don't know how they would react knowing how I truly feel.

 

[wait.what]

I'm really sorry to hear this joker did this to you. I wish I could say I'm surprised, but I'm afraid I'm not. Different places have different laws and variations on "best practices," but I guarantee you this guy's weird, borderline-stalkerish behavior isn't considered appropriate anywhere.

I don't think you specifically said that your therapist was worsening your suicidal urges by acting like a crazy, controlling boyfriend, but I can tell you he sure would have had that effect on me. Do I have it right that this dude would call you at any hour of the day or night, with the implicit threat that you had better take all his calls immediately, or else he might call first responders and have you hauled off to a hospital in handcuffs? Because that is some Big Psycho energy right there.

Also, I don't for 2 seconds believe that he suddenly "discovered" that you were too mentally ill to get by solely on outpatient treatment, either. You were literally talking to us last night about how to terminate your working relationship with this guy, because the burden of living on his manipulative terms had grown too great. Now today he "just happens" to do a 180 degree turn and essentially says, "Oh, if I don't get to disrupt your life and demand your attention any damn time I please, I 'can't' work with you at all." He most certainly "could," if he felt like it. Working on getting you moved to either a different therapist or a higher level of care if it's clear he's not helping you is part of his actual fucking job. It's just not as much fun for him as yanking your chain all the time.

I really, really hope you don't chase after this creep and beg his forgiveness, which is what I suspect he's hoping you'll do. I hope you don't ctb over him either. I'm not telling you that you should be forced to stay alive because of him either. What I'd wish for you is the ability to forget him completely if you choose. I get that brushing him off and never looking back is probably a big ask of you right now. People like him pick vulnerable victims for a reason.

Dude's a scuzzbucket, though. Whatever you decide to do, please keep that in mind.

 

[want2dienow]

I feel I'm getting closer to my decision to CTB. Unfortunately I am seeing a therapist I meet with twice a week and he wants me to text him every day. Ideally I'd like to stop therapy before I CTB to spare him the ordeal of knowing I'm gone or feeling guilty or dealing with that.

I worry if I ask to stop therapy he will be suspicious. If I stop messaging him or he messages me and I don't respond I worry he'd call someone out to check on me. He's also texted me late/early.

I am planning the SN method. I'm worried about it going wrong because of my therapist.

Is there anything I can do or a plan to stop therapy where I can make an exit without worrying about intervention?

can't manage anything if your dead.

 

[IWTD]

Is this therapist hired by someone else? I don't see why you can't just stop your sessions if your not interested in going to therapy.

Is there any reason you can't lust lie when the therapist messages you and put on an illusion that your okay?

I stopped my sessions and she still calls, offers to call for free. Some good people out there

 

[brokensea]

I'm really sorry to hear this joker did this to you. I wish I could say I'm surprised, but I'm afraid I'm not. Different places have different laws and variations on "best practices," but I guarantee you this guy's weird, borderline-stalkerish behavior isn't considered appropriate anywhere.

I don't think you specifically said that your therapist was worsening your suicidal urges by acting like a crazy, controlling boyfriend, but I can tell you he sure would have had that effect on me. Do I have it right that this dude would call you at any hour of the day or night, with the implicit threat that you had better take all his calls immediately, or else he might call first responders and have you hauled off to a hospital in handcuffs? Because that is some Big Psycho energy right there.

Also, I don't for 2 seconds believe that he suddenly "discovered" that you were too mentally ill to get by solely on outpatient treatment, either. You were literally talking to us last night about how to terminate your working relationship with this guy, because the burden of living on his manipulative terms had grown too great. Now today he "just happens" to do a 180 degree turn and essentially says, "Oh, if I don't get to disrupt your life and demand your attention any damn time I please, I 'can't' work with you at all." He most certainly "could," if he felt like it. Working on getting you moved to either a different therapist or a higher level of care if it's clear he's not helping you is part of his actual fucking job. It's just not as much fun for him as yanking your chain all the time.

I really, really hope you don't chase after this creep and beg his forgiveness, which is what I suspect he's hoping you'll do. I hope you don't ctb over him either. I'm not telling you that you should be forced to stay alive because of him either. What I'd wish for you is the ability to forget him completely if you choose. I get that brushing him off and never looking back is probably a big ask of you right now. People like him pick vulnerable victims for a reason.

Dude's a scuzzbucket, though. Whatever you decide to do, please keep that in mind.

Thank you, thank you, thank you for this message. It means so much. He did say he would call to have me taken in if I was in danger and he did text me at 11pm + at night and during the morning/day. Not exactly demand I respond but was told if I'm gonna do something I'd go off somewhere. So not responding made me nervous. I did also initiate conversation since he said I could text him as much as I wanted every day.

But thank you for your words. Been bawling about this and was so concerned about him getting hurt if I died and was trying to spare him pain and he was the ONLY human in my real life I shared with that I was suicidal and I felt so incredible rejected after this massive amount of "support" he gave me on a literal daily basis. It was so confusing and hurtful to suddenly be rejected.

You're making me see he was being a jerk and I shouldn't let this lead me into more complete despair over someone like that. I feel a small sense of my power back he took away from me and it's true what you said. Your message really meant a lot to me. Thank you.

 

[wait.what]

The thing that's unconscionable is that he's telling you you're too sick for him to keep seeing you, and yet he's not at the very least giving you referrals to clinicians who would be more appropriate. He's just all "toodle-doo!"

Honestly, if he's as worried about you as he claims to be, he should be trying to get you admitted to a psyche unit. That is what "best practice" would typically look like in this situation, at least in the U.S. In order of preference, a therapist worried that a patient is going to kill themselves would attempt to: 1) convince them to seek inpatient treatment voluntarily, 2) call the patient's emergency contact and work with that person on getting him/her admitted, 3) contact the local authorities about doing a "wellness check," a procedure that frequently, although not always, ends up with the patient getting dragged to the hospital against their will.

Commitment in any form tends to be a pretty horrible experience, so I wouldn't normally fault a therapist for not starting down that road. However, it is utter shit to toss around jargon like "best practices" and then not bother to follow any actual best practices. At that point using such phrases is just a gaslighting technique that attempts to take advantage of a layman's unfamiliarity with professional terminology. This is especially so when at least one "best practices" option, namely getting you referrals to other therapists, requires pretty minimal effort on the therapist's part, and is unlikely to traumatize the patient.

(For the record, I once taught in classrooms where there were a number of kids who got special services due to emotional and behavioral difficulties. I was a mandatory reporter in that context, so I was neither quite a layman or a psyche professional. This was in the U.S., by the way. I'm sure things work differently elsewhere in the world.)

Also, just FYI, it's still possible for your now-ex-therapist to set the wheels of involuntary commitment in motion, assuming he could convince a judge that you're in imminent danger of hurting yourself or others. So do be cautious about what you say to him, assuming you have any further contact.