I've had many conversations with my mom about suicide and euthanasia. At first her reaction was very negative, but she's now starting to understand where I come from. At least she's trying to see things from my point of view...
Apathy79
Arcanist
- Oct 13, 2019
- 486
First post here. I'm not sure what the etiquette is with reviving old threads but this is the first one I've found that I thought I could contribute something meaningful to.
I'm not a suicidal person, which may make my presence here strange. Though I have strongly advocated for doctor's rights to assist people who have chosen to die through legal and other public interest avenues, which includes the necessity to legalize attempted suicide. So I am firmly "pro-choice" in the context in which the term is used here.
I'd like to provide an alternate perspective that may interest this community. About 5 years ago, a very close lifelong friend confided in me that he had attempted suicide, using what this site dubs the "CO method", and failed after being found by his mother too soon. They decided that no-one else needed to know, and life went on. It was about 5 years later during one of our many philosophical chats over beers that he decided to tell me. I can remember the conversation like it was yesterday - I've never had one like it before or since. I should clarify here that I was the best man at this guy's wedding before this chat, and had seen him almost daily for 30 years, and not only had this never come up, but I never even had the slightest inkling.
Anyway, when he first told me, I didn't know how to react. Is he serious? He seems to be. How could I possibly not have known? Surely this affects absolutely everything. What is he expecting of me in this moment? What is the most useful way to respond? Etc. All of these thoughts just culminated in a blank silent stare. Eventually I said something like "I don't know what to say. I had no idea. I'm happy to chat about it if you like. I doubt I can help though." And we took it all very slowly and discussed it over the course of the night and into the morning, with him reminiscing numerous times about how close he was to telling me and/or me finding out by accident. One of the things that struck me most was even though he had only seriously made the one attempt, the idea had never left him, despite his subsequent marriage, kids, great health and financial success. They all seemed like useful distractions at best. But he ultimately couldn't escape his own mind, and that's where the demons were.
I mostly just listened and the few things I did say in retrospect were really dumb. The numerous beers didn't help. But even years later with hindsight, I don't know what can be said in that situation that is useful. I was trying to interject ideas about love being worth living for, and most suspected post-death options meaning death won't be an escape route, the same issues will just resurface again in another body / existential existence, into a conversation where he clearly didn't believe those things and I knew it. Anyway, I think he was happy that I said something rather than just staring blankly and letting him talk for hours, even if what I said contributed nothing, and he knew I respected his decision and didn't judge him for it.
After we finished chatting that night, he asked me never to tell anyone we knew and we never discussed it again, although our relationship felt much deeper for it.
Fast forward another 5 years, and he took his life anyway (the method wasn't revealed to me, and I didn't ask), to the complete shock of his wife and kids, and everyone else that knew him except his mother and me. At the wake, I was disappointed to hear the judgmental BS spouted about his decision, especially by those that were closest to him - reading through the forums here, I can see why it feels like the whole world is like that. But despite extreme temptation, I kept tight lipped about that night. Partly to avoid having the blowtorch turned on me, partly because it would just inflame things, but mostly because it felt like I had made a commitment to him that night that ultimately went beyond the grave.
Make of all this what you will but I believe the conversation that night was extremely positive for both of us even if ultimately the outcome was the same. I understand that is not the norm, and many here feel, perhaps correctly, that they have no-one in whom to confide where it will end well. Anyway, I thought this community might be interested in hearing a positive perspective from someone on the other side of that conversation.
I'm not a suicidal person, which may make my presence here strange. Though I have strongly advocated for doctor's rights to assist people who have chosen to die through legal and other public interest avenues, which includes the necessity to legalize attempted suicide. So I am firmly "pro-choice" in the context in which the term is used here.
I'd like to provide an alternate perspective that may interest this community. About 5 years ago, a very close lifelong friend confided in me that he had attempted suicide, using what this site dubs the "CO method", and failed after being found by his mother too soon. They decided that no-one else needed to know, and life went on. It was about 5 years later during one of our many philosophical chats over beers that he decided to tell me. I can remember the conversation like it was yesterday - I've never had one like it before or since. I should clarify here that I was the best man at this guy's wedding before this chat, and had seen him almost daily for 30 years, and not only had this never come up, but I never even had the slightest inkling.
Anyway, when he first told me, I didn't know how to react. Is he serious? He seems to be. How could I possibly not have known? Surely this affects absolutely everything. What is he expecting of me in this moment? What is the most useful way to respond? Etc. All of these thoughts just culminated in a blank silent stare. Eventually I said something like "I don't know what to say. I had no idea. I'm happy to chat about it if you like. I doubt I can help though." And we took it all very slowly and discussed it over the course of the night and into the morning, with him reminiscing numerous times about how close he was to telling me and/or me finding out by accident. One of the things that struck me most was even though he had only seriously made the one attempt, the idea had never left him, despite his subsequent marriage, kids, great health and financial success. They all seemed like useful distractions at best. But he ultimately couldn't escape his own mind, and that's where the demons were.
I mostly just listened and the few things I did say in retrospect were really dumb. The numerous beers didn't help. But even years later with hindsight, I don't know what can be said in that situation that is useful. I was trying to interject ideas about love being worth living for, and most suspected post-death options meaning death won't be an escape route, the same issues will just resurface again in another body / existential existence, into a conversation where he clearly didn't believe those things and I knew it. Anyway, I think he was happy that I said something rather than just staring blankly and letting him talk for hours, even if what I said contributed nothing, and he knew I respected his decision and didn't judge him for it.
After we finished chatting that night, he asked me never to tell anyone we knew and we never discussed it again, although our relationship felt much deeper for it.
Fast forward another 5 years, and he took his life anyway (the method wasn't revealed to me, and I didn't ask), to the complete shock of his wife and kids, and everyone else that knew him except his mother and me. At the wake, I was disappointed to hear the judgmental BS spouted about his decision, especially by those that were closest to him - reading through the forums here, I can see why it feels like the whole world is like that. But despite extreme temptation, I kept tight lipped about that night. Partly to avoid having the blowtorch turned on me, partly because it would just inflame things, but mostly because it felt like I had made a commitment to him that night that ultimately went beyond the grave.
Make of all this what you will but I believe the conversation that night was extremely positive for both of us even if ultimately the outcome was the same. I understand that is not the norm, and many here feel, perhaps correctly, that they have no-one in whom to confide where it will end well. Anyway, I thought this community might be interested in hearing a positive perspective from someone on the other side of that conversation.
Sweet emotion
Enlightened
- Sep 14, 2019
- 1,325
I'm sure my family knows that one day they are going to lose me. And they know they have to accept it. When you have had Complex Regional Pain Syndrome for 14 years, which is the highest ranking pain condition in medical history, they have to know that you aren't going to live the rest of your life is such brutal pain which attacks you every minute of the day. For anyone to EXPECT you to live like that is just ignorant and cruel. When I talk to people that have no idea about the disease, they look at me like I told them I just murdered thier first born. Are people so ignorant to believe that death is the worst thing in the world? There are far worse things in this life than death and we are experiencing them. All of us are tied to each other because we know the horrors life can bring. It really bothers me when people react so negativity to suicide. They don't even want to hear the person out. They automatically want to call the white coats to have you put away.
