Method Exit bag and inert gas megathread

[kudaphillips]

Doesn't sound like they 'implore' everyone to test the gas--It says, 'IF you have any concerns'

Right. But this is what I'm saying .

the person is obviously concerned about her prefilled cylinder . Testing seems easy solution

 

[standingfast]

Went to the local gas supplier and bought my 40 cubic feet of helium this morning. Walked in and just said "I need to purchase a 40 cubic feet cylinder of helium". Then he got it, I paid and I was gone. I dressed up sexy-ish to show the "girls" a little bit to distract. And I was light and casual.

 

[Tommen Baratheon]

@Tommen Baratheon I really do appreciate you taking the time to reply, it means a lot thank you so so much

np I've been on sick leave since June, so I 've got time. (-;

Keep in mind though that I'm not an expert. Most of what I know was picked up from this very thread and then I've got the latest PPeH. I forgot when I paid for it, but it should be good for at least another year. I also have the book 'Uitweg' (Dignified Dying) by Boudewijn Chabot.

But he talks about using 2 small helium for balloon tanks without a regulator. I'd like a bit more control than that. He does warn about helium tanks in the US mixed up with oxygen to prevent people from ctb.

 

[athiestjoe]

Folks on this mega thread may like this post from @Talvikki about this film released by Boudewijn Chabot about the Nitrogen method (if someone on this thread already had posted it, sorry about that). They did a very nice summary and then I went ahead and provided a translation of the video from Dutch in case people wanted to understand what was said, although the imagery already pretty made it self evident. Nitrogen film - information about the nitrogen method

 

[standingfast]

Is there some bodily prep before inert gas and exit bag, similar to with SN? Do I need to do anything?

 

[Endoflifer]

I found a breathing apparatus close to home, but it says it's for 300-bar cylinders and mine is 200 bar. Does that mean it won't work?

 

[OnMyLast Legs]

Are there examples of this working with young-ish and healthy people?

When I browse the Wikipedia list of suicides I see a lot of carbon monoxide (esp. East Asian music/film stars) but very few exit bags.

 

[Tommen Baratheon]

Are there examples of this working with young-ish and healthy people?

When I browse the Wikipedia list of suicides I see a lot of carbon monoxide (esp. East Asian music/film stars) but very few exit bags.

Do a search for 'helium suicide'. Didn't take me long to find an example of a 17yo.

 

[PlannedforPeru]

I appreciate all the help that was provided to me in the past and hope someone better informed could help me once again.

I'm consulting the people in this thread before going for round 2, do you think this would be enough to do the job at 25 LPM? Or should I revisit airgas and try to get a more pure, larger tank or just straight up refill this one? (For larger tank they said I need an account with a background check)

The canister is 40 cf with a nitrogen purity of 99.??? % (I have the documents I can pm if someone has purchased from AirGas before but both the seller and the documents were unclear to me).

For context, the regulator is argon instead of nitrogen and depending on the feedback I'm considering taping over the purge valve (maybe small hole) to repurpose the hood into an exit bag. More information and pictures can be found on this thread: https://sanctioned-suicide.net/threads/failed-attempt-to-ctb-with-inert-gas.183264/post-2725268


Edit: Did another test run with the dummy head, I recorded a video but my dumbass didn't see the how blinding the oxygen meter light was on the camera. Still posting it here:


but pretty much the reading was 0.1% (touched 0 for a split second) at 1:16 time mark when you can hear me kill the gas feed. At the very end I took out the mannequin head and you can barely see the oxygen leveling back out (2.2%, 3.9%, 4.5%, 5.2%). Again, pardon my lacking cinematography skills.

TLDR; It took about 1 minute to drop to 0.1% oxygen level at 25 LPM

 

[Tommen Baratheon]

I appreciate all the help that was provided to me in the past and hope someone better informed could help me once again.

I'm consulting the people in this thread before going for round 2, do you think this would be enough to do the job at 25 LPM? Or should I revisit airgas and try to get a more pure, larger tank or just straight up refill this one? (For larger tank they said I need an account with a background check)

The canister is 40 cf with a nitrogen purity of 99.??? % (I have the documents I can pm if someone has purchased from AirGas before but both the seller and the documents were unclear to me).

For context, the regulator is argon instead of nitrogen and depending on the feedback I'm considering taping over the purge valve (maybe small hole) to repurpose the hood into an exit bag. More information and pictures can be found on this thread: https://sanctioned-suicide.net/threads/failed-attempt-to-ctb-with-inert-gas.183264/post-2725268


Edit: Did another test run with the dummy head, I recorded a video but my dumbass didn't see the how blinding the oxygen meter light was on the camera. Still posting it here:


but pretty much the reading was 0.1% (touched 0 for a split second) at 1:16 time mark when you can hear me kill the gas feed. At the very end I took out the mannequin head and you can barely see the oxygen leveling back out (2.2%, 3.9%, 4.5%, 5.2%). Again, pardon my lacking cinematography skills.

TLDR; It took about 1 minute to drop to 0.1% oxygen level at 25 LPM

I don't know how to convert cf to bar. With bar and l the math isn't that hard. You multiple bar with l to know how much l compressed gas is in the tank.

A cylinder with 20 l at 200 bar contains 4.000 liter of compressed gas (20*200). You can now divide this by the flow to know what's available.

(20 l * 200 bar) / 25 l/min = 160 minutes

Thnx for the vid. It was surprising to me how much noise the gas makes. Also a question: which oxygen meter did you use? (SonI can add it to my shopping cart. :-)

 

[PlannedforPeru]

Thnx for the vid. It was surprising to me how much noise the gas makes. Also a question: which oxygen meter did you use? (SonI can add it to my shopping cart. :-)

Thanks for the work you do in this thread and helping again, I'll pm you the link since I'm not sure about rules on this stuff. For anyone else, check out AR8100 or shoot me a pm, I'm happy to answer any questions when I can about my setup or past experience. I'm probably not the best person for technicalities of the process lol but maybe I can be informative on acquiring stuff.

Fair warning, oxygen meter is a bit pricey on top of the cost of everything else.

 

[snailluvr]

hi all, does this look like the right pressure for a full 40CF argon tank? i am planning on doing this either tomorrow or a week and a half from now so i'm hoping this all looks right

 

[viadolorosa]

Thanks for all answers last time.

I have now done several exit bags. But there can be two problem when I test them. (Only bags over head. No nitrogen.)
1. Plastic often stick to mouth and nose when I breath.
2. I do not feel CO2 or lack of O2.

Will pressure from nitrogen flow solve problem 1?
Is problem 2 sign that air is leaking in = drawcord not tight enough? Or did I not test long enough? After how much time should I feel CO2 or lack of O2?

Thanks again.

 

[DeadManLiving]

After some additional research, I found liquid nitrogen is very easily obtained in the US. It's about $4/liter and you need ideally 10 - 15 liters to saturate a small enclosed space. The containers cost $200 - $300+ but can be purchased cheaper used. This hasn't been used by many people to ctb which is why it's still readily available. In terms of reliability and simplicity of setup, it should theoretically score highly. If more people actually try it, we will be more confident, but then it will also go the way of SN and become a legend of the past that no one can access anymore. I guess this is just the inevitable cycle all these methods go through as they get discovered.

At this point, the most ideal thing I can imagine, is rapidly decanting 10 liters liquid nitrogen, into a wide, flat container (like a metal pan or something), in medium-sized weatherproof tent. If you keep your body low to the ground, there's practically no chance you won't be out in seconds flat. It seems more foolproof that the mask/bag avenue, which it seems like people have a propensity to mess up some detail and abandon the method.

Yeah LN2 is the most effective bespoke method at this time. I mean the current scientific consensus and warning is that you never transport a Dewar of LN2 in an elevator. If you using an elevator the tank has to go up and down without anybody inside because if it spills you're 100% dead.

Your math and calculations on a vehicle cabin or accurate. About 20 L of LN2 spilled inside a vehicle cabin will be enough to double its internal pressure or replace the entire atmosphere two times over. You'll be dead in a few breaths or two. You could also do it in a tent and just lay down on the floor since the cool nitrogen gas will settle to the bottom and you'll die in the blanket plume peacefully. It's effectively a poor man's sarcopod. I have read many media reports of this method that were later retracted simply because of how effective it is. I mean you just spill it and you're dead. The important thing is to just keep it bespoke because of enough people catch on then we might see some restrictions on purchasing.

 

[ElusiveFreedom]

Hello, I didn't find any option for 600l of N2 in my area (EU, Czechia, Ostrava) but I found 700l He for baloons. What kind of stuff should I ask the shop to find out if it'll be sufficient?

 

[Tommen Baratheon]

Thanks for all answers last time.

I have now done several exit bags. But there can be two problem when I test them. (Only bags over head. No nitrogen.)
1. Plastic often stick to mouth and nose when I breath.
2. I do not feel CO2 or lack of O2.

Will pressure from nitrogen flow solve problem 1?
Is problem 2 sign that air is leaking in = drawcord not tight enough? Or did I not test long enough? After how much time should I feel CO2 or lack of O2?

Thanks again.

1. Some people wear a face mask to avoid this.
2. This is the advantage of inert gas: your body is deprived of oxygen, but your brain won't notice, so you won't gasp for air.

If you're testing /with/ gas (bag on top of your head, open gas, fill bag, hold breathe, bag over your head, close gas, breathe in) you should be out in 3 minutes max

 

[viadolorosa]

1. Some people wear a face mask to avoid this.
2. This is the advantage of inert gas: your body is deprived of oxygen, but your brain won't notice, so you won't gasp for air.

If you're testing /with/ gas (bag on top of your head, open gas, fill bag, hold breathe, bag over your head, close gas, breathe in) you should be out in 3 minutes max

Thanks. But the problem I see is this:

I do not feel CO2 or lack of O2. This can mean that CO2 leaks out and O2 comes in.
If this is true, N2 can leak out and O2 come in during ctb attempt with gas. Then failure is risk.
Conclusion: Exit bag must be tighter around neck.

Is this correct reasoning? Or is it normal to not feel CO2 after 10-20 deep breathings in bag?

And forgive my bad english.

 

[I_go_in]

Is there literally any risk in the full mask scuba method with Nitrogen? It seems like investing a few 100 bucks to have a 100% certain way to die peacefully is worth it. How could it possibly fail? Surprised it isn't used more in more advanced countries.

 

[kudaphillips]

Thanks. But the problem I see is this:

I do not feel CO2 or lack of O2. This can mean that CO2 leaks out and O2 comes in.
If this is true, N2 can leak out and O2 come in during ctb attempt with gas. Then failure is risk.
Conclusion: Exit bag must be tighter around neck.

Is this correct reasoning? Or is it normal to not feel CO2 after 10-20 deep breathings in bag?

And forgive my bad english.

Yes o2 can get In the bag when it's over your head when the gas is off . But the way this method functions , is that the flow of gas creates a positive pressure inside the bag which won't let outside air inside . You can feel this and assure yourself if you test it out , you feel the air rushing out the bottom of the bag .

You don't want the bag too tight , just snug. Certainly not an air tight fit.

 

[Endoflifer]

Hi fellow despondents (I presume)! I have everything I need but now have to start assembling and it makes me nervous. I'm so afraid I'll botch something or that there will be a leak and I'll be back to square one again. Right now I have another question regarding the cylinder itself. Looking up guidelines for installing the regulator I keep coming across warnings that you should always keep the cylinder upright and properly secured with a chain or belt, and never to move it with the regulator attached. Because if anything happens, the cylinder will be out of control and may break through walls. I mean, my god. Mine is 5 L, but still, I suppose the pressure inside is enough to cause a lot of damage. How seriously do you all take these warnings and how do you store and secure the cylinder?

 

[kudaphillips]

Hi fellow despondents (I presume)! I have everything I need but now have to start assembling and it makes me nervous. I'm so afraid I'll botch something or that there will be a leak and I'll be back to square one again. Right now I have another question regarding the cylinder itself. Looking up guidelines for installing the regulator I keep coming across warnings that you should always keep the cylinder upright and properly secured with a chain or belt, and never to move it with the regulator attached. Because if anything happens, the cylinder will be out of control and may break through walls. I mean, my god. Mine is 5 L, but still, I suppose the pressure inside is enough to cause a lot of damage. How seriously do you all take these warnings and how do you store and secure the cylinder?

They have to have this type of warnings to cover their ass. You could probably drop your cylinder from 6 feet and it would be fine . Doesn't mean you should take the precautions thiugh, and obviously don't do anything like that .

There's no reason to store the cylinder with the regulator hooked up , but you could it's not a big deal . I'd wager to guess no one in this thread has ever personally had a cylinder explode or anything like that . I'd worry more about the procedure and bag construction and SI rather than dangers of storing the cylinder

 

[Endoflifer]

Thanks for replying! Yes, I worry about those things as well, but first things first, I have to make sure the gas will flow, so handling the cylinder ('cracking' it when first using it, for example) and hooking up the regulator and hose and checking for leaks are my initial concerns right now, and they are more than enough already!

 

[Endoflifer]

I'm actually going to start by making the exit bag. I do have a question about the hose. I got an aquarium hose that seems to fit tightly onto the hose barb that came with the regulator. Internal diameter is 6 mm. That should be fine, right? Much appreciated!

 

[littleadonis]

1. What size range for the bag is OK? PPeH says 35x50 cm. Any other suggestions?

I wouldn't go smaller than the recommendation. My reasoning is that at a minimum you need more gas in the bag than your lung volume. (about 5 liters) Otherwise when you inhale it might pull air in from outside. Then you need safety factor and enough gas to dilute any exhaled co2. I have made a test bag following the PPeH recommendation and inflated it using a bike air pump and it felt like a good size.

I'm not sure if there is any downside to a larger bag other than it will take longer to inflate at the start.

Where did you hear this? I was just about to buy a 35x43cm oven bag that I thought would be more than enough.

 

[exitingtothevoid]

Where did you hear this? I was just about to buy a 35x43cm oven bag that I thought would be more than enough.

I actually didn't hear it anywhere, it came from thinking about how this works. Imagine you have a bag that is only slightly larger than your head. Maybe it only holds 1l of gas when fully inflated with your head in it. If you fully exhale before pulling the bag down, then try to inhale the full 5l that your lungs can hold, you'll need 4l more gas than is in the bag. That 4l has to come from somewhere. Either it'll pull 4l of air though the neck opening, or you'll suck the bag down around your nose and mouth.

But it's hard to say how small is too small without measuring the free volume of the bag on your head. 35x43cm still seems big enough, I guess?

 

[littleadonis]

35x43cm still seems big enough, I guess?

I went with the 43x55cm one instead.

 

[kudaphillips]

I actually didn't hear it anywhere, it came from thinking about how this works. Imagine you have a bag that is only slightly larger than your head. Maybe it only holds 1l of gas when fully inflated with your head in it. If you fully exhale before pulling the bag down, then try to inhale the full 5l that your lungs can hold, you'll need 4l more gas than is in the bag. That 4l has to come from somewhere. Either it'll pull 4l of air though the neck opening, or you'll suck the bag down around your nose and mouth.

But it's hard to say how small is too small without measuring the free volume of the bag on your head. 35x43cm still seems big enough, I guess?

This is def discussed in pph. My understanding is the smaller bag allows more co2 build up.
In a larger bag, you won't notice any CO2 buildup. That's why the larger bags are recommended.

 

[blacksand]

Are there examples of this working with young-ish and healthy people?

When I browse the Wikipedia list of suicides I see a lot of carbon monoxide (esp. East Asian music/film stars) but very few exit bags.

Unless being young can let you survive breathing a 0% oxygen environment then yes it will kill you stone dead just like anyone else.

 

[oono]

Is there literally any risk in the full mask scuba method with Nitrogen? It seems like investing a few 100 bucks to have a 100% certain way to die peacefully is worth it. How could it possibly fail? Surprised it isn't used more in more advanced countries.

There is a guide on this forum for the SCUBA method, made by user "befree". This is personally the method I want to use.

 

[Placo]

Lately I've been fine but after reading the news of a boy who died because of laughing gas I'm getting the idea of having a suicide in the drawer with this method, at least you die laughing, but I imagine the complexity is considerable and I don't live alone.