Discussion DMT Simulated death?

[lostonetoo]

DMT or Ayahuasca- Active ingredient- Dimethyltryptamine

Dimethyltryptamine is a chemical found in all of us, it is stored in the brain and released in the very final moments before death, it is widely accepted in the scientific community that this is the cause of euphoria in the final moments and Near Death Experiences i.e. tunnel vision and recounting of life experiences.

Dimethyltryptamine is also found in other animals most notably toads,

People who ingest Ayahuasca or DMT report a mixture of terrifying and comforting near death experiences. it has been credited for miracle turnarounds in users state of mind in the aftermath. many report instantly finding spirituality,A world renowned addiction psychologist (Gabor Mate) suggested 1 dose could be equivilant to 1000 hours counselling.

These are class A substances but pose zero danger to physical health. Only mental. You may think you are dying on it but there is no chance you will, you could not possibly overdose.

I am right at the end but there is no way Im going until i have experimented with this fully. I have souced mine and will enter the afterlife briefly anyday now.

Anybody who is truly at the end I suggest try this as a last ditch attempt to save themselves. its the one thing that could turn everything in an instant

if you dont you are heading for this experience anyway.

I should add these are very powerful psychedelics and would come with some risk of psychosis althiugh i believe it to be low

 

[Tommen Baratheon]

Don't a lot of people on DMT experience the presence of so-called 'machine elves'?

 

[lostonetoo]

Don't a lot of people on DMT experience the presence of so-called 'machine elves'?

Yes the Elves appear to be more present in 5meo DMT

So strange a chemical can produce such similar specific entities in multiple users.

 

[Esokabat]

Yes the Elves appear to be more present in 5meo DMT

So strange a chemical can produce such similar specific entities in multiple users.

WRONG.
Why comment if you don't know what you are talking about.
Nn-DMT = elves
5-MeO-DMt = no elves
Ayahuasca = nn-DMT
Simulated Death and complete ego death= 5MEO-DMT

 

[KillingPain267]

NEAR-death experiences are not death. Nobody knows what comes after those experiences when the brain truly dies and no chemicals are released, let alone DMT. A real simulation of death would be either something unknown or simply unconsciousness. Drink yourself to a black out or go under anesthesia fully unconscious or simply go to sleep and don't dream, that would be a more realistic simulation of death.

many report instantly finding spirituality,

This is nonsense. Chemicals are not spirituality. This was the failure of the Hippie movement. They thought change in society could come in a pill or tab. Even tribes who use natural psychedelics in their area use them in conjunction with a whole lot of rituals, wisdom of the ancients and community. Some tribes even use alcohol and not psychedelics. Does that make alcohol a spiritual tool? No, it's just chemicals. But some people do feel so stimulated by their first drinks that they think they have found instant "spirituality" or at least a new level to reality.

 

[lostonetoo]

WRONG.
Why comment if you don't know what you are talking about.
Nn-DMT = elves
5-MeO-DMt = no elves
Ayahuasca = nn-DMT
Simulated Death and complete ego death= 5MEO-DMT

Do you know what you are talikng about?

Why would you suggest 5meo causes the human NDE when it is the NN form which is stored in our brains and released naturally?
Ayahuasca is indeed nnDMT mixed with a MAOI inhibitor to lengthen the experience. NNDMT can be obtained sperateley.
And elves could be seen on either.

NEAR-death experiences are not death. Nobody knows what comes after those experiences when the brain truly dies and no chemicals are released, let alone DMT. A real simulation of death would be either something unknown or simply unconsciousness. Drink yourself to a black out or go under anesthesia fully unconscious or simply go to sleep and don't dream, that would be a more realistic simulation of death.

This is nonsense. Chemicals are not spirituality. This was the failure of the Hippie movement. They thought change in society could come in a pill or tab. Even tribes who use natural psychedelics in their area use them in conjunction with a whole lot of rituals, wisdom of the ancients and community. Some tribes even use alcohol and not psychedelics. Does that make alcohol a spiritual tool? No, it's just chemicals. But some people do feel so stimulated by their first drinks that they think they have found instant "spirituality" or at least a new level to reality.

Many report instantly finding spirituality. I stand by this statement, go on youtube and view the testimonies for yourself. I find it a little silly to compare it to alcohol

WRONG.
Why comment if you don't know what you are talking about.
Nn-DMT = elves
5-MeO-DMt = no elves
Ayahuasca = nn-DMT
Simulated Death and complete ego death= 5MEO-DMT

With regard to the Ego Death that could be achieved by any psychedelic.

5meo is the most potent, perhaps that is the point you wish make

 

[Esokabat]

Do you know what you are talikng about?

Why would you suggest 5meo causes the human NDE when it is the NN form which is stored in our brains and released naturally?
Ayahuasca is indeed nnDMT mixed with a MAOI inhibitor to lengthen the experience. NNDMT can be obtained sperateley.
And elves could be seen on either.

Many report instantly finding spirituality. I stand by this statement, go on youtube and view the testimonies for yourself. I find it a little silly to compare it to alcohol

With regard to the Ego Death that could be achieved by any psychedelic.

5meo is the most potent, perhaps that is the point you wish make

Show me one person that saw elves on pure 5 MEO and I might believe your uninformed, erroneous statement.
You are wrong. You are uninformed.

And the NDE experience cannot be compared to an nn-DMT experience, they are nothing alike, I tell you from experience and as a researcher.

If you would have bothered to research this more, people who actually study NDEs don't believe that is has anything to do with nn-DMT.
If you give nn-DMT to a person who actually had an NDE, they will laugh at the comparison. They literally do not share ANY common feature.

The pure 5-MEO experience has some elements that are comparable to an NDE, although only to one specific small segment of an NDE which normally has many different segments shared across subjects. So we can say that the 5 MEO has a component that is also a component of NDEs, but NDEs contain about 20 other components that 5 MEO does not contain.
On the other hand, nn-DMT experience does not contain any shared elements with an NDE so if the brain produces nn-DMT at the time of death, then the conclusion is that NDEs are not produced by nn-DMT.

Your research stayed at the surface. You are arrogant to think you know so much about this subject.
The type of ego death that is caused by 5MEO cannot be re-produced by other psychedelic.
Just don't even bother quoting me or answering me because as soon as you told me that there are elves on 5, I can see that you have neither knowledge on this subject, nor any experience.

 

[Tommen Baratheon]

This is nonsense. Chemicals are not spirituality. This was the failure of the Hippie movement. They thought change in society could come in a pill or tab. Even tribes who use natural psychedelics in their area use them in conjunction with a whole lot of rituals, wisdom of the ancients and community. Some tribes even use alcohol and not psychedelics. Does that make alcohol a spiritual tool? No, it's just chemicals. But some people do feel so stimulated by their first drinks that they think they have found instant "spirituality" or at least a new level to reality.

If you have never experienced psychosis there is no way for a "normal" person to understand this, but during my first psychosis (no drugs) I had what can be called a 'spiritual awakening'. A feeling of One, an overwhelming feeling and an understanding of The Meaning of Life (not the movie). Everything was so obvious. Unfortunately, there was also fear and paranoia, some would go so far to call it a failed Kundalini experience. But I've met others who had the similar experience... without chemicals. But scientists aren't really interested in researching this.

If taking drugs (or consuming plants, mushrooms, ...) can lead (help) to what a person is experiencing as spiritual, then who are you to judge? You'll probably explain psychosis as chemicals/neurotransmitters/... as well - it's all in the brain - , but have you ever experienced such spirituality yourself?

 

[AmericanMary]

DMT put me in psychosis for a long ass time. Be careful <3

 

[lostonetoo]

DMT put me in psychosis for a long ass time. Be careful <3

Did you have prior mental issues?

 

[AmericanMary]

Did you have prior mental issues?

At the time these were my diagnosis: ADD, OCD, bipolar.

I had never dissociated. I had never experienced psychosis.

I tried DMT. It was a cool experience for sure. But it fucked with how my mind works.

I am not religious. At all. Even a little. Yet I met a "religious" type figure. A god figure. For months after, I still heard his voice sometimes.

I'd have dreams and flash backs to what I saw on DMT.

Insane experience.

 

[KillingPain267]

If you have never experienced psychosis there is no way for a "normal" person to understand this, but during my first psychosis (no drugs) I had what can be called a 'spiritual awakening'. A feeling of One, an overwhelming feeling and an understanding of The Meaning of Life (not the movie). Everything was so obvious. Unfortunately, there was also fear and paranoia, some would go so far to call it a failed Kundalini experience. But I've met others who had the similar experience... without chemicals. But scientists aren't really interested in researching this.

If taking drugs (or consuming plants, mushrooms, ...) can lead (help) to what a person is experiencing as spiritual, then who are you to judge? You'll probably explain psychosis as chemicals/neurotransmitters/... as well - it's all in the brain - , but have you ever experienced such spirituality yourself?

When I once took LSD and drank vodka everything also became "obvious". But then I went to the hospital, and starting being ultra-talkative with the staff (I usually have severe social anxiety) all while being paranoid of them. I felt connected with one of the ambulance responders asking if was an introvert (and he looked surprised how I could know that). After the trip I realized from their notes in my medical journal that I acted like a jerk and/or crazy person who couldn't rest. I am still ashamed of it. So, does that mean anything? Is vodka now a tool for spiritual enlightenment too? No. It's just a CNS-depressant. I've seen my father in full psychosis shitting his pants and talking to invisible dead people and hallucinating that his father had died. All of what he experience was not part of physical reality. The real spiritual enlightenment is to take physical reality head-on and see how horrible and God-forsaken this universe is and that everyone is selfish (and thus not "One" with anything) at least not how the universe is structured now. There hasn't come any science or technology from people with heads full of acid. We already have a tool to perceive reality, it's called a normal/average/neurotypical brain (I say this as a non-neurotypical person with OCD and severe social anxiety) that can calmly study physical reality (as boring as it is). Who is to say that "Oneness" is the "true" reality? What if this world really is just fragmented categories and the supernatural is hidden from us currently for a reason? The idea that shrooms and acid (obvious chemicals with a direct reaction on neurotransmitters) somehow open up a non-chemical world is ridiculous imo. But things like meditational experiences are definitely more realistic. Things like NDEs are also interesting from a philosophical standpoint.

Anyway, this is just what I believe

I'm actually interested in what you believe causes psychosis, if not chemicals and neurotransmitters?

 

[Tommen Baratheon]

When I once took LSD and drank vodka everything also became "obvious". But then I went to the hospital, and starting being ultra-talkative with the staff (I usually have severe social anxiety) all while being paranoid of them. I felt connected with one of the ambulance responders asking if was an introvert (and he looked surprised how I could know that). After the trip I realized from their notes in my medical journal that I acted like a jerk and/or crazy person who couldn't rest. I am still ashamed of it. So, does that mean anything? Is vodka now a tool for spiritual enlightenment too? No. It's just a CNS-depressant. I've seen my father in full psychosis shitting his pants and talking to invisible dead people and hallucinating that his father had died. All of what he experience was not part of physical reality. The real spiritual enlightenment is to take physical reality head-on and see how horrible and God-forsaken this universe is and that everyone is selfish (and thus not "One" with anything) at least not how the universe is structured now. There hasn't come any science or technology from people with heads full of acid. We already have a tool to perceive reality, it's called a normal/average/neurotypical brain (I say this as a non-neurotypical person with OCD and severe social anxiety) that can calmly study physical reality (as boring as it is). Who is to say that "Oneness" is the "true" reality? What if this world really is just fragmented categories and the supernatural is hidden from us currently for a reason? The idea that shrooms and acid (obvious chemicals with a direct reaction on neurotransmitters) somehow open up a non-chemical world is ridiculous imo. But things like meditational experiences are definitely more realistic. Things like NDEs are also interesting from a philosophical standpoint.

Anyway, this is just what I believe

I'm actually interested in what you believe causes psychosis, if not chemicals and neurotransmitters?

In my case mania induced sleep deprivation and stress. (-: You know what's interesting ? I'm reading this book from a known Dutch psychiatrist, 'Psychose begrijpen in 33 vragen' (Understanding psychosis in 33 questions). He states there has been many research over the years, but they haven't found even one, not a single one, diagnostic biomarker concerning psychosis. He says: 'it is impossible to structural, functional or chemical connect psychotic experiences to brainfunctioning'.

Does that mean chemicals or neurotransmitters are not involved? (I know the human body has cannabinoid receptors.) They probably are, but that's not my point. I'm talking about the experience itself, no matter what other things a so-called psychotic person does or says. In my case, that "clarity" if you will only lasted for a few minutes and then I went bonkers. But I choose to believe those brief, clear moments were something special.

I respect what you believe; I just don't see it like that.

 

[KillingPain267]

In my case mania induced sleep deprivation and stress. (-: You know what's interesting ? I'm reading this book from a known Dutch psychiatrist, 'Psychose begrijpen in 33 vragen' (Understanding psychosis in 33 questions). He states there has been many research over the years, but they haven't found even one, not a single one, diagnostic biomarker concerning psychosis. He says: 'it is impossible to structural, functional or chemical connect psychotic experiences to brainfunctioning'.

Does that mean chemicals or neurotransmitters are not involved? (I know the human body has cannabinoid receptors.) They probably are, but that's not my point. I'm talking about the experience itself, no matter what other things a so-called psychotic person does or says. In my case, that "clarity" if you will only lasted for a few minutes and then I went bonkers. But I choose to believe those brief, clear moments were something special.

I respect what you believe; I just don't see it like that.

Interesting stuff and reference. Thank you. Even though I'm a physicalist, ironically I kind of agree with the statement of that psychiatrist, and would actually expand it to things like depression or even skizophrenia. I mean, scientists don't even fully know or agree how even alcohol works on the brain, even though it's such a common drug. But I think it has more to do with the slow progression and limited science in neurology, psychiatry and psychology.

Interesting stuff about the moment of extra-clarity. Some say that in their NDE, that the experience felt "hyper-real". Although I still believe it is a physical process, it sure is interesting and I kind of want to experience that, lol. But I don't wanna mess with psychedelics or even cannabis anymore, it always increases my anxiety. I'm more of a depressant kind of guy, alcohol, opioids etc. Lol. Although I'm sober now. So now I stick to just reading and listening and thinking about science and philosophy to distract myself. I'll look up that Dutch psychiatrist.

 

[lita-lassi]

ive done dmt quite a few times, and currently coming out of an intense acid trip rn, i can say that it will certainly grant a new perspective on some shit but it isnt magic. its just chemistry. im still a very broken person who's just had a few more holes poked in reality. i think the few it worked so well on are intensely lucky. for me it just feels like... more mess, just prettier and very different