Amitriptyline reliability

[121792]

Hello, I'm thinking of using the amitriptyline method but I'm worried about whether or not it will work. Also, what damage could be done if you were unsuccessful?

In the 2019 peaceful pill handbook, it says reliability is 8/10, but in the recent peaceful pill ehandbook, it says 6/10. Is this because of how long it can take to kill you - 12 to 24 hours or longer, thus increasing the risk of being found before you are dead? It says in the 2019 book that survival from amitriptyline is rare.

I never want to go back to a mental hospital again, so do you think I will be successful? 10 grams of ami with 300mg of diazepam and 30mg of metoclopramide.

Have I got anything to worry about apart from being found? I really want this method to work.
Most people here seem to be going the SN route but there doesn't seem much mention about amitriptyline.

I'd just love my mind to be put at ease and feel confident that this method will work. I won't be found as I live alone and nobody visits me.

Any info you have that would put my mind at ease would be much appreciated.

 

[LostSoul1965]

Hello, I'm thinking of using the amitriptyline method but I'm worried about whether or not it will work. Also, what damage could be done if you were unsuccessful?

In the 2019 peaceful pill handbook, it says reliability is 8/10, but in the recent peaceful pill ehandbook, it says 6/10. Is this because of how long it can take to kill you - 12 to 24 hours or longer, thus increasing the risk of being found before you are dead? It says in the 2019 book that survival from amitriptyline is rare.

I never want to go back to a mental hospital again, so do you think I will be successful? 10 grams of ami with 300mg of diazepam and 30mg of metoclopramide.

Have I got anything to worry about apart from being found? I really want this method to work.
Most people here seem to be going the SN route but there doesn't seem much mention about amitriptyline.

I'd just love my mind to be put at ease and feel confident that this method will work. I won't be found as I live alone and nobody visits me.

Any info you have that would put my mind at ease would be much appreciated.

No one can say if it will work for certain. If you follow the correct protocol as described in the PPeH then chances of success are very good.

 

[121792]

No one can say if it will work for certain. If you follow the correct protocol as described in the PPeH then chances of success are very good.

Thanks for the reply. I hope so!

 

[athiestjoe]

Also, what damage could be done if you were unsuccessful?

Greatly could depend at far along it was, if the brain lost oxygen, etc. But the biggie to consider would be that excessive amounts (TCAs like amitriptyline raise serotonin levels) may result in serotonin syndrome with symptoms like confusion, rapid heart rate, high blood pressure, and muscle rigidity. But it is hard to say what the actual liklihood would be for an attempt but I always figure people should go into an attempt with two scenarios (1) it is going to be successful and be sure it is what you want as if you can't take back the action and die well that's it and (2) be willing to deal with any permanent consequences of a failure and research what those could be for each method. So I am glad you asked as it means you are considering what's the worst case scenario for surviving the attempt and thus are not acting impulsively and trying to carefully plan your self-deliverance.

Any info you have that would put my mind at ease would be much appreciated.

I am not sure if it will put you at ease, but let me try to address a few things about this method and maybe something will be helpful, maybe not.

it can take to kill you - 12 to 24 hours or longer,

It could possibly take even longer than that 12-24 hour period. Suggestions go as high as not to be found for 48 hours.

From w o z z's Ways to a dignified self-determined death it also sounds like a pretty long, drawn out way to CTB:

Lethal dose
For all tricyclic antidepressants we recommend a dose of 6 g. For a long and deep sleep, the combination with benzodiazepine is necessary (see below). Tricyclic antidepressants slow down the digestive process and thus their own absorption. Death should normally occur 12 to 24 hours after ingestion of these deadly drugs. However, one should know that dying sometimes takes 24 to 48 hours.
In order for self-determined dying to succeed, it is essential that no life-saving measures are initiated in the first 48 hours.

Then the issue about inconsistent dosing, for example even the PPH changed its dosing over the years until it got to the current 10g. Other literature though say 6g-7.5g of the TCA:

Lethal dose

The lethal dose of all mentioned tricyclic antidepressants is given with a quantity between 6g and 7.5g.

In the book of the WOZZ - Foundation a dose of 6g is mentioned (cf. Admiraal, Chabot, Ogden, Loenen, van, Pennings: Wege zu einem humanen, selbstbestimmten Sterben, Amsterdam, 2008, p.91). Chabot gives a lethal dose of 7.5g (cf. Chabot: Dignified Dying.
A Guide. 2014, p.96). The dose of the long-acting benzodiazepine taken in combination should be at least 500mg (cf. Admiraal, Chabot, Ogden, Loenen, van, Pennings: Ways to a humane, self-determined dying, Amsterdam, 2008, p.92 and Chabot: Dignified Dying.
A Guide. 2014, p.96).
Click to expand...

Then as you noted the PPH says 10g (when not part of a 5-drug cocktail, 8g in the 5-drug mix). PPH suggests not being found for 24 hours, which along with wozz's mention of 48 hours sure makes this method sound not very ideal, but again I can totally understand the desire to get out of this miserable world and looking for an available method.

It sounds you have previous copies, you will also notice the dosage in the PPH/PPEH has changed over the years from a lower dose to its current 10g suggestion, adding to the wiggle room to find a sweet spot. In 2012 it said 5g, in 2019 it said 8g, then began to say 8-10g, now says 10g. So in 12 years the dose suggestion doubled. And along the way the meto dose changed from 60mg to 30mg. I think what I am sort of getting at as things change, while there is a scienfic basis to it the PPH/PPEH is still subject to changes as Dr. PN is adjusting as it goes along doing the best he and his partner can to provide information but this 12 year change doubling the dose should kind of show why perhaps there are still some reliability concerns for this or other methods (no method is without its risk of course).

There is a discussion as to how they got to their rating and I bet one of the factors is the fact this is not a peaceful way to die (it literallly says 'it is not peaceful' in their blurb on it and note that while it can be done as a single agent, it is 'greatly enhanced' as part of the cocktail mentioned above and it scores very low on the process side given how slow it is).

Taking into account that even in the current MAID protocol of DDMAPh, it calls for 8g of Amitriptyline on top of all the other medications so take with that as you will as to if a lower dose of a TCA alone would be sufficient: https://www.acamaid.org/pharmacologyinfoupdates/

That's a pretty range of so-called lethal doses. Individual facts like weight and health likely also play a role so it is not really a one-size fits all situation, leading to more ambiguity on a successful dosing.

With whatever you decide, I hope you find everything you are looking for and get peace & serenity.

 

[121792]

Greatly could depend at far along it was, if the brain lost oxygen, etc. But the biggie to consider would be that excessive amounts (TCAs like amitriptyline raise serotonin levels) may result in serotonin syndrome with symptoms like confusion, rapid heart rate, high blood pressure, and muscle rigidity. But it is hard to say what the actual liklihood would be for an attempt but I always figure people should go into an attempt with two scenarios (1) it is going to be successful and be sure it is what you want as if you can't take back the action and die well that's it and (2) be willing to deal with any permanent consequences of a failure and research what those could be for each method. So I am glad you asked as it means you are considering what's the worst case scenario for surviving the attempt and thus are not acting impulsively and trying to carefully plan your self-deliverance.


I am not sure if it will put you at ease, but let me try to address a few things about this method and maybe something will be helpful, maybe not.



It could possibly take even longer than that 12-24 hour period. Suggestions go as high as not to be found for 48 hours.

From w o z z's Ways to a dignified self-determined death it also sounds like a pretty long, drawn out way to CTB:


Then the issue about inconsistent dosing, for example even the PPH changed its dosing over the years until it got to the current 10g. Other literature though say 6g-7.5g of the TCA:

Then as you noted the PPH says 10g (when not part of a 5-drug cocktail, 8g in the 5-drug mix). PPH suggests not being found for 24 hours, which along with wozz's mention of 48 hours sure makes this method sound not very ideal, but again I can totally understand the desire to get out of this miserable world and looking for an available method.

It sounds you have previous copies, you will also notice the dosage in the PPH/PPEH has changed over the years from a lower dose to its current 10g suggestion, adding to the wiggle room to find a sweet spot. In 2012 it said 5g, in 2019 it said 8g, then began to say 8-10g, now says 10g. So in 12 years the dose suggestion doubled. And along the way the meto dose changed from 60mg to 30mg. I think what I am sort of getting at as things change, while there is a scienfic basis to it the PPH/PPEH is still subject to changes as Dr. PN is adjusting as it goes along doing the best he and his partner can to provide information but this 12 year change doubling the dose should kind of show why perhaps there are still some reliability concerns for this or other methods (no method is without its risk of course).

There is a discussion as to how they got to their rating and I bet one of the factors is the fact this is not a peaceful way to die (it literallly says 'it is not peaceful' in their blurb on it and note that while it can be done as a single agent, it is 'greatly enhanced' as part of the cocktail mentioned above and it scores very low on the process side given how slow it is).

Taking into account that even in the current MAID protocol of DDMAPh, it calls for 8g of Amitriptyline on top of all the other medications so take with that as you will as to if a lower dose of a TCA alone would be sufficient: https://www.acamaid.org/pharmacologyinfoupdates/

That's a pretty range of so-called lethal doses. Individual facts like weight and health likely also play a role so it is not really a one-size fits all situation, leading to more ambiguity on a successful dosing.

With whatever you decide, I hope you find everything you are looking for and get peace & serenity.

Thanks for your detailed message, sorry for the late reply.

I'm fairly sure I will be undisturbed for up 48 hours as I live alone and nobody visits me... so I should be okay there.

I have the Peaceful Pill Handbook 2019 edition and it says the peacefulness is a 7 out of 10. I also have the info from the PP E-Handbook (updated version), but the 3 pages I have doesn't mention anything about peacefulness. In the PPH, it says that the benzodiazepam is needed to make it peaceful. So with a 7/10 score and the fact that it says the BD will make it peaceful, surely it will be? You said it says it isn't peaceful? What exactly does it say?

Yeah, I'm taking my time with this and not rushing into anything. Another worry I have is whether the benzodiazepam will be effective. The reason I worry is because I found a place to get them online and took them recreationally to relax me. The last time I took them, high doses didn't really seem to have much of an effect, so I'm worried they might not be as effective now. I didn't abuse them, but I took 20mgs a few times as I felt really relaxed and they made me sleep which was pleasant. Then I bought them again and high doses didn't seem to have much effect. So I'm a little worried. The last time I took them was April this year... so it's been a while and if I do decided to go through with my plans, it wouldn't be until the new year. I'm not sure when really as I'm worried about the shelf life of the pills. One of the websites I bought pills from before had an upcoming expiration date of like a few months. So I'm also worried about what the amitriptyline will be... will they have an expiration date that is soon up. If so, should I take them sooner.

I googled a bit about it and it said that drugs can last a lot longer than their expiration date... if that's the case I might possibly wait until next summer, but I'm not sure.

You said in 2019, it said 8 grams, but I have the 2019 edition and it says 10 grams in it. The same as the updated version.
The reliability was 8 in 2019 and now I believe it is 6 out of 10.

Why do you think more people aren't opting for the amitriptyline route? Is it because it can take so long to die?

Is serotonin syndrome something you can get over at home or would you need to go to the hospital. If if didn't work, it would be nice if I could just stay at home and recover from whatever side-effects occur as I really don't want to go to a mental hospital.

I'm not really prepared for the side-effects but this seemed like one of the best methods. I had the link to the place you get sodium nitrate but I've forgot it now unfortunately. I don't think I would be able to test it for purity and I also heard it can turn you blue and certain things which put me off.

It's a pity it wasn't more simple and we could all get nembutal. I've thought about suspension hanging and tried it a few years ago but couldn't get it to work, so I don't have that method either. Amitriptyline seems like the only route to go down for me.

Anyway, thanks for your information. Good luck!

 

[ozymandias1]

I was thinking about amitriptyline too but now after reading this thread, I'm not so sure lol. I initially preferred it at first because pills are simple and not ugly whilst the hypoxia method requires lots of equipment and research and you have to die with a plastic bag over your head which might be ugly and traumatising for anyone who finds you, but I don't want to suffer for 48hrs lol. Plus, I don't know how I'm supposed to get that amount of amitriptyline and benzodiazapine in the UK all at once. Hypoxia it is I guess.

 

[maniac116]

In general, prescription drugs have less than 14% success & yes, there is a possibility of physical or mental disability & further suffering.
Personally I wouldn't do it, but I hope you find peace in whatever you decide