A misanthrope is a humanist

[Epsilon0]

Hmm... so you are saying that in order for misanthropy to exist in an individual it has to be translated into action? It cannot merely be present at an intellectual level alone?

Because that's where I am at. My misanthropy lives only within my mind, it does not make a show of itself firstly because I am moulded by my religious and moral upbringing, and secondly because it is not in my nature to show contempt, disrespect or discriminate anyone.

I have to give this some thought, but for now, I will say that I am so glad we chanced upon this forum at the same time. Your posts have given me not a few laughs and quite many intellectual kicks.

Goodie bag :-) Can I call you that?

Or is that too cheesy for a misanthrope in the making?

Now, how about you? Where do you score on a scale of 0 to 10 where 10 is "I hate everyone and their dog".

I was thinking today about three similar words:

Misogyny
Misandry
Misanthropy

The first two are attitudes revealed by words and actions. There is contempt, derision, dismissal, devaluation, denial, hatred, and disrespect aimed at another gender, based on a belief that one gender is right and the other is wholly or almost wholly wrong and of no moral but perhaps some practical value. While one may still interact with the other gender out of necessity (such as social contact at work or with family members) or personal wants or needs (such as sexual contact, reproduction, and child rearing), the other gender is viewed with contempt and disrespect, as unworthy of consideration, respect, or equal treatment, as utterly hopeless, and as incapable of reaching bars raised by the belief systems or personal beliefs of the misogynist/misandrist. Such views lead to excusing abusive and exclusionary behaviors toward members of the opposite gender. I would tentatively hypothesize that such stances are arrived at through personal negative experiences and/or exposure to social systems of belief, whether familial, religious, cultural, etc.

In this line of reasoning, the misanthrope feels the same ways listed at the beginning of the above paragraph about other humans and humanity. The stance is revealed by words and actions. The misanthrope may continue to engage out of necessity or want, but in a narcissistic, self-serving way, rather than reciprocal or mutually-serving. One's experiences and influences can lead to becoming a misanthrope and seeing humans as wholly or almost wholly wrong, of limited value, and unworthy of respect, consideration, or equal treatment. Such views lead to excusing abusive and exclusionary treatment of other humans.

Based on your consistent behaviors on SS in general and with me personally, I do not judge your character as being in any kind of danger of becoming misanthropic.

But I don't live inside you and what I think only has value for me in determining if you are a safe and desirable person for me to interact with.

It's far more important to ask yourself, What do you think? Have I made a strong case for what misanthropy is, and is that what you are heading toward? Do you have desire for or repulsion to it? Do you have agency in whether or not you want to or actually become one? And is it a temporary, understandable and forgivable state you experience as well as other any other temporary and understandable state?

 

[Deleted member 1465]

Hmm... so you are saying that in order for misanthropy to exist in an individual it has to be translated into action? It cannot merely be present at an intellectual level alone?

Because that's where I am at. My misanthropy lives only within my mind, it does not make a show of itself firstly because I am moulded by my religious and moral upbringing, and secondly because it is not in my nature to show contempt, disrespect or discriminate anyone.

I have to give this some thought, but for now, I will say that I am so glad we chanced upon this forum at the same time. Your posts have given me not a few laughs and quite many intellectual kicks.

Goodie bag :-) Can I call you that?

Or is that too cheesy for a misanthrope in the making?

Now, how about you? Where do you score on a scale of 0 to 10 where 10 is "I hate everyone and their dog".

May I answer that too?

 

[Epsilon0]

May I answer that too?

Need you ask? I just made you a cuppa. It's waiting for you.

 

[GoodPersonEffed]

@Epsilon0, one can always pretend but hold hate and desire to harm in their heart. Thoughts are also actions. I'll of course allow you to define you. :)

Yeah, it's been great being on SS with you at the same time for sure!

Goodie bag? My first impression is that it sounds like an aged sex worker, so no.

I'm not misanthropic at all. I have issues with individuals, groups, and cultures. I am sad and sometimes angry, but I am also compassionate even to those whom I judge to be the worst, even as I'm defensive or defending against them. As I've said on other threads, I agree with MLK and Gandhi, I would deny the sharing of Paradise to no one, but damn is it a struggle to get everyone to agree we all deserve it and to share it safely and equally.

May I answer that too?

You are not allowed to answer about "Goodie bag."



No, really.

 

[Epsilon0]

@Epsilon0, one can always pretend but hold hate and desire to harm in their heart. Thoughts are also actions. I'll of course allow you to define you. :)

Yeah, it's been great being on SS with you at the same time for sure!

Goodie bag? My first impression is that it sounds like an aged sex worker, so no.

I'm not misanthropic at all. I have issues with individuals, groups, and cultures. I am sad and sometimes angry, but I am also compassionate even to those whom I judge to be the worst, even as I'm defensive or defending against them. As I've said on other threads, I agree with MLK and Gandhi, I would deny the sharing of Paradise to no one, but damn is it a struggle to get everyone to agree we all deserve it and to share it safely and equally.

Ok, you just gave a serious flash back to Sunday school where they kept hammering this idea: Sin = action, language and thought.


I understood action and language, but I always struggled with the last part. The little devil in me wanted to ask: You mean I can't even think what I want? Where's the fun in that?


Aged sex worker?

There you go, cultural frame work in all its glory.

Goodie bag makes me think of this thing:

 

[GoodPersonEffed]

The little devil in my wanted to ask: You mean I can't even think what I want? Where's the fun in that?

YOU SO CAN!!!!! One of my favorite lines in the book Boundaries talks about how we need to have safe spaces inside to act out so that we don't become repressed.

I have done a lot of healing beating the hell out of and even poisoning people in my mind. If that's volitional action that creates the fruits for an undesirable rebirth, I bet I'm still on track for a better one than this shit show.

 

[Epsilon0]

I had three bikes stolen last year and, being a pacifist this is hard for me to admit, but I day dreamed about hitting the thieves with a baseball bat... It's hard to explain to rage I felt at this violation of private property.

 

[Deleted member 1465]

I have a confession here...

For all my ramblings on here my view is probably at the top of the scale. At a personal level I still try and fight the good fight, but deep down...

I have to concur that although suffering has a function, it all seems out of balance to me. No amount of good things in life seem to be worth the meaningless suffering that many go through.

I look at the way I perceive reality and despair. I run from it. I think other people do this too, delusion and distraction form a huge part of modern life so that we can turn away from reality.
We have to play the game, we have no choice. Unless we kill ourselves. Ironic.

I admit that maybe there is more going on and it's beyond me. Maybe there's a reason for the dreadful assymetry of reality that I admit I'm missing. Maybe this is the realm of the spiritual and the faith I find impossible to feel.

If so, then I have a lot to learn.

 

[Epsilon0]

@Underscore

Is busy eating the candy and drinking the tea, I suppose?

Or, what do you suppose he is doing, @GoodPersonEffed ?

 

[Deleted member 1465]

@Underscore

Is busy eating the candy and drinking the tea, I suppose?

Or, what do you suppose he is doing, @GoodPersonEffed ?

I was thinking and monkey thumb typing and swearing at auto correct which has now memorised both your usernames Btw but still tries to put 'bit' in preference to 'but'.

 

[Epsilon0]

I have read the bits about your life scattered around the forum and your words make a lot of sense.

For all my ramblings on here my view is probably at the top of the scale. At a personal level I still try and fight the good fight, but deep down...


I think I am also trying to live up to some sort of idealized notion about goodness and fairness, "but deep down..."

My being active on this forum is like the photons which escape the surface of the sun: this is what the world perceives. But the real struggle, and the dark misanthropy, is hidden deep within the dense core of the star.

 

[Deleted member 1465]

Lol as an aside re distraction.

I was in MH unit once. A way station on the way to the nut house. Long story.

They gave the 'service users' colouring in books to distract them from negative thoughts.

They tried to give one to me. I used to be a graphic designer, an illustrator and an artist.

I thought about it. Then I told them to fuck off.

 

[Epsilon0]

I've hear stories about your drawing of a Roman well...

 

[GoodPersonEffed]

I've hear stories about your drawing of a Roman well...

Links please!

 

[Epsilon0]

New therapy method: painting your sorrow by numbers.

Apparently it has extraordinary therapeutic benefits, but more clinical studies have to be carried out before Big Pharma can commercialize a 100 € colouring book which cures depression.

The future holds great promise, people. You just have to make it!

 

[GoodPersonEffed]

The future holds great promise, people. You just have to make it!

The future is now! @Underscore has made 2,999 posts. I'm on the edge of my seat waiting to see what #3,000 will be!



UPDATE

It was on another thread, yet fits with this thread's most recent posts:

Haha not only so they not listen to their patients they don't listen to each other! We don't know what to do so well do...something...anything...whatever!

Sorry for your experience

 

[Deleted member 1465]

The future is now! @Underscore has made 2,999 posts. I'm on the edge of my seat waiting to see what #3,000 will be!

This is a sketch of my Roman well drawing wot I just did from memory in some app.

I kid you not. Took three days to measure and draw the profile, dangling down the shaft in a harness. It was never published.

 

[GoodPersonEffed]

I had a little dyslexia, @Underscore was at 2,299 posts. Now I can't get the party poopers back in their little plastic containers, confetti everywhere that will be turning up for months.

 

[Deleted member 1465]

Eeeek party poopers? What kind of parties do you go to?
My drawing looks squashed

 

[GoodPersonEffed]

Eeeek party poopers? What kind of parties do you go to?
My drawing looks squashed

Haha stupid autocorrect. I wrote party poppers, but I have written party pooper more than once in the past.

So what is the background story of the Roman well? I mean, I've already, ahem, dug myself in this deep by asking about in the first place.... I know you were an anthropologist, is this a for-real thing? Effing Romans, man. Were the ruins found outside of a vomitorium?

My drawing looks squashed

Your drawing looks like a penis.

 

[Deleted member 1465]

It was a 15 foot deep Roman well on a villa site I supervised on. They needed someone to draw the profile who was good at illustration and nuts enough to dangle down the shaft on a climbing rope.
It took three days of careful measurements and when it came out it looked like a huge willy
Everyone thought I was taking the piss but that's what it looked like, with the construction cut, the limestone block work and the. ..er...Bell shape scoured out of the bedrock.
Never saw it in print.

 

[GoodPersonEffed]

It was a 15 foot deep Roman well on a villa site I supervised on. They needed someone to draw the profile who was good at illustration and nuts enough to dangle down the shaft on a climbing rope.
It took three days of careful measurements and when it came out it looked like a huge willy
Everyone thought I was taking the piss but that's what it looked like, with the construction cut, the limestone block work and the. ..er...Bell shape scoured out of the bedrock.
Never saw it in print.

That is an AWESOME life story.

Hope you know my previous comment was dry humor. I hate to ruin dry humor with emojis but then run the risk of being misunderstood.

 

[GoodPersonEffed]

@Epsilon0 and @Underscore, meet kamakura:

https://sanctioned-suicide.net/threads/i-hate-humans.34447/

@kamakura, meet this misanthropy thread. I think you may like it, and I think it may like you.

 

[GoodPersonEffed]

@Epsilon0

I figured it out. I had forgotten. I am not a misanthrope. I am an utterly disheartened dystopian. Have been for years.

 

[Epsilon0]

@Epsilon0

I figured it out. I had forgotten. I am not a misanthrope. I am an utterly disheartened dystopian. Have been for years.

Same here!

 

[Deleted member 1465]

I'm a potato *waves*

 

[Jean Améry]

This reminds me of a memorable scene from the movie The Devil's Advocate when the devil (Pacino) makes the following statement: "I'm a fan of man. I'm a humanist, maybe the last humanist".

(1:21)

The devil is supposed to be the greatest misantrophe (at least in christian mythology) yet here he is (also) presented as a humanist.

 

[Epsilon0]

This reminds me of a memorable scene from the movie The Devil's Advocate when the devil (Pacino) makes the following statement: "I'm a fan of man. I'm a humanist, maybe the last humanist".

(1:21)

The devil is supposed to be the greatest misantrophe (at least in christian mythology) yet here he is (also) presented as a humanist.

That's such a classic! Pacino was perfect for this role. "God likes to watch!" He he

I forget now which philosopher said something along the lines: we pray to a god whose main attribute is silence.

Do you happen to know? (It sounds an awful lot like Sartre, but I can't find the quote online.)

 

[a.n.kirillov]

I have come to a surprising conclusion: a misanthrope is a humanist. Have you ever heard such a scandalous statement? And yet, allow yourself to entertain, for a second, the notion that misanthropy is an expression of hate towards that which debases us, rendering us un-human, and that a misanthrope abhors us precisely because we have no humanity.

Misanthropy is seeing the horrendous crimes and evil nature of mankind, and turning away in revolt, disdaining to perpetuate the lie and make-belief that we are good. A misanthrope hates humanity because it lacks the most human qualities: compassion, respect, dignity and moral integrity.

A misanthrope looks you straight in the eye
and exposes you for your foolishness, your narrow-mindedness, your deceit and your selfishness. In short, all that which makes you un-human.

With a misanthrope, there is nowhere to hide, because a misanthrope sees what you should be, but are not.



"No. I'll spare no one.
My eyes are far too much offended.
The court and town alike present me nothing
But objects to provoke my spleen; I fall
Into black humours and profound disgust,
To see men treat each other as they do;
There's nowhere aught but dastard flattery,
Injustice, treachery, selfishness, deceit;
I can't endure it, I go mad —and mean
Squarely to break with all the human race."

Molière

I share your views about human nature, but I consider myself a philanthropist nowadays, because I think we, as sentiences or consciousnesses are victims of our nature, and I have compassion with all of us. The lines are blurry with such terms of course; if misanthropy means hating humans I am not a misanthropist. Can I be a philanthropists who hates our base instincts and necessary self-interest and who doesn't necessarily like to be around humans?

 

[Deleted member 1465]

I think we, as sentiences or consciousnesses are victims of our nature, and I have compassion with all of us.

I like they way you put that. It kind of explains to me why I 'on paper' hate the way things appear to be, but still try and play the game. I see it as kind of like saying 'I hate the idea of war, but I respect the soldiers that fight it.'