Help writing a legal will

[rikamonie]

i need help, i have investments that i want to go to my family when i die, but it says in UK we need 2 whitnesses to sign the will too, i dont know what to do ): obviously i cant do that it would be so suspicious, is there any other way? please help its really important that they get it

 

[Life_and_Death]

i know here in canada, that if youre suicidal you cant legally write a will because "you arent in the right frame of mind" so id check out the laws where you live. they might not respect your wishes.

which i dont understand, right frame of mind or not theres still certain things youd want but hey im not the one that writes the rules i just think they are stupid lol.

 

[rikamonie]

i know here in canada, that if youre suicidal you cant legally write a will because "you arent in the right frame of mind" so id check out the laws where you live. they might not respect your wishes.

which i dont understand, right frame of mind or not theres still certain things youd want but hey im not the one that writes the rules i just think they are stupid lol.

man thats stupid frl, in UK it says you must have sound of mind which means you must have the mental capacity to make a will and make rational decisions... i didn't think it meant suicidal people cant make rational decision but maybe thats also what it means here god thats awful ):

edit: found out it doesn't invalidate the will here :')

 

[Giraffey]

I would speak to a solicitor regarding this. You can prepare your will yourself and just have the solicitor approve it and provide a witness signature, there are usually others in the office who can provide the second necessary signature as well - a witness need not be a friend or family member. If the will is not too complicated then I see little reason why with some preparation you couldn't get it all done within a standard hour-long appointment.

@Life_and_Death makes an important point though. If there are any doubts as to your mental capacity (for example, if you are exhibiting pressured speech or casually talking about depression and suicide) then a witness may refuse to sign your will. You have investments to protect and you're conscious that what with the CoVid epidemic, something could happen to you at any time. A growing number of young people are apparently preparing wills (I have one myself), so it's not that unusual.

Edit: As far as I was reliably informed by a barrister friend who specialises in this area of law, suicidal ideation or intention does not automatically invalidate mental capacity (legally speaking).

 

[Saed]

Since they cannot be family members or beneficiaries (and over the age of 18) would it really be so suspicious?
You could maybe say,during the Covid lockdown,you had loads of time to organise things you'd never bothered with before. Thought it a good idea that everyone should make a will.
It's one of those things people often don't get round to or put off,having to face their own mortality...
Pretty much anyone can witness a will,outside of the above mentioned. Doesn't have to be anyone particularly close.

I think you're worried it will look suspicious,because you know why exactly you're making it.
To others,it'll probably be one of those things we really should get around to.
Still a sensible thing to have,even if you don't ctb.

 

[Life_and_Death]

man thats stupid frl, in UK it says you must have sound of mind which means you must have the mental capacity to make a will and make rational decisions... i didn't think it meant suicidal people cant make rational decision but maybe thats also what it means here god thats awful ):

yeah sadly "normies" think we arent in the right frame of mind because were suicidal. forget our past and that its been an on going thing for years. yet they will still let us out of mental hospitals, yeah figure that one out.

 

[AlreadyGone]

Can lawyers be witnesses?

 

[rikamonie]

I would speak to a solicitor regarding this. You can prepare your will yourself and just have the solicitor approve it and provide a witness signature, there are usually others in the office who can provide the second necessary signature as well - a witness need not be a friend or family member. If the will is not too complicated then I see little reason why with some preparation you couldn't get it all done within a standard hour-long appointment.

@Life_and_Death makes an important point though. If there are any doubts as to your mental capacity (for example, if you are exhibiting pressured speech or casually talking about depression and suicide) then a witness may refuse to sign your will. You have investments to protect and you're conscious that what with the CoVid epidemic, something could happen to you at any time. A growing number of young people are apparently preparing wills (I have one myself), so it's not that unusual.

Edit: Suicidal ideation or intention does not automatically invalidate mental capacity.

thank you thats a really good idea, unfortunately i have severe social anxiety so i never meet with my solicitor alone, my mum was told i want to die so i cant tell her that i need to make a will.. god this is so stressful ah

Since they cannot be family members or beneficiaries (and over the age of 18) would it really be so suspicious?
You could maybe say,during the Covid lockdown,you had loads if time to organise things you'd never bothered with before. Thought it a goid idea that everyone should make a will.
It's one of those things people often din't get round to or put off,having to face their own mortality...
Pretty much anyone can witness a will,outside of the above mentioned. Doesn't have to be anyone particularly close.

I think you're worried it will look suspicious,because you know why exactly you're making it.
To others,it'll probably be one of those things we really should get around to.
Still a sensible thing to have,even if you don't ctb.

i dont know anyone that i can talk to or ask to sign it that isnt aware of my current mental health, unless i find 2 random people on the street :')

 

[Life_and_Death]

thank you thats a really good idea, unfortunately i have severe social anxiety so i never meet with my solicitor alone, my mum was told i want to die so i cant tell her that i need to make a will.. god this is so stressful ah

personally id try to handle it before hand. i know i have a friend that i could tell this too and as much as it hurt i trust he would handle things accordingly.
as much as he hates this whole thing and wishes i wouldnt, he knows my backstory and understands my pain.

 

[Saed]

@SlowMo We must have been typing at the same time.

 

[rikamonie]

Can lawyers be witnesses?

i think anyone over the age of 18 who isnt family and who you arent giving anything to in the will can be a witness


my struggle is that i cant go somewhere to get it signed because of my social anxiety its impossible, it would need to be someone i know that i can go to who doesnt know my situation, which is like no one so im pretty screwed

 

[Giraffey]

thank you thats a really good idea, unfortunately i have severe social anxiety so i never meet with my solicitor alone, my mum was told i want to die so i cant tell her that i need to make a will.. god this is so stressful ah


i dont know anyone that i can talk to or ask to sign it that isnt aware of my current mental health, unless i find 2 random people on the street :')

That complicates matters as a will signing must be 'visually' witnessed, but there is currently no case law that says whether it can or cannot happen over Skype or Zoom etc. I think your best bet would be to try and speak to a solicitor, either over a telephone or video call, or if your anxiety is really bad then perhaps a consultation over email (they should provide you with basic initial advice in an email without the need for a formal consultation or charge).

 

[Saed]

That's quite thought-provoking about having to be of sound mind...
Presumably,that would only be an issue if someone was butthurt and challenged the will?

 

[Life_and_Death]

That's quite thought-provoking about having to be of sound mind...
Presumably,that would only be an issue if someone was butthurt and challenged the will?

nope. if the lawyer (or whoever over sees this) has even the littlest bit of doubt no one signs anything. and whatever you wanted doesnt matter

 

[Giraffey]

That's quite thought-provoking about having to be of sound mind...
Presumably,that would only be an issue if someone was butthurt and challenged the will?

To give you an example. I was once speaking to a girl who suffered from bipolar disorder. We'd been speaking romantically for nearly two weeks and had never met in person. She'd come into an inheritance that ran to around £30k and in the grip of a manic state, wanted to deposit it all into my bank account for "safekeeping" - she told me that I could spend whatever I wanted. Being a nice honest guy, I declined.

Had she decided to write a will at this point and had me sign it (assuming I was not to benefit), knowing her state of mine was not sound, if I'd gone ahead and signed it and someone had challenged the validity of the will in court - then my signature would be invalid as I had failed in my duty as a witness, the will would therefore potentially be invalid.

As above, if there are doubts as to one's state of mind at the time of bearing witness to a will and these are evident to the witness, they are legally obliged not to sign, and should they renege on that duty it can be tricky waters in the messiness of court later on. Cue squabbling, bickering family members and your wishes not being enacted.

 

[rikamonie]

That complicates matters as a will signing must be 'visually' witnessed, but there is currently no case law that says whether it can or cannot happen over Skype or Zoom etc. I think your best bet would be to try and speak to a solicitor, either over a telephone or video call, or if your anxiety is really bad then perhaps a consultation over email (they should provide you with basic initial advice in an email without the need for a formal consultation or charge).

yeah that does seem like the only option right now thank you for the advice :'3 this sucks so bad, its the last thing i need to do before i go but it seems like i wont be able to do it because of stupid anxiety problemms

do you know what happens to investments or money people have if no will is made? will probably google it myself but the more information i can get the better

 

[Saed]

nope. if the lawyer (or whoever over sees this) has even the littlest bit of doubt no one signs anything. and whatever you wanted doesnt matter

That's understandable. I've known people who gave away all their worldly possessions or who have bern exploited during manic episodes.

To give you an example. I was once speaking to a girl who suffered from bipolar disorder. We'd been speaking romantically for nearly two weeks and had never met in person. She'd come into an inheritance that ran to around £30k and in the grip of a manic state, wanted to deposit it all into my bank account for "safekeeping" - she told me that I could spend whatever I wanted. Being a nice honest guy, I declined.

Had she decided to write a will at this point and had me sign it (assuming I was not to benefit), knowing her state of mine was not sound, if I'd gone ahead and signed it and someone had challenged the validity of the will in court - then my signature would be invalid as I had failed in my duty as a witness, the will would therefore potentially be invalid.

As above, if there are doubts as to one's state of mind at the time of bearing witness to a will and these are evident to the witness, they are legally obliged not to sign, and should they renege on that duty it can be tricky waters in the messiness of court later on. Cue squabbling, bickering family members and your wishes not being enacted.

Yes,sorry,I'd understood from the previous post.
Was still typing my response when you posted.
Interesting story,and yes,I've known manics to do things like this.

 

[Jumper Geo]

In the UK you can get a cheap Will online which is legal Legal Wills if you need witnesses your local GP can sign it and a Priest if you know one, prepare to tip as the doctor charged £5.00 for signing passport applications.

Cheers

Geo

 

[Life_and_Death]

That's understandable. I've known people who gave away all their worldly possessions or who have bern exploited during manic episodes.

it doesnt make sense to me. if its a sudden thing then yes they have a point. but if youve been suffering for years and can prove this then i personally feel they should rethink the rules. same for assisted suicide. everyone can use it EXCEPT suicidal people. i looked into it when they first brought it to canada in 2016, its basically impossible.

the only difference between us and someone with cancer is we for the most part have a choice. that doesnt make the suffering any less. (ive never had cancer so if im wrong please tell me) i feel that if anything we suffer MORE then cancer patients because they have loved ones standing by them, they arent being looked down on, the whole thing is just all kinds of messed up and if people just took the time to understand us instead of blaming us we wouldnt have half the problems we have and even if we did, healing would be easier. and all they have to do is open their ears and hearts but they are so closed minded they dont care. (yes im talking about you if youre reading this. instead of being butthurt shes passed you really should look into it all before pointing fingers.and if you want to hate me because im right thats your problem. however i HIGHLY advise you grow up. life sucks and people commit suicide, if you really want to help your daughter you will open your heart and understand us instead of condemning us. but hey what the fuck do i know, im suicidal and not in the right frame of mind)

 

[rikamonie]

In the UK you can get a cheap Will online which is legal Legal Wills if you need witnesses your local GP can sign it and a Priest if you know one, prepare to tip as the doctor charged £5.00 for signing passport applications.

Cheers

Geo

thank you for the information it all comes back to my anxiety again getting in the way of being able to do that i wish i wasnt incapable of doing simple social interactions

 

[Giraffey]

yeah that does seem like the only option right now thank you for the advice :'3 this sucks so bad, its the last thing i need to do before i go but it seems like i wont be able to do it because of stupid anxiety problemms

do you know what happens to investments or money people have if no will is made? will probably google it myself but the more information i can get the better

I wouldn't want to give you any advice as I really don't know enough about it to feel confident in an answer. I'm so sorry for your situation though, it must be awful having such social anxiety :(

That's understandable. I've known people who gave away all their worldly possessions or who have bern exploited during manic episodes.

Yes,sorry,I'd understood from the previous post.
Was still typing my response when you posted.
Interesting story,and yes,I've known manics to do things like this.

We seem to have a habit of typing at the same time in this thread! Yes definitely, I've met a few bipolar people over the years who have been in the clutches of a manic episode and finding myself responsible for their welfare I've been stricken by the sobering thought - "imagine if I wasn't a decent person, I could destroy this person's entire life..." Very scary.

 

[rikamonie]

I wouldn't want to give you any advice as I really don't know enough about it to feel confident in an answer. I'm so sorry for your situation though, it must be awful having such social anxiety :(



We seem to have a habit of typing at the same time in this thread! Yes definitely, I've met a few bipolar people over the years who have been in the clutches of a manic episode and finding myself responsible for their welfare I've been stricken by the sobering thought - "imagine if I wasn't a decent person, I could destroy this person's entire life..." Very scary.

^^^ its ok i understand :3 thank you for the help anyway, yeah i literally cant function like a normal person, it took me so long to even be able to order at mcdonalds by myself, and i still cant do it at KFC it makes me feel so silly

 

[Saed]

it doesnt make sense to me. if its a sudden thing then yes they have a point. but if youve been suffering for years and can prove this then i personally feel they should rethink the rules. same for assisted suicide. everyone can use it EXCEPT suicidal people. i looked into it when they first brought it to canada in 2016, its basically impossible.

the only difference between us and someone with cancer is we for the most part have a choice. that doesnt make the suffering any less. (ive never had cancer so if im wrong please tell me) i feel that if anything we suffer MORE then cancer patients because they have loved ones standing by them, they arent being looked down on, the whole thing is just all kinds of messed up and if people just took the time to understand us instead of blaming us we wouldnt have half the problems we have and even if we did, healing would be easier. and all they have to do is open their ears and hearts but they are so closed minded they dont care. (yes im talking about you if youre reading this. instead of being butthurt shes passed you really should look into it all before pointing fingers.and if you want to hate me because im right thats your problem. however i HIGHLY advise you grow up. life sucks and people commit suicide, if you really want to help your daughter you will open your heart and understand us instead of condemning us. but hey what the fuck do i know, im suicidal and not in the right frame of mind)

I agree with you regarding suicidal people,the desire to die does not make you of unsound mind.
I was purely posting an example of someone who is in the grips of mania or psychosis,who may well not be making decisions they'd make were they not in the grips of mania.
The solicitors are actually not only covering their asses,but the clent's too.
I wasn't meaning suicidal people,because I don't believe that the desire to die is always the result of mental illness,and automatically invalidates their wishes.

 

[Life_and_Death]

I agree with you regarding suicidal people,the desire to die does not make you of unsound mind.
I was purely posting an example of someone who is in the grips of mania or psychosis,who may well not be making decisions they'd make were they not in the grips of mania.
The solicitors are actually not only covering their asses,but the clent's too.
I wasn't meaning suicidal people,because I don't believe that the desire to die is always the result of mental illness,and automatically invalidates their wishes.

thats what i was getting at but kinda started ranting lol

 

[Giraffey]

^^^ its ok i understand :3 thank you for the help anyway, yeah i literally cant function like a normal person, it took me so long to even be able to order at mcdonalds by myself, and i still cant do it at KFC it makes me feel so silly

I completely understand. I suffered horrible social anxiety when I was younger, to the point where I once wet myself because I was so afraid of asking if I could go to the toilet... I'm quite a confident person now in general, but I still suffer from the most awful stage fright. I tried to 'cure' that once a few years ago by doing a stand-up comedy routine for a room of about 150 people - wow, that was a total unmitigated disaster... A comedy of errors... Some of them were laughing, some sat with jaws dropped, some were digging out their pitchforks and hammers to crucify me... I'll save that story for a PM, if ever you feel like having a chatter with someone.

But needless to say as someone who has been there and largely conquered it, it's definitely not silly what you're going through and although it feels like the entire world is watching and staring, they really aren't. Even when people are, within a minute or two it's yesterday's news. Easy to say, less than easy to believe when you're in the moment... Anyway, I'm sending you big socially distanced virtual hugs and hoping that you can find a solution to all of this. I'll keep my thinking cap on!

 

[Saed]

thats what i was getting at but kinda started ranting lol

No probs,you let it all out.

 

[Life_and_Death]

^^^ its ok i understand :3 thank you for the help anyway, yeah i literally cant function like a normal person, it took me so long to even be able to order at mcdonalds by myself, and i still cant do it at KFC it makes me feel so silly

thats ok :) i cant have people behind me. and theres a lot of things i cant do because of my anxiety. remember you feel this way for a reason. instead of putting yourself down try understanding it and embrace it. :)

 

[SheJumped]

i know here in canada, that if youre suicidal you cant legally write a will because "you arent in the right frame of mind" so id check out the laws where you live. they might not respect your wishes.

Thank you for this, I never knew such law was active in Canada.

 

[autumnal]

nope. if the lawyer (or whoever over sees this) has even the littlest bit of doubt no one signs anything. and whatever you wanted doesnt matter

Note that I am not a lawyer, this is a layperson opinion.

The point is that with suicidality, it hopefully won't be apparent to the lawyer at the time of signing that you were not of sound mind. So the will gets signed, and when you die and the will is administered, questions over your capacity only come up if someone wants to challenge the will, and that someone can only be a person who missed out on an inheritance and believes they should have been entitled to one (such as your family or dependents).

Additionally, in the domain of wills, the concept of not being of sound mind mainly refers to disorders directly affecting perceptions of reality. So the manic phase of bipolar (as someone mentioned), psychotic states due to schizophrenia or drug use etc. States where you genuinely don't understand at the time the proper implications of leaving your money to someone, such as a stranger instead of to your family. Mood disorders that make you more likely to suicide, and even may be the direct cause of your suicide, do not automatically mean you were not of sound mind for financial decisions. The condition needs to affect your capacity to decide where to leave money. I suppose someone suffering from such profound depression that they believed all humans were unworthy of happiness, and so decided to will their assets to be destroyed rather than left to family, might constitute depression affecting their decision-making capacity. But whether or not that depression was also the cause of their suicide isn't immediately relevant.