Venting What have we done to the megathreads?

[Stan]

This is a proper vent.

One of the the important things of this site is to share information for people to understand how to cbt painlessly and safely. I'm a big fan of the SN method so I will focus on that one and perhaps people with a focus on the others can say whether it is the same elsewhere. The SN megathread has had over a 1/4 million views! If you were a Youtuber and got that, you would be making some serious money. Why do people view it? Mainly to understand what it is, what you need and how its done. Every pm I get is because people cannot work out fact from fiction regarding the method. All the information you need about SN can fit onto one side of a piece of letter sized paper, 2 if you want the full explanation. Nobody looks at the relevant PPH pages in the resources section. There are over 160 pages on the subject as well as multiple threads appearing daily which adds even more confusion with some of the replies that are more speculation than fact.

The best way to distribute information is to have one single point of truth which can be updated if necessary. If this was a commercial website, they would have paid people called 'content managers' who would make sure that the single point of truth is protected by managing the content through deletions of inaccurate information. This is not a commercial website.

What we have done is become lazy. Instead of searching for information we just make a post or even worse, a new thread. Then a variation of an answer appears and even more confusion comes along.

Personally I would burn down the SN megathread and start it again as it's obvious that for a lot of people it's providing more questions than answers, which means it is doing exactly the opposite of what it is supposed to do.

Rant over

 

[Roger]

Agreed, with knobs on.

 

[Heart of Ice]

I've read about 70 pages of the damn thing and the same questions seem to be repeated over and over again. And then I add to the noise by asking my own questions, of course. But for my defense, I haven't seen them be answered fully anywhere. There are posts there that could be easily answered by reading the first page or the PPH. I understand if a suicidal perzon has no mental strength to swim through all of the thread, but the first page is not that dense and neither is the PPH.

Same with the hanging megathread, but even worse there. I read the entire thing over the course of a few days.

 

[Stan]

I understand if a suicidal perzon has no mental strength to swim through all of the thread, but the first page is not that dense and neither is the PPH.

Absolutely agree which is why there needs to be one concise or detailed version of the truth more for this reason alone. Some of the questions show more fear about SI at times than the method. I'd also like to speculate that we have reduced the amount of commercial suppliers of SN who sell to the general public by repeatedly posting them here.

 

[Can'tStandAnymore]

There needs to be one topic where only the people who tried the SN method can post their story on. Only one post per every person, and these posts can be updated if needed.

 

[Daniela]

There needs to be one topic where only the people who tried the SN method can post their story on. Only one post per every person, and these posts can be updated if needed.

Yes Please

 

[MeltingHeart]

This is a proper vent.

One of the the important things of this site is to share information for people to understand how to cbt painlessly and safely. I'm a big fan of the SN method so I will focus on that one and perhaps people with a focus on the others can say whether it is the same elsewhere. The SN megathread has had over a 1/4 million views! If you were a Youtuber and got that, you would be making some serious money. Why do people view it? Mainly to understand what it is, what you need and how its done. Every pm I get is because people cannot work out fact from fiction regarding the method. All the information you need about SN can fit onto one side of a piece of letter sized paper, 2 if you want the full explanation. Nobody looks at the relevant PPH pages in the resources section. There are over 160 pages on the subject as well as multiple threads appearing daily which adds even more confusion with some of the replies that are more speculation than fact.

The best way to distribute information is to have one single point of truth which can be updated if necessary. If this was a commercial website, they would have paid people called 'content managers' who would make sure that the single point of truth is protected by managing the content through deletions of inaccurate information. This is not a commercial website.

What we have done is become lazy. Instead of searching for information we just make a post or even worse, a new thread. Then a variation of an answer appears and even more confusion comes along.

Personally I would burn down the SN megathread and start it again as it's obvious that for a lot of people it's providing more questions than answers, which means it is doing exactly the opposite of what it is supposed to do.

Rant over

Perhaps yr right and it does need to be started again. Maybe stating that only very specifically stated questions can be asked- and only if very neessary-ie, not just chit chat about how they 'feel' about it, SI & so on, and stuff like...what if someone come in my yroom etc- that is for them to sort out & come up with a solution- once they have read the clearly stated time frame. Personally i had a couple of questions-practical ones-that were not answeared by the PPH & wasnt actually able to find in the thread- but again with so many pages now-its become too much to sift through.

If yr right about the commercial suppliers-how would they make the connection through a post on here? still does seem wise to not post though-of anything just keep to private messages for sure.

 

[Soul]

The instructions on the first 2 pages of the megathread should be separated, stickied in the list of resources and locked except for updates deemed important by the admins. The rest of it should be closed and allowed to sink.

The same should be done for all the methods.

 

[MeltingHeart]

I've read about 70 pages of the damn thing and the same questions seem to be repeated over and over again. And then I add to the noise by asking my own questions, of course. But for my defense, I haven't seen them be answered fully anywhere. There are posts there that could be easily answered by reading the first page or the PPH. I understand if a suicidal perzon has no mental strength to swim through all of the thread, but the first page is not that dense and neither is the PPH.

Same with the hanging megathread, but even worse there. I read the entire thing over the course of a few days.

I've asked questions that havent been fully answeared also- very practical ones (Not stated in the Pph either)- i dont think the intial page info of SN thread is actually totally complete, clear or comprehensive enough (though very close to being so) and then obviously after that infomation is just lost in the sea of posts and questions.

The instructions on the first 2 pages of the megathread should be separated, stickied in the list of resources and locked except for updates deemed important by the admins. The rest of it should be closed and allowed to sink.

The same should be done for all the methods.

yeah thats a good idea! & then one seperate SN board/ thread that does alllow people to ask questions to each other, makes comments, discuss etc?

 

[BPD_LE]

Funny, I was just thinking earlier reading your SN replies, @Stan is gonna blow soon! I feel the same with hanging threads. I'm repeating the same things over and over. It's really not that complicated! People seem unwilling to read and research themselves. I've gone from knowing very little about SN to having it as a now more likely method, in a matter of weeks. I have acquired everything I need and haven't asked a single question. I've researched and then researched the research. The information is there. People are lazy Stan.

 

[Stan]

Some of the questions beggar belief to me. It as if they are looking for a personal consult from a doctor and I will give some examples to illustrate:

1. Will I be sick?

I don't know! Everyone is different. Taking antiemetics really improve the chance that you won't but even then it is not a guarantee that you won't. Even a doctor with a gold plated stethoscope and every diploma that could be gained can't tell by examining you in person never mind throwing out that question on an anonymous forum!

2. Will I have a seizure?

See answer in principle of question 1

3. Will I go blue?

*eye roll*

4. What if I don't like the taste?

*double eye roll*

5. Will it kill me?

SERIOUSLY?????

6. Will I make noises?

FFS!

7. Will it hurt?

There could be some discomfort during the process, it's not a tickling contest. When it comes to physical pain, headaches (low level ones and not splitting migraines), a bit of a stomach ache perhaps. Fast heart rate which is not painful but I can appreciate it could increase anxiety. Laboured breathing as the body works to try and get more oxygen in, again not painful but could increase anxiety. But you may get no symptoms at all. If you have an underlying physical health condition, then nobody knows how you will react. people can't ask other people for a personal prognosis on how they react to SN. I absolutely understand people want to know. Just need to understand what could happen to you as the worse case scenario and then hope for the best. Again, the worse case scenario with SN is far less then many other methods that are as easy as this to do.

8. Where can I get the regimen drugs?

Countless times this has been answered on this forum.

9. Where can I get SN?

Has there been a worldwide ban on search engines or looking at a few world famous internet marketplaces?

I also see a bunch of threads about certain drugs and overdoses. You could type the same question into google and get an answer from a real medical resource in seconds.

 

[*KNAZ*]

Perhaps sorting the questions into common themes and creating a sort of FAQ for SN? People are uncertain and I think that uncertainty leads to queries that seem repetitive. They just may need some extra assurance or their questions answered in ways that make sense to them. This is a complex issue. CTB is not like exchanging cake recipes.

 

[MeltingHeart]

it's not a tickling contest ha ha! thats pretty good. As if the whole process is going to be a wholly enjoyable or feel nothing experience! - it is as if people are not fully understanding-that you are at the end of the day -poisoning yrself- and causing yr entire body to shut down- there needs to come with that a level of acceptence I guess- about the magnitude of what you are doing! it's not like taking half an e at a party or something, of course, it is highly likely you will experience some symptoms-and in particular anxiety- I cant imagine that could be wholly avoidable given the circumstances.

Perhaps sorting the questions into common themes and creating a sort of FAQ for SN? People are uncertain and I think that uncertainty leads to queries that seem repetitive. They just may need some extra assurance or their questions answered in ways that make sense to them. This is a complex issue. CTB is not like exchanging cake recipes.

Cake recipes,ha! love some of the analogies that pop up, so true though.

 

[*KNAZ*]

it's not a tickling contest ha ha! thats pretty good. As if the whole process is going to be a wholly enjoyable or feel nothing experience! - it is as if people are not fully understanding-that you are at the end of the day -poisoning yrself- and causing yr entire body to shut down- there needs to come with that a level of acceptence I guess- about the magnitude of what you are doing! it's not like taking half an e at a party or something, of course, it is highly likely you will experience some symptoms-and in particular anxiety- I cant imagine that could be wholly avoidable given the circumstances.

Cake recipes,ha! love some of the analogies that pop up, so true though.

Indeed. I think the big take away lessons are:
1. Take the recommended effective dose: 15 to 20 grams.
2. Mix with a small amount of water (no juices or soda).
3. Take an anti-emetic if possible.
4. Slam it like it's a shot of tequila. No slow sipping.
5. Be someplace private where you won't be disturbed.

 

[malummo]

I agree. I just realized that I had mistyped a sentence in a megathread trying to explain "something". anyway, some dont read or researches just questions are raised again. post from hydra is enough. contains all the necessary information.

 

[schopenh]

Consult with the admin(s) to see if you can help in effecting major structural changes on the website.
Getting upset over typical and seemingly unchangeable human behaviours (like using heuristics to obtain information for example) will have no outcome for you or anyone.
Most people lack the skills (intellectual or otherwise) to just sit down, sift through piles of information and draw conclusions. When they lack the skills _and_ they are discouraged by systemic things like 1. confusing structure and 2. far too much extrenuous, useless or contradicting information. Then you are 100% guaranteed to see exactly what you are seeing - so don't let it frustrate you.

I've been a moderator on many websites / online groups and I can tell you what most of my hard work trying to bring about meaningful change produced - 99.9% nothing. On the odd occasion that change seemed to be happening, the other moderators or members blocked it, and trying to entreat with them all became mentally exhausting (net input far greater than net output).

I ended up making my own website where I can share information in a format and manner that I see fit (although it has nothing to do with suicide). Although for various systemic reasons ranging from my inability to promote the page (and my philosophical abhorence to doing so) and the fact that information is simply too high quality for 99% of people, means it was all mostly a waste of my time too.

In summary... good luck! lol

With all that said, I would contribute to writing an SN guide, simply because I've nothing better to do.

 

[Stan]

Consult with the admin(s) to see if you can help in effecting major structural changes on the website.
Getting upset over typical and seemingly unchangeable human behaviours (like using heuristics to obtain information for example) will have no outcome for you or anyone.
Most people lack the skills (intellectual or otherwise) to just sit down, sift through piles of information and draw conclusions. When they lack the skills _and_ they are discouraged by systemic things like 1. confusing structure and 2. far too much extrenuous, useless or contradicting information. Then you are 100% guaranteed to see exactly what you are seeing - so don't let it frustrate you.

I've been a moderator on many websites / online groups and I can tell you what most of my hard work trying to bring about meaningful change produced - 99.9% nothing. On the odd occasion that change seemed to be happening, the other moderators or members blocked it, and trying to entreat with them all became mentally exhausting (net input far greater than net output).

I ended up making my own website where I can share information in a format and manner that I see fit (although it has nothing to do with suicide). Although for various systemic reasons ranging from my inability to promote the page (and my philosophical abhorence to doing so) and the fact that information is simply too high quality for 99% of people, means it was all mostly a waste of my time too.

In summary... good luck! lol

With all that said, I would contribute to writing an SN guide, simply because I've nothing better to do.

I don't have the ambition to change it, as you said with your experience, it's pushing a big rock up a steep hill. I think what i was pointing out that specifically for the SN megathread, it's pointless now. People just ask questions without using the search bar. The mods are doing this for everyone voluntarily in their role so I would not want to put any burden on them for this.

But I can't deny now that when I see a stupid question or statement that I will respond in kind. I am sure a few complaints will be seen

 

[Roger]

But I can't deny now that when I see a stupid question or statement that I will respond in kind. I am sure a few complaints will be seen

You could always just ignore them.

 

[Stan]

You could always just ignore them.

I do with the benign ones that do no harm or damage. But when I see one that introduces for example, a new terrifying symptom without any basis- then I reserve the right to play with them

 

[BPD_LE]

@Stan, while I have you. I don't have Meto and I'm worried about throwing up. So I'm planning to drink the SN whilst hopping on one leg, dressed as Elvis, singing the national anthem of Estonia. Is that a good substitute?

 

[Stan]

@Stan, while I have you. I don't have Meto and I'm worried about throwing up. So I'm planning to drink the SN whilst hopping on one leg, dressed as Elvis, singing the national anthem of Estonia. Is that a good substitute?

Normally I wouldn't answer, but as it is you I will. It's not meto - it's Metro, the underground transportation system in Paris. So you have to be on one of those trains as not to throw up. If you have an artificial leg, I suggest labelling the real leg as to make sure you don't make a mistake when choosing which leg to hop on. Singing is not a good idea as you will be drinking - i would suggest using the medium of dance instead to relay Estonian national pride. You can't go wrong with Elvis

 

[Rachel74]

Some of the questions beggar belief to me. It as if they are looking for a personal consult from a doctor and I will give some examples to illustrate:

1. Will I be sick?

I don't know! Everyone is different. Taking antiemetics really improve the chance that you won't but even then it is not a guarantee that you won't. Even a doctor with a gold plated stethoscope and every diploma that could be gained can't tell by examining you in person never mind throwing out that question on an anonymous forum!

2. Will I have a seizure?

See answer in principle of question 1

3. Will I go blue?

*eye roll*

4. What if I don't like the taste?

*double eye roll*

5. Will it kill me?

SERIOUSLY?????

6. Will I make noises?

FFS!

7. Will it hurt?

There could be some discomfort during the process, it's not a tickling contest. When it comes to physical pain, headaches (low level ones and not splitting migraines), a bit of a stomach ache perhaps. Fast heart rate which is not painful but I can appreciate it could increase anxiety. Laboured breathing as the body works to try and get more oxygen in, again not painful but could increase anxiety. But you may get no symptoms at all. If you have an underlying physical health condition, then nobody knows how you will react. people can't ask other people for a personal prognosis on how they react to SN. I absolutely understand people want to know. Just need to understand what could happen to you as the worse case scenario and then hope for the best. Again, the worse case scenario with SN is far less then many other methods that are as easy as this to do.

8. Where can I get the regimen drugs?

Countless times this has been answered on this forum.

9. Where can I get SN?

Has there been a worldwide ban on search engines or looking at a few world famous internet marketplaces?

I also see a bunch of threads about certain drugs and overdoses. You could type the same question into google and get an answer from a real medical resource in seconds.

@Stan is the male version of me! Love it!

@Stan, while I have you. I don't have Meto and I'm worried about throwing up. So I'm planning to drink the SN whilst hopping on one leg, dressed as Elvis, singing the national anthem of Estonia. Is that a good substitute?

What Elvia song? It's crucial to CTB

 

[Roger]

@Stan is the male version of me! Love it!

What Elvia song? It's crucial to CTB

"Ah got the hup, two, three, four,
Cyanosis GI Blues"

 

[BPD_LE]

Viva Las Dignitas

 

[Alchemist]

That could work on the short term, but eventually it will repeat all over again. Some people are lazy and not very clever, so they don't even take the time to read. That has been a normal thing for internet forums since always.

 

[MeltingHeart]

That could work on the short term, but eventually it will repeat all over again. Some people are lazy and not very clever, so they don't even take the time to read. That has been a normal thing for internet forums since always.

but I do think that a suicide forum in particular has its own unique problems- in that some people-esp. those that are not just 'planning for the future' but that feel like they want it (ctb) now (for what ever reason), they might be in such a desperate/ distraught state- that it does unfortunately add to both that sense of panic; people just crying out for help, wanting instant answers, posting those (perhaps not well thought out) questions- they are seeking that escape whilst being terrified of it at the same time! & also that brain fog that comes from deep depression, the inability to get out of bed, wash, organise things... I used to be bright, intelligent(ish), organised & focused- Now I am struggling with even the most basic task-like paying my phone bill etc.- I can break down and collapse trying to make a piece of toast- so I guess for some- they may not be feeling strong enough/ focused enough to be really 'with it' in researching/ planning etc...it just kind of goes with the territory I would say; once highly functional people-may have become less than sharp & diligent- whilst in their current state of mind. I know I sure have...prob killed a few brain cells by repeated attempts too...but that's another story...

 

[GreyMonkey]

Reading endless pages and asking repeated questions gives ideators something to do so it feels like suicide is being approached without actually doing it. I imagine it helps the fantasy that the action will be taken and it feels like one is doing something.

Then go further and start stock piling the materials. Oh look I'm really taking action now, I'm serious.

But am I? I speak for myself in some way here as being active on here helps the fantasy that I'll actually exit this life, yet going from the fantasy to the action is a way way bigger step than I often account for.

I imagine that many of these questions are coming from those who are in pain and desperate and want to, likely without recognising it, feel like they are going to take the real steps to get away from the pain.

It is highly likely though that only some smaller percentage of the people who read and ask questions ever go on to complete and most of those interacting are just doing so on a strange sort of way in attempts to find relief.

 

[MeltingHeart]

Reading endless pages and asking repeated questions gives ideators something to do so it feels like suicide is being approached without actually doing it. I imagine it helps the fantasy that the action will be taken and it feels like one is doing something.

Then go further and start stock piling the materials. Oh look I'm really taking action now, I'm serious.

But am I? I speak for myself in some way here as being active on here helps the fantasy that I'll actually exit this life, yet going from the fantasy to the action is a way way bigger step than I often account for.

I imagine that many of these questions are coming from those who are in pain and desperate and want to, likely without recognising it, feel like they are going to take the real steps to get away from the pain.

It is highly likely though that only some smaller percentage of the people who read and ask questions ever go on to complete and most of those interacting are just doing so on a strange sort of way in attempts to find relief.

Very perceptive! Agree a lot! It's sort of become something of an occupation (for the mind in some sense) a strange thing to focus on - I myself am guilty of it - just keep on asking questions- as if I am approaching something of a 'resolve' , when in part atleast it is something like a delay tactic - whilst too damn scared to proceed - but I still feel like I am 'working on it' so to speak.

 

[dreamsofdestruction]

To be honest, the megathread concept just sucks. If you're lucky, there's a quality post at the top, but for popular topics, it's pretty clear that it will become a cluttered mess nobody will want to read from start to finish after a while.

I'd most of the time prefer to have separate threads that at least have a clear subject and which you can find using the search function.

But there's also a link to a wiki at the top, I don't even know if that's run by the same people who run the forum, but that's the place where people should collaborate to collect the valuable content.

 

[Mud.]

but I do think that a suicide forum in particular has its own unique problems- in that some people-esp. those that are not just 'planning for the future' but that feel like they want it (ctb) now (for what ever reason), they might be in such a desperate/ distraught state- that it does unfortunately add to both that sense of panic; people just crying out for help, wanting instant answers, posting those (perhaps not well thought out) questions- they are seeking that escape whilst being terrified of it at the same time! & also that brain fog that comes from deep depression, the inability to get out of bed, wash, organise things... I used to be bright, intelligent(ish), organised & focused- Now I am struggling with even the most basic task-like paying my phone bill etc.- I can break down and collapse trying to make a piece of toast- so I guess for some- they may not be feeling strong enough/ focused enough to be really 'with it' in researching/ planning etc...it just kind of goes with the territory I would say; once highly functional people-may have become less than sharp & diligent- whilst in their current state of mind. I know I sure have...prob killed a few brain cells by repeated attempts too...but that's another story...

All this.

Plus. This is an international forum.
Think of all the people whose native language is not English.
It's much harder to navigate the board using Google Translate and to search the forum if you can't come up with the right keywords.