Thoughts about incel shooters?

[paredler]

Title

 

[WhiteRabbit]

Hmmmm.... I'm going to say not good. Very bad, in fact.

 

[Reflection]

Hurting innocents is scum behavior.

 

[DefinitelyReady]

Pathetic cowards.

 

[Dot]

Sme as n.e othr shootrs

Bd nws

 

[ham and potatoes]

no different than any other terrorist that targets innocent people because they blame them for their problems.
incels shoot women, muslims shoot jews and christians, racist white people shoot black people.

 

[paredler]

no different than any other terrorist that targets innocent people because they blame them for their problems.
incels shoot women, muslims shoot jews and christians, racist white people shoot black people.

Even if they /re neglected by society and they want to revene?

 

[ham and potatoes]

Even if they /re neglected by society and they want to revene?

and im sure the racist white people who did things like shot up black churches felt they were being neglected by society in favor of black people as well.

 

[derpyderpins]

I'll try to add a little nuance here.

I think it's possible to (1) point out that they are pathetic monsters and what they do is abhorrent while also (2) wanting to examine what gets them to that point.

It's not excusing it or making them the victim: it's on them that they did the bad thing. No matter how much society isolates you and treats you badly, only a select horrible type of person can go through with something like that.

But, if more and more people fall into those bad groups, beliefs, and thought patterns associated not with being "incel" (no success in sex life) but with the "incel" community and the shit they spew, you increase the odds of one snapping. Most of them are just LARPing being tough or psychopaths or whatever, totally going to get all the normies someday because they're so awesome and cool! Really, they're losers behind a keyboard.

If one in every so many people are capable of being so horrible under the right conditions, though, then if more get pushed into those conditions more sad events will occur.

I do pity the incel community, generally, and their related NEET/blackpill/Xpill/whatever crowd. They're outcasts looking for community. It took hurt to get there, hurt plus having people dismiss their concerns, most likely. Even if it's all their own fault, it feels bad to be isolated, ridiculed, reviled, and know - deep down - that there's some truth to it, and no matter how much you blame everyone else for your problems it is you who is messed up.

 

[EvisceratedJester]

I have some thoughts on them and none of them are positive

 

[Blurry_Buildings]

They highlight a need for society as a whole to expand the social safety net, mental health services, and comprehensive deradicalization programs. No one is born a violent extremist, and I believe they can be saved, preventing the terrorism from occuring. Bad people can be changed for the better with enough time and effort.

 

[ham and potatoes]

the incel ideology is awful.
"i suck at talking to women. the women and every one else in the world must be to blame though, not me"

 

[Ironborn]

"The child who is not embraced by the village will burn it down to feel its warmth"

 

[Darkover]

under my watch i would never let anything like life on this planet exist for if one machine is to be killed then it might as well be all of us

 

[EvisceratedJester]

They highlight a need for society as a whole to expand the social safety net, mental health services, and comprehensive deradicalization programs. No one is born a violent extremist, and I believe they can be saved.

Mental health issues are generally not considered to be a large factor in things, like mass shootings. 5% of shootings are related to severe mental illnesses while 25% of mass shootings are related to non-psychotic mental illnesses, however, this is incidental. The contribution of mental illness to mass shootings has been on the decrease. Things, such as nihilism, feelings of emptiness, anger, and a desire for notoriety seem to be larger factors in mass shootings. These factors seem to, at least from what I've observed, also heavily intersect with incel ideology.

I just felt the need to specify this, because a lot of people are quick to blame mental illness, especially when it comes to crimes that are viewed as being predominantly committed by white people (around 57% of mass shootings are committed by white people). Oh, and before anyone gets on my ass for mentioning this:

A content analysis of news documents covering mass shootings from 2013 to 2015 found that white and Latinx male perpetrators were more likely to have their crimes attributed to mental illness than were shootings by black men.41 White men were qualitatively described as more sympathetic characters than black and Latinx men, who were more often labeled as violent threats to public safety.41

While providing mental health services is important, we shouldn't treat mental illness as the main cause, let alone an excuse for this behaviour. Most mass shootings and mass murders are committed by people who aren't mentally ill.

 

[Blurry_Buildings]

Mental health issues are generally not considered to be a large factor in things, like mass shootings. 5% of shootings are related to severe mental illnesses while 25% of mass shootings are related to non-psychotic mental illnesses, however, this is incidental. The contribution of mental illness to mass shootings has been on the decrease. Things, such as nihilism, feelings of emptiness, anger, and a desire for notoriety seem to be larger factors in mass shootings. These factors seem to, at least from what I've observed, also heavily intersect with incel ideology.

I just felt the need to specify this, because a lot of people are quick to blame mental illness, especially when it comes to crimes that are viewed as being predominantly committed by white people (around 57% of mass shootings are committed by white people). Oh, and before anyone gets on my ass for mentioning this:


While providing mental health services is important, we shouldn't treat mental illness as the main cause, let alone an excuse for this behaviour. Most mass shootings and mass murders are committed by people who aren't mentally ill.

There have been studies that show that the majority of incels are likely mentally ill. I am not excusing their behavior, but I believe they can be deradicalized before violence occurs. I don't know if incels are more often white or not, but this wouldn't change either way. Everyone deserves mental health care and compassion, even the worst amongst us.

 

[EvisceratedJester]

There have been studies that show that the majority of incels are likely mentally ill. I am not excusing their behavior, but I believe they can be deradicalized before violence occurs. I don't know if incels are more often white or not, but this wouldn't change either way. Everyone deserves mental health care and compassion, even the worst amongst us.

Again, this usually tend to incidental rather than a major factor in these types of crimes.

 

[Blurry_Buildings]

Again, this usually tend to incidental rather than a major factor in these types of crimes.

cambridge.org/core/journals/bjpsych-advances/article/incels-violence-and-mental-disorder-a-narrative-review-with-recommendations-for-best-practice-in-risk-assessment-and-clinical-intervention/6A934637D21AEE4C1D90FAF5FB63D769

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9892684/

I dont think it is incidental in this specific hate group... and I dont understand your point. Are you saying we should not try to deradicalize them and provide mental health care, even if they aren't mentally ill?
...Im not here to say either way I guess. I think bad people can be saved.

 

[mrpeter]

There is no such thing as an incel

yeah they just lie for attention

 

[Dr Iron Arc]

They're a good case for why peaceful suicide materials should become more accessible. So many of them should have been killing themselves instead of innocent people and if it were easier for them to CTB they would hopefully just do that instead of making their inceldom the problem of other people in the future.

Then again maybe it was more about the attention for a majority of them and I have no sympathy for that aspect of it.

I hope one day I can prevent myself from becoming one by killing myself before it's too late. I'm already too scared of guns to ever consider owning one but who knows what the future holds?

 

[mrpeter]

There have been studies that show that the majority of incels are likely mentally ill. I am not excusing their behavior, but I believe they can be deradicalized before violence occurs. I don't know if incels are more often white or not, but this wouldn't change either way. Everyone deserves mental health care and compassion, even the worst amongst us.

Honestly if Elliot Rogers parents didn't suck and stayed together I don't think he would have become a misogynist and committed a mass shooting

People who believe in blackpill ideology maybe. Do you even know what the term incel means?

involuntary celibate it technically just means virgin

 

[mrpeter]

They're a good case for why peaceful suicide materials should become more accessible. So many of them should have been killing themselves instead of innocent people and if it were easier for them to CTB they would hopefully just do that instead of making their inceldom the problem of other people in the future.

Then again maybe it was more about the attention for a majority of them and I have no sympathy for that aspect of it.

I hope one day I can prevent myself from becoming one by killing myself before it's too late. I'm already too scared of guns to ever consider owning one but who knows what the future holds?

if we had peaceful suicide available suicide rates would skyrocket if you think about it more people would die even if "peaceful" the us don't really gaf

Elliot Rodger was a racist more than anything (he hated Indian, Asian and black men).

yeah he complained about how women dated black men but not him

 

[Dr Iron Arc]

if we had peaceful suicide available suicide rates would skyrocket if you think about it more people would die even if "peaceful" the us don't really gaf

And? If that means more incels get wiped out too then that's a net positive. Or maybe it should at least be legal to execute them and only them.

 

[mrpeter]

Elliot Rodger was a racist more than anything (he hated Indian, Asian and black men). Pretty much all the mass shooters were racists. America is founded on racism, so it's no wonder people continue in the tradition.

elliot roger is half asian so hes a hypocrite

And? If that means more incels get wiped out too then that's a net positive. Or maybe it should at least be legal to execute them and only them.

then people lie about being incels so they can legally kill themselves peacefully

 

[Dr Iron Arc]

then people lie about being incels so they can legally kill themselves peacefully

Why is that an issue then?

 

[mrpeter]

Why is that an issue then?

not an issue for me personally i would love to die peacefully

but technically more people would die if they implemented peaceful suicide

 

[Dr Iron Arc]

not an issue for me personally i would love to die peacefully

but technically more people would die if they implemented peaceful suicide

That doesn't really seem like an issue either since what most people on this forum seem to want anyway is for peaceful methods to be more accessible. Incels removing themselves from the equation before causing mass shootings is but one tiny benefit to be had from that being the case.

 

[mrpeter]

That doesn't really seem like an issue either since what most people on this forum seem to want anyway is for peaceful methods to be more accessible. Incels removing themselves from the equation before causing mass shootings is but one tiny benefit to be had from that being the case.

i'm ok with peaceful suicide but 90% of people in the world care more about how much people live instead of violent crime happening technically its a lose lose situation for them

 

[mrpeter]

Yeah, it means involuntary celibate. Logically, that doesn't exist, except maybe for an individual marooned on an uninhabited island or in solitary confinement for life with no chance of being freed until death. Those who are virgins can just go to a prostitute for one, and they are no longer incel. Those who call themselves incels or are called incels do not know if they may find a sexual partner at some point in their lives, which means they are not involuntarily/forced to be celibate. They may be celibate for longer periods than they'd like, but then anyone can be considered an incel because then it's a question of length of time the celibacy lasts. Are you incel if it's been a week since you had a chance to have sex? A month? A decade? Half a century? Incel is a misnomer. What you mean are the idiots who are in online forums saying "it's over, it's over" repeatedly. Most of them have had sexual encounters or will eventually have some so are not really incels. They just complain about it being too infrequent encounters. Many don't even blame women, they blame everything from dating apps through western media, black men, Jews and other men hoarding women (called "Chads"). It's all idiotic.

True I think the whole "no one will date me" mindset is kind of dumb, most incels are average looking. so I think they can get a gf if they tried, but its not easy, Elliot Roger is a kind of a chad imo in terms of looks way better looking then me and most men. Elliot Roger never once asked a girl out then complained that they didn't want to date him, if this guy tried he could have gotten a hot blonde gf like he wanted.

 

[notwhereIbelong]

Can't say I agree with them.
A bit interesting from a psychological perspective.