Venting Pro-lifers everywhere, even on here

[FuneralCry]

It really does seem like pro-lifers are everywhere, not even this place seems to be an escape from them. I don't get why those people think their "help" is wanted when it was never even asked for in the first place, I never want to read pro-life toxic positivity ever again, it reminds me of why I hate existence so much. I never want to read "it gets better, there is hope especially if you are young, there is happiness, just get help, you need help", pro-lifers need to realise that people vent on this suicide discussion to escape from their "help" and "advice".

I hate how people push the idea of recovery and help when really only death is the relief from the curse that is existence, suicide prevention types just create more suffering and make people feel worse, they just invalidate people's feelings, those people should just learn to mind their own business.

And anyway the suicide discussion isn't suicide prevention discussion, the idea that suicide is something to be prevented in the first place is such a delusional idea. Honestly I don't understand those who worship this torturous and futile process of decaying from age to the point that this is forced onto other people, there is no "happiness" in existing, I cannot stand pro-lifers and their harmful delusions.
Pro-lifers just make death sound more appealing, I will never be able to get how suicide is supposedly so bad as one cannot suffer from not existing, to me death means peace.

 

[Lydia12]

hate them too, they are sadists and want to see you suffer

 

[ipmanwc0]

When 8chan suicide was around being pro life was against the rules

 

[R_N]

Should we just be an echo chamber tho? I understand pain of existence myself but I think maybe as long as discussion is civil, it is fine.

And we can always ignore people that annoy us too much.


On the other side I understand that overflow of pro life people would make this place unbearable for those who who seek less ignorance and more understanding. We already have average people around us irl as well so we usually know all of their talking points.


I dunno. I am often conflicted myself.

 

[Dandy88]

I think there many types of pro-lifers. If I could, I would rescue every life out there. With rescue I mean to help to overcome the suffering and become a happy person again. So in this manner im definitely a pro-lifer.

But I'm know that life can be so fucking hard and unbearable, that ctb is the only way out. I have my own attempts behind me.
I will never stop trying help people who feel bad but I will never trying to stop people who wants to die, and if I can help them with one if this decisions, I'm glad to help.

So.. what I am?

 

[wildflowers1996]

I feel like they genuinely probably think they are doing the right thing and I think I do understand their mindset - because I think for some people, things do get better, some people are glad they didn't ctb, some people find love and happiness and life is worth living for them - I think they perhaps don't realise, or want to realise, that that isn't the case for everyone.
What frustrates me is when people say "get help" but the help doesn't work or just… isn't there? :( they tell you to get help but aren't able to tell you how to do that - at most they might say see a therapist, call a suicide helpline or take medication - and for some people those things do help - but what if you've tried those things multiple times and they just don't work for you? :( Then they don't have any answers, but don't want you to ctb either
I guess they've heard the message "suicide isn't the answer" many many many times and it's ingrained in them - and they just hope somehow things will change for you but they don't have to live with the constant suffering. Perhaps they are trying to prevent suffering of people who want to ctb's loved ones, but that doesn't seem very helpful for the suicidal person
I think it's also religiously motivated sometimes - people believe life is sacred and suicide is a sin, and there's a part of me still that fears this is true?
I am so scared of going to hell and I wonder if people are trying to protect me from that :( it's why I don't think I could ever actually help someone ctb myself, just in case hell is real, but maybe it's my religious ocd speaking :(

 

[Cage]

Should we just be an echo chamber tho? I understand pain of existence myself but I think maybe as long as discussion is civil, it is fine.

And we can always ignore people that annoy us too much.


On the other side I understand that overflow of pro life people would make this place unbearable for those who who seek less ignorance and more understanding. We already have average people around us irl as well so we usually know all of their talking points.


I dunno. I am often conflicted myself.

Oh for the love of god just take the mask off already. You're not fooling anyone.

@FadingSunshine Fuck you too. You're one of the first major pro-lifers I've seen here and you deserved to be named and shamed by everyone else here for it.

 

[R_N]

Oh for the love of god just take the mask off already. You're not fooling anyone.

@FadingSunshine Fuck you too. You're one of the first major pro-lifers I've seen here and you deserved to be named and shamed by everyone else here for it.

I am being honest and you are overly emotional to the point of hostility. Also I am not here with an agenda, nor am I a new member. I mean it is dumb of me to even point this out because older members know me good enough already. And it is evident by my posts what my stances on life are, but obviously you can't really read.

I am putting you on ignore as of now because I am not arguing with hostile people. Take care.

 

[moondazed]

I'd wager anyone frequenting this site is suicidal to a degree, even the "pro-lifers" you I point out. But people grieve differently, and sometimes it's trying to find a little light. I think as long as anyone isn't trying to move you in one direction or another, they have a rightful place here.

Some suicidal people are very angry, and rightly so.

Some suicidal people are very sad, and rightly so.

Some suicidal people desperately want to feel something positive, and rightly so.

Just don't be a dick, or tell someone how they should feel, right?

 

[dizzdesi]

I hear ya, it can get really aggravating. I know that they're just trying to help, but I think what they (and many people in general) don't realize is that not everyone wants to hear unsolicited advice or opinions. I think that their soap box speeches very rarely deter people who are serious about ctb. There's gotta be better ways to stop people from ctb, like simply offering support and being a kind person irl. Not saying they don't already do that, but I believe that's more comforting than...well we all know the pro-lifer spiel lol

 

[Cloud Busting]

You do realize you can report posts and use the ignore feature, right?

There has definitely been an influx of pro-life people here who spout toxic positivity. Honestly, they don't match the tone of the site and don't seem to last long.

I'm tired of the idea that anyone who is pro-recovery is pro-life. Are all people who support medical treatments for the terminally ill pro-life? I kinda doubt it.

I think it depends on the vibe of the post. If the poster is otherwise pro-choice and doesn't undermine the reality of suffering, pro-recovery posts don't bother me. I've had multiple people here reach out to me on my old account- right before I attempted to ctb- asking me to reconsider. None of them were forcing anything on me and all of them respected my final decision in the end (even tho it failed lol).

I think the responsible thing to do is to offer varying perspectives. You cannot be sure a person cannot be saved if you don't. If it becomes clear they can't, it's then best to back off.

Should we just be an echo chamber tho? I understand pain of existence myself but I think maybe as long as discussion is civil, it is fine.

Agreed. As long as discussions are civil- as you said- differing opinions ought to be welcomed here.

I think there many types of pro-lifers. If I could, I would rescue every life out there. With rescue I mean to help to overcome the suffering and become a happy person again. So in this manner im definitely a pro-lifer.

But I'm know that life can be so fucking hard and unbearable, that ctb is the only way out. I have my own attempts behind me.
I will never stop trying help people who feel bad but I will never trying to stop people who wants to die, and if I can help them with one if this decisions, I'm glad to help.

So.. what am I?

I would consider this pro-recovery, not pro-life. I'd say most people here are pro-choice. The difference imo lies on whether or not people are pro or anti recovery.

Oh for the love of god just take the mask off already. You're not fooling anyone.

I do not understand what a pro-lifer witch hunt is supposed to solve.

This is giving me some serious red scare vibes lol

@FadingSunshine Fuck you too. You're one of the first major pro-lifers I've seen here and you deserved to be named and shamed by everyone else here for it.

It's rude to drag someone into drama they aren't apart of. Why not call them out in their posts directly instead of tag them passive-aggressively?

People are free to post whatever they want (as long as it doesn't violate the rules), and you're just as free to disagree.

 

[Abandoned Character]

Is this post concerned specifically with the suicide discussion sub forum? Not everyone shares the views you do, so it makes sense that this community has a dedicated recovery section. When unnecessary advice leaks into venting threads and the like that can definitely be frustrating though.

 

[Cloud Busting]

Is this post concerned specifically with the suicide discussion sub forum? Not everyone shares the views you do, so it makes sense that this community has a dedicated recovery section. When unnecessary advice leaks into venting threads and the like that can definitely be frustrating though.

I think it depends. Obviously in a goodbye thread or during a discussion of methods, posters are not going to be receptive of recovery. Pro-recovery posts are absolutely not welcome in those spaces.

In a vent post though, I don't see a problem with offering a more nuanced or positive perspective as long as it's done respectfully. People have shared such sentiments to me in venting posits. As long as it's not condescending or spreading toxic positivity or lies I don't have a problem. It's made me reconsider or think more clearly, so I'd say it's a net positive.

I've shared support and positivity to numerous people here, whether it be through pm or in venting posts. No one has ever been offended by it, at least not to my knowledge. I've seen users post venting posts, only to be offered a perspective that isn't merely despair and doom, and later post in the recovery section.

Tone and intent matters.

 

[carac]

I think I am anti-pain, if I see someone is suffering and they want to ctb then it is their life, their choice. I won't encourage nor will I deter.

If I see some who is suffering but can't ctb due to reasons (not ready yet, si, can't find a method etc) then I will offer support/advice to deal with their pain or even recover, if I am able to.

 

[Deleted member 65988]

I think it's also religiously motivated sometimes - people believe life is sacred and suicide is a sin, and there's a part of me still that fears this is true?
I am so scared of going to hell and I wonder if people are trying to protect me from that :( it's why I don't think I could ever actually help someone ctb myself, just in case hell is real, but maybe it's my religious ocd speaking :(

And that is why it is such an effective measure to keep people here because you ctb doesn't benefit them at all, it was even a crime to die by suicide at some point in the past and it still is a crime today in some countries.

They made suicide punishable with hell because they didn't want their peasants offing themselves to escape basic enslavement in the fields. This way, it ensures their fear keeps them working and breaking their backs. Same with you fearing hell as your fate after death so it keeps you here, to till the fields of life so to speak till you've run the course of it and are replaced.

Looking at it logically, if suicide got you a ticket to eternal bliss, there would be no incentive for the religious to even stick around, religions would lose an awful lot of followers quickly.

Also, what's the use of someone being dead if they cant pay tithe/taxes.


And this is also why I won't post a goodbye thread when the time comes, to hear the messages of how I can still have hope or that I don't need to do it will only serve to irriate me because I am aware I can do those things. Many just say those things not out of the intent for it to be meaningful but to do it because they'd want to on a public forum where others can see them being a good person.

 

[Cloud Busting]

And this is also why I won't post a goodbye thread when the time comes, to hear the messages of how I can still have hope or that I don't need to do it will only serve to irriate me because I am aware I can do those things. Many just say those things not out of the intent for it to be meaningful but to do it because they'd want to on a public forum where others can see them being a good person.

Do you have evidence of this happening? I've never witnessed it.

In my goodbye thread I got mostly farewells and peace wishes. When I made a reply to announce I failed my attempt and was focusing on recovery instead of attempting again, people expressed they were happy I survived. There was one poster who gave me pro-life vibes, but they're no longer active, and I happily called them out on their toxic positivity bs. Everyone else was supportive, but they didn't push any sanctity of life shit on me.

There were two users who tried to egg me on however. They were called out and subsequently banned.

 

[Deleted member 65988]

Do you have evidence of this happening? I've never witnessed it.

In my goodbye thread I got mostly farewells and peace wishes. When I made a reply to announce I failed my attempt and was focusing on recovery instead of attempting again, people expressed they were happy I survived. There was one poster who gave me pro-life vibes, but they're no longer active, and I happily called them out on their toxic positivity bs. Everyone else was supportive, but they didn't push any sanctity of life shit on me.

There were two users who tried to egg me on however. They were called out and subsequently banned.

I've surfed through quite a few goodbye threads from years gone by and even read one of a user (Goodpersoneffed) who specifically asked for none of those kind of messages in their goodbye thread which I can understand and a reason why I won't do one, I'll just leave. Especially those that ask about the method which I can also understand to be intrusive.

It just really depends I suppose if someone comes up with that sanctity of life shit. Yeah, I knew one of those users, they and I had a few exchanges that really pissed me off, glad they aren't around anymore after what they did especially on your goodbye thread. Sometimes you just don't know what people will say.

It's a bit of a balance I suppose from whatever users comment in the end.

 

[Scythe]

The "you're so young you still have so much to live" always felt really odd and creepy to me in a way. It's like someone felt they could've fixed their youth so they started projecting. I guess it's also the emphasize on the youth part that creeps me out, and usually what follows after yoi're so young are always some weird or creepy shit in my experience.

 

[Forever Sleep]

The "you're so young you still have so much to live" always felt really odd and creepy to me in a way. It's like someone felt they could've fixed their youth so they started projecting. I guess it's also the emphasize on the youth part that creeps me out, and usually what follows after yoi're so young are always some weird or creepy shit in my experience.

I think it's a mixture of that but also just experience. Probably most people can remember things that happened to them when they were young that felt overwhelming at the time that they might see differently now. They may even react differently to them as adults if it happened again to them now. We don't have the knowledge, authority or means to deal with things as children that we hopefully have as we age.

Having said that- I still don't personally see that as a strong argument. Certain things that happen in childhood can still follow us and taint the rest of our lives. Plus- being such a pessimist- I don't know what to tell youngsters to look forward to! My best argument would be- sure- certain things may start to bother you less as you mature. Still- from my experience, you swap all those problems for a whole bunch of new ones!

Still- regarding pro-lifers and people who still see value in life- I think it's possible to be pro-life and suicidal. Personally, I think it's good that this forum welcomes anyone experiencing ideation. I wouldn't want to be part of a death cult! Obviously- keeping on at someone with unsolicited advice isn't great but I think most people take a hint if people tell them their advice isn't welcome or appropriate- or- they eventually get banned.

 

[SVEN]

I think there many types of pro-lifers. If I could, I would rescue every life out there. With rescue I mean to help to overcome the suffering and become a happy person again. So in this manner im definitely a pro-lifer.

But I'm know that life can be so fucking hard and unbearable, that ctb is the only way out. I have my own attempts behind me.
I will never stop trying help people who feel bad but I will never trying to stop people who wants to die, and if I can help them with one if this decisions, I'm glad to help.

So.. what I am?

Conflicted ?

 

[Cloud Busting]

I've surfed through quite a few goodbye threads from years gone by and even read one of a user (Goodpersoneffed) who specifically asked for none of those kind of messages in their goodbye thread which I can understand and a reason why I won't do one, I'll just leave.

Have you specifically seen people try to talk people out of ctb in goodbye threads? I didn't witness that in goodpersoneffed's thread, however they specifically asked people not to, so…

Especially those that ask about the method which I can also understand to be intrusive.

I agree.

Personally I think there should be a sticked "Goodbye Thread Etiquette" thread. It wouldn't cover everything, especially since what is considered insensitive is subjective, but it would provide a general rule of thumb. I think it'd be useful.

You're right that you can't control what people will say. I don't regret making one at all personally, but it's reasonable to feel uncomfortable with making one.

It just really depends I suppose if someone comes up with that sanctity of life shit.

I don't think sanctity of life arguments will ever be tolerated here. Lol.

Yeah, I knew one of those users, they and I had a few exchanges that really pissed me off, glad they aren't around anymore after what they did especially on your goodbye thread.

I hope the pro-lifers who want to shut down SaSu paid attention to that thread. I'm personally fine with anyone screenshooting posts from it to use as a rebuttal against those who argue this forum is a death cult. Any dipshit who tries to use this forum to get off on the pain of others gets swiftly banned. My goodbye thread is a perfect example.

Still- regarding pro-lifers and people who still see value in life- I think it's possible to be pro-life and suicidal. Personally, I think it's good that this forum welcomes anyone experiencing ideation. I wouldn't want to be part of a death cult! Obviously- keeping on at someone with unsolicited advice isn't great but I think most people take a hint if people tell them their advice isn't welcome or appropriate- or- they eventually get banned.

Define pro-lifer.

To me, a pro-lifer is anyone who supports the sanctity of life. A pro-choice stance, to the contrary, supports bodily autonomy.

Take abortion for example. A pro-lifer takes the sanctity of life stance, and therefore thinks abortion is fundamentally wrong (though some may make exceptions, like in cases of rape or disease/death to the mother and fetus.) A pro-choice advocate would support bodily autonomy and therefore support the legalization of abortion. A lot of pro-choice types consider abortion a tragedy and wish it didn't exist, but realize it's inevitable, and wish to make the procedure as safe and accessible as possible to those who want it.

Would you consider me a pro-lifer? I am pro suicide prevention (though I think current practices are flawed and executed poorly,) and consider suicide a tragedy. I think helping people reconsider should be a priority, yet I respect people's choices. Not everyone can be saved, and it's not up to me to decide who can or cannot. That's on the individual. Medically assisted suicide should be available to those who desire it.

I agree that suicidal people can be pro-life. I also think people are mislabeled as pro-lifers by more cynical types. It's also possible I'm just pointlessly meandering over semantics.

Also, I don't think life has any inherent value, but I don't think suicide is the only logical decision one can make to make peace with suffering or boredom or whatever. It's just one of many options

 

[Deleted member 65988]

Have you specifically seen people try to talk people out of ctb in goodbye threads? I didn't witness that in goodpersoneffed's thread, however they specifically asked people not to, so

Have I?, not live threads that I personally saw but shared messages as such as "you don't have to do this" for example which I understand given the context, could mean that if the OP is not ready then they don't have to do it, not necessarily a bargaining attempt. I was just referencing GPE because that's what I would personally do myself, not necessarily that anyone commented on that thread even after GPE stated not to.

Personally I think there should be a sticked "Goodbye Thread Etiquette" thread. It wouldn't cover everything, especially since what is considered insensitive is subjective, but it would provide a general rule of thumb. I think it'd be useful

Of all the things I've seen on this forum, I've always wondered why that wasn't a thing to begin with. A general rule of thumb would've been helpful.

I don't think sanctity of life arguments will ever be tolerated here. Lol

Yeah, that much is clear.

I hope the pro-lifers who want to shut down SaSu paid attention to that thread. I'm personally fine with anyone screenshooting posts from it to use as a rebuttal against those who argue this forum is a death cult. Any dipshit who tries to use this forum to get off on the pain of others gets swiftly banned. My goodbye thread is a perfect example.

I did comment that thread as an example to show that this forum isn't a death cult that is sad whenever someone survives but that there is genuine support for that person to pull through on their recovery since they didn't ctb, which your case was a turning point in your life. Still very glad those users were banned, the last thing this forum needs is people like that who purposefully encourage people to ctb or get off on the pain of others.

 

[cherrypiegonnadie]

there is a whole recovery section they can got to. I dont see no problem with ppl saying stuff like "if you have any doubts remember you can always call for help" on goodbye threads, but straight up trying to talk ppl out of it on this site specifically is just tone deaf tbh

 

[Rational man]

I believe we may have church representatives here. Im sure ive made contact with one person who tried to convince me that my plans would be the wrong thing. I personally wouldn't judge anyone about their circumstances and in my case i have a disease that will eventually end my life. I want to live but I now accept that.this autoimmune dysfunction.has other plans for me. it.doesn't.make.me.a prolifer but we do get one shot at life and then thats it forevermore. I don't fear death but I fear the dying days that I witnessed when my Mother died. Therefore, my choice to find cessation of my life when the time is right is my personal.choice and i do not intend to live my dying days in pain amidst a health system that is broken in UK and a UK political system.that is ineffective and archaic.

 

[umopep!sdn128]

Oddly enough, most people love life. If you ask them about it, they will probably answer yes. So they think that you should too. But no one owes anyone anything. Everyone is different, but no one cares. Society is terrible, it forces everyone to be equal to the majority, they say such nonsense, "that you can and should do something." You can't and you shouldn't. Should sick people (with autism spectrum disorders, ADHD) do the same? I know from myself that people with mild disorders are not diagnosed. But there are diseases; the differences between "normal" people are obvious. But they are forced to think that they are just as "normal", and cannot cope with their studies/work and do not communicate in a team simply because they do not want to. Yes, this is essentially disgusting to them, but they are shoved into these groups, and the "normal" people there only laugh at them and wipe their feet on them. This life is a real hell, and these people, who actually have a keen sense and awareness of how crappy this world is, are forced to suffer. The only good news is that, according to entropy, life in this universe will inevitably die out. And perhaps it will form into another with fairer laws. People will think much less about suicide because everyone will have a happy life, but even if they want to die, no one will stop them.

 

[Cloud Busting]

Have I?, not live threads that I personally saw but shared messages as such as "you don't have to do this" for example which I understand given the context, could mean that if the OP is not ready then they don't have to do it, not necessarily a bargaining attempt. I was just referencing GPE because that's what I would personally do myself, not necessarily that anyone commented on that thread even after GPE stated not to.

Ah ok. I misunderstood you. I thought you were saying you wouldn't make a goodbye thread because pro-lifers post in them and try to talk people out of it. I was confused because I've never seen that happen.

Im personally just not understanding where FC is coming from. As you stated, a lot of people here will try to help people reconsider, perhaps think of other options. I don't think this is "pro-life" behavior, as long as it's not a bargaining attempt as you said.

I do think there are pro lifers who join this site in an attempt to guilt trip, but they don't usually last long, as I previously stated.

As long as you're not tone deaf and you're respecting a person's choice, I don't see a problem with trying to provide a little light to the downtrodden. This board is pro-choice and not pro-suicide after all.

 

[SilentSadness]

I don't think there needs to be any pro-lifers on the forum to stop it being an "echo chamber" or toxic place or whatever. The purpose of this forum is to discuss suicide and vent, it's exactly the same as any other forum about a specific topic. It's nice to be in a place with people who share my views, because they don't anywhere else.

 

[Deleted member 65988]

Im personally just not understanding where FC is coming from. As you stated, a lot of people here will try to help people reconsider, perhaps think of other options. I don't think this is "pro-life" behavior, as long as it's not a bargaining attempt as you said.

Fully agree, I think weighing options first in contrast to bargaining an attempt is better.

As long as you're not tone deaf and you're respecting a person's choice, I don't see a problem with trying to provide a little light to the downtrodden. This board is pro-choice and not pro-suicide after all.

Definitely, neither do I see a problem with that.

 

[Cloud Busting]

Fully agree, I think weighing options first in contrast to bargaining an attempt is better.

People are free to disagree, but I really consider it irresponsible to not ensure that users here are weighing all their options before deciding to ctb. It is not a decision that should be made rashly imo. If an individual is not perceptive, and have clearly made up their minds, obviously back off and let that person do their thing. I think aiding a person in imploring if ctb is the right decision for them is fine, as long as you're not the one making the choice for them.

I just don't understand why it's pro-life to offer support beyond sharing method information. Platitudes like the OPs do not help with the death cult stereotype imo.

 

[R_N]

People are free to disagree, but I really consider it irresponsible to not ensure that users here are weighing all their options before deciding to ctb. It is not a decision that should be made rashly imo. If an individual is not perceptive, and have clearly made up their minds, obviously back off and let that person do their thing. I think aiding a person in imploring if ctb is the right decision for them is fine, as long as you're not the one making the choice for them.

I just don't understand why it's pro-life to offer support beyond sharing method information. Platitudes like this do not help with the death cult stereotype imo.

It feels to me that this is a common problem with human nature. Wherever we go we always group ourselves and shun other groups.

This place is about suicide and I get that but this doesn't mean I will hate everyone else who is not neccessarily pro suicide as long as they respect my own decisions and dont force me to do things.


This stuff hits home for me since I was a child because I was bullied due to my nationality when my brain was developing. I saw this everywhere and still see it to this day since then.

It is what it is I guess. I am not going to tell anyone what to do.