Discussion Jordan B Peterson got SUICIDE RIGHT?

[DoNotLet2]

Hello
Trigger warning: mentioning Jordan B Peterson (he's just a human but he is controversial to some), suicide. And of course those are just my opinions.

I found this video lately. I feel like it sums us all up but what do you guys think? He says that mentally ill people are overloaded with problems. It proves that you can be a right-winged person without being a pro lifer bullshitter (there is a significant difference between actual pro lifers and idiots who do nothing to help, but that's just my opinion).
The Reason for Almost All Mental Illnesses - Prof. Jordan Peterson - YouTube

 

[profoundexperience]

Just watched it & thank you.

Something like his metaphor of a "blowout" (like a tire) is probably what was the genesis my problems. But, I've never been able to recover from that.

I believe his argument about it being a magnitude of "complexity problem" has a lot of merit. We certainly evolved in a context where life was simpler... Today, Spotify has over 50 million tracks available on demand. How do you choose?

Life is getting more complex, exponentially. That may very well explain why rates of depression are increasing so precipitously.

But, I think a lot of other factors may be also involved...

 

[ceelestial]

Hello
Trigger warning: mentioning Jordan B Peterson (he's just a human but he is controversial to some), suicide. And of course those are just my opinions.

I found this video lately. I feel like it sums us all up but what do you guys think? He says that mentally ill people are overloaded with problems. It proves that you can be a right-winged person without being a pro lifer bullshitter (there is a significant difference between actual pro lifers and idiots who do nothing to help, but that's just my opinion).
The Reason for Almost All Mental Illnesses - Prof. Jordan Peterson - YouTube

Trigger warnings are ridiculous, people have different opinions deal with it. That said i think for a large portion he's entirely correct. As for the use of political tribes, there is no rule, no line and every group ever has suicide within it. It's a matter of perspective to, the pagans viewed it as the 2nd most courageous act behind dying in battle and celebrated death as making it through the suffering of life, the most devout of religious have also committed suicide, all these labels are useless. I have a good friend who's a baptist bishop who is pro euthanasia for example.

 

[Superdeterminist]

I think he's onto something, because I really do think that complexity is the cause of most suffering. If life were simple then we would have, in theory, the solution to all problems, so there would be much less unhappiness, because people tend to become unhappy when they can't solve their problems. That fat guy really does want to lose weight, but it's not as simple as "just stop eating". That smoker really does want to quit their habit, but it's not as simple as "just stop smoking". I think that as we obtain more information about the world through science, we illuminate more of the complexity in the world and we're becoming better able to solve more and more human problems (although there will also be some new problems that emerge from progress). You have to be careful about defining complexity though, and I think it needs to be defined properly here. I also get the impression (I could be wrong) that JBP thinks people's problems can always be solved today, which I would disagree with, because I think that we're too ignorant in our current state of understanding to have that power.

 

[esse_est_percipi]

He has a daughter who went through a magnitude of problems herself, and I think she was even suicidal at one point, so he has some familial experience with this. She said she was able to overcome many of her problems by switching to an only-meat diet.

 

[bov]

Yeah if I were JP's daughter I'd be even more suicidal

 

[ceelestial]

Yeah if I were JP's daughter I'd be even more suicidal

No you wouldn't, you could use a good father.

 

[Playlainin]

Jbp = big yikes from me

 

[TooConscious]

Usually I dismiss straight away who puts us all in to one segment but I'm glad I watched that short clip. Very well worded wisdom Nice one.
Can't recall why I stopped watching Jordan.... I think it's because all the scumbag plastic gangsters my generation 20-40 cottoned on to him and are using his works as a means of nietzsches Will to power.
Yet these people still remain evil dick heads with no empathy but become successful with personal gain.

 

[Mer]

JBP is a snakeoil sales man.

He makes money off the misery of boys and men looking for meaning in their lives.

 

[signifying nothing]

I think a lot of people's problems stem from seeing life as being much simpler than it is. In reality I think the structures of our lives are much more complex than we could ever know consciously, all the interconnections and relationships between things and people.

In other words, I think we get stuck with problems because we can't see all the things involved in how they have come about and are perpetuating, and therefore can't readily see the things we could do to change our situations.

Also, I think that because of how our societies are and how we have been brought up, we are further constrained because of what we have learnt is permissable behaviour. And this restricts our ability to overcome our problems. Suicide being one of those behaviours that, for most people, falls outside of being acceptable and is therefore difficult to achieve.

 

[aeon]

Beware of carnivores !

 

[Lupgevif]

A psychologist and a celebrity, a combination I don't feel like listening to.

 

[Donk]

bruh he needs to expand his diet to more than just steak. This world has plants and fruits for a reason. it's called vitamins and fibre.

 

[bov]

bruh he needs to expand his diet to more than just steak. This world has plants and fruits for a reason. it's called vitamins and fibre.

Yeah that's definitely his biggest problem XD

 

[AutoTap]

Interesting, I havnt heard it listened to him for a long time.

 

[LostMyWill]

This guy is literally part of the reason why people are pushed to suicide. He preys on people's vulnerability to promote his idiotic conservative agenda.

 

[ceelestial]

lmao why is this site so packed full of self loathing professional victim leftists? take responsibility for yourself, conservative agenda? what? you talk nonsense, not everything boils down to political tribalism and even though im no jp fan there's no denying his intent is righteous and has helped many people more so than you losers ever will wanting as you do everyone to be rock bottom scum so you can feel more at home in your nest of bitterness, rage and jealousy at being a failure. This is where i smugly point out that atheism and liberal men are the most miserable highest suicide rates on the planet, why don't you start looking at yourselves HONESTLY and you might figure out why. I hate professional victims, wah wahh look at me blaming the world for being a waste basket wahhh, TAKE RESPONSIBILITY FOR YOU. Go on mods ban me i dont care this place is anti truth and just a hivemind for t scum radical leftist losers who btw don't even have the courage to end their lives anyway and definitely not with dignity instead crying and wanking about the world being UNFAIRR WAHHHHHHH, they'll all be here still moaning in 10 yrs time.

Playlainin said:
Jbp = big yikes from me

LostMyWill said:
This guy is literally part of the reason why people are pushed to suicide. He preys on people's vulnerability to promote his idiotic conservative agenda.

 

[WeepingWillow]

lmao why is this site so packed full of self loathing professional victim leftists? take responsibility for yourself, conservative agenda? what? you talk nonsense, not everything boils down to political tribalism and even though im no jp fan there's no denying his intent is righteous and has helped many people more so than you losers ever will wanting as you do everyone to be rock bottom scum so you can feel more at home in your nest of bitterness, rage and jealousy at being a failure. This is where i smugly point out that atheism and liberal men are the most miserable highest suicide rates on the planet, why don't you start looking at yourselves HONESTLY and you might figure out why. I hate professional victims, wah wahh look at me blaming the world for being a waste basket wahhh, TAKE RESPONSIBILITY FOR YOU. Go on mods ban me i dont care this place is anti truth and just a hivemind for t scum radical leftist losers who btw don't even have the courage to end their lives anyway and definitely not with dignity instead crying and wanking about the world being UNFAIRR WAHHHHHHH, they'll all be here still moaning in 10 yrs time.

Sorry but from where i sit it sounds like you're the one doing the crying

 

[RainAndSadness]

No, he doesn't get suicidal people and I really don't know why he has so many fans among mentally struggling people.

Jordan Peterson on Suicide

4 Reasons Not to Commit Suicide, According to Jordan Peterson

ideapod.com

1. reason: Stay alive and keep suffering because you could hurt your family. (Why is their suffering more important than mine?)

2. reason: You have to exhaust all alternatives first. (And they'll keep looping this one argument forever and ever.)

3. reason: You have potential which can't be wasted. (Empty platitude.)

4. reason: You have no right to kill yourself. (Seriously?)

 

[Superdeterminist]

lmao why is this site so packed full of self loathing professional victim leftists? take responsibility for yourself, conservative agenda? what? you talk nonsense, not everything boils down to political tribalism and even though im no jp fan there's no denying his intent is righteous and has helped many people more so than you losers ever will wanting as you do everyone to be rock bottom scum so you can feel more at home in your nest of bitterness, rage and jealousy at being a failure. This is where i smugly point out that atheism and liberal men are the most miserable highest suicide rates on the planet, why don't you start looking at yourselves HONESTLY and you might figure out why. I hate professional victims, wah wahh look at me blaming the world for being a waste basket wahhh, TAKE RESPONSIBILITY FOR YOU. Go on mods ban me i dont care this place is anti truth and just a hivemind for t scum radical leftist losers who btw don't even have the courage to end their lives anyway and definitely not with dignity instead crying and wanking about the world being UNFAIRR WAHHHHHHH, they'll all be here still moaning in 10 yrs time.

JBP is definitely conservative-leaning, there's no question about that. And in my opinion he's justified in pushing back against extreme leftists like when he was voicing his opposition to forcing people to use certain pronouns. But his self-help stuff is really questionable; "clean your room" and "stand up straight with your shoulders back" kind of makes a mockery of most people's actual problems, I think anyway.

 

[Symbiote]

Easy to say "Don't kill yourself", harder to formulate a plan to lead you away from all that. Takes a lot of hard work, failure, and perseverance to get out this hole. I've been trying to climb my way back up after hitting rock bottom a dozen times. Sometimes I slip and fall back 10 feet before grabbing a branch and trying again. I don't know where I get the energy from, I don't know why I keep on going. Maybe it's pursuits of hobbies? Games? Or my job passion. I can dream all day, but only the act of doing something to make those dreams become a reality is something I have to do on my end. No one is going to hold my hand throughout this process, I don't expect them to.

 

[RainAndSadness]

JBP is definitely conservative-leaning, there's no question about that. And in my opinion he's justified in pushing back against extreme leftists like when he was voicing his opposition to forcing people to use certain pronouns. But his self-help stuff is really questionable; "clean your room" and "stand up straight with your shoulders back" kind of makes a mockery of most people's actual problems, I think anyway.

It's been like 5 years and none of those misgendering laws happened. So even in that case he was wrong and he should be hold accountable for the damage he has done towards the transgender community (which I'm a part of by the way) for misrepresenting what those laws really did. He unleashed a huge amount of hate towards my community for no reason. The law simply criminalized extreme speech, for example bill C-16 made it illegal to promote genocide against people of a certain gender identity. He pretended that the law made it illegal to misgender someone and that's simply not true.

What the Wilfrid Laurier professors got wrong about Bill C-16 and gender identity discrimination

Just five months after it became law, Bill C-16 has its first big controversy — and it shows how the legislation is being misinterpreted in practice

nationalpost.com

 

[Nymph]

bruh he needs to expand his diet to more than just steak. This world has plants and fruits for a reason. it's called vitamins and fibre.

He probably shits bricks lol

 

[Superdeterminist]

It's been like 6 years and none of those misgendering laws happened. So even in that case he was wrong and he should be hold accountable for the damage he has done towards the transgender community (which I'm a part of by the way) for misrepresenting what those laws really did. He unleashed a huge amount of hate towards my community for no reason. The law simply criminalized extreme speech, for example bill C-16 made it illegal to promote genocide against people of a certain gender identity. He pretended that the law made it illegal to misgender someone and that's simply not true.

View attachment 54383

What the Wilfrid Laurier professors got wrong about Bill C-16 and gender identity discrimination

Just five months after it became law, Bill C-16 has its first big controversy — and it shows how the legislation is being misinterpreted in practice

nationalpost.com

Sorry, I'm not informed on all the details, maybe he was arguing for a bad cause. I think that this is really tricky, because most of us like the idea of free speech but true free speech might be a mistake. It's really difficult... Often people mock the idea of being offended by words, but in a technical sense, words are indeed physical and they can literally change your physical state (heart rate etc) by playing on your emotions.

I want to add, returning to the subject of JBP's self-help stuff, that I recall him saying that he gets emails/meets people often who tell him how his book/advice changed their life for the better. And I'm willing to believe that, I don't think anyone's being dishonest here. I'm happy if people's lives can really be improved from one man's anecdotal advice. But there's no way it would do anything for me, I can't understand how this happens. It's because we all have different minds I suppose. I only wish I could find a solution so easily.

bruh he needs to expand his diet to more than just steak. This world has plants and fruits for a reason. it's called vitamins and fibre.

That's a really bizarre one isn't it? He claims that it has solved all sorts of health issues for both him and his daughter. Though odd, I can believe that. But I heard and agree with the following: the meat isn't doing anything beneficial, it's probably just that he's cut out the food that was causing the problems, which he can't identify. But by restricting to just meat he has eliminated it.

 

[esse_est_percipi]

But his self-help stuff is really questionable

yes, it is. It assumes that there is already a base level of functionality and motivation, to be able to even get anything out of trying his stuff.
But if your life is a nihilistic hellhole and you're staring into the abyss, how can you 'pursue what is meaningful' and what good is it to 'be precise in your speech'?

He may be a good psychologist and clinician, but Peterson is an amateur philosopher who uses distorted and favorable-to-his-argument interpretations of great thinkers to justify the status quo and the continuance of the current system of capitalistic exploitation.