Venting It's bizarre that the government forces euthanasia cocktails on criminals, but denies them to those who want them

[KillingPain267]

Don't believe for a second that the government really respects anyone's rights and wishes.

 

[sserafim]

Everything in this world is upside down

 

[Agon321]

It is obvious that national governments do not necessarily care about the welfare of society.
I would love to see many politicians in front of the gallows and guillotines.
Fortunately, no one punishes you for your dreams ;).

I might even delay my CTB to see it ;)

 

[KillingPain267]

It is obvious that national governments do not necessarily care about the welfare of society.
I would love to see many politicians in front of the gallows and guillotines.
Fortunately, no one punishes you for your dreams ;).

I might even delay my CTB to see it ;)

Haha yeah. I'd like to see the entire US government staff in a Nuremburg style trial and scalped for the genocide of Native Americans as well as invasion of Vietnam, Afghanistan, Iraq, Libya and many more. I'd delay ctb for that too, haha. And I say this as a pacifist, lol (I wouldn't participate, just watch it on TV).

 

[Agon321]

Haha yeah. I'd like to see the entire US government staff in a Nuremburg style trial and scalped for the genocide of Native Americans as well as invasion of Vietnam, Afghanistan, Iraq, Libya and many more. I'd delay ctb for that too, haha. And I say this as a pacifist, lol (I wouldn't participate, just watch it on TV).

Well, I'm not a pacifist ;).
I believe that sometimes violence can be very positive. Of course, this is just my humble opinion.

Politicians do whatever they like. Society just watches and allows almost everything.
The worst thing about all this is that I am also a weak sheep. I hate this pathetic truth.
Knowing all this makes me extremely angry.

 

[KillingPain267]

I believe that sometimes violence can be very positive.

Strangely enough, I actually agree with this, haha. I'm just an anthropological pacifist, meaning I don't think people SHOULD do violence to other people, but if they do, yes it CAN be positive and I enjoy seeing such justice. Also, if someone gets karma from their actions (especially through nature) it is positive (like someone speeding and falling or someone abusing animals and getting mauled). Those can be positive. I just don't trust humans enough to trust them with acting in violence.

 

[KuriGohan&Kamehameha]

Imo it's because violence and lack of consent is socially accepted if a person has committed a criminal act that is taboo enough. The death penalty is seen as a form of revenge/justice rather than something humane or merciful. Think of how many people crave the idea of punishing random criminals or fucking over people who have wronged them in some way to get their just desserts. Euthanasia comes from a place of compassion while executions are last resort punishments by design.

No part of the rationale behind the death penalty comes off as compassionate towards the prisoner, it appeals more to those seeking displays of retribution, especially if a criminal has committed something heinous like a murder. The price of that crime then becomes paying with their own life. There's some schaudenfreude aspect of human nature that takes delight in misery and suffering if it is inflicted on those who violate the social contract, what we have in the modern day is really no different than the townspeople who would gather in the square and cheer as they watched prisoners being hanged or beheaded in the old days. Just a slightly different flavor.

 

[Praestat_Mori]

@KuriGohan&Kamehameha says it. Death penalty is seen as justice/revenge while for people who wish to die it's compassion - and then there are often religious POVs how "precious" life is in any case.

 

[psp3000]

this thread really makes me think


some things it made me curious or wonder/think about:

is it forced if someone acknowledges and is aware of the all the potential consequences for their crimes, and would that be enough consent for the death penalty

is it revenge based if some of the most extreme forms of the death penalty are seen as inhumane and aren't being carried out at all or as much depending on the laws of any specific country/region (firing squad, electric chair, hanging, etc.)

would the death penalty be seen as compassion instead of revenge because the person isn't forced to live with what they've done for the rest of their life wether if it's in or out of prison

would the death penalty be seen as compassionate if it's a less extreme form of it out of the fear that the person is/was innocent


sorry if these are bad questions

 

[Praestat_Mori]

@psp3000 I don't think you asked bad questions!

Death penalty is controversial - I'm not against death penalty per se. Some who received a death sentence may appreciate it (e.g. child abuser who already know they are incurable and accept their fate) others may not accept their death sentence for other horrible crimes.

The question is what would be the harder punishment for severe crimes? I would say in most cases the harder punishment is spending life in prison and being isolated for many decades until natural death.

would the death penalty be seen as compassion instead of revenge because the person isn't forced to live with what they've done for the rest of their life wether if it's in or out of prison

That's also a question how the one who committed the crime sees the "crime" itself. Murdering an innocent person isn't acceptable and is a crime but what if the murderer sees it as the right thing to do and does not understand the general social consent?

Well here it gets already complex - what is the harder punishment for such person?

Death penalty should never be seen as compassionate - it's a penalty for severe crimes by definition of the society that is currently living.

 

[ijustwishtodie]

Everything in this world is upside down

Literally. When I was younger, I made up a new terminology which I called "the inverse theorem". It's where everything that should be going on to maximise happiness and minimise suffering isn't happening but rather that what is happening is.. the inverse (i.e. opposite) of that. We're in a world which minimises happiness and maximises suffering. The healthy foods are less preferable than junk food, the kind people get exploited, the narcissists succeed, people side with the bullies, those who want to live end up dying, those who want to be dead end up living and so on. It really does feel like everything is upside down

 

[Forever Sleep]

Imo it's because violence and lack of consent is socially accepted if a person has committed a criminal act that is taboo enough. The death penalty is seen as a form of revenge/justice rather than something humane or merciful. Think of how many people crave the idea of punishing random criminals or fucking over people who have wronged them in some way to get their just desserts. Euthanasia comes from a place of compassion while executions are last resort punishments by design.

No part of the rationale behind the death penalty comes off as compassionate towards the prisoner, it appeals more to those seeking displays of retribution, especially if a criminal has committed something heinous like a murder. The price of that crime then becomes paying with their own life. There's some schaudenfreude aspect of human nature that takes delight in misery and suffering if it is inflicted on those who violate the social contract, what we have in the modern day is really no different than the townspeople who would gather in the square and cheer as they watched prisoners being hanged or beheaded in the old days. Just a slightly different flavor.

I agree that it's a sign of power that a state can terminate your life if you break its rules. I guess modern day euthanasea methods are portrayed as being hummane though. We don't hang, draw and quarter people anymore. It's all a lot more clinical than that now.

Honestly, I can see what the OP means though. When you see people like Ted Bundy and John Wayne Gacy being given probably relatively peaceful deaths compared to what they inflicted on their victims. Then you consider there are likely hundreds of thousands of innocent, kind people who would beg for a lethal injection, it does seem kind of mixed up. I've honestly felt pretty envious of criminals if their exit was quick and painless.

Not that I would support giving them a painful death. Honestly, I don't really know what should be done with such heinous criminals. I can't say I really support capital punishment though. I think the justice system is too fallible.

 

[BruhXDDDDD]

Solution: kill 200 people. get happy juice.

Imo it's because violence and lack of consent is socially accepted if a person has committed a criminal act that is taboo enough. The death penalty is seen as a form of revenge/justice rather than something humane or merciful. Think of how many people crave the idea of punishing random criminals or fucking over people who have wronged them in some way to get their just desserts. Euthanasia comes from a place of compassion while executions are last resort punishments by design.

No part of the rationale behind the death penalty comes off as compassionate towards the prisoner, it appeals more to those seeking displays of retribution, especially if a criminal has committed something heinous like a murder. The price of that crime then becomes paying with their own life. There's some schaudenfreude aspect of human nature that takes delight in misery and suffering if it is inflicted on those who violate the social contract, what we have in the modern day is really no different than the townspeople who would gather in the square and cheer as they watched prisoners being hanged or beheaded in the old days. Just a slightly different flavor.

I still can't really wrap my head around why a prisoner wouldn't find the death penalty preferable. I kind of want it right now, much less if I didn't have anything to look forward to. I think I just generally despise or have ambivalent feelings toward people and I hate having to keep living among them. I feel like I'm living in the result of a bunch of power struggles and narrowminded people rather than anything remotely resembling the kind of world I'd want.