Is it better to try to live for a short period of time, or to survive for a long period?

[-nobodyknows-]

A little while ago, I did something that many people would probably consider foolish: I stopped treatment. At the time, I was receiving ECT regularly and it was going nowhere. I was on benzodiazepines and out of it for most of the day. I couldn't really do much of anything. I was probably going to be hospitalized again for an indefinite period of time if I didn't show signs of improvement.

Then I saw a movie. A story that gave me a crazy idea. What if I stopped trying to run from things? Accepted that this was a part of me? Would I somehow find a way to survive? Would someone help me to do so? Would I feel better if I were able to find someone who would stand by me?

If I held out long enough, would something change?

I knew that if I stayed on my current path, my chances of that were basically zero. And, I wanted that so badly. So, I did something completely insane.

I lied to everyone. I told them that I wasn't suicidal any more. I got off absolutely everything. It took a little while to convince my doctors, but I did. No more ECT. No more pills. No more therapy.

I sort of knew it was a dangerous idea. A game of Russian roulette, with every cylinder loaded but one. The chances of this going poorly for me are very high, considering my history.

It's been a year now since I stopped everything. And it hurts so much. But honestly, I'm happy I did.

I still don't have anything. I still don't have a reason to live, or anyone to stand by me. But even so, even if I never do, I can't help but feel that this is better.

I know that this is quite selfish. There are people that will be hurt if I kill myself. And, in all honesty, I probably will. I know myself pretty well, and I can tell that things are getting dangerous.

But I can't go back. I won't. I don't want to survive. I want to live. Even if it kills me in the end.

I met some really nice people in this past year. People I would have never met if I hadn't chosen this path. I am so happy that I was able to meet them.

I worry what my death will do to them. I hope they never find out what happened to me.

I cannot help but wonder if I made the right decision. Is this foolish? Is this selfish? Is this brave? I do not know anymore.

Please, tell me.

 

[timechained]

Youtube: Allen Frances, Saving Normal

 

[RW__Asher23]

I am not in a place where I can advise anyone or tell you if this is selfish or brave but I read what you wrote here and you feel and have have emotion in this and you felt there was a choice you had to make. From your perspective it was what you felt you needed to do and did. Right or wrong or brave or selfish doesn't matter as much as the fact you are still here a year later and that says a lot. You said no one to stand with you but you met some Nice people over the past year, so none of them stand with you today but what tomorrow brings no one knows but it could be more nice people and one of them might stand with you. Maybe not but you have come a long way. Many who made this choice might not have made it this far so I wish you the very best in the rest of your life's journey no matter what it is in the end I stand here with your decision to make a choice and it was YOURS no one else's so I support your wishes and hopes and fears and hope the rest of your journey is a good one and what you wanted in the end. Live , ctb, or try another day? Whatever it is wish you the very best outcome and it is what you wanted. Your choice. Peace.

 

[encore]

quality of life > quantity of life for me, always. there are so many things i wish i could do, i yearn for normalcy, but i also dread having to live so long to achieve those things. i like having an expiration date. it's calming, in a way. i understand that i probably won't do half of the things i wish i could, but i'd still take this over having a drawn out life without an ending in sight.

 

[belowaveragefish]

Coming to terms with accepting the fact that life is shit isn't easy. I've learned to not only accept the fact that life sucks, I've also accepted the fact that I'll be labelled a "failure" by dying, and that this action is for my own personal happiness.

I always say that CTB is "striking a blow for freedom amidst life's oppression". Yeah it's selfish, but it's also something that is for your own well-being. You may not realize that quickly. It's like the ultimate in self-care, in a sense.

To quote one of my favorite songs about suicide:

"I will now accept the fact that I'm a failure, 'cause I'm so afraid the future might be scarier".

 

[melonrazor]

we are in the similar position. i understand what you mean and i feel the same.

 

[Forever Sleep]

It doesn't seem all that strange to me. You tried multiple different things to try to fix a problem. They didn't work to a reasonable level so, you stopped them. That seems logical to me. What was the official advice though? You need to try them for years, multiple years for them to work? I'm assuming the side effects weren't fun- if you wanted to stop them?

ECT has always frightened me. It seems quite a severe action but then, I can understand being willing to try it if things are really bad. Is there a marked change do you feel? Between before, during and now, after treatment? Really though- why would anyone risk certain treatments if they weren't helping?

I don't think it's selfish to stop doing something that feels as if it's doing more harm than good. Maybe it would be different if there was strong evidence or strong indicators that suggested these treatments would have helped long-term but, it doesn't sound like there were. I don't really approve of the idea of people being expected to be human guinea pigs because this or that treatment might work. Fair enough if they want to try it but, I don't believe it should be expected of them or enforced. Especially since it seems so hit and miss. Some people here have come off worse after taking drugs. Not to say everyone does but, people should be made aware of the risks and, allowed to choose.

I suppose if you have a fear that you may suicide as a result, that it troubles you for whatever reason- the hurt it may cause others etc. you will have to make choices if those feelings become too intense, how best to combat them. Whether that means drugs again or, something else. Would it have been impossible for you to suicide when you were on those treatments?

As for your question though, I'd absolutely say living is better than just surviving. Perhaps it's kinder to loved ones if we linger on- possibly in misery or pain. They can maybe still pretend we are who we were or, that we'll get miraculously better. That's pretty selfish and cruel though- when you think about it- if it's more than likely we won't improve. Surely, if they truly loved us, they wouldn't want to see us linger on in pain. It's like prolonging pain. That's sadistic.

 

[LigottiIsRight]

It's perfectly fine to stop treatment if one believes that's the adequate thing for them. Regarding the question that opens the thread, I'm convinced that living (so to say, enjoying one's experience and having a sense of purpose and fulfillment in some way), it's way more important (is, in fact, the only thing that matters) than mere survival, but this opinion come from another conviction, which is that life has no intrinsic value.

 

[-nobodyknows-]

What was the official advice though? You need to try them for years, multiple years for them to work? I'm assuming the side effects weren't fun- if you wanted to stop them?

I was in treatment for nine years. I was on a significant amount of medication (honestly I don't even remember how many I have tried over the years) for a long time. I did bilateral ECT for 11 months, and made the decision to start saying I was doing better somewhere around the 9th month. The side effects did suck, random spasms that would cause me to do things like fling a bowl of soup I was carrying up at myself, and not being able to remember much of anything during that period of my life. I normally have a pretty good memory, but there's a huge gap where I don't really have any for that part of my life. I also had a hard time recalling whether or not I had done something a few minutes prior, like whether or not I washed my hair in the shower. I still have problems with that.

But honestly, the side effects didn't really matter to me. What really bothered me was not being able to do much. You can't drive, and you can't really work either. I didn't want treatment to be my life. I wanted more.

The recommendation before I started lying and saying I was feeling better was long term hospitalization. I had already been hospitalized three times when I was younger for a total of about three and a half months. Really didn't want to do that again, especially considering that the hospitals in the country I am in now are not the best when it comes to daily comforts.

Is there a marked change do you feel? Between before, during and now, after treatment? Really though- why would anyone risk certain treatments if they weren't helping?

No. When I was receiving ECT, it wasn't like I was feeling better. I was pretty much unable to think clearly about anything. My mind was just blank and empty. When I started being able to think again, usually a couple of days after treatment, I would be suicidal again. This is why I had to receive treatment multiple times a week for such a long period.

As for why I stuck with it for so long, despite it not helping, I guess I just wanted something to change. It's kind of like my current situation. Even though it's highly likely things will go nowhere, I still want to try. I don't want to be like this.

A long time ago, I had someone who tried to help me. They stood by me for a good while. Way longer than anyone else ever did. I told them everything. And they would help me feel better. They used to tell me that things would change one day. That things would get better. They were the best friend I ever had in my life.

In the end, though, they left. I believe it is because they could no longer handle listening to me talk about myself so negatively. Maybe they stopped believing in me. Maybe they thought I was manipulating them when I told them I was planning to kill myself. I don't really know for sure. But I always wanted to prove them right. That they didn't stand by me for nothing.

Would it have been impossible for you to suicide when you were on those treatments?

My brain was pretty much cooked, so it would've been more difficult. Plus, if I were in the hospital, the chances of success would have dropped dramatically.