is duster a viable way out?

[Tonic_Secrecy]

I read in a few places that people have died from inhaling duster Is it possible for me to achieve the same with 4 canisters of duster and a bag over my head or is that just wishful thinking? I checked the inert gas megathread but it didn't mention anything about duster not against or with it so I decided to ask here.

 

[Eudaimonic]

I don't think this method is reliable.

 

[resurgence]

yeah maybe not, as someone that huffed duster do not do that lol. you are gonna feel extremely brain damaged for a long time if you try that. also edit to add: you wont make it through that much in one go. you are going to pass out before you are even done the first can from oxygen deprivation

 

[Kyotospade]

It's more likely to get you a temporary high it's not a viable method

 

[Intoxicated]

yeah maybe not, as someone that huffed duster do not do that lol. you are gonna feel extremely brain damaged for a long time if you try that. also edit to add: you wont make it through that much in one go. you are going to pass out before you are even done the first can from oxygen deprivation

The OP mentioned using a plastic bag, which is a different technique than just huffing. Imagine that you fill a plastic bag with the asphyxiant gas contained in an air duster can, then place your head inside and seal the bag. If you manage to pass out because of the oxygen deprivation, how exactly are you supposed to wake up then (while your face is surrounded by O2-depleted gas)?

 

[Tonic_Secrecy]

The OP mentioned using a plastic bag, which is a different technique than just huffing. Imagine that you fill a plastic bag with the asphyxiant gas contained in an air duster can, then place your head inside and seal the bag. If you manage to pass out because of the oxygen deprivation, how exactly are you supposed to wake up then (while your face is surrounded by O2-depleted gas)?

That's what I was hoping would happen I might try it if I can't secure an SN order

 

[resurgence]

The OP mentioned using a plastic bag, which is a different technique than just huffing. Imagine that you fill a plastic bag with the asphyxiant gas contained in an air duster can, then place your head inside and seal the bag. If you manage to pass out because of the oxygen deprivation, how exactly are you supposed to wake up then (while your face is surrounded by O2-depleted gas)?

yeah tbh i skimmed this doing something else. what that makes me think of is on some of my weird duster binges it would make me throw up, like id pass out and wake up to a puddle of vomit. so it would be just hoping that doesnt happen/you are out beforehand? what would the bag situation be in the case of throwing up?

That's what I was hoping would happen I might try it if I can't secure an SN order

i hope things go the way you want them to go<3 would be just passing out without the knowledge that its happening really

 

[KillingPain267]

They may warn of duster deaths but it's rare. If it was that easy, then all those things would be banned. Save yourself the brain damage and research a better method. Once you have brain damage from failed attempts, you will have a harder time research and preparing a proper exit.

 

[Intoxicated]

yeah tbh i skimmed this doing something else. what that makes me think of is on some of my weird duster binges it would make me throw up, like id pass out and wake up to a puddle of vomit. so it would be just hoping that doesnt happen/you are out beforehand? what would the bag situation be in the case of throwing up?

I don't think that vomit could somehow help you survive gas ashyxiation. If you breathe with a gas mixture containing 5% of O2 or less, unarousable unconsciousness may be reached within 2 minutes. After that, nothing can bring your consciousness back unless you start breathing with something that would contain a substantially greater percent of O2.

They may warn of duster deaths but it's rare. If it was that easy, then all those things would be banned.

They are not banned, but adding bitterants for prevention of inhalation abuse is common. Arguments like "if X is not banned, it can't be used for CTB" are just a fallacy.

 

[theolivanderroach]

There are some deaths but it's rare. If it was reliable I would have ctb in middle school when I was doing that shit for fun

 

[Worndown]

Once you pass out, you will breathe air again and wake up.
It is a proven aid with methods where your passing out facilitates success.

 

[Eudaimonic]

I don't think that vomit could somehow help you survive gas ashyxiation. If you breathe with a gas mixture containing 5% of O2 or less, unarousable unconsciousness may be reached within 2 minutes. After that, nothing can bring your consciousness back unless you start breathing with something that would contain a substantially greater percent of O2.

They are not banned, but adding bitterants for prevention of inhalation abuse is common. Arguments like "if X is not banned, it can't be used for CTB" are just a fallacy.

Wouldn't hypercapnia still be an issue?

 

[Intoxicated]

There are some deaths but it's rare. If it was reliable I would have ctb in middle school when I was doing that shit for fun

You placed and sealed a plastic bag with an asphyxiant over your head just for fun? Can you describe how you managed to survive that step by step?

Wouldn't hypercapnia still be an issue?

If you hyperventilate before and during inhalation of the asphyxiant, you probably become unconscious and insensitive to CO2 much faster than hypercapnia could develop to the point when it might present an issue.

Spoiler: From BRITISH JOURNAL OF ANAESTHESIA (1966)

Hillischer's work was drawn to the attention of Frederick William Hewitt (fig. 9) who began his own experiments with nitrous oxide and oxygen in the same year. His first report on the subject (Hewitt, 1889) confirmed that there had been no advance in nitrous oxide anaesthesia during the previous twenty years. He wrote:

. . . certain phenomena occur to which I would direct special notice—phenomena which necessitate the withdrawal of the anaesthetic and the admission of air to the lungs. Amongst these phenomena may be mentioned lividity or actual cyanosis (varying with the previous colour of the patient's face), true stertor, jerky and irregular respiration, clonic movements in the extremities and elsewhere, dilatation of the pupils, and considerable acceleration of the pulse rate. Most, if not all, of these symptoms occur whenever the gas is administered to full surgical anaesthesia, and they are I believe, asphyxial in origin.

He demonstrated their asphyxial nature later (Hewitt, 1892):

At the instigation of Sir George Johnson, Mr. Braine and I administered nitrogen, not only practically free of oxygen but with known and small percentages of this gas, to several patients at the Dental Hospital of London; and the phenomena were to the by-standers indistinguishable from those of an ordinary nitrous oxide administration. No one can, I think, deny that the "stertor", "jactitation" and lividity produced by nitrogen are of asphyxial origin.

At the same time he pointed out that "The unsuitability of atmospheric air as an oxygenating agent (during nitrous oxide anaesthesia) is due to its useless nitrogen."
Details of the administration of nitrogen were given by Johnson (1891a, b; see also Hewitt, 1893, p. 267):

Mr. Braine was good enough to administer this gas (compressed nitrogen containing 0.5 per cent by volume of oxygen and 0.3 per cent of carbon dioxide) in five instances to members of the staff of King's College, who volunteered to submit to the experiments. . . . Encouraged by these results Mr. Braine felt justified in administering the gas to patients at the Dental Hospital for anaesthetic purposes. The only difference, in the opinion of some of those present, being that the anaesthesia was less rapidly produced, and somewhat less durable, than that from nitrous oxide, although in each case the tooth was extracted without pain. . . . On a subsequent occasion the same gas was administered by Dr. Frederick Hewitt at the Dental Hospital. As before nine patients took the gas. The maximum period required to produce anaesthesia was 70 seconds, the minimum 50 seconds, and the mean time 58.3 seconds. . . . In the case of 3 per cent gas (3 per cent of oxygen with nitrous oxide), which was given to five patients, the time required to produce anaesthesia varied from 60 to 75 seconds, the average time being 67.5 seconds. In each case the tooth was extracted without pain, the duration of anaesthesia being somewhat longer than with pure nitrogen. In each case there was lividity, dilatation of the pupils, and more or less jactitation. On the same day Dr. Hewitt gave nitrogen with 5 per cent oxygen to four patients. With this mixture the time required for the production of anaesthesia ranged from 75 to 95 seconds, the average being 87.5 seconds. . . . In all four cases there was slight lividity before the face piece was removed, but in only one case was there jactitation of the limbs.

Notice how fast you can achieve anesthesia with a 95% N2 + 5% O2 mixture. Ashyxiants like LPG, difluoroethane or tetrafuoroethane (which are common propellants in air dusters) should act similarly to nitrogen.

When I tested breathing inside an isolated plastic bag filled with plain air, having 1-minute hyperventilation done beforehand, I couldn't notice any signs of suffocation for more than 2 minutes. After 3 minutes I had somewhat unpleasant perceptions, but they were still well bearable.

You can make your own tests to ensure that hypercapnia actually takes a lot of time to develop.

 

[Tonic_Secrecy]

You placed and sealed a plastic bag with an asphyxiant over your head just for fun? Can you describe how you managed to survive that step by step?


If you hyperventilate before and during inhalation of the asphyxiant, you probably become unconscious and insensitive to CO2 much faster than hypercapnia could develop to the point when it might present an issue.

Spoiler: From BRITISH JOURNAL OF ANAESTHESIA (1966)

Hillischer's work was drawn to the attention of Frederick William Hewitt (fig. 9) who began his own experiments with nitrous oxide and oxygen in the same year. His first report on the subject (Hewitt, 1889) confirmed that there had been no advance in nitrous oxide anaesthesia during the previous twenty years. He wrote:

. . . certain phenomena occur to which I would direct special notice—phenomena which necessitate the withdrawal of the anaesthetic and the admission of air to the lungs. Amongst these phenomena may be mentioned lividity or actual cyanosis (varying with the previous colour of the patient's face), true stertor, jerky and irregular respiration, clonic movements in the extremities and elsewhere, dilatation of the pupils, and considerable acceleration of the pulse rate. Most, if not all, of these symptoms occur whenever the gas is administered to full surgical anaesthesia, and they are I believe, asphyxial in origin.

He demonstrated their asphyxial nature later (Hewitt, 1892):

At the instigation of Sir George Johnson, Mr. Braine and I administered nitrogen, not only practically free of oxygen but with known and small percentages of this gas, to several patients at the Dental Hospital of London; and the phenomena were to the by-standers indistinguishable from those of an ordinary nitrous oxide administration. No one can, I think, deny that the "stertor", "jactitation" and lividity produced by nitrogen are of asphyxial origin.

At the same time he pointed out that "The unsuitability of atmospheric air as an oxygenating agent (during nitrous oxide anaesthesia) is due to its useless nitrogen."
Details of the administration of nitrogen were given by Johnson (1891a, b; see also Hewitt, 1893, p. 267):

Mr. Braine was good enough to administer this gas (compressed nitrogen containing 0.5 per cent by volume of oxygen and 0.3 per cent of carbon dioxide) in five instances to members of the staff of King's College, who volunteered to submit to the experiments. . . . Encouraged by these results Mr. Braine felt justified in administering the gas to patients at the Dental Hospital for anaesthetic purposes. The only difference, in the opinion of some of those present, being that the anaesthesia was less rapidly produced, and somewhat less durable, than that from nitrous oxide, although in each case the tooth was extracted without pain. . . . On a subsequent occasion the same gas was administered by Dr. Frederick Hewitt at the Dental Hospital. As before nine patients took the gas. The maximum period required to produce anaesthesia was 70 seconds, the minimum 50 seconds, and the mean time 58.3 seconds. . . . In the case of 3 per cent gas (3 per cent of oxygen with nitrous oxide), which was given to five patients, the time required to produce anaesthesia varied from 60 to 75 seconds, the average time being 67.5 seconds. In each case the tooth was extracted without pain, the duration of anaesthesia being somewhat longer than with pure nitrogen. In each case there was lividity, dilatation of the pupils, and more or less jactitation. On the same day Dr. Hewitt gave nitrogen with 5 per cent oxygen to four patients. With this mixture the time required for the production of anaesthesia ranged from 75 to 95 seconds, the average being 87.5 seconds. . . . In all four cases there was slight lividity before the face piece was removed, but in only one case was there jactitation of the limbs.

Notice how fast you can achieve anesthesia with a 95% N2 + 5% O2 mixture. Ashyxiants like LPG, difluoroethane or tetrafuoroethane (which are common propellants in air dusters) should act similarly to nitrogen.

When I tested breathing inside an isolated plastic bag filled with plain air, having 1-minute hyperventilation done beforehand, I couldn't notice any signs of suffocation for more than 2 minutes. After 3 minutes I had somewhat unpleasant perceptions, but they were still well bearable.

You can make your own tests to ensure that hypercapnia actually takes a lot of time to develop.

do you know what brand of duster would be the most successful?

 

[maniac116]

What dusters can reliably do is rapidly destroy brain cells even to the point of psychosis. Personally I wouldn't want to add to my misery.

 

[Intoxicated]

do you know what brand of duster would be the most successful?

No, I can't suggest optimal brands. As far as I know, many dusters contain bitterants or odorants which may make inhaling the gas somewhat unpleasant. I'd recommend to consider other asphyxiants first.

The best relatively cheap asphyxiant is probably food-grade N2O (for making a whipped cream) which can be purchased in whippets or cans depending on the location. This is what I'm going to use for CTB. If N2O is unavailable, I'd suggest to look for non-flammable HFC refrigerants like R-134a. Unlike air dusters, non-flammable HFC refrigerants commonly don't contain any nasty odorants, so they can be inhaled without discomfort.

Air dusters should be considered as the last resort when better gases cannot be obtained with a reasonable effort.

 

[Tonic_Secrecy]

No, I can't suggest optimal brands. As far as I know, many dusters contain bitterants or odorants which may make inhaling the gas somewhat unpleasant. I'd recommend to consider other asphyxiants first.

The best relatively cheap asphyxiant is probably food-grade N2O (for making a whipped cream) which can be purchased in whippets or cans depending on the location. This is what I'm going to use for CTB. If N2O is unavailable, I'd suggest to look for non-flammable HFC refrigerants like R-134a. Unlike air dusters, non-flammable HFC refrigerants commonly don't contain any nasty odorants, so they can be inhaled without discomfort.

Air dusters should be considered as the last resort when better gases cannot be obtained with a reasonable effort.

alright, thank you any particular N2O brands? preferably from amazon as my card doesn't like working any other place.

 

[Intoxicated]

As far as I understand, the forum rules don't allow mentioning particular sellers here (maybe this applies to brands too). I don't think there is a big difference between N2O brands anyway. You can just choose whatever seems cheapest.

If you gonna buy small 7.8g/8g chargers with a dispenser, I advice to look for dispensers having volume of 0.5 liters, with good reviews (don't buy a particular dispenser if many users complain about leakage issues with it). Before the first use, disassemble the dispenser, wash its insides with warm water and then dry.

For testing how N2O works on you, you can also buy latex balloons. The idea is to release N2O into a balloon and then inhale the gas from there - this technique prevents possible frostbites. In my experiments, I maximally exhaled air from the lungs, then inhaled the contents of the whole balloon (containing approximately 4 liters of gas from a single 8g charger) and held my breath until the strong effect was achieved.

 

[kitchenwindow197]

I cant see how this wouldnt work- i think people read your post wrong and assumed you would just be huffing 4 cans straight? As long as the plastic bag is secure i think it would work.