Help Information about end of life clinic

[doneforlife]

Hi all ...Is there anyone from Switzerland here ?

 

[maxatcu]

It is not as easy as you think.

 

[illAF]

Hi all ...Is there anyone from Switzerland here ?

I am.

It is not as easy as you think.

No, it's really not. Even when being swiss..

It is not as easy as you think.

No, it's really not. Even when being swiss..

 

[befree]

The Swiss law, according to which all 6 Swiss VAD associations work, applies to every person, regardless of the nationality.

 

[illAF]

The Swiss law, according to which all 6 Swiss VAD associations work, applies to every person, regardless of the nationality.

Yeah, I was more talking about the fact that at least I wouldn't have to cover the travel expenses...
But I can't even get out of my bed (into a psych ward) for now so doesn't help me in anything to be in switzerland.

 

[_nohope_]

But is there really a chance to get help if you don't have a terminal illness and "just" mental problems?

 

[befree]

But is there really a chance to get help if you don't have a terminal illness and "just" mental problems?

Simple answer: no.

I have helped people with the VAD application for many years. In 99% of the cases, applications are not accepted just because of mental illness.
Generally, even if an application is accepted regardless of the type of illness, it does not mean that you will be approved for VAD.

But you don't have to have an illness that leads to death. I had helped a person last year who was approved because of tinnitus.

More info:

Pegasos

hi, i’m sorry if this has been answered i just cannot figure out how to find/use the search function. pegasos in switzerland. i read the faqs and they seem contradictory. they say they don’t consider depression to invalidate your ability to decide. they also say they accept applications from...

sanctioned-suicide.net

 

[illAF]

But is there really a chance to get help if you don't have a terminal illness and "just" mental

I heard somewhere that they progressively open to some mental situations. But I'm really not an expert in the matter. If anyone knows better than me ?

I heard somewhere that they progressively open to some mental situations. But I'm really not an expert in the matter. If anyone knows better than me ?

Edit : thank you @befree For the answer, even if it's not the one I'm happy to have.

Simple answer: no.

I have helped people with the VAD application for many years. In 99% of the cases, applications are not accepted just because of mental illness.
Generally, even if an application is accepted regardless of the type of illness, it does not mean that you will be approved for VAD.

But you don't have to have an illness that leads to death. I had helped a person last year who was approved because of tinnitis.

Do you know about chronic illnesses like ME/CFS or fybromialgia combined with severe mental issues ?

 

[befree]

Do you know about chronic illnesses like ME/CFS or fybromialgia combined with severe mental issues ?

In this case I would recommend to send this question to one of the 6 VAD associations in Switzerland. But I think this could be an accepted reason.
Since you are a Swiss citizen you can choose any of the Swiss associations. My number one is L....c....e (Dr.P.....). She is doing a wonderful job.

 

[illAF]

In this case I would recommend to send this question to one of the 6 VAD associations in Switzerland. But I think this could be an accepted reason.
Since you are a Swiss citizen you can choose any of the Swiss associations. My number one is L....c....e. She is doing a wonderful job.

Thank you very much. I assume you stopped your activity helping people applying ?
https://www.letemps.ch/societe/peuton-aider-malades-psychiques-mourir-exit-franchit-outresarine

Thank you very much. I assume you stopped your activity helping people applying ?
https://www.letemps.ch/societe/peuton-aider-malades-psychiques-mourir-exit-franchit-outresarine

If you happen yo speak French..

 

[befree]

I assume you stopped your activity helping people applying ?

I stopped it in this forum, because it had become a fulltime job. And often, after corresponding for weeks, members said that they don't have the money after all (CHF10.000,-).

 

[illAF]

I stopped it in this forum, because it had become a fulltime job. And often, after corresponding for weeks, members said that they don't have the money after all.

I see. If by any chance you speak French and would have the possibility/energy/envy to talk a bit more about that (or know someone), you can PM me. But I would totally understand you don't.
I know I could try and gather the informations myself - and I partly did it months ago - but right now everything feels so difficult to achieve.
I hope it is okay asking.

I see. If by any chance you speak French and would have the possibility/energy/envy to talk a bit more about that (or know someone), you can PM me. But I would totally understand you don't.
I know I could try and gather the informations myself - and I partly did it months ago - but right now everything feels so difficult to achieve.
I hope it is okay asking.

In any cases, I know nothing would be possible right now as I am deeply depressed.

 

[befree]

I know nothing would be possible right now

This is exactly the point. If you don´t have CHF10.000,- (not for me, I did it for free) and all the required medical records, it doesn´t make sense to send an email to the association and work on an application.

 

[illAF]

This is exactly the point. If you don´t have CHF10.000,- (not for me, I did it for free) and all the required medical records, it doesn´t make sense to send an email to the association and work on an application.

Well, I happen to have 10,000 when I'm late paying my bills. But that's another story.
And if I remember well, the only association I read about for now - Exit - does not demand money. Or maybe 300 or something.
But they do require a medical certificate that none of my doctors would do

 

[befree]

combined with severe mental issues

I missed this point. Don´t mention this in your application.

none of my doctors would do

There are more doctors in Switzerland.

 

[isthisit?]

What is the end of life clinic?

 

[TheDog_]

In this case I would recommend to send this question to one of the 6 VAD associations in Switzerland. But I think this could be an accepted reason.
Since you are a Swiss citizen you can choose any of the Swiss associations. My number one is L....c....e (Dr.P.....). She is doing a wonderful job.

That one is no longer taking application as of 2022. She seems nice, but oh well.

 

[doneforlife]

Simple answer: no.

I have helped people with the VAD application for many years. In 99% of the cases, applications are not accepted just because of mental illness.
Generally, even if an application is accepted regardless of the type of illness, it does not mean that you will be approved for VAD.

But you don't have to have an illness that leads to death. I had helped a person last year who was approved because of tinnitus.

More info:

Pegasos

hi, i’m sorry if this has been answered i just cannot figure out how to find/use the search function. pegasos in switzerland. i read the faqs and they seem contradictory. they say they don’t consider depression to invalidate your ability to decide. they also say they accept applications from...

sanctioned-suicide.net

Anton Fier , 66 was a member and got approved without any illness and reason given was "completed life". There were 2 American sisters who also got approved. As per media , they were not suffering.

Simple answer: no.

I have helped people with the VAD application for many years. In 99% of the cases, applications are not accepted just because of mental illness.
Generally, even if an application is accepted regardless of the type of illness, it does not mean that you will be approved for VAD.

But you don't have to have an illness that leads to death. I had helped a person last year who was approved because of tinnitus.

More info:

Pegasos

hi, i’m sorry if this has been answered i just cannot figure out how to find/use the search function. pegasos in switzerland. i read the faqs and they seem contradictory. they say they don’t consider depression to invalidate your ability to decide. they also say they accept applications from...

sanctioned-suicide.net

Recently Alex Pandolfo (who has Alzheimer's) got green signalled. So it's a bit confusing..what exactly are the rules..

In this case I would recommend to send this question to one of the 6 VAD associations in Switzerland. But I think this could be an accepted reason.
Since you are a Swiss citizen you can choose any of the Swiss associations. My number one is L....c....e (Dr.P.....). She is doing a wonderful job.

What's L...c...e?

I see. If by any chance you speak French and would have the possibility/energy/envy to talk a bit more about that (or know someone), you can PM me. But I would totally understand you don't.
I know I could try and gather the informations myself - and I partly did it months ago - but right now everything feels so difficult to achieve.
I hope it is okay asking.

In any cases, I know nothing would be possible right now as I am deeply depressed.

Can I please request ( if it's ok) to share any information, whatsoever you have ..

 

[befree]

That one is no longer taking application as of 2022. She seems nice, but oh well.

I´m unable to comment without knowing more details.

66 was a member and got approved without any illness

Right, because he didn´t have a mental illness which makes the application process more complicated or hopeless. "Completed life" is a recognized reason when there is no mental illness that creates doubt.

Alzheimer: You can have Alzheimer's but still be judgmental.

L...c....e : I´m no longer sure if it´s right to mention names of VAD associations here in the forum. I don't want it to seem like I'm promoting or just recommending certain associations. I just want to be fair.

There are the following VAD associations in Switzerland and Germany (as mentioned in other threads several times before):

Pegasos, Dignitas, Lifecircle, Eternal Spirit (cooperate with Lifecircle), Ex-International, Exit, Sterbehilfe.de (Office in Hamburg, Germany
and Switzerland - in Germany for German citizen only, in Switzerland for Swiss citizen only).

Can I please request ( if it's ok) to share any information, whatsoever you have

What kind of information ? Other than already posted on the forum?

What is the end of life clinic?

VAD association (voluntary assisted dying)

 

[doneforlife]

I missed this point. Don´t mention this in your application.

There are more doctors in Switzerland.

I´m unable to comment without knowing more details.

Right, because he didn´t have a mental illness which makes the application process more complicated or hopeless. "Completed life" is a recognized reason when there is no mental illness that creates doubt.

Alzheimer: You can have Alzheimer's but still be judgmental.

L...c....e : I´m no longer sure if it´s right to mention names of VAD associations here in the forum. I don't want it to seem like I'm promoting or just recommending certain associations. I just want to be fair.

There are the following VAD associations in Switzerland and Germany (as mentioned in other threads several times before):

Pegasos, Dignitas, Lifecircle, Eternal Spirit (cooperate with Lifecircle), Ex-International, Exit, Sterbehilfe.de (Office in Hamburg, Germany
and Switzerland - in Germany for German citizen only, in Switzerland for Swiss citizen only).

What kind of information ? Other than already posted on the forum?

VAD association (voluntary assisted dying)

So if someone applies as " Completed Life" , how come are they green signalled ? Do they not need doctor's certificate? Do they not need any physical illness ?

 

[befree]

So if someone applies as " Completed Life" , how come are they green signalled ? Do they not need doctor's certificate? Do they not need any physical illness ?

Right. According to the Swiss law you do not have to be ill, but you have to be judgmental and you must have a certain age.
There are two things: the Swiss law and the conditions of the individual associations. There is only one VAD association that accepts applications because of "completed life". Each application is a case-by-case decision. There is no guarantee that Mr.X will also be approved for "Completed life" just because Mr.Y was approved for "Completed life".

And again, accept an application does not mean you will definitely be approved for VAD. You may also need to see a psychiatrist in Switzerland who will make an independent assessment regarding your mental health. This can happen to everybody, regardless of the reason of your request, if there are doubts.

 

[doneforlife]

Right. According to the Swiss law you do not have to be ill, but you have to be judgmental and you must have a certain age.
There are two things: the Swiss law and the conditions of the individual associations. There is only one VAD association that accepts applications because of "completed life". Each application is a case-by-case decision. There is no guarantee that Mr.X will also be approved for "Completed life" just because Mr.Y was approved for "Completed life".

And again, accept an application does not mean you will definitely be approved for VAD. You may also need to see a psychiatrist in Switzerland who will make an independent assessment regarding your mental health. This can happen to everybody, regardless of the reason of your request, if there are doubts.

Thanks. Could you please provide the age. Exit international says 50 . Also could you please explain a bit more on "you have to be judgemental" ? I need to be judgemental about what?

 

[befree]

As I said: the conditions of the individual associations. Each association can make its own conditions according to Swiss law.
This means if ass.XYZ accepts applications from a 50 years old person, ass.ABC can decide to accept applications from a 66 years old person.

The person must be mentally healthy to be able to:

understand what suicide means
understand what VAD means
understand what the VAD process is
understand what happens when he or she drinks the lethal drug
or opens the infusion

And the person must be able to convince the association or psychiatrist that this decision is well-considered and is not a spontaneous decision.

 

[Deathisbetter]

Hi befree do people with autism get accepted?

As I said: the conditions of the individual associations. Each association can make its own conditions according to Swiss law.
This means if ass.XYZ accepts applications from a 50 years old person, ass.ABC can decide to accept applications from a 66 years old person.

The person must be mentally healthy to be able to:

understand what suicide means
understand what VAD means
understand what the VAD process is
understand what happens when he or she drinks the lethal drug
or opens the infusion

And the person must be able to convince the association or psychiatrist that this decision is well-considered and is not a spontaneous decision.

 

[befree]

Hi befree do people with autism get accepted?

Hi.
I don't know of any such case. An independent opinion of a Swiss psychiatrist would definitely be needed. I doubt it would be accepted as
a VAD reason.

There are 3 classifications of Austism. One of them is Asperger syndrome. Despite the problems in social life, one can be intelligent as an adult with Asperger's. But whether this will convince the psychiatrist? I don't know.

 

[doneforlife]

As I said: the conditions of the individual associations. Each association can make its own conditions according to Swiss law.
This means if ass.XYZ accepts applications from a 50 years old person, ass.ABC can decide to accept applications from a 66 years old person.

The person must be mentally healthy to be able to:

understand what suicide means
understand what VAD means
understand what the VAD process is
understand what happens when he or she drinks the lethal drug
or opens the infusion

And the person must be able to convince the association or psychiatrist that this decision is well-considered and is not a spontaneous decision.

Ok. These are all fine. But one thing, which I don't get is , if I don't have any physical illness and say "completed life" let's say at age 66 , and the psychiatrist asks why dont you want to live...I would have no explanation.
If I say , I have no interest in anything: it would be identified as Anhedonia or depression etc.

As wanting to die is never considered "rational" , unless you have some severe physical illness , I would be declared mentally unfit even if I understand suicide, VAD etc. It's mostly a slippery slope. I wish I knew how Anton Fier made it happen!!

Hi befree do people with autism get accepted?

Since autism is a mental condition, so mostly I guess no.

 

[befree]

let's say at age 66 , and the psychiatrist asks why dont you want to live...I would have no explanation.
If I say , I have no interest in anything

This is definitely not enough and not convincing.

As wanting to die is never considered "rational" , unless you have some severe physical illness

This is not right. A rational decision is: "Completed life".

But to be recognized as a rational decision, the above conditions must be met.
("The person must be mentally healthy to be able to:.....")

 

[Deathisbetter]

This is definitely not enough and not convincing.

This is not right. A rational decision is: "Completed life".

But to be recognized as a rational decision, the above conditions must be met.
("The person must be mentally healthy to be able to:.....")

Hi befree I have auditory hallucinations hear voices does schizophrenia ever get accepted for VAD or auditory hallucinations?

 

[doneforlife]

This is definitely not enough and not convincing.

This is not right. A rational decision is: "Completed life".

What could be a convincing reason ? Could you please guide here. I can understand for older people but for someone in 50s how can I claim "completed life" without sounding mental...

 

[befree]

Hi befree I have auditory hallucinations hear voices does schizophrenia ever get accepted for VAD or auditory hallucinations?

Hi. No.
And this also answers your question here: https://sanctioned-suicide.net/threads/faking-tinnitus.100876/
With this mental illness I see absolutely no way to convince a psychiatrist, even if you really have tinnitus.

What could be a convincing reason ? Could you please guide here. I can understand for older people but for someone in 50s how can I claim "completed life" without sounding mental...

Please think for yourself. If you are only in your 50s, what would have to happen for you to say you are done with life?
Give me examples and I'll tell you how I feel about it.