Discussion i dont know how i feel about this website

[RandomFellowIdc]

I feel very conflicted.

a place where people can talk openly about how they feel and what their plans are, get any info they might need, its a great thing to have. it gives people some freedom society simply does not allow. getting the actual chance to make important decisions about your own life, including ending it if needed, is good.

but at the same time, its also not. its almost disturbing. seeing people talk about planning to ctb so casually feels strange, since we are talking about something extremely tragic, a permanent decision, something that has and will traumatise many.

i want to ctb myself and i really appreciate how open you are allowed to be here and the information this website provides. it is extremely useful.
but at the same time, i feel like it is leading to many preventable tragedies, and that is obviously not a good thing.

either way, i'm not going to do anything about it even if i could. i will not take any freedom away from anyone, but i wouldnt feel comfortable contributing to anything either.

wondering what others think about this

 

[~GeminiVII~]

i respect that. i suppose this forum is just a way for people to vent. i can type how i feel into a word document but i feel like im not getting anything off my chest. if i spoke openly about how i feel, i would probably get sectioned. even on here i hold back but i think its just nice for people to have the freedom to rant about such personal topics like wanting to CTB and not just be shutdown with "oh you're selfish", "you're taking the easy way out", "you have so much to live for" etc.

 

[missedmybus]

I have the same feeling tbh. So many young people with so much potential.

In the end it is their choice though. The encouraging other people to do it/self loathing/misandry turns me off a lot, but having been in that position myself in the past, I also see where it is coming from.

I think the recovery and off topic boards are probably the best. But that's maybe just because I already had my exit plan set before discovering this website.

 

[Shadows From Hell]

What pro-lifers fail to see regarding this site, is there have been more turn arounds than people actually ctb.

I know my numbers are probably way off, but I would venture to say 1 out of 5000 people who have visited this site, have ctb. That's a very low figure, and remember, this is only my opinion on numbers.

 

[ecstasy]

i agree with you mostly, some people need to think deeply about their decision to ctb-- recovery is possible
but in the end its a safe space for people no matter their situation and everything is up to the user themself, this place is just here for support and resources

 

[lastch]

This site has provided immense comfort to me. The things we talk about on this site would get you hospitalised if you talked about with someone in real life. I'd love nothing more than to tell my loved ones I won't be here for much longer, but am unable to due to the societal norms around suicide. Instead of being accepting and respectful of a persons wish to die on their own terms and for their own reasons, we are told "suicide is never the answer" or "suicide is a permanent solution to a temporary problem". In my case, my family are constantly telling me that things will get better and I have so much life to live, whereas I don't want to be here and am terrified of the future and how bleak it is. My mindset is something my family will never understand but this is a community where people do understand your pain and how difficult your decision to ctb is.

 

[heavysoul]

I agree, I also have been feeling conflicted about the site. I think it's good for those who are very certain about their decision to ctb, have maybe been suffering for a long time (older in age) or suffering deeply and consistently and sure that they've wanted to ctb for quite some time.

However, I agree that for others, learning about the methods instructed about on this forum could lead to premature deaths from people whose lives would have otherwise improved if they had stuck around a bit longer and committed to recovery, instead of leaving deep grief and sorrow upon their loved ones.

One of the reasons I have this conflict is because I am only 18 and have been suicidal for a bit now, with some breaks, but the suicidal thoughts only continue to come back. I'm worried that I've become too reliant on this site, logging on multiple times per day at this point, and every time, I think my suicidality gets a bit worse, partly from reading all the posts about how much others are suffering and their reasons for why they want to ctb, and also from reading about methods. Each time I read about methods I log off dreaming about the method and contemplating going through with it just a bit more. However, I have my reasons why I don't feel it's right for me/don't want to/don't feel ready to ctb so I know that going through with whatever method would be premature.

But the reasons I do like this site are that I deeply relate to many of the people here and it feels validating to read through posts describing deep feelings that I otherwise might have never put into words. And it's cathartic for me to post on here and share my own feelings.

So yes, I also feel conflicted and totally understand your reasonings.

 

[RandomFellowIdc]

This site has provided immense comfort to me. The things we talk about on this site would get you hospitalised if you talked about with someone in real life. I'd love nothing more than to tell my loved ones I won't be here for much longer, but am unable to due to the societal norms around suicide. Instead of being accepting and respectful of a persons wish to die on their own terms and for their own reasons, we are told "suicide is never the answer" or "suicide is a permanent solution to a temporary problem". In my case, my family are constantly telling me that things will get better and I have so much life to live, whereas I don't want to be here and am terrified of the future and how bleak it is. My mindset is something my family will never understand but this is a community where people do understand your pain and how difficult your decision to ctb is.

the weird thing is that theyre kind of right. it is a permanent solution to something that is possibly temporary. its also not the "answer", cause its not a slution to your problems. at the end of the day you are running away. is it cowardly? maybe, kinda. but at the end of the day i was born and forced to live without my consent. is it that wrong for me to want to quit a game i never decided to play? i never signed a contract before i was born as far as i know.

suicide is a big decision. if succesful it can never be reversed. but i think if its something youve seriously considered for a while then even if its extremely tragic if someone were to go through with it... do we have the right to force them to live? surely nobody should have the power to decide that for you?

its a complicated matter, and honestly, there really is no winning either way. at the end of the day, people will suffer regardless. i'd say freedom of choice is most important here.

 

[SadFoxDreamer83]

I think this chat can even save lives, because many times there are people who just by being listened to already cheer up, and little by little they can feel better. You can avoid reading the conversations about methods and substances and you can try to encourage people to try to convince them not to give up. In my opinion this chat helps many people to feel less alone and also in many cases it can help them to feel better and also have new positive ideas, such as the idea of writing in a diary, what to do to reduce anxiety, hobbies, etc.

 

[charcoalcat]

It seemed like a tragedy because of our indoctrinated mind. Death is neither a positive nor negative event. You can view it as a tragedy or a neutral event. Why is passing from an accident or illness acceptable while voluntary ending it is not? If death is a natural and imminent part of existence, isn't ctb death a preferable choice as we can still find honor in departing life in a way that reflects our values and character?

 

[slowdance]

The thing about letting people choose for themselves is that some of them are inevitably going to make choices you disagree with. I think that you can't know that your life will never be worth living when you're 18. But I believe even more strongly that it's not my place to decide for someone else how to live or end their life. If they want my advice, I'd tell them to keep trying. But if they don't want my advice, then I trust them to know what's best for their own life. If I value living life so much, I can prove it by living mine. Other people can make their own choice for themselves.

 

[particularrodent]

the purpose of the forum is suicide discussion. not suicide encouragement, nor suicide prevention. just discussion. and discussion can take many forms, including forms that seem to encourage or try to prevent. that's why this site is for adults only as they (ideally) can make this distinction and choose for themselves what they will do with the information and viewpoints exchanged

seeing people discuss suicide so candidly and seemingly casually was at first also shocking to me, but i personally use this site to feel less alone. when everyone around you refuses to talk about something you're struggling with, it can make the problem worse as you feel so, so alone. even if it is discussed at all, it's usually done in such a vague way that i still feel alone...

the existence of a place like this is indeed shocking and downright uncomfortable, but something being uncomfortable or painful doesn't mean it doesn't exist (and so we have this site). i'd say a lot of adults here only ended up here after a very long time of building emotions, or at least this was the case for me. finding this place (post subreddit shutdown) isn't exactly on google search page one, i don't think. if resources were so easy to access or were so effective, there would be a lot less users and thus a lot less preventable tragedies

in a truly good world, all ctbs would be preventable (including ctbs that result from degenerative disease)

 

[Worndown]

This is one of the few places where these exist in the open.
Yes, it is strange. I am sure freedom feels strange when first experienced by those who were not free.

 

[identity0]

Saying that allowing people to write without censorship leads to "preventable tragedies" is a claim with no evidence and i don't believe it. It seems like a conclusion that stems from misguided 'suicide prevention' propaganda that actually does more harm than good.

 

[ForgottenAgain]

It seemed like a tragedy because of our indoctrinated mind. Death is neither a positive nor negative event. You can view it as a tragedy or a neutral event. Why is passing from an accident or illness acceptable while voluntary ending it is not? If death is a natural and imminent part of existence, isn't ctb death a preferable choice as we can still find honor in departing life in a way that reflects our values and character?

I agree with this. I used to feel like ctb would be the worst kind of death and the more tragic. It can be, depending on the method. Assuming the person uses a method that is as painless as possible, I think it can be a better passing than even natural death.

I saw one of my pets die a natural death and it was incredibly painful to watch... Comparing that to my past cat's euthanasia, I know my kitty didn't suffer and the most pain was from me seeing her life leave her eyes and her tongue flop to the side... My mother died from cancer and on her last days I think she was alive but not here anymore. She didn't look at me, at anyone, glossy eyes staring at the distance, cold skin. I have other examples as I volunteered with the elderly and it was not pretty to see...

I don't think a "natural death" is better, not anymore. Obviously I don't want anyone to die if their life can be turned back around. I'd love for everyone to be happy, but we don't know what's in store for us. People that decide to ctb (adults) can only make their decision based on their past and present conditions and experiences. They can have an educated guess about the future and that's it. They're all doing their best with the information they have and sometimes that's all we can do.

 

[DivineSpark]

I am just happy I can freely talk about my self destructive thoughts and feelings. There is another mental healthcare website called 7 cups, they banned me for being suicidal.

 

[Forever Sleep]

I think a lot of people on this site are very self aware. I have seen plenty of members move into recovery (of all ages) or, leave the site completely because it didn't gel so much with their thinking and/ or they felt it might hinder their attempts at recovery.

The site often receives criticism that it is an 'echo chamber' which, I can't really deny. I imagine people choose to stay here though because it resonates with how they feel. Obviously, it's a shame people do feel like this but surely, there is also a degree of hypocrisy to insist- it's ok for me to feel like this but, not you.

I think it's much easier to think we can solve other people's problems. Especially when we don't fully consider what it's like to be them.

That all said, it also disturbs me how many young people there are here. It's certainly easier to be more comfortable with a middle aged person's decision because- they've likely experienced so much more of life to know for sure that they don't like it!

I suppose I do maybe have more sympathy for young people though. I've had ideation since age 10. Sometimes I do wonder whether my feelings were so very different at 18 than they are now at 45. Maybe it benefited my family not to go through the grief of losing me then but- has it really benefited me to stay alive all that time? My own bias would say 'no'. That's not to say it would be the same for everyone though.

One common theme I see amongst younger members is a lack of hope/ drive/ ambition. That I suppose I find the most challenging thing. If they don't want to join society. They don't have an interest in pursuing anything. They don't want to work- what direction do you point them in? At least at that age, I had a creative drive- unrealistic as it was, it was enough to make me actually want to study hard at uni and find a job in something I enjoyed. A lot of that drive has left me now. I can't help but pity people who are starting out with that total lack of ambition. I don't know how you give that to someone.

Do you? I can understand your distress on seeing so many young people here but, how do you think they can be helped? So- taking a couple of common themes: They have no ambition, don't want to work or study and have dropped out of schooling. Or another one: They desperately want to have a romatic relationship but, whatever they try, can't seem to attract anyone.

I truly do think it is the responsibility of the pro-life adults out there- parents, MP's to create a safer space where especially younger people can feel free to express their problems and hopefully, get advice. So- a more pro-life version of here really. I wonder how many would use it though. What if the advice was all platitudes and, stuff they'd heard before or, didn't want to try? Would they still end up coming back here do you suppose?

 

[Rymrgand]

The problem with talking about "preventable tragedies" is that if we are here, trying to CTB, it's because our life is already a tragedy. Suicide is only a consequence. This is the same reason why I hate how some people is saying that SaSu is killing people. No; abuse, discrimination, chronic illness, ultracapitalism and this culture, where being an asshole is considered cool by a lot of people, is killing people.

the weird thing is that theyre kind of right. it is a permanent solution to something that is possibly temporary. its also not the "answer", cause its not a slution to your problems. at the end of the day you are running away. is it cowardly? maybe, kinda. but at the end of the day i was born and forced to live without my consent. is it that wrong for me to want to quit a game i never decided to play? i never signed a contract before i was born as far as i know.

Assuming your problem is a bad life, stopping your life is definitely a solution.

Still, I think there are some people who, I feel, would improve their lives with more time and would stop wanting to CTB. I admit I even feel kinda annoyed when someone with friends, a partner and a supportive family is trying to CTB, even if they don't have really big problems.

And about what some users talk about here... sure, I disagree with a lot of people, and I dislike a lot of them too. But if we compare it to other mainstream websites, like twitter and reddit, this place is pretty decent, at least in my limited experience.

 

[NonEssential]

I've never written this much on any forum before. This seems like the only place where I can express thoughts that I usually try to hide.

 

[L'absent]

I find your approach quite interesting: on one hand, you say you appreciate freedom of expression and self-determination, yet on the other, you seem disturbed when people here actually exercise it. You feel conflicted? Maybe because you're trying to hold together two irreconcilable positions: acknowledging individual freedom while wanting to limit it when its exercise makes you uncomfortable.

You say this site might lead to 'preventable tragedies,' but preventable according to whom? According to those who decide that someone else's life must be "saved" even against their will? For some, the real tragedy is not being able to freely decide for themselves, and that is precisely why a space like this exists.

Moreover, you present yourself as a neutral observer, yet your tone betrays a certain paternalism. You've just arrived, and you're already concerned about the fact that people here can discuss these choices openly. The thing is, those who come to a place like this do so because they are tired of having to justify themselves to people who think they know what's best for them.

If you truly believe in freedom, then you should accept it fully, even when it goes against your personal sensibilities. Otherwise, your argument is just another thinly veiled attempt to push the usual pro-life mentality under the guise of open-mindedness. That's not the kind of rhetoric anyone here is interested in.

 

[Hypocrite_]

I think a big part has to do with the moderation and culture of the forum itself. My limited time here has shown me a very empathetic, resourceful place focused on providing emotional and technical support for each other and at the end of the line, resources on how to actually plan & execute your own peaceful exit without unnecessary suffering on top of it all.

I am grateful for SS.

 

[Lost Magic]

I have always felt conflicted but if someone is determined to ctb, it's their choice and theirs alone. And if they want to continue fighting on, then more power to them. There is a good recovery section of the site too, that should also be mentioned. Until society ends the taboo stigma of suicidal thoughts and feelings then this place is one of the few resources we have. Humans deserve more peaceful end of life rights.

 

[RandomFellowIdc]

i admit i couldve worded this post a lot better, but i get the point everyone is trying to make, and i do have to agree with most of it. i suppose this just isn't something i am used to

 

[sadalways]

I like this forum, known about it for like 5 years (didnt make an account or post though due to being anxious) and i don't know any other place where i can freely talk about stuff like this. And the people seem very welcoming and nice, that's a huge bonus. When someone does CTB though and write their last post it does make me... feel some type of way but i'm just glad we have a palce to talk about this stuff

 

[2messdup]

I think a big part has to do with the moderation and culture of the forum itself. My limited time here has shown me a very empathetic, resourceful place focused on providing emotional and technical support for each other and at the end of the line, resources on how to actually plan & execute your own peaceful exit without unnecessary suffering on top of it all.

I am grateful for SS.

My thoughts exactly

 

[Jaded_Wolf]

I think having sites like this is very important. I didn't find this site by accident or random chance. I don't recall how many search results I went through, but I found this site because I was looking for other people's experiences with suicidal ideation.

i personally use this site to feel less alone. when everyone around you refuses to talk about something you're struggling with, it can make the problem worse as you feel so, so alone. even if it is discussed at all, it's usually done in such a vague way that i still feel alone...

I don't think I could have said this better myself.

In any other type of forum, it's not really possible for me to talk about my suicidal ideation at length. At the slightest hint of suicidal ideation, it seems like the conversation immediately is redirected to keeping me safe, safety plans, do I need to be hospitalized, etc. While I don't think there's any intent of malice, shutting down conversations about my suicidal ideation doesn't stop me from having such thoughts. If anything, such thoughts only fester as I feel pressured between choosing hospitalization (which potentially could be very expensive, traumatic and disruptive) and pretending my mental health isn't as bad as it really is. Of course I can try to journal my thoughts/feelings in a private diary, but that isn't the same as talking with like-minded individuals who can readily understand what it's like to have ongoing, serious suicidal ideation.

 

[Life'sA6itch]

Rather than thinking about it being strange/odd that many (of all ages here really) discuss facets of ctb, I find it sad the SHEER NUMBERS of us for whom life is not working. That is the real shock, the real story never covered in the media, or discussed at home or in houses of worship, schools, colleges, etc.

I know how I feel about the site and it's very positive even ctb is generally not. I am grateful for this site simply because no where else can you have honest discussion, questions, etc. without horrible reprimands that usually don't even address the reasons for you wanting to ctb. The site wouldn't be here without need and the need is great unfortunately.

Sure, some despair due to their own mistakes but the number of people in despair due to things that they had no choice in & at the hands of others is ridiculous and shows humanity is inhumane.

 

[sonofsun]

if someone wants to CTB they will do it anyhow this place just provides them with information that will help them make correct choice so as to avoid unnecessary suffering and the possibility of harming themselves with methods that should not be attempted

 

[OptingOutSmiling]

This site is the best thing that's happened to me, when it happened. When I joined, I didn't think I'd be here for so long, and I'm still here. Of course it's "out there", but so am I in where I am, and thankfully there is a place I feel I can be me. I'm grateful for learning about methods, as this was the reason for joining, but weirdly I've also grown as a person in learning so much from members' experiences and views on just about everything. Thanks everyone.

 

[areyousafe??]

It makes me sad that so many people are thinking about suicide, but it also makes me feel less alone as it's not something people like discussing in real life. Everyone who I have interacted with on here has been nothing but compassionate and understanding.

It's a shame how much this website gets blamed for suicide. It's got a notorious reputation...people don't usually just "stumble across" this website and because of this, end their lives. I recently read a news article and the family blamed Sasu for their family member's suicide. People seem to like to point their fingers at anyone else other than themselves.