antidepressants debunked

[Deleted member 1768]

https://drugs-forum.com/ams/researchers-antidepressants-should-not-be-used-for-adults-with-major-depressive-disorder.28843/

 

[lifeisbutadream]

I thought it was a scam. The whole psychiatry business is a scam, and worse, much worse.

 

[SlackJim]

you have to laugh really when a listed side effect is "increased suicidal thoughts"

 

[Deleted member 1768]

Class action lawsuit comes to mind. This is not the only research that provides evidence of dangerous side effects from non-performing/poorly performing mental health. Most of the literature and studies have dealt with the anti-depressants.
If I was on them and found out about this I would happily sue.
...just realized I typed 'happily' sue...lol.

 

[GlowingCactus]

Very interesting paper, thank you for sharing. This part doesn't even surprise me :

Industry involvement in research and the possible implications
Lundh et al39 showed that industry involvement by the manufacturing company leads to more favourable results and conclusions than sponsorship by other sources. Industry-sponsored studies showed more often benefits, relative risk (RR) 1.27 (95% CI 1.17 to 1.37), and more often favourable conclusions, RR 1.34 (95% CI 1.19 to 1.51).39
Ebrahim et al30 identified 185 eligible meta-analyses assessing the effects of different antidepressants, and in the meta-analyses including an author who was an employee of the manufacturer of the assessed drug, these were 22-fold less likely to have negative statements about the drug than other meta-analyses.
The above-mentioned systematic review assessing the effects of SSRIs (see 'How good are antidepressants?' section) also concluded that the vast majority of the included trials (39 out of 43 trials) with useful data were at high risk of 'for profit' bias.28 That review found no significant effect of SSRIs on the HDRS in trials at low risk of 'for profit' bias, whereas the beneficial effects were statistically significant in trials at high or unclear risk of 'for profit' bias.28
As a substantial proportion of research concerning antidepressants is prone to 'for profit bias', the results of previous results likely overestimate benefit and underestimate harm.30 39 This needs to be considered when interpreting the available research results.

you have to laugh really when a listed side effect is "increased suicidal thoughts"

To be fair, many medications have side-effects which are what the medication is supposed to treat. For example, if you look at the side-effects of the antiemetic Metoproclamide, you'll see nausea and vomiting is listed as a common side-effect (common meaning it affects between 1 and 10% of patients).

 

[Deleted member 1768]

Very interesting paper, thank you for sharing. This part doesn't even surprise me :

Industry involvement in research and the possible implications
Lundh et al39 showed that industry involvement by the manufacturing company leads to more favourable results and conclusions than sponsorship by other sources. Industry-sponsored studies showed more often benefits, relative risk (RR) 1.27 (95% CI 1.17 to 1.37), and more often favourable conclusions, RR 1.34 (95% CI 1.19 to 1.51).39
Ebrahim et al30 identified 185 eligible meta-analyses assessing the effects of different antidepressants, and in the meta-analyses including an author who was an employee of the manufacturer of the assessed drug, these were 22-fold less likely to have negative statements about the drug than other meta-analyses.
The above-mentioned systematic review assessing the effects of SSRIs (see 'How good are antidepressants?' section) also concluded that the vast majority of the included trials (39 out of 43 trials) with useful data were at high risk of 'for profit' bias.28 That review found no significant effect of SSRIs on the HDRS in trials at low risk of 'for profit' bias, whereas the beneficial effects were statistically significant in trials at high or unclear risk of 'for profit' bias.28
As a substantial proportion of research concerning antidepressants is prone to 'for profit bias', the results of previous results likely overestimate benefit and underestimate harm.30 39 This needs to be considered when interpreting the available research results.



To be fair, many medications have side-effects which are what the medication is supposed to treat. For example, if you look at the side-effects of the antiemetic Metoproclamide, you'll see nausea and vomiting is listed as a common side-effect (common meaning it affects between 1 and 10% of patients).

Yes. All drugs have possible side effects, but anti-depressants have been proven not to work, and the side effects include suicidal ideation, and suicide. But you are ignoring a multitude of severe side effects that people are not told about either before/while taking them, and these effects, ei.) inability to have sex can be permanent. These drugs do not work.

 

[MeltingHeart]

you have to laugh really when a listed side effect is "increased suicidal thoughts"

i thinkk this is normally only in first few days-and also if yr under 20 or something though. they did used to work quite well for me- up to a point- but they can only do so much-like slightly boost the required chemicals in yr brain-they sadly cant change the bare facts of yr life-therefore really only useful for clinical type depression not ALL the other types of depression

 

[Deleted member 1768]

i thinkk this is normally only in first few days-and also if yr under 20 or something though. they did used to work quite well for me- up to a point- but they can only do so much-like slightly boost the required chemicals in yr brain-they sadly cant change the bare facts of yr life-therefore really only useful for clinical type depression not ALL the other types of depression

You need to do some serious research my friend. Suicidal ideation is the least worrying of the side effects. Please note that doing your own research entails finding out how the study was done, who funded it, and what researchers were looking for. Funding, and the method of research are extremely important. I check funding first, and if that pans out I check methods...rarely goes beyond funding though. I am surprised that you focus on the increase in suicidal ideation, and not on the myriad permanent disabilities that can and often do occur.
If anyone has access to 'prove' that depression is a so-called chemical imbalance in the brain I would like to see it.

 

[MeltingHeart]

You need to do some serious research my friend. Suicidal ideation is the least worrying of the side effects. Please note that doing your own research entails finding out how the study was done, who funded it, and what researchers were looking for. Funding, and the method of research are extremely important. I check funding first, and if that pans out I check methods...rarely goes beyond funding though. I am surprised that you focus on the increase in suicidal ideation, and not on the myriad permanent disabilities that can and often do occur.

i know there are for sure ALOT of negatives & they dish them out far to easily before trying other alternatives-therapies etc. But I do know lots of people that have really benefitted from them- i did too-up untill a point-then too much happened -where even an anti d couldnt help-but they did used to help me. Dont get me wrong-I am by no means an advocate of them as an answear to peoples problems-and I am painfully aware of how fucked up drugs companies can be-and the money involved etc etc-just look at the opioid epidemic in the states--thats pure corruption.v, f**cked up, just saying that SOMETIMES they can be the right thing for some people & can help.

 

[Deleted member 1768]

i know there are for sure ALOT of negatives & they dish them out far to easily before trying other alternatives-therapies etc. But I do know lots of people that have really benefitted from them- i did too-up untill a point-then too much happened -where even an anti d couldnt help-but they did used to help me. Dont get me wrong-I am by no means an advocate of them as an answear to peoples problems-and I am painfully aware of how fucked up drugs companies can be-and the money involved etc etc-just look at the opioid epidemic in the states--thats pure corruption.v, f**cked up, just saying that SOMETIMES they can be the right thing for some people & can help.

Absolutely agree, but how many are harmed, not helped by them? Where is the proof? That is my question. I am not looking for anecdotes. I need solid evidence that depression is a chemical imbalance. I have found absolutely none. On the contrary most of the evidence I have encountered are based on surprisingly small groups of people, and extreme bias on the part of researchers.

 

[MeltingHeart]

Absolutely agree, but how many are harmed, not helped by them? Where is the proof? That is my question. I am not looking for anecdotes. I need solid evidence that depression is a chemical imbalance. I have found absolutely none. On the contrary most of the evidence I have encountered are based on surprisingly small groups of people, and extreme bias on the part of researchers.

yeah i dunno, ive read a fair bit on it, and watched a load of stuff too- seems even the experts cant agree on whether or not its a chemical imbalance or rather more external factors, nature vs nuture if u will, ive certainly had friends that have benefitted from and as i said myself (to a point) though admittedly that a pretty damn small 'test' group. Do you not even think Bi polar is a chemical type thing? What do you feel is a main cause of depression disorder? Do you think across the board anit-d's are harmful? (not asking in a giving third degree kind of way-i genuinely have an interest in other peoples opinions) And I would add that my main problem with the anti-d that i had was that it helped but i was on it for far too long without ever been offered ANY talking therapy, so in a sense it was just putting a plaster on an open wound-that was useful at the time-but the wound never had the chance to heal -if you know what i mean

 

[MeltingHeart]

Absolutely agree, but how many are harmed, not helped by them? Where is the proof? That is my question. I am not looking for anecdotes. I need solid evidence that depression is a chemical imbalance. I have found absolutely none. On the contrary most of the evidence I have encountered are based on surprisingly small groups of people, and extreme bias on the part of researchers.

what do you feel about bi polar?
have you seen the documentary Boy Interuppted?

 

[GlowingCactus]

Yes. All drugs have possible side effects, but anti-depressants have been proven not to work, and the side effects include suicidal ideation, and suicide. But you are ignoring a multitude of severe side effects that people are not told about either before/while taking them, and these effects, ei.) inability to have sex can be permanent. These drugs do not work.

Uh... I'm not ignoring anything and you will never see me defending psychiatry (apparently that's how you interpreted my message but I wasn't). I just didn't say everything I think but I'm aware of the things you mention.

 

[SoyImbecilaburrido]

https://drugs-forum.com/ams/researchers-antidepressants-should-not-be-used-for-adults-with-major-depressive-disorder.28843/

Can i kill myself with antidepressants? Cool

what do you feel about bi polar?
have you seen the documentary Boy Interuppted?

Im esquizofrenial and... well i like antidepressive pill, i want more, i will take four, ore five? When i will die?